Federal Officials: At Least 32 Dead After Virginia Tech University Shooting

possible link...

Columbine High School massacre Tuesday, April 20, 1999

Today is the 16th. Sick anniversary tribute?

Originally posted by eagle32
If an armed man was to burst through my door now I have no chance to save myself, my pregnant wife and my daughter, If someone followed him in and shot him in the back of the head then I would be thankful that he had a gun to save the day, just a shame he would be locked up for murder and owning illegal firearms and if the intruder survived he would be compensated and given his own TV show.

I had a friend killed by a hit and run driver, shall we ban all cars too?

[edit on 16/4/07 by eagle32]

I think you misunderstand the concept of self defence, if the attacker has a gun then armed self -defence is justified and self defence can be used to justify preventing harm to another as well as yourself.

Why do you assume your saviour would only have an illegal weapon? Why not a firearm licence-holder?

The result of the situation you describe would, indeed, be in the hands of the CPS, the jury and the judge but many people in the UK have used guns to kill in self-defence and been acquitted so your assumption he'd be prosecuted for murder is a big, big, leap

I don't really see it happening. I mean with two hand guns, if the guy was smart he would unload one then load the other so if anybody tried to rush him he would still have a clip left. I don't mean to be evil by looking at it from that point of veiw but the way things have been unfolding it looks as if he knew what he was doing.

I know everybody would like to go down fighting, and me if I was there, if I got the oportunity to get close enought to take him down I would. But I was not so I don't know what the situation was. A good gunman would take control of the situation which would really leave the students with few options.

As for me all I can do is to pray for the wounded, pay my respects for those who lost their lives, and be thankful for the ones who were not physically harmed.

Styki

Va Tech news conference 4:30PM EST

Virginia Governor is returning to the state cutting short a trip to Japan

FNC now calling this massacre the single worst shooting in US history.

President to speak shortly

[edit on 2007/4/16 by JacKatMtn]

Originally posted by Styki
I don't really see it happening. I mean with two hand guns, if the guy was smart he would unload one then load the other so if anybody tried to rush him he would still have a clip left.

Yes, he very well may have done this, but it still takes time. You can't reload with the same hand, you'd have to put the other gun down. Time is time is time regardless of how you break it down.

Peace

Originally posted by StrangerousI think you misunderstand the concept of self defence, if the attacker has a gun then armed self -defence is justified and self defence can be used to justify preventing harm to another as well as yourself.

Why do you assume your saviour would only have an illegal weapon? Why not a firearm licence-holder?

The result of the situation you describe would, indeed, be in the hands of the CPS, the jury and the judge but many people in the UK have used guns to kill in self-defence and been acquitted so your assumption he'd be prosecuted for murder is a big, big, leap

I was just throwing out a random situation.
I cant have a gun, i can NOT kill an intruder despite what you claim, if i did then i would be locked up.
There was a famous case here where a farmer shot an intruder with a shotgun (licensed) and was sent straight to jail.
I dont know what countries law you are thinking of but in Britain there is no justifying shooting anyone for any situation unless you are licensed to do so as an armed officer. (not including war situations).
This is simple fact.
If the saviour had a licensed gun he would still be at fault.
Unlike the U.S a guy like me cant go just get a gun license and have firearms, otherwise everyone would do it with half a chance.

Up to 11 pages, definately a hot topic.

For those calling for immediate gun ban consider the logistics. There are a few million illegal immigrants that we don't have the money and manpower to remove, what makes people think that the nearly half billion guns in private ownership could be found and removed?

The single man gun killing spree has been going on since the late 50's, an ex-marine in a bell tower in Texas if memory serves. I would say that it is a telling sign of the times. My belief is that this going postal or Columbine is a result of technology outpacing morality. With Victorian England at the high of the Industrial Revolution we find Jack the Ripper, the first noted modern serial killer. Today we have people that wish to exact revenge for their wrongs. The different settings are classified seperately to make things more paletable for people, but can you honestly say there is a difference between an office, Mc Donalds, a school, a church or wherever the events take place? The results are still innocent victims to a determined and misguided individual.





[edit on 16-4-2007 by Ahabstar]

well


that was a quick statement

FNC 32 Deceased which includes the gunman

The President pledged to help with the investigation, offered condolences and said he spoke to Virginia Governor Tim Kaine and the Va Tech President.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't the recently expired Assault Weapons Ban not allow mag capacities of over 10 rounds?

