KofC & Freemasonry

Forums! What other place then to disguse yourself as an avatar of the masonic realm! Seriously, too much general info here that can be googled, it's insulting to the Rite in a lot of respects.

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by theron dunn

Originally posted by intrepid
... bringing up the TOS is pretty much a threat. Everyone here has to abide by this, not just people that are trying to debunk Masonry.

Trying to debunk masonry? Is THAT what you are trying to do? Wow... and here I thought you were trying to imitate FW for a laugh...

You need to try harder than that, intrepid.

I was being humorous... or thought I was. I didn't see you are trying to debunk masonry at all, hence the post about FW... sorry that wasn't clear.

However, mentioning TOS was not a threat... the Mods here MORE than adequately police these forums, and I have no complaint. Fair and even handed is what I have seen... i am just tired of being attacked with lies, and lies ARE a direct contravention of the TOS, though not a serious one...

there are a few here, that will remain nameless, that post delusional falsehoods, as have been shown via their own postings over time, but I guess schizophrenic delusions are not the same as lies... no sweat, I an MORE than happy with the job you all are doing and will refrain from pointing out the obvious in the future.

Also, although it does occur, in an email from Supreme Council to me, in response to my inquiry this year (2004), Knights can not be Masons, and Masons can not be Knights. Membership in freemasonry is forbidden by the Catholic Church.

In a broad generalization in principal, if all Knights were to follow the direction from many bishops, this would be true. The reality is that there are many Knights who are Masons. The only restriction from becoming a Knight relating to this is the requirement that you be a practicing Catholic. It may be that this is left to the person's conscience. There are no questions regarding membership to forbidden fraternal organizations.
Does anyone have specific examples where someone was actually prevented from becoming a Knight due to Masonic membership, or received sanctions from their priest or bishop because of Masonic membership?

ROW OVER VICAR'S BAN ON FREEMASONS TOP level talks between the freemasons and the Church have been held over a vicar's decision to ban ministers and readers who are masons from serving in his parishes.

www.iomonline.co.im...

Here is an example.

Originally posted by Cearbhall
The KofC as with all good devout Catholics oppose Freemasonry and its evils.

I am born and raised Catholic. I will say I never heard that. Never once did the priest tell us that Masonry is evil.
Can you be more specific? Why was I supposed to do this?

Originally posted by FreeMason
There is no NWO I hate to break it to you, it is just a fanciful nightmare concieved by those angry at how the world is running right now.

Sincerely,
no signature

To me, such comments around here.... you know.. like your comment are disregarded by myself and I imagine awhole lot of other people, so I suggest you just be quiet on that subject.

And your point caller is????????????

In Freemasonry there is a great society that tells men many great truths about life. It is the people who hate Freemasons that are in denial. They have an agenda of hate and only they can say why they act in this shameful way. They are trapped in their hatred of Freemasonry and Freemasons.

Gerard

My problem with your comment is.. freemasonry knowledge is of worldly events and of worldly concerns... which are not the concerns of the father.

Originally posted by LTD602

Originally posted by wakenseek
There is no hatred toward masonry, only disbelief as to the brainwashing that occurs within their membership. Any knowledge they have taught you is easily accessable to any persons with the ability to seek it out. A membership to a cult is not a pre-requisite to a higher understanding. I am sure there are many great and genuine men who are freemasons but as long as they continue to be blinded by the smoke and mirrors of masonry they will never be able to see and understand the evils of this organization at the highest levels. You will not know their secrets if you are not one of them by blood. You will only remain their manipulated soldier to keep the illusion alive.

What are these "evils"? What "smoke and mirrors" exactly?

"One of them by blood"? Masonry is not inherited.

Oh how wrong you are... wealth is inherited... TRUE and I do mean TRUE Masons are BORN into it... Not strays who agree for the moment. Which is why you will NEVER be privey to their actual secrets. You are part of a secret organization that is in effect secret to its own members. Which is the only way it can effienciently work.

