Putin does it again!!! (poisoned spy)

www.canadafreepress.com...

Canada Free Press has this article.

The guy probably was handling the radioactive material and mishandled it HIMSELF. He was probably up to no good, either sympathizing with terrorists or helping Russia arm anti-American terrorists in some way. He mishandled the material and ended up poisoning himself.

At least that's what I get from this article.

Who knows. It's as good of an explaination as any. If it's true then it's a MAJOR consiracy.

Hey!!!!!

Those buggers stole my theory!!

I said this AGES ago!.. Look back on this thread, page 2 or 3 I think..


I'll dig it up....

Originally posted by stumason
Ok, here is my wild and wacky theory for the day....

It doesn't seem to make sense when you look at in from an assasination point of view. Takes too long, guy has a chance to talk, make up stories etc etc... There could have been 1001 ways to bump off someone that would be much more efficient than this.

Now, what if the guy was practicing what he preached. Maybe he was maing some sort of dirty bomb to antagonise someone into attacking someone else.

Polonium is found in Uranium. You can make it out of Bismuth, but you need some funky gadgetry for that.

Maybe, he was working on a dirty bomb of some kind, but ended up being poisoned himself.

Just a thought... But you heard it here first......

Conspiracy Theory Copyright Stumason 24th November 2006.

See!! See!! I said it ages ago!!

It's on the bottom of page 1 on this thread

Stumason - Yep. There ya' have it. Page one.

So what about it? Could he have been working with terrorists? He could have been working with them and he mishandled the materials.

It's not a far-out thought. It could very well be true.

For all we know he could have been working with them making a dirty bomb to use against America. Putin would have given his blessing on that one!!

It came to me as I thought using something as expensive, hard to get and unlikely an assasination medium as Polonium seemed...odd.

But, it would make for a perfect ingredient to use in a dirty bomb. Highly radioactive, only small amounts need to be ingested to be fatal, but has a short half-life so it wouldn't render area's unusable after a while.

All you'd need to do is mix the Polonium into the explosive and detonate. The explosion would render the Polonium airborne and inhalable, causing maximum effect.

First people blamed Russia and Putin outright for killing Litvenenko- the hero. The absence of any facts didn't stop anyone.

Now people are blaming Russia and Putin for helping Litvenenko- the trecherous terrorist- in plottoting against UK and US. Again the absence of facts linking Litvenenko to Putin doesn't seem to be of concern.

The common factor in these theories: Blame Putin and his evil regime.


How about the fact that Litvenenko is a fugitive and a wanted criminal in Russia. There is an arrest warrant with his name on it. He ran away from Russia, and could not go back under any circumstances because he would be arrested. Why would Russian officials ever deal with him of all people? He betrayed them once, and he could do it again. If the story about his KGB career is true, Litvenenko lost all credibility in Russia as an intelligence agent.

Could it just be that Putin is not the common denominator, but instead the UK government or intelligence agencies are? This guy's recent activities point to an obvious link between him and Western intelligence officials in Europe (example- meeting with an Italian official before his death). This could just as well be a botched operation of a Western agency. Or maybe he was doing business with the Chechens or other terrorist group, without any government involvement. Litvenenko is a traitor and liar no matter what the case.

I just don't see how Russia ties into any of this. I think that some officials or individuals of interest (think- Berezovsky) in the UK know more about what happened than Putin does. Maybe this whole hunt for the assassins is a disinformation stunt itself.

Originally posted by maloy
First people blamed Russia and Putin outright for killing Litvenenko- the hero. The absence of any facts didn't stop anyone.

Now people are blaming Russia and Putin for helping Litvenenko- the trecherous terrorist- in plottoting against UK and US. Again the absence of facts linking Litvenenko to Putin doesn't seem to be of concern.

The common factor in these theories: Blame Putin and his evil regime.

I've never once blamed Putin. Re-read what I posted above. I doubted the assasination theory from the word go.

I am going to stick by my guns and say "No" to assasination and "No" to Putin involvement. I reckon there is a third party here that has not been mentioned, up to no good with some radioactive material and Litvenenko was involved with them.

Originally posted by maloy
Now people are blaming ....

Not me.

If you read my first post I said ... 'who knows'. This is a mystery that will take a very long time to unravel. I doubt we will ever know what really happened. However, speculation (and that's what it is) about how this could have happened is healthy.

I was not talking about anyone in particular. It's just that that the Western media presents this story in a somewhat biased way, and that naturally leads to predisposed opinions among the general population. Because of this story you hear people talk about Putin ruining his own reputation, and having evil intent (whatever that means). How did Putin get tied to this story to begin with?

And I believe speculation is in good interest, as long as it is not limited to one disposition. Maybe if we look away from Putin and FSB for a second, and turn to the UK we can find a few individuals to speculate about concerning this killing. But all the attention is on Russia.

