My father was a Mason for over 50 years. He was also a Shriner.

I am the only person in my family that converted to Roman Catholicism. My father disowned me the day I announced that I was being baptized as a Catholic.

I am a Knight of Columbus.

Until very recently, if any Catholic joined the Mason's, he was automatically excommunicated from the Roman Catholic Church. This is because, until very recently, the Masons were virulently anti-Catholic.

In the 1980's, the automatic excommunication for any Catholic that joined the Mason's was removed. The Church still strongly advises against any Roman Catholic joining the Masonic Orders. But, unless one actively works against the Church, it will no longer automatically result in excommunication.

BUT, one may NEVER be a member of both the Masonic Orders and the Knights of Columbus. If one is, then you are violating the oath you have taken in order to become a Knight. You have also demonstrated, in the most obvious way, that you do NOT support the Catholic Church by joining such an organization.

It does not matter what some other Knight, Priest, Brother, Nun, etc. may tell you in their ignorance. I have had various Priests, etc. tell me many things over the past 60 plus years that were in error. There are Priests that also do not follow the solemn vows they took upon ordination. That doesn't make them right, does it? Any more than telling you that you can belong to both organizations is correct.

The simple fact is, that the Knight's of Columbus, as an organization, very specifically prohibits any member from also being a member of the Mason's. This is fact, not just opinion.

Any person that claims to be a member of both should query up through the Knight's organization to find out just how strong this prohibition is. If they should bring their membership to the attention of the governing bodies of the Knight's, they will quickly be stripped of their membership in the Knights.

One simply can not be a true member of an organization that supports the Catholic Church, and also be a member of an organization that fought against the Catholic Church for centuries.

Free Masonry was virulently anti-catholic from its beginnings, right up through the 1960's. It was also considered a path to power and influence by many.

In the late 18th and first half of the 19th century, in the America's, Masons tried to control the government. They did control many counties in some states, particularly in the Northeast. They violently controlled their members, resorting to murder and other forms of intimidation toward anyone that tried to expose their practices.

That is fact, not just opinion. It has been well documented through many court cases, where Masons were convicted of such acts. It was proven that these acts were approved at the very highest levels of the organization.

The result was revulsion, and a virtual death of the organization. They lost much of their assets, many chapters closed and their membership plummeted. By the early 1860's, they had virtually no influence in the American political scene at all.

The Masonic orders reorganized into a much more benign and fraternal order. They dropped most of their political activities, outlawed violent retaliation against members that exposed ritual, etc., and became more of an asset to the general community, instead of just being an asset to Masons.

It was the Masonic orders that had led much of the "Know Nothing" types of activities against the Irish and against Catholics in general. They openly advocated anti-catholic legislation, laws that prevented Catholics from holding office, etc. They worked hard to try to stop immigration from predominately Catholic countries, believing that all Catholics were inherently "anti-American".

As late as the 1960's, prominent Masons were still publicly arguing that Catholics were not suitable to hold public office.

My father was a Mason for all of his adult life. I am VERY familiar with the fact that the Masonic Orders were virulently anti-catholic into the 1960's.

So, please, don't try to pass off the pap that the Knights of Columbus are modeled on the Masons. They are not, and never were modeled on the Masonic Orders.

They were organized to help Roman Catholic men. They were involved in providing life insurance for Catholic men, in an era when most insurance companies refused to cover them. They provided for the widows and orphans of Catholic men. They fought against the rappant discrimination against Catholics in hiring, housing, and in virtually all other aspects of life.

The Masons were a LOT more concerned with holding Catholics down, and preventing any more of them from coming into the USA. They fought against civil rights for Catholics (and Jews, Blacks and virtually everyone but White Protestants).

No, there is only the most superficial similarities between the Masonic Orders and the early Knights of Columbus.

Today, thank God, most Masons would reject the practices of the past. The Masonic Orders are no longer racist, anti-catholic, etc. Unfortunately, in the USA, they are still sexist, prohibiting women from becoming Masons. That is NOT the case in most of Europe.

Maybe, someday, the Catholic Church will lift its prohibition against Catholics becoming Masons. But, as it stands, no Roman Catholic may become a member of any Masonic Order, and remain in good standing with their church.

My father was a third degree knight and after his passing we found a blue mask/hood that was used in this ceremony. Obviously there is some ritual in this ceremony. I'm sure he would be horrified to know we found it. Can anyone tell me what the significance of the hood is? Thanks.

Originally posted by OldMedic
Free Masonry was virulently anti-catholic from its beginnings, right up through the 1960's. It was also considered a path to power and influence by many.

