MSNBC's Keith Olbermann blasts Bush and Fox News (video)

His motives are irrelevent... it could be someone completely different saying the things he's saying and it wouldn't change anything.

The sad truth for these hardcore right-wingers is that they have nothing left of substance to counter the arguments that they instigate. They have resorted to changing the subject and, like some of you said, are now attacking the messengers because they know they cannot meaningfully attack the message.

It's actually a good sign... their positions are slowly falling apart to the point where very few people take these ultra-conservatives seriously. Fox is pretty much the only ostrich with its head still in the sand.

UH OH....NEWSFLASH from Amazon.com:


Keithy-boy's book at 63 TODAY...DOWN from 58!!!!!!!!!

OOPS! I wonder what's in store for tonights show?

Well thats weird...isn't that like...the opposite of what your trying to argue.
I wonder what he'll be "motivated" by tomorrow...

[edit on 28-9-2006 by xEphon]

Originally posted by xEphon
So what if that is his motivation?

Does it in any way change the message?
Is it any more nefarious than the president giving scheduled speeches to secure approval ratings? Should we automatically discount what the president has to say just because hes giving that "les shores up them there votes in New York" speech? Even if, that speech is the most coherent and rational speech that ever came out of his mouth? Of course not!
Unless a persons motives are sinister, and I doubt selling books or *gasp* getting rating for your TV show is sinister, then using a persons motives for their actions makes no sense unless you somehow don’t agree with them. It’s called a straw man argument. And you two, (FF / KnowItAll) are using Keith as the straw man.

Are you gonna attack my BTS rating also now?

I'm not attacking anyone. You are actually the first person to make my EXACT point. I do not believe half of what I hear, and less of what I read. Motivation of people in power (politics or media) is key to everything. You have motivations, I have motivations. You just have to examin that first. While I may not always agree with someone's view, if their motivations are sincere, well-placed and heartfealt, I will respect them and their opinions. In this matter however, motivation is very clear: SCHTICK to drive up ratings and books! Neither of which in this case is having any sucess.

[edit on 28-9-2006 by xEphon]

The pattern is increasing passion amongst rational individuals who are increasingly desperate to thwart a fascist-elitist take-over of this country.

The courts, the media mouthpiece of the administration, the office of the President itself, is now part of the battleground.

The battle is for the hearts and minds of individuals like you and me. At stake is the future of this great nation.

I really dont see anything left or right about Olbermans comments. They were just the facts of what has happened to our country, we have been hijacked by a bunch of lunatics. The same lunatics that never let that @#$##$# SOB Clinton not be able to do his job proprely because of Monica-gate. The spin these lunatics do the truth and reality makes me dizzy.

I dont give a darn about his motivation, he is giving us the truth. You think your Doctor went into medicine to save your butt? It doesnt matter the motivation is, what matters are the results!

Originally posted by xEphon

UH OH....NEWSFLASH from Amazon.com:


Keithy-boy's book at 63 TODAY...DOWN from 58!!!!!!!!!

OOPS! I wonder what's in store for tonights show?

Well thats weird...isn't that like...the opposite of what your trying to argue.

I wonder what he'll be "motivated" by tomorrow...

[edit on 28-9-2006 by xEphon]

Nope, my point is that Keithy-boy is not very good at what he is attempting to do, unless he's attempting to appear as a nutcase; in which he's actually being very effective at.

Actually your the one trying to imply that he's motivated by book sales or ratings. Its quite a leap of faith. Whats worst, is that your trying to demonize the content by trying to make it seem like the motivation for X discounts Y. He wants to sell books := his talking points are wrong?

Do you not see the point everyone is trying to make? Regardless of whether he is trying to sell his soul to the devil or to the left-wing political base, his op-ed is the point of discussion, not his motivations.

Originally posted by LoneGunMan
I really dont see anything left or right about Olbermans comments. They were just the facts of what has happened to our country, we have been hijacked by a bunch of lunatics. The same lunatics that never let that @#$##$# SOB Clinton not be able to do his job proprely because of Monica-gate. The spin these lunatics do the truth and reality makes me dizzy.

I dont give a darn about his motivation, he is giving us the truth. You think your Doctor went into medicine to save your butt? It doesnt matter the motivation is, what matters are the results!

Of course you don't. See, your motivations (as are mine) are quite clear in this post. All I'm asking for people is to have a truely honest discussion about Olberbuttman and the reasons he's doing what he's doing. Obviously, you're views are to the left of mine. I frankly think Clinton was a disgrace. You do not. No problem...just be honest. You probably never have, nor never will express your opinions (in the form of voting) for any Republican, as I will never vote for a liberal candidate.

Just be honest!

I actually had not heard or seen Keith until I ran across this thread and you wann'a know what? I like the guy and believe what he says has merit. I'm sure alot of other people who have not heard of him and run across this thread will feel the same way regardless of childesh 'book sale scoreboard' games and pointless dribble.

Keep kicking up 'dirt and dust', you are only going to help make Keith more popular.