Sure, it was an accident. Right. Oops, I guess I mistakenly ingested a bunch of polonium with dinner. I suppose he thought that the foil pack he was playing with in his pocket at dinner really contained salt so he doused his meal with it. Simple mistake. Forget the fact that the Russians have poisoned with isotopes before.

When Russian officials resorted to nuclear poisoning in the past-- including the assassination of two Swiss intelligence officials who were engaged with Russia and South Africa in the nuclear black market--they relied on such readily available radiological substances as cesium-137 in salt form.

Because they used Cesium in the past that means they wouldn't use polonium in this case? Who's to say the hit man didn't leave a trail by mistake. Not your typical weapon used by assasins I would guess. And the fact that polonium comes pre-packaged in a little foil pouch makes it a bit easier to deal with one would imagine.

Fact is, we'll never know for certain why he was murdered or by whom. But it's definitely a murder IMO.

Originally posted by seattlelaw
But it's definitely a murder IMO.

...... or his own fatal mistake by mishandling the stuff that he was carrying for the terrorists. ...... Or whoever packaged it for him wanted him dead so they mispackaged it. ..... Or etc etc etc.

The list goes on and on ....

I think something significant happened at that dinner table that night. I could easily be wrong and we will never know for sure. But that's what my instinct is telling me at this moment.

With the idea in mind that this guy was potentially a terrorist, and possibly poisoned himself, has anyone else brought up what the uses for this substance are?

Polonium
When it is mixed or alloyed with beryllium, polonium can be a neutron source: beryllium releases a neutron upon absorption of an alpha particle that is supplied by 210Po. It has been used in this capacity as a neutron trigger for nuclear weapons. Other uses include:

1)Devices that eliminate static charges in textile mills and other places.[1] However, beta particle sources are more commonly used and are less dangerous. A non-radioactive alternative is to just use a high voltage DC power supply to ionise air positively or negatively as required.[2]

2)210Po can be used as an atomic heat source to power Radioisotope thermoelectric generators via thermoelectric materials.

So here you have a guy that is possibly aligned with terrorists getting sick from messing with a substance that can be used as a weapon trigger, while in London. Does this strike anyone else as something to be concerned about?


[edit on 12/12/2006 by defcon5]

The chances of this guy being Assasinated by Polonium is remote as it is crap for that purpose.

I still firmly believe he knew that Polonium was being used by Putin or a russian group.For what reason l don`t know possible.He planned his last few days carefully so that a trail would be left.He then killed himself using polonium 210.

Spooks even bad ones are careful not to leave any trace of there movements.This is becoming more of a 007 movie everyday.

This guy wasn`t the Terrorist or the Spy his last days were spent being the Whistle Blower.

Sure, he offed himself in a horrible manner just to discredit Putin. C'mon man, that's hogwash. By all accounts he was an activist, not a martyr.

Originally posted by seattlelaw
Sure, he offed himself in a horrible manner just to discredit Putin. C'mon man, that's hogwash. By all accounts he was an activist, not a martyr.

Indeed it is pig cleaning fluid. Shame no-one is actually saying he did that at all. What we are saying is that it is we doubt the assasination theory and it seems more plausible the guy was handling it himself.

I find the following facts odd:

1. Radiation was found at The Emirates Stadium. Did the assassin stop off to watch Arsenal with it in his pocket?
   
2. Radiation has been found at the house of one of the guys best friend's and his best friends former wife. Did the assassin goon a tour of his associates before flying to England?
   
3. Radiation was found at the British embassy. Victor wahts his face was recently made a British Citizen, he had good cause to go to the embassy.
   

It just seems to be that Victor has been spreading this radiation around for quite some time, everywhere he went.

That suggests prolonged exposure, as he didn't go to Germany after Nov 1, when he was supposed to have been poisoned in the Sushi bar. Not sure when or even if he attended Arsenal, or it could have been an associate.

Several of his associates have been turning up positive for radiation as well.

Why?

Has Victor been snogging everyone, as it is extremely difficult to spread Polonium in human to human contact? I doubt it.

I have suspicions that they were all up to some no good stuff and have all been contaminated by being in the presense of this material at one time or another. It just so happens that Victor has been exposed more so than the others and a convenient scape goat to hide their nefarious activities is the Russian Government, as it is sooooo well known he is a critic of them.

If the Russians wanted him dead, they would have had him bumped off in a far more efficient manner. like the Journalist who was shot in the head.

It just so happens that Po-210 is useful in either a dirty bomb or as a trigger in an actual Nuclear weapon. This should be of concern. The assisnation route is a wild goose chase and is doing well at diverting the authorities away from something far more sinister.

Litvinenko, who was born an orthodox Christian, was a convert to Islam with close ties to the Chechen rebels. His last words consisted of his desire to be buried “according to Muslim tradition.”

The above was taken from FlyersFan's link..

I am going on a hunt to see if there is truth to that, as it is interesting...

Litvinenko's father, Walter, said in an interview published today that his son - who was born an Orthodox Christian but had close links to Islamist rebels in Chechnya - had requested to be buried according to Muslim tradition after converting to Islam on his deathbed.
Link to Source

That is from The Times, apparently straight from Litvinenko's fathers mouth.

