Catholics under Attack - the Secular Humanist Conspiracy

After spending some months on ATS, spending a fair amount of time in the Conspiracies in Religion arena, I have truly come to believe that if there IS a conspiracy, it is the Secular Humanist agenda. Why?

The incredibly militant tone of Anti-Catholicism postulated here and elsewhere. From 'God-cracker' references to the 'why do Catholics worship Mary' to the numerous DaVinci Code-inspired threads, the RCC seems to be a universal whipping boy. What is most disconcerting are the comments that are either shockingly ignorant or deliberately inflammatory - or both. Personally, I don't mind comments stated from ignorance - I am a teacher, so combatting ignorance is my profession. How people can post some of the comments and arguments they post demonstrates a shocking lack of research. When my students blithly trot out something that is nonsensical or intellectually deficient, they get a research paper on that topic. So, we are dealing with ignorance, apathy ... or a hidden agenda?


The acceptance that any person of strong religious conviction is either an idiot, pawned his soul to the Anti-Christ, a willing participant in a conspiracy, a thrall to the Vatican (in the case of the RCC), or some combination of the above. Accepting grays, greens, serpos, the NWO...all of these things are often blithly accepted as Gospel - but the Gospel itself is suspect?


The media in America is actively biased towards an Anti-Catholic agenda. TV sitcoms, commercials, magazines, and other mass media outlets are geared to a consumer-based, 'me-first', secular society. Sex, drugs, and language that was inacceptable are now commonplace elements on TV. The news media is designed to provide viewers and readers with little pre-packaged info-bites that discourages introspection, reflection, or invites active participation in the 'consumption' of news. We are fed pre-packaged pap that is called news, and the puppeteers pulling the strings have a humanist agenda.


Of course, the greatest conspiracy against Catholics is spearheaded by the DaVinci Code. The basic premise of the book and the movie paints the RCC as a 2000 year old organization bent on the damnation of billions of souls over it's existence. Dan Brown was not just writing a book - he was launching a nuke at the church. Because of the media illiteracy of the American public, far too few people possess the ability or inclination to seperate fact from fiction under the best of circumstances. A book like the Da Vinci Code creates a fertile breeding ground for undereducated or militant secularists. A coincidence? I don't think so.

America has a long history of Anti-Catholic sentiment. In Connecticut, Catholics were not allowed to hold property - this barred them from voting as well - until the 1820's. The 'Know-Nothings' was an Anti-Immigrant political party with a proudly stated anti-Catholic agenda. The Knights of Columbus was formed principally to combat the Anti-Catholic forces arrayed against us. Today, Catholics find themselves under attack again from government. In Connecticut, the General Assembly - led by the Lt. Governor - attempted to punish Catholic hospitals because they had moral objections to performing abortions or precribing the 'morning after' pill. Same-sex civil unions are legal in CT - and now, the Gay and Lesbian groups are pushing for a constitutional mandate for marriage. They also are fomenting against Catholic adoption agencies that require adoptive parents to be a man and woman couple. The Diocese of Boston is likely out of the adoption business because of this issue. Am I in trouble yet? I've criticized the position of another group...evil, evil Catholic.....

Last year saw an unsettling movement to take away one of the most sacred of Christian holidays. Target, WalMart, and a slew of other retailers have eschewed 'Merry Christmas' for 'Happy Holidays'. Why? Well, Christmas has that pesky Christ connotation. How dare those pesky Christians try to cram their outdated and ridiculous presumptions on this holiday? Mangers and other religious-based displays - or at least Christian ones - are tabu in public areas. Not to offend or criticize my Jewish friends, but there was a community in Florida that had a Hanakah display but a manger was forbidden. Kwanzaa displays are all the rage, but a cross? A creche? Christmas - oops, Holiday trees - good. An Advent wreath? How dare those Christians impose their beliefs on the Holidays? Jeez - you would think that its all about them!

Why the conspiracy? Money. Control. Religious people - especially the more than a billion Roman Catholics - have loyalties that are divided. We are influenced by the Pope, and that's something that Madison Ave, Hollywood, and the TV industry cannot abide. Secularists are conditioned to revile Catholics - isolate your enemy, break them down, breed them out.

Originally posted by shantyman
The incredibly militant tone of Anti-Catholicism postulated here and elsewhere. From 'God-cracker' references to the 'why do Catholics worship Mary' to the numerous DaVinci Code-inspired threads, the RCC seems to be a universal whipping boy.