Originally posted by dnero6911

TRUE and I do mean TRUE Masons are BORN into it...

No one is "born into" Masonry. And no one has a "right" to become a Mason. When a young man reaches adulthood, if he wants to become a Mason, he applies for membership in his local Lodge. He then must pass a unanimous ballot in order to be admitted. If only one member votes against him, his application is rejected.

It's really that simple.

Originally posted by dnero6911
Oh how wrong you are... wealth is inherited... TRUE and I do mean TRUE Masons are BORN into it... Not strays who agree for the moment. Which is why you will NEVER be privey to their actual secrets. You are part of a secret organization that is in effect secret to its own members. Which is the only way it can effienciently work.

[ahem]

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Whew! Thanks. I needed a good laugh.

I'll be going through the York Rite sometime in the spring of 2005.

First, let me make it quite clear, I am not a Freemason. I have no axe to grind, I have nothing to gain, either for, or against them. People are entitled to associate into whatever Societies they so wish, as long as they do no harm to others, or seek to do harm to others.

Due to some rather silly press campaigns over the years I was growing up, I was somewhat suspicious of this Organisation, known as Freemasonry, for quite a while.

It would be rather hard not to have been. Agreed?

However once I became an adult, I learned to think for myself. Hopefully, with some logic included along the way.

Rather than branding a "label" such as Freemasonry, one way or the other, what of the reality? Specifically, what of FREEMASONS themselves?

So I asked about amongst friends, "Who do we know that are Freemasons"? Over time, that built into quite a number of people that I knew, that were Freemasons.

Some years on, what do I think of these people, that I have known for a considerable time now, to be FREEMASONS?

I tell you this, these people, are amongst the finest people, it has been my privilege to know, during my life. They are a credit to humanity. I'm not joking, they have almost uniformly been really wonderful people. The people that when the chips are down, you can turn to for help, and they will help you. You might get a bit of serious advice along the way, but I suppose, that's good too.

There's an old maxim: "Evil is, as Evil does."

I've never seen a Freemason, do other than good.

I think that says it all.

I repeat, I am not a Freemason. I have no interest in Freemasonry, in any way. I count my Society to be the Universal Society of Humanity, past, present, and future. The closest relationship I have had with any of them, has been as the dearest of friends, some of whom are now sadly passed on, and very greatly missed.

I admit it would be easy for someone to pretend impartiality, in this medium we know as the Internet, and be anything but impartial. But you don't have to take my word for anything.

Think of the individual Freemasons that you know. What are they like?

Are they anything like my experience of them?

I would be very surprised if they weren't.

[edit on 28-11-2004 by 7mm08] Typos.

[edit on 28-11-2004 by 7mm08]

How come Masonic Ritual is posted all over the net, for any one with enough computer skills to find?

I have never seen any of the Knights of Columbus ceremonials posted anywhere on the net, unless someone can prove otherwise. We keep our ceremonials secret, as not to spoil it for the new members that come in. We would never want to ruin that fresh experience for them.

It seems Knights of Columbus have been better at keeping our secrets to ourselves.

Then by the logic that seems to be prevelent in some here that would make
The KoC far more evil and untrustworthy right? You really do keep secrets.

I have been reading these various Mason, KoC, Mason/KoC with a few KoP
thrown in for flavor, topics. It seems to me if we were to take all of the posts
about these two organizations, remove all organization specific identification,
and lay them side by side, you would not be able to tell which belong to who.
Both organizations use,in some cases exactly the same statements to defend themselves. so the only difference i can see between them is faith. Now
I am of the belief that faith is not something that can be quantified,legislated,
or ordered. faith is a personal and individual thing that can only be experienced and appreciated on an individual level. so like the old lady on the commercial said " wheres the beef?".