A convert to Islam....

Interesting...

And there is more!!!

The radiation spy scandal took a sensational twist last night with the revelation that KGB defector Alexander Litvinenko had converted to Islam before he died.

Scotland Yard detectives are now trying to discover if he had any secret links with Islamic extremist terror groups.

Their biggest fear is that the former Soviet spy, who died of polonium-210 poisoning in a London hospital, may have been helping Al Qaeda terrorists or other extremist groups get hold of radioactive material to be used in a devastating “dirty” atom bomb.

The news comes on top of a claim by Litvinenko’s friend Mario Scaramella that the former spy helped smuggle radioactive material from Russia to Switzerland in 2000.

Litvinenko’s sympathies with Chechen rebels, seeking to break away from Moscow and create an independent Muslim state, are well known.

And when Chechen rebels were blamed for a massive bomb attack in 1999 that destroyed a Moscow block of flats with the loss of 400 lives, Litvinenko enraged Russian President Vladimir Putin with his claim that the Russian leader himself ordered the attack in a bid to damage the Chechen cause.

Source - The Express

So, the guys best friend tells Police that Litvinenko has previously smuggled readioactive material before?

Some more digging is in order, methinks....

Granted that the unusual (hopefully!) spread of isotope from airliners to stadium to friends and restuarants is suspicious. On the other hand, if he was the victim of an earlier attempted poisoning and was not aware of that he could easily have walked around spreading it here and there unwittingly.

If it was tossed on top of his meal and he used a napkin to wipe his mouth, e.g., he could then have wiped his hands, shook hands with someone, etc. Once it's on his body it could easily leave traces wherever he traveled - and also where his contaminated contacts traveled. Let's not assume that all trace radiation found was there as a result of his presence. No way to know how it got there.

As far as the death-bed wishes, there are many millions of muslims who abhor al Queda's tactics and goals. I'm not sure his wishes indicate he advocated using dirty bombs, etc. If he was a supporter of the Chechen rebels why would he bring the isotope to London? What do the British have to do with the uprising in Chechnya? I just don't see it.

Also, if he wanted to make a statement in support of militant tactics by terrorist groups the time to do it would have been on his deathbed. He could have put down Putin as his nefarious and godless assassin and incited others to rise up against the dictator, etc. Perfect opportunity to advance his politics if that was what he'd been doing.

Originally posted by seattlelaw
Granted that the unusual (hopefully!) spread of isotope from airliners to stadium to friends and restuarants is suspicious. On the other hand, if he was the victim of an earlier attempted poisoning and was not aware of that he could easily have walked around spreading it here and there unwittingly.

That's stretching it a bit? A previous attempted poisoning that failed. That would suggest they would try a different method if the first failed.

Originally posted by seattlelaw
If it was tossed on top of his meal and he used a napkin to wipe his mouth, e.g., he could then have wiped his hands, shook hands with someone, etc. Once it's on his body it could easily leave traces wherever he traveled - and also where his contaminated contacts traveled. Let's not assume that all trace radiation found was there as a result of his presence. No way to know how it got there.

I know that he would leave traces, especially if he had a pee wherever he travelled, which would be expected.

You could also easily assume that if he contaminated himself, then the same method of transfer could take place. Poisoning isn't the only theory and is by far the weakest. Occums razor should be applied here and the most likely circumstances are self contamination, not poisoning.

Originally posted by seattlelaw
As far as the death-bed wishes, there are many millions of muslims who abhor al Queda's tactics and goals. I'm not sure his wishes indicate he advocated using dirty bombs, etc. If he was a supporter of the Chechen rebels why would he bring the isotope to London? What do the British have to do with the uprising in Chechnya? I just don't see it.

I'm not suggesting all muslims support terrorists, but recent converts tend to gravitate towards the more fundamentalist ideals. The same applies for recent converts to Christianity, they are always way OTT with their beliefs too.

London may have just been a stopover or assembly point before going elsewhere.

A dirty bomb laced with Po-210 would be impossible to detect if smuggled abroad, as the radiation detectors would not pick up on it, as Alpha particles can not get out of a wet paper bag with a map.

Hence, you could transfer the assembled device and the Authorities would be none the wiser.

Originally posted by seattlelaw
Also, if he wanted to make a statement in support of militant tactics by terrorist groups the time to do it would have been on his deathbed. He could have put down Putin as his nefarious and godless assassin and incited others to rise up against the dictator, etc. Perfect opportunity to advance his politics if that was what he'd been doing.

But why would you do that? If your part of a plot building a dirt bomb or whatever and you accidentally contaminated yourself, why would you expose the whole plot on your death bed?

You would already have eyebrows raised due to being contaminated, so why not throw the Police off the scent by blaming Russia.

After all, your a well known dissident, so the story is plausible. It would, at the very least, buy enough time for your associates to hide whatever you were up too.