Tends to happen why you protect child rapists.

shantyman, excelent post! Rest assured - there are many Catholics who are fighting back. Not in the manner that the secularists would expect. We are fighting back by raising our kids right. Explaining to them why the secularist spew is bad, showing them in everyday life how the secularist garbage is poisoning society. I have seen the turn-around and I think it is growing. The future is in the children, and REAL Catholics are doing their best to ensure their future spiritual survival.

re: Nygdan.....that though there was a rule against one line posts. I guess you just need to quote the author and that negates the rule???

Thats you response? A grip over a possible one liner? We don't want one liner reseponses that add nothing to the conversation. I didn't quote to 'get around' the restriction. I was responding in breif to a specific section of the discussion.

Last year saw an unsettling movement to take away one of the most sacred of Christian holidays. Target, WalMart, and a slew of other retailers have eschewed 'Merry Christmas' for 'Happy Holidays'.

Christmas wasn't even an important christian holiday until relatively modern times. Easter the is crucial christian holiday, because its on easter that the core of the mythos occurs.

Also, do you suggest that Target and Walmart are owned by Secular Humanists? How is it a SH conspiracy if not? Wouldn't using merry christmas be a commercialization of christmas? If you were a SH and wanted to destroy christianity, wouldn't you want people to associate it with crass commercialism and retail stores?

Why does anyone think that Christmas has any place in stores, or some special privilege to being hyped up at stores? Keep religious holidays in churches.

Most of the catholic bashing that I have seen has come from Protestants. Following that, self proclaimed 'agnostics'. But actual Secular Humanists? Practically never.

attempted to punish Catholic hospitals because they had moral objections to performing abortions or precribing the 'morning after' pill.

And how did they attempt to 'punish' them? What makes any organization think it can be a public hospital and receive tax payer funds, but not provide perfectly legal serivces? Thats not catholic bashing.

They also are fomenting against Catholic adoption agencies that require adoptive parents to be a man and woman couple. The Diocese of Boston is likely out of the adoption business because of this issue.

The adoption business?
And, again, its wrong for gays to adopt a kid, but its perfectly fine for the church to protect and enable child-rapists???

Mote, beam, eye.

Originally posted by Nygdan

Originally posted by shantyman
The incredibly militant tone of Anti-Catholicism postulated here and elsewhere. From 'God-cracker' references to the 'why do Catholics worship Mary' to the numerous DaVinci Code-inspired threads, the RCC seems to be a universal whipping boy.

Tends to happen why you protect child rapists.

This is exactly the kind of glib response that typifies the anti-Catholic animus that shantyman was referring to. It adds nothing to the content of the original post, yet seeks to inflame and denigrate an organization of over a billion people worldwide based upon the action of a select few. It is not unlike someone trying to explain and justify a mellenia of anti-semitism based upon the relatively recent events occuring in present-day Israel. I suppose that you feel that all Marines are also wanton murders and that the world public is right to despise all US servicement because some officers have attempted to protect or shield their men from prosecution?

BTW, can you refresh me on the rules regarding single-line responses, Mr. Moderator?

Awesome subject. Great post shantyman. I'm 100% with you all the way.
I hate the Anti-Catholic sentiment on this site. It just shows to me more of how the world is going down the tubes. Even most of the mods are anti-Catholic (if they don't say so, you can tell by their scathing remarks). It's weird but if you could beam most of these anti-catholics back into the 1960's they'd be the minority and the shame that would be thrown upon them would be great....but not today. No, today it's cool to not believe in God ("how archaic!"). In fact, it's become so cool to disregard God as fiction that I often wonder how long before He exacts His wrath down here....and I do believe He will. I believe when we reach a certain level of Godlessness that He will make Himself known in a big way and it's not gonna be pleasant.