Now this is my personal observation.
The RCC in its 1950 +- years history has come full circle. it has become what
Paul derided.
It was the policy of The Jerusalem church that all must be Jews and follow Jewish law.

Paul disagreed and believed that the church should be all inclusive with no
requirements as to Jewish law. the church split Eventually giving birth to the
Pauline RCC. Fast forward to today, The RCC says you cant play unless you are exactly like us and believe all the "revealed " truths we tell you.
trust me , we are just going to 'nip the tip".


seems to me that a fall back to the Old Religion/s is in order.

Originally posted by stalkingwolf
Now this is my personal observation.
The RCC in its 1950 +- years history has come full circle. it has become what
Paul derided.
It was the policy of The Jerusalem church that all must be Jews and follow Jewish law.

Paul disagreed and believed that the church should be all inclusive with no
requirements as to Jewish law. the church split Eventually giving birth to the
Pauline RCC. Fast forward to today, The RCC says you cant play unless you are exactly like us and believe all the "revealed " truths we tell you.
trust me , we are just going to 'nip the tip".


seems to me that a fall back to the Old Religion/s is in order.

You are somewhat correct on what Paul (Saul) of Tarsus said. What St Paul said was the gentles and Jews can be Christians. Jew that became Christian where not bound to Jewish Law. Also the first split in the church actually took place about the year 1000. Before that there was allot of auguring between the east and west churches but the final schism was about 900 and something years after Paul (also notice the similarity between Catholic and Orthodox masses). Now The Catholic church (Vatican 2) does not say believe us or go to hell. I heard more of that attitude from the Pentecostal church I used to go to (Look up Jack Chick and see what I am talking about). The Catholic Church welcomes anyone but it is harder to convert to Catholic than any other Christian faith.

Originally posted by chief_counsellor

ROW OVER VICAR'S BAN ON FREEMASONS TOP level talks between the freemasons and the Church have been held over a vicar's decision to ban ministers and readers who are masons from serving in his parishes.

www.iomonline.co.im...

Here is an example.

CC,

I'm a bit late, but curious as to what this is an example of. The orig. post asked:

"In a broad generalization in principal, if all Knights were to follow the direction from many bishops, this would be true. The reality is that there are many Knights who are Masons. The only restriction from becoming a Knight relating to this is the requirement that you be a practicing Catholic. It may be that this is left to the person's conscience. There are no questions regarding membership to forbidden fraternal organizations.
Does anyone have specific examples where someone was actually prevented from becoming a Knight due to Masonic membership, or received sanctions from their priest or bishop because of Masonic membership? "

....and you post a link about a Bishop who had problems with Freemasonry in the Anglican Church (the Church of England)
....or are you assuming that ALL Bishops and Priests are Roman...because they aren't.

Just curious.

[edit on 5-12-2004 by senrak]

Originally posted by chief_counsellor
Senrak, you have a copy of the 1st to 3rd degree ceremonials for the Knights of Columbus??? Holy cow..how did you get those? You weren't on the degree teams for the Knights were you?

It would be difficult for me to be on the degree teams since I'm a Mason (and therefore according to several on this list uneligible to be Catholic...and therefore uneligible to be a Knight of Columbus) :-)

I'm a collector of fraternal ritual books. I have hundreds in my library including K of C.

Regards

PBREZ I am very familiar with Jack Chick& co.
i stay up to date on their antics.

Originally posted by stalkingwolf
PBREZ I am very familiar with Jack Chick& co.
i stay up to date on their antics.

Ironically it was a Jack Chick tract called "Temple of the God-Makers" which slammed Freemasons & the LDS (Mormon) church that sparked my interest in Freemasony. I began to read and to talk with men whom I knew to be Masons and ultimately petitioned a Lodge. That was 15 years ago and I've loved every moment of being a Freemason. I'll bet ol' Jack wasn't counting on that kind of response to his nonsense.

Fundamentalism.....it's a SCARY and DANGEROUS thing.