I don't know exactly how Bush and the Congress at the time addressed it when it expired, but I believe that its expiration allows high capacity mags to be used again. I'm curious to see if anybody will bring this up that it was allowed to expire - if these guns did in fact have over 10 rounds a piece. With 50something people shot, and assuming that he had several misses, you could probably figure that if these were 10 round magazines in the pistols, he must have reloaded several times. Unless these were high capacity mags, which could be attributed to the ban expiring.

As mentioned time and time again though, people kill people. However, guns make it quite a bit easier. We def need more stringent processes to ensure that they get in the hands of the right people. But, again, it is tough to know who will snap one day and who won't.

I'm sure people will blast it for being biased and potentially having some incorrect facts and such, but I bet Bowling For Columbine rentals will be high in the near future. Interesting movie analyzing gun violence in this country versus other "first world" nations.

I pray for everybody involved in the situation. Peace guys.

Originally posted by JacKatMtn
The President pledged to help with the investigation

Oh I bet he did. I wouldn't be surprised if they go into this guy's house and find Al-Qaeda crap.

I hope I'm only saying that in jest.

Peace

Originally posted by el_madmaster
Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't the recently expired Assault Weapons Ban not allow mag capacities of over 10 rounds?

From one of the students interviewed, he described the shooter as having a vest with a bunch of clips attached so I don't know the capacity of the clips but I guess it didn't matter if he had numerous high or low quantity clips. Unfortunately he had plenty of ammo.

Originally posted by Dr Love
Oh I bet he did. I wouldn't be surprised if they go into this guy's house and find Al-Qaeda crap.

I felt the same, just remember I am only a messenger

I hav eto say this though in reference into people asking why the university was not closed down.

I go to a university in a very urban city with like many urban cities there is high crime rates. We do have problems with gang activity here on campus and people either being held up or being shot on campus. I am not saying it is an everyday thing but it does happen to the point wehre it is not suprising. I have countless emails from the university that proves this and is an advisory to stay safe.

I can see why the university didnt close th ecampus when they thought the shooter was confined int the dorm. If they knew the shooter was roaming around campus that is a different story.

On the other hand i remember last year we had a killer that was spotted on campus for several days. Yet we just went on like normal just with our attention lil hightened.

I dont know. I think they didnt realize the true weight of this until the shooter went into the education building. I dont think it is crazy to think that it was a crime of passion or something in the dorm. I guess they just couldnt imagine this person goin crazy and jsut going ona rampage.

Originally posted by Dr Love
Oh I bet he did. I wouldn't be surprised if they go into this guy's house and find Al-Qaeda crap.

I hope I'm only saying that in jest.

Peace

hmmm.. I don't know. I know the FBI are apparently looking at a motive like that, but I feel its just a whacko with guns and ammo.

Reporting on MSNBC, that one weapon was 9mm(auto)
and one was .22 caliber.
Not sure if second weapon was auto or revolver.

(Edit for clarity)

[edit on 16-4-2007 by Jbird]

I've been watching this story/situation evolve throughout the day, and can only say I'm feeling more numb with each update and detail released.

My heart goes out to every individual or family affected by this tragedy ... to include the nation as a whole.

'tis a sad day, folks



 

Originally posted by Dr Love
I wouldn't be surprised if they go into this guy's house and find Al-Qaeda crap.

I hope I'm only saying that in jest.

Or because he is asian something to do with China or South Korea (or should that be North :s) nuclear program, sounds crazy but when 4 guys from my neck of the woods are 'al qaeda' anything is possible for excuses for a 'revenge on the terrorists' attack.
Now I think this is going wwaaayy off topic lol.

couple of topic related pics on this report including the detainee and a wounded victim being carried out.
news.sky.com...

video with students describing what they saw over the top
news.sky.com...

"School was closed twice in the last week due to bomb threats"

[edit on 16/4/07 by eagle32]

Virginia Tech News Conference to begin at 4:30 PM EST

Maybe we can piece together the pieces of the puzzle we have collected from the news today and put it in one post to make it easy to keep up with the situation.

ADD: telephone interview, 2hr delay from first shooting to email notification of the incident to warn students. so 7:05 911 call add 2hrs, well past 9:00AM before students were notified, the second shooting took place after 9:30AM, and reported police gunman shootout around 10:00AM.(this sounds like it could be a little off timewise but it was a student interview on FNC) Just trying to piece this together.

[edit on 2007/4/16 by JacKatMtn]

before the new conference startsi would like to point out how armed to the teeth this sheriff dept. is.

They are carrying around m16 and running around in full camo fatigues? I mean they are painting this town as a small quiet town but dang these police units look like darn soldiers.