He did eat at a Sushi bar....

Not saying he wasn't deliberately poisoned, as it would be a good cover, but he was eating raw fish....

Bit early to start throwing accussations around...

Originally posted by stumason
He did eat at a Sushi bar....

Not saying he wasn't deliberately poisoned, as it would be a good cover, but he was eating raw fish....

Bit early to start throwing accussations around...

Sounds like a ricin attack to me, sushi or not.

So, all these politically-bent murders are just cooincidence?

There is that kind of puffer fish or something that is poisonous and has to be cut apart exactly right to not rupture the organ with the poison that's considered a sushi delicacy...but yeah, smells fishy to me! (pun intended)

Well, they've confirmed Thallium poisoning. Not very nice that, by all accounts.

Could it have come from the fish? Possibly, but then others would have been ill as well.

It does seem to be a deliberate poisoning...

[edit on 19/11/06 by stumason]

Originally posted by stumason
Well, they've confirmed Thallium poisoning. Not very nice that, by all accounts.

I don't think it came from the fish then, the poison carried by the fish I was speaking of is an organic alkaloid poison, nothing that contains the element Thalium.

There is an antidote to Thalium poison, Prussian Blue which I assume was administered, the guy isn't dead, right?

He is in a critical but stable condition, so I think he'll be ok...

When I mentioned coming from the fish, I was thinking of the tendency of fish and other "lower down the food chain" animals retaining environmental poisons in their bodies. Kind of like Salmon with their dioxins...

But, that is so unlikely as to be impossible. If it was in the fish, you would have thought others owuld be ill.

Incidentally, do we know who this "contact" was that he was meeting when he was poisoned?

Putin is doing a fantastic job there in Russia. He has single handedly brought it out of economic collapse and has imposed some sense of order and security for the people. That is what they want and he has given it to them.

The economy of Russia now is actually prospering despite the huge mafias and syndicates that operate there which is quite remarkable given all that they have been throught.

Obviously, his foreign policy is something that makes little sense as Russia can bring what it could to the table. They would be much better off if they toe the Nato line when it comes to foreign policy. It is the most profitable to both Russia, the West and the World at large to do so.

[edit on 19-11-2006 by IAF101]

Before the Westerns start jumping on the band wagon and accussing Putin of everything and anything that goes wrong in Eastern Europe- take a look at your own "democracies". Journalists are dying everywhere. Censorship and propaganda is in every country. There is no free media anywhere, because in every capitalist regime all media is bought out by the few.


First off- Putin did not kill anyone, nor is he out to hunt people off. The few journalists that are dying in Russia, are killed by organized crime factions, that either run the press or have some political affiliations. None of these affiliations are with Putin's regime, but some of them are with local governments. To say that "Putin killed" somebody is very ignorant.


And with all the blame and flaming Putin receives from the West- it just shows the spin of the Western media. Putin took what was left of Russia in the 90's- a degenerating, bankrupt, corrupted, and decaying anarchous state, and made it a country again. Sure US, and NATO loved Russia in the 90's- Russia that couldn't defend itself or its allies. Russia that could be exploited and robbed by foreign and domestic oligarchs. The West could not care less about conditions or democracy in Russia- all they care is that Russia stays weak. Thats why you see the idiotic news being filtered out by your corporate (oops I mean free) media.

Putin may not be the role model of a democratic leader. But maybe Russians don't want him to be. Democracy did not work out that well for Russia if you haven't noticed. So they are trying an alternative. Putin has far more support than any US president since FDR. People know issues with his administration. They know about the censorship. But they keep reelecting Putin. So it works, and thats what they are sticking with. NATO and EU and their new Easter European buddies can accuse and whine all they want.

There is not 1 single death of any journalist linked to Putin's administration or Russia's interior agencies. These murders are outside of the Kremlin's control. Putin is the easiest subjest to blame, and the Western media is only too happy to jump on the band wagon.


Russian democracy is in no way degenerating. In the 90's- there was no democracy. There was anarchy with criminal warlords and political puppets. Russian democracy and economy today is far more improved than what it was.


So why doesn't the West just report what it's really trying to say:

"Putin is evil because he is making Russia strong, so any murders or any 'evil' plots are from here on being blamed on his regime. And of course the ubiquitous slogan- Putin is turning Russia into a totalitarian regime, because he is not letting us steal Russia's oil and gas. Throw in support of a random 'Axis of Evil' country, and you got yourself a new scapegoat" -spin it

[edit on 19-11-2006 by maloy]

You tell them ^^^.

And also want to add C&C motto : Soveit Power Supreme!!

Yuschenko was more useful to the USUK alive and disfigured than dead. His story formed part of the Orange Revolution narrative.

I assume this guy is more useful alive than dead for a similar reason: USUK anti-Russian propaganda.

Who benefits from this poisoning ?

The declining powerbase of the USUK or the ever more prosperous Russia who is forming long term economic ties with Germany/France/Italy.

The USUK state-controlled media are saying "KGB" a lot too... !

Someone is trying to re-ignite the Cold War. It isn't Russia.

The story is running for two days now. Just before the Russia-EU summit as it happens.

It's not good enough for the apologists of the current Russian administration to accuse the UK of trying to restart the Cold War. There are plenty of other "Mock" wars that have a greater value and believability that our Political establishment could use for their own ends. The fact is that Russia isn't really that important anymore to merit this sort of subterfuge. The UK is not dependant on Russia's energy supplies as many of our European neighbours are (if The Norwegians turn nasty, we may have a problem), they pose no military threat to the UK and despite what has been said, Putin and Blair get on well with each-other and seem to be in broad agreement on most of the major issues of interest to the countries.

The issue is that a UK citizen researching the death of a Russian journalist(s) has been poisoned in London and is now under armed guard in Hospital. Why are people pointing the finger at Russian agencies and their associates? Because they have got (to use a couple old Police phrases) "Form" and a lot of "previous". I don't know whether this has been carried out by an official agency or by a associates of the Russian Mafia. To be honest it is getting difficult to spot the difference between the two.

Fang, Norweigan reserves run out in less than a decade. It's quite obvious that Russian gas will be pumped through Norway's existing infrastructure thereafter. The state-controlled BBC is pumping out anti-Russian propaganda (eg. the constant repetition of "energy as a weapon") for two reasons:

1) to push forward Blair's domestic nuclear agenda.

2) to continue with the USUK century old doctrine of driving a wedge between Germany/France and Russia: keeping Russia out of Europe.

Before "priors" any good investigator looks for motive first. I can see no benefit to Russia from a (Yuschenko-style) botched up poisoning operation.

Recall Putin's recent Oct. 10 press conference in Dresden, where he talked about "people hiding from Russian justice, and nurturing plans to sacrifice someone as a victim, in order to create a wave of anti-Russian sentiment worldwide."

I think you will find that Norwegian reserves will last a little longer than ten years. As for the BBC going on about Russia's use of energy as a 'Weapon', this only came about as a result of Russia's recent pricing dispute with Georgia, which resulted in a severe reduction of gas supplies to Europe. Now, I don't think this was Russia's a intention. It was an action that had my Russian colleagues in London banging their heads on their desks in disbelief. It not only acted as a wake up call to Western Europe, it also scuppered a number of Anglo Russian business deals which were in the making. As for the wedge between Germany and France I don't think the UK has much need to exert itself on that front at present. The main problem relating to Blair's and his successors Nuclear agenda is not simply public opinion but also trying to find someone who will pay for it...but don't get me started on that.
My slightly rude comment in my previous post, about not being able to distinguish where the Russian state ends and the Criminal/ Shadow state begins, was not entirely flippant and is borne out by some of the more curious aspects of the Lifestyles of Russian émigré's in London. Let me assure you blablablaxyz (may I call you Blab?) none of this is borne out of any anti Russian sentiment on my part. I feel a real anger that the achievements and wealth of Russia which came about as a result of the struggle and sacrifice of the Russian people have found their way into the pockets of some pretty odious individuals.


[edit on 07/21/06 by Fang]

Can I buy it off the shelf or synthesize it easily from common ingredients found readily ?? If so, do you know how it can be done ? What is the procedure ?

Originally posted by IAF101
Can I buy it off the shelf or synthesize it easily from common ingredients found readily ?? If so, do you know how it can be done ? What is the procedure ?

Come on over to my house for dinner some night soon. I'll go through the step-by-step procedure for producing thallium while we dine on sushi.

Well if this guy was a member of the FSB, then maybe they do have a good reason to get rid of him, which isn't proof enough that they did it though. If you choose to serve in an agency such as FSB (KGB / GRU), especially in a more centralized state such as Russia, you are going to be giving up some liberties. One of these liberties is spilling secrets or alleged secrets (even though he served in FSB, doesn't mean what he was reporting was the truth) and sensitive information about ongoing affairs. Free press or not, that is venturing onto dangerous grounds, and you are willingly risking your life. I still don't believe that he was murdered at all.


And about Britain (USUK) not being concerned with Russia or its energy- A major exporter such as Russia, has a huge impact on the market whether you are buying directly from them or not. Any issue with Russian exports will have a major impact on prices and economies throughout Europe. Britain is very much interested in Russia, and its media is a clear example of that.

And with all of the ex-oligarchs of Russia fleeing to UK- that only signifies one thing- they were working with sources in UK long before Putin started to root them out (and for a good reason too). These oligarchs, like Berezovsky, were draining Russia of the few sources of money it had left, yet they were keeping only a portion of the profits while the government got pennies. Where did the rest of the money go? One can only guess, but there aren't that many options.

So UK has bigger issues with Russia now, than even the US, although both carried heavy losses as the result of Putin's Presidency and subsequent economic and energy reforms. The Western petroleum giants specifically, were in big trouble, and this continues to this day- Exxon and other companies are getting decreasingly smaller shares in huge oil projects in Sakhalin and the far East.

A major struggle for remaining resources is already taking place- thus Britain and US take every chance to strike a PR blow to Putin. Forget Middle East and Venezuela. Russia, Azerbaijan, Turkmenistan, and Kazakhstan have more oil combined than the Middle East- and as of yet there are not in anyone's sphere of influence. There are already billions of dollars at work in Azerbaijan setting up oil processing infrastructure, and Russia is doing what it can to undermine the Caspian pipeline. Meanwhile Russia's Baltic pipeline could soon be operational, insuring increased economic relations with Germany- and Britain and NATO aren't very thrilled.

Shaping up to be an interesting decade, if you set aside the dumb media propaganda like this example and many others. Rather than telling the facts, it goes straight to making assumptions and throwing in random catchphrases like KGB (why would anyone still be using KGB moniker?), FSB, Putin, and totalitarian. Unless Putin was there in the hospital or eating Sushi with this guy, his name shouldn't even appear in the article.

[edit on 20-11-2006 by maloy]