You made all very valid points. Yeah, that Christmas thing really gets me. I'm 42 and back in the 1960's the only people celebrating Christmas were Christians (and mainly Catholics). Many Protestant religions held back a bit on the festivities, but it was the Catholics who made Christmas the special time of year that it was. I remember "The Little Drummer Boy" being shown every year during primetime along with "Rudolph" and all the other Rankin/Bass Chistmas shows. Notice how the only show they never program anymore is "The Little Drummer Boy"? Wonder why? Because it acknowledges belief in Jesus, the nativity, Mary, Joseph - the birth of Christ....you know, what Christmas is "really" about. Remember "The Andy Williams Christmas Specials"? Remember how half the songs sung on those shows were holy/religious Christian Christmas songs? "Oh Holy Night", "Little Town of Bethlehem", "What Child Is This", "We Three Kings". You'll never hear a holy Christmas song ever sung again on primetime television. Why? Because it might offend. How ironic. The PC climate has made it so good is bad, and bad is good. America is catering to the idiot portion of it's population (screw the people with level heads and firm beliefs). Also, as a side note I think alot of the decisions to eradicate Jesus and Christianity off the television and movies has alot to do with the people who call the shots in the entertainment field (the vast majority of higher ups being Jewish - why would they push the Jesus agenda - they won't - hence we see Jesus and Christianity exit popular culture to a level where it is mocked, made fun of and ridiculed as entertainment).
My opinion is that all the non-believers got jealous of our little Catholic Christian Christmas celebration and everybody wanted a piece of it (without the Jesus/religious aspect). To me, that's a slap in God's face.
Nowadays we celebrate Jesus' birth, without celebrating Jesus' birth. Kinds hypocritical don't you think. The problem is we have a whole younger generation who was raised without any religion at all and they still want Christmas....but not for any of the right reasons at all. The last thing people think about anymore at Christmas is Jesus and that is very sad, because if it wasn't for Him, that holiday wouldn't exist at all.

The Catholic Church believes that the end of the world will occur when the Church no longer exists (when it dies). The people make up the Church and without followers she'll die eventually. At this going rate of anti-Catholicism and anti-Jesus beliefs we really aren't far off from this time. I predict with the growing anti-Catholic sentiment gaining more popularity in the world that we are bringing the end closer by our choosing. Mock Him all you want, but in the end He will have the last laugh.....not you.

also in america people speculate that catholic priests are targeted to be put into comprimsing positions with regard to child abuse and paedophiles etc... also the fact that many males have always ran away from there sexual problems(not being straight), by joining the priesthood. thats a big problem. just what percentage of catholic priests became priests to get away from the sexual problems is unknown, but you can be sure it is a high percentage.

another problem for catholics is vatican2, which has wiped away so much of the foundations of the faith. so when things like davinci code comes out, people are ready to accept it as fact, over the bible, because of years of propaganda

Originally posted by Nygdan
Why does anyone think that Christmas has any place in stores, or some special privilege to being hyped up at stores?

Because it's always been that way for the last 50 years in America.
So why do we need to fix something that isn't broke?
Call it tradition if you will. An enjoyable tradition too.
let me guess, you're no older then your early 30's, right?
You're young, so you weren't around when it was different (and better) and you're cashing in on your younger contemporaries modern thinking and logic.....because it's cool and acceptable.

Oh yeah Secular Humanism is the way of the devil... Will you also be shoving "Left Behind" novels down your childrens throats? Will you be allowing your children to play the Grand Theft Auto for Christians?

Brainwashing tripe like the below is the alternative to Secularism as Fundamentalism always goes extremist if it's given enough time to florish.

www.radicalcongruency.com...

Having been raised as a Catholic, I too saw/heard/read about many things which were supposedly being done to undermine the church... a conspiracy of sorts, though I don't subscribe to it. It just seems like paranoia to me. Catholics want to believe that the world is against them, because it validates their religion in a way (I would know).

Sure it's stupid that hospitals are forced to offer abortions, but all hospitals are forced, not just the Catholic ones.

It just so happens that certain moral requirements for being a good Catholic are in direct opposition of some laws. Other religions run into the same problems too. I don't hear them screaming "Conspiracy!" though.

And why is the DaVinci Code such a big deal? Because certain "heretical" claims might actually be TRUE??? Anyone remember Galileo? The truth about the earth revolving around the sun kept from the people for 200 years. Galileo threatened with DEATH because what he was preaching was heresy.

Oh and let's not forget the Spanish Inquisition or the Witch burnings, or hiding pervert priests for years and using the faithful's donated money to pay for the lawsuits.

Well, I grew up in the Catholic faith, going to CAtholic schools up through and including high school. So I know alot about Catholicism. While I do not go around making insulting statements about the Catholic Church because I think it's rude, I certainly don't agree with the Church. Why? I'll tell you some of the reasons:

- First of all, I hate the idea that women cannot be priests and that they are held in a lesser light than men.

- Along with the above, birth control is banned. Do you have any idea how many good Catholic women have died because of having too many children?

- I don't believe the Pope is infallible. He's a human being, capable of error just like the rest of us.

- I am disgusted by the Church's position on child molesting. This goes back a very long way and has never been addressed by the Church's top echelon, or most other Church reps. Instead, they blame the homosexuals, which is ridiculous, they are both 2 separate things.

- The Church has a very long history of manipulation, including "revising" the Bible (see Nicene Council). This is putting it nicely.