Originally posted by xEphon
Actually your the one trying to imply that he's motivated by book sales or ratings. Its quite a leap of faith. Whats worst, is that your trying to demonize the content by trying to make it seem like the motivation for X discounts Y. He wants to sell books := his talking points are wrong?

Do you not see the point everyone is trying to make? Regardless of whether he is trying to sell his soul to the devil or to the left-wing political base, his op-ed is the point of discussion, not his motivations.

It doesn't matter how many people try to explain this to him, it's just not happening.

He's missing the point entirely.

Originally posted by xEphon
Actually your the one trying to imply that he's motivated by book sales or ratings. Its quite a leap of faith. Whats worst, is that your trying to demonize the content by trying to make it seem like the motivation for X discounts Y. He wants to sell books := his talking points are wrong?

Do you not see the point everyone is trying to make? Regardless of whether he is trying to sell his soul to the devil or to the left-wing political base, his op-ed is the point of discussion, not his motivations.

I'm not implying...I AM STATING his motivations. All I'm saying is I cannot even get to the basis of his comments without looking into his motivation for saying them. Perhaps I am being extrodinarily picky, or perhaps my sarcasm is getting the best of me.

Bottomline for me....Can't give comments any credibility if I can't give his motivations any credibility. All I am saying with regard to the declining book sells, is that he is really not very good at what he's doing.

Yall have fun...and remember to go vote in November.

Interesting...no comments about certain behavior to get into the "club"? (posted on page 4)

I'm out...good day to all of you.

Originally posted by KnowItAll
...Olberbuttman....

Nothing mature to see here people. Move on.

Dude, if you're going to try and be funny, PLEASE be funny.

Even if Olbermann did it to boost his sagging book sales, he's still right. There's nothing wrong with multi-tasking.

Peace

Originally posted by KnowItAll
All I'm asking for people is to have a truely honest discussion about Olberbuttman and the reasons he's doing what he's doing. Obviously, you're views are to the left of mine. I frankly think Clinton was a disgrace. You do not. No problem...just be honest. You probably never have, nor never will express your opinions (in the form of voting) for any Republican, as I will never vote for a liberal candidate.

Honestly... As everyone but you seems to get, his motivations are not an issue when what he's saying is absolutely true.

Honestly... I think Clinton was a disgrace, too. I'm not a leftist flaming liberal... my views are all across the spectrum. I'd vote for Pat Buchanan as President ANY day if it meant cleaning some of the messes, including immigration, that Bush has left to fester. I'm sure many here agree. So there goes YET ANOTHER one of your arguments.

You just don't get that the world isn't black and white and not everything can be divided into group 1 and group 2, liberal and conservative etc.... most of us are capable of thinking a little more than that. Enough with the childish liberal/conservative crap...

Your entire underlying argument that seeps through your posts like the crud coming out of Fox News is nothing but labelling, rationalizing and twisting the facts to suit your distorted little view of how things work.

Originally posted by Dr Love

Originally posted by KnowItAll
...Olberbuttman....

Nothing mature to see here people. Move on.

Dude, if you're going to try and be funny, PLEASE be funny.

Even if Olbermann did it to boost his sagging book sales, he's still right. There's nothing wrong with multi-tasking.

Peace

So typical of this site. Mature? Same behavior as the topic of this site. Liberals all act the same...RAVING LUNATICS! You have to start calling names and attacking character. I'm not going to state my opinions anymore.....
ALL the same:
Olberbuttman;
Howard Dean;
Bill "Hummer" Clinton'
Ted (Chippaquadik) Kennedy;
All the same....you all are just like parrots.

I thought you were "out"??? You mean you were just joking that you were leaving?

Couldn't resist getting in the last word, I suppose.

Predictable.

EDIT: And you might want to get checked up for those hallucinations... NO ONE is calling you names...

[edit on 28-9-2006 by firebat]

Originally posted by firebat
I thought you were "out"??? You mean you were just joking that you were leaving?

Couldn't resist getting in the last word, I suppose.

Predictable.

EDIT: And you might want to get checked up for those hallucinations... NO ONE is calling you names...

[edit on 28-9-2006 by firebat]

Not name calling huh...mature, now I'm hallucinating? Whatever. Again, typical.

Originally posted by KnowItAll
It's all schtik!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Trying to boost his sagging pathetic show, and trying to sell books. NO MORE NO LESS!!!!

If Edison invented the light bulb just so he could get rich and famous, we'd still have light wouldn't we?

Who knows why Olbermann did this...maybe it was completely sincere. Trying to nail down his MOTIVE is a losing game...if you have a problem with his CONTENT, then address it.

When has the world been painted black and white? I always thought it was done in shades of grey and color too. When the people who call themselves conservative make the black and white, evil vs. good, dualistic universe statement for the way people think only limits them. I for one have political opinions all over the place, and have always changed them depending on what is right and wrong.

The right vs. left is used the same way as spin, its to limit your thinking and to distract you. The term liberal in politics means a liberal use of government. AKA big governement, this is what the republicans have done. They have made the government its biggest in American history. They have become liberal.

This is about Olberman's op-ed, that for the first time since 911 I have seen someone state the truth and not the spin. Instead of extrapolating this great bit of editorial into a good follow up and come up with some more ideas, we are left to spin our wheels in a black and white argument. Some people make me want to just unplug from the grid and live off the land.