I think the Masonic Fraternity was and is opposed to dogma over truth. To the extent that the RCC promoted dogma over truth (e.g. Gallileo), it was opposed by Freemasonry.

(much piffle snipped)

[It was the Masonic orders that had led much of the "Know Nothing" types of activities against the Irish and against Catholics in general. They openly advocated anti-catholic legislation, laws that prevented Catholics from holding office, etc. They worked hard to try to stop immigration from predominately Catholic countries, believing that all Catholics were inherently "anti-American".

I would love to see a source for this, please.

So, please, don't try to pass off the pap that the Knights of Columbus are modeled on the Masons. They are not, and never were modeled on the Masonic Orders.

Soooo.... three degrees followed by honorary degrees. Ceremonies involving oaths, etc. It's all just a coincidence? The KoC was started to provide a fraternal organization for Roman Catholic men to keep them from wanting to join the Masons, the Oddfellows, and anything else the Church didn't directly control. Wake up.

They fought against civil rights for Catholics (and Jews, Blacks and virtually everyone but White Protestants).

Slight error here. The fact is that a great number of Jewish Brethern have been Masons from its earliest public apperance.

Unfortunately, in the USA, they are still sexist, prohibiting women from becoming Masons. That is NOT the case in most of Europe.

Wonderful! I was unaware of the moral advances of the Roman Catholic Church under Ratzinger. I look forward to seeing Dames of Columbus, female priests, women Cardinals, and, finally, a Pope with earrings to match the rest of the finery.

C'mon... pot, meet kettle.

Maybe, someday, the Catholic Church will lift its prohibition against Catholics becoming Masons. But, as it stands, no Roman Catholic may become a member of any Masonic Order, and remain in good standing with their church.

Yeah, yeah... and you can't be pro-choice and be Catholic. And you can't use family planning tools and be Catholic. And you can't etc, etc.

The days when the Church had the power to be that choosey about its membership are pretty well over.

I was raises Catholic and married in the Lutheran church, don't really attend any at the moment, but I've been a Mason for almost two years now. If you do some basic research, you will learn that the church's main problem with Freemasonry is that in the 17th century, Freemasons talked about democracy and freedom of religion which were horrible ideas to the church. The church at that time really needed to be reigned in.

Most Catholics I know could care less about all the rules, my own sister's second marriage was performed by a married Catholic priest. My father is in the KOC, was Grand Knight of his Council for two years back in the 90's and after going to two dinners at the Mason's with me, they prefer those to the KOC ones. Some of the fanantical Catholics on here will probably squirm when they hear this, but next year at the Grand Lodge Bull and Oyster Roast, my father is going to have a couple tables of his KOC friends, he told them how good it was this year.

The church has to maintain a very delicate balance, if the tick off to many members, the money will go bye bye, which is why the threat of excommunication is an empty threat and means nothing to the majority of people. When was the last time you actually heard of someone being excommunicated? I for one would love to have the certificate to hang on my wall.

Originally posted by LordCarpainter
You'll notice that John F. Kennedy is on there. He switched on the Jesuits when he tried to shut down the CIA, which was founded and controlled by members of the Roman Catholic Knights of Malta. He also tried to stop the Federal Reserve. The Jesuits sunk a ship (Titanic) to protect that.

Color me confused. The Jesuits sunk the Titanic 5 years before JFK was born to protect the Federal Reserve against him?

Hey, I'm a new member here and I located this thread.

Though it's old I'd like to ask a question and see if I find any responses. As my signature should say I'm a 3rd Degree Knight of Columbus but first and foremost I am a Seminarian of the Roman Catholic Church. The relationship between the church and freemasonry has always been interesting to me (I may in fact write my Master's paper on the topic) and so I'd like to know something: with no opinion on the official declaration by the CDF how many members here or do you personally know who are both members of the KofC and the Masons?

I'd like to know just to see how widespread this is.

Originally posted by Brother Joseph
how many members here or do you personally know who are both members of the KofC and the Masons?

I know of one, who is a member of this forum (Appak).

We have a couple of Roman Catholic members in my Lodge, but don't know if they are KofC.

[edit on 12-2-2009 by orangeman dave]

What's wrong with making America a Catholic country? That would be just awesome. We don't want just America to become Catholic, but the entire world! Bwa Ha ha!

CC

fourth of july parade ? Lake of fire?-"Where do bad folks go when they die, They don't go to heaven where the angels fly, Go to a lake of fire and fry, Don't see them again 'till the Fourth of July"