- The Inquisition holocaust was an abomination - one that took the Church until the year 2000 to apologize for. I am Pagan and the Church has spent 2000 years demonizing my religion. Why should I take Catholicism seriously or have any respect for it?

- Protecting the Nazis during WWII.

- The Church has a strong anti-gay stance which I find abhorent.

This is all I can think of right now, there's probably more. But I do have a question for you - how is a law that makes same sex marriage legal, being anti-Catholic?

Further, if you really want to talk to someone who's religion society doesn't like, talk to a Pagan, Wiccan or Witch. I don't like religions that condemn other religlions or beliefs, plain and simple, and I think the Catholic Church does that.

Hope this helps. I'm not trying to do a hate-speech against the Church, normally I don't talk about such things, but hey, you asked. Hope it helps a little to answer your question.

Peace,
Forestlady

Kruel - just because you don't seem to like the catholic faith does not mean there is not a conspiracy against it. conspiracies really happen in the real world. all the time, through out ones lifetime people take part in many conspiracies, whats the big deal about that word anyway.

whats that saying, "just because youre paranoid does not mean they are not out to get you"

surely you can see how important spiritual beliefs are to all people, and the people running this society know that if you give people doubts about there beliefs that do not have faith in those anymore, and we are in an increasing secular world are we not. at the end of the day things like witch hunts were there to protect those beliefs because pagan beliefs go against any thing that a christian stands for, so although they may seem wrong, the end might of justified the means.

Originally posted by Nygdan

Originally posted by shantyman
The incredibly militant tone of Anti-Catholicism postulated here and elsewhere. From 'God-cracker' references to the 'why do Catholics worship Mary' to the numerous DaVinci Code-inspired threads, the RCC seems to be a universal whipping boy.

Tends to happen why you protect child rapists.

Nydgan, your cogent, insightful response overwhems me. Such cutting brilliance, such a clarion call of insight, such wit... please.

Did you even bother to read my post or is this something that you just trot out whenever you see something Catholic? Personally, I think that latter. There is absolutely no question that molestation occured, I was very shaken to learn that there were men in positions of authority who swept it under the rug. As a lay minister, I can tell you that the Catholic Church in America is incredibly transparent now. The reforms the church has developed and is instituting are being followed by other religious denominations. And without excusing the priest molestations, Doctors, Lawyers, teachers, therapists all have much worse track records. Than again, there is always the legion of secular humanist pedophiles out there....but - as my original post argues, the Church does make the easy target for people like you, doesn't it?

I do thank you for providing the perfect Pavlovian dog response that I have come to expect from so many people. If you can't think of something intelligent, throw out something hurtful, spiteful, and cruel.

Originally posted by forestlady
Well, I grew up in the Catholic faith, going to CAtholic schools up through and including high school. So I know alot about Catholicism. While I do not go around making insulting statements about the Catholic Church because I think it's rude, I certainly don't agree with the Church. Why? I'll tell you some of the reasons:

- First of all, I hate the idea that women cannot be priests and that they are held in a lesser light than men.

- Along with the above, birth control is banned. Do you have any idea how many good Catholic women have died because of having too many children?

- I don't believe the Pope is infallible. He's a human being, capable of error just like the rest of us.

- I am disgusted by the Church's position on child molesting. This goes back a very long way and has never been addressed by the Church's top echelon, or most other Church reps. Instead, they blame the homosexuals, which is ridiculous, they are both 2 separate things.

- The Church has a very long history of manipulation, including "revising" the Bible (see Nicene Council). This is putting it nicely.

- The Inquisition holocaust was an abomination - one that took the Church until the year 2000 to apologize for. I am Pagan and the Church has spent 2000 years demonizing my religion. Why should I take Catholicism seriously or have any respect for it?

- Protecting the Nazis during WWII.

- The Church has a strong anti-gay stance which I find abhorent.

This is all I can think of right now, there's probably more. But I do have a question for you - how is a law that makes same sex marriage legal, being anti-Catholic?

Further, if you really want to talk to someone who's religion society doesn't like, talk to a Pagan, Wiccan or Witch. I don't like religions that condemn other religlions or beliefs, plain and simple, and I think the Catholic Church does that.

Hope this helps. I'm not trying to do a hate-speech against the Church, normally I don't talk about such things, but hey, you asked. Hope it helps a little to answer your question.

Peace,
Forestlady

on women priest - at the end of the day the priest is supposed to be a representative of jesus, jesus was a man. i am not going to get into the arguments that will lead to sexist comments.

the subject of birth control - in the eyes of the church sex is supposed to be carried out between a man and wife, and for procreation, need i explain further.

the pope being infallible - is not the pope supposed to be open to higher forces, something that we lay people are not open to. i suppose we are not supposed to talk about that though. but being gods representative on earth, probably means hes open to more than we know.