Originally posted by KnowItAll
Love/Rich et al....

Unfortunately you are all falling for it.....I can't even get to the merits of his rant because it is not genuine....

It's all schtik!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Trying to boost his sagging pathetic show, and trying to sell books. NO MORE NO LESS!!!!

To bad that you just don't get "it." "It" being the end of the "free ride", possibly the "awaking" of the "entranced."

America's coup started in FLA. 2002, Ionly hope the country doesn't rip itself apart when the masses finally do "wake up"

Ikema over n' out!

I just watched the video again and all I have to ask you guys is.. what is he saying that is new? Did he say something new? What was it exactly?

He attacked Bush and called out his faults... which.. every Democrat has done? You act like he states facts and like I said on page 3 that you obvious Democrats seemed to by pass and feel unimportant he DID NOT BACK WITH FACTS AND IS AN OPINION.

He is a good speaker, it had energy and instead of YOU GUYS (Democrats) understanding what he is saying and instead of YOU GUYS look at the issues both sides you took his word as gods own voice. How dare you. How dare you take this man and his rant and declare it truth with no backing and then have the nerve to claim self righteousness and blast anyone with another opposing view point. It is simply amazing to see ignorance at such a level in so many people, no side is perfect but both claim to be.

Whether or not it was about ratings or maybe he wanted to boost book sales. That is irrelevant at so many levels, and instead of turning directly to insults and mud slinging and turning it further into a partisanship battle BOTH of you childish sides should look at both facts.

Did Bush fail to get Bin Laden, or did Clinton?

I TELL you this instead. The GOVERNMENT failed you and YOU failed. You failed at so many levels its disgusting.

We the greatest super power are a REACTIONIST society. We don't give a DAMN about anything until it directly interferes with our own affairs. We bother if you aren’t for sure something will happen. Then 9/11 came out of no where and we had the AUDACITY to point fingers! We actually demanded answers and expect someone to be at fault when before 9/11 how many Americans knew where Afghanistan was? How many even do now? Disgusting.

Something goes wrong we don't care how it happened or why it happened but instead people are more concerned their point of view being completely irrelevant to the topic at hand and making sure their man is on top. the Liberals aren’t at fault, it was those dirty Christian homophobe Neo-Cons are at fault, they ruined America! While the other side is arguing, it wasn't us conservatives, it was those nasty Christmas hating Communist, they let Bin Laden attacked.

All wrong, the governments foriegn policy is shared by all administrations and since the second great war it has hardly changed. We don't give a damn about the welfare of other people around the world, so long as the puppet government installed does our bidding. To say America wants to spread Democracy for the sake of the people is a JOKE... a JOKE ladies and gentleman plain and simple. Look at Africa, millions die, do we care? No, because we get what we need. Did we care about Iraqis? Hell no. We cared about stabilizing the region, or removing a man who stood up to us. We talk to our friends, especially in Europe like children, we make absolutely insulting comments to the leaders of Russia and China and TELL them how to run THEIR country. Is it a wonder some of the most exploited people in the world attacked us? Can you honestly say our arrogance did not cause it? Who’s fault is that friends? It's yours, it's mine, its the entire government and our ideology that we are some how the savior nation, we disregard everyone else on this planet and look at for number one.

Electing a Democrat into office won't change jack, re-electing a republican won't either. What’s the difference between the two? What social issue has ACTUALLY BEEN SOLVED??? NONE!!! Healthcare? Mah, who cares. Social Security. Deal with that later. Abortion? A judge will decide... later. Gay Marriage? Well when the polls need a boost we will preach about it. Budget? OMG, both parties make me sick. Education? 9th in the world for higher education, 15 in the world for lower education (industrialized nations) and number one in military power. Feeling ill yet? Border security? Billions wasted on a program tried 3 times in the past 20 years, pushed 2 months before elections. Solved? Right.

Its you voters, you don't see this, you listen to FOX and you keep your narrow eyes on "staying the course" and dirty Christmas hating liberals. Or you watch your CNN and you keep your narrow eyes focused on those evil republicans.

Watch the country drown, waste it for your children, nothing will be accomplished if all anyone does is fight. 50/50 is about the ratio of dems to reps. of course that being the only two real parties you can belong to, and 50% of the population seeing their way, the other 50 their way and not giving a damn about the FACTS, results in an ignorant society who are oblivious to the world. Wow, amazing, it would appear that is what we are now no? Is it a wonder why we are loosing respect in the world, is it a wonder why terrorist attack us for our imperialistic nature, is it a wonder why our children are DUMB because we build nuclear tipped bunker busters instead of buying books to replace the 15 year old text they use now, maybe some new science equipment.. no.. to easy it seems, not enough profits for our leaders.. you act like its the other 50% fault.. its our cultural failures, its our educational failures, its our government failures, its our policy failure and it is our failure to see the problem.

But go on, continue fighting on who’s right who’s wrong and get no where in your arguments because no one will change their view points.

No one will compromise.


[edit on 9/28/2006 by Rockpuck]