Inquisition holocaust - pagan religions have always been the dark side for the catholic church, the two do not go together. the church will not want people to open themselves up to forces they cannot control.

child molesting & gays - males have always run away from there sexual problems and have joined the priesthood, just a fact. if you were not normal(straight), you went and joined the priesthood. this has always been a problem for the church and always will be, because a high percentage of the catholic priests join them because they are not straight and have internal issues with the sexual preference.

Protecting the Nazis - was to do with the nazis saying they could be the major religion after the war, and the fact that catholics were controlled from rome, so it was easier for the nazis to get into bed with the vatican.

anti gay - the problem is that the church sees the sexual problems in being gay as a spiritual matter, being gay is not in your genes, they believe it is a spiritual matter.

[edit on 1-6-2006 by andy1033]

Originally posted by forestlady
- First of all, I hate the idea that women cannot be priests and that they are held in a lesser light than men.

The whole concept of priests was based on the apostles and their mission...they were all men.

Originally posted by forestlady
Do you have any idea how many good Catholic women have died because of having too many children?

Not a clue. Back this up with stats. I don't believe it at all.

Originally posted by forestlady
- I don't believe the Pope is infallible. He's a human being, capable of error just like the rest of us.

We don't believe the Pope is infallible, we believe the Mother Church is.

Originally posted by forestlady
- I am disgusted by the Church's position on child molesting. This goes back a very long way and has never been addressed by the Church's top echelon, or most other Church reps. Instead, they blame the homosexuals, which is ridiculous, they are both 2 separate things.

Sexual molestation is a problem everywhere (see Africa and it's current military). Yes, homosexuality and pedophila are 2 entirely different things. The majority of Catholic bashers lump these 2 together to fit their agenda.

Originally posted by forestlady
- The Church has a very long history of manipulation, including "revising" the Bible...

.....name me a Christian religious denomination that was never guilty of this.......
can you say Protestantism????

Originally posted by forestlady
- The Inquisition holocaust was an abomination - one that took the Church until the year 2000 to apologize for. I am Pagan and the Church has spent 2000 years demonizing my religion. Why should I take Catholicism seriously or have any respect for it?

an apology is an apology is an apology......do you need another one?
and if you are Pagan the very last thing I'd expect from you is respect for the Church...

Originally posted by forestlady
- Protecting the Nazis during WWII.

More BS. Typical Catholic bashing propaganda.

Originally posted by forestlady
- The Church has a strong anti-gay stance which I find abhorent.

....and so does God. Or didn't you know? Maybe you need to take this up with Him (see Bible).

Originally posted by forestlady
How is a law that makes same sex marriage legal, being anti-Catholic?

It's not anti-Catholic. It's anti-Christian or anti-God.
God forbids homosexuality to be "acted upon" (see Bible).

Originally posted by forestlady
I don't like religions that condemn other religlions or beliefs, plain and simple, and I think the Catholic Church does that.

Wrong again. So misinformed. We are probably the least condemnable of all religions. In fact, the Protestants hate us with so much angst that they have stated they think our Pope is the Anti-Christ. When it comes to Protestants...we turn the other cheek and leave them be, but they hate us.

Originally posted by forestlady
Hope it helps a little to answer your question.

Not at all. You just reinforced the belief of the original post in this thread. Thanks for keeping the anti-Catholic stereotype alive and well.


[edit on 1-6-2006 by zerotolerance]

I'm sure forestlady knows the official responses... she did mention that she grew up as a Catholic.

Look, if you're wanting to convert, try using logic and proof... not "the bible says this", or "God says that". It simply doesn't work. Put yourself in the shoes of an athiest for a moment and try to think like they do... THEN try to answer those questions. You'll find that it all comes down to faith. You know who else has faith? Extremist Muslims, and they kill people in the name of their faith, just as Catholics used to. If only more people used their brains instead of following a religion like a bunch of sheep.

I just love these religious threads... so full of drama!

If there's any conspiracy, it's the Church making up lies about Secular Humanism being Satanic!

Now if you'll please excuse me while I pray to the Dark Lord.

Originally posted by Kruel
If there's any conspiracy, it's the Church making up lies about Secular Humanism being Satanic!

yep theres a satantic quote.

Originally posted by Pyros
BTW, can you refresh me on the rules regarding single-line responses, Mr. Moderator?

Nah.

Originally posted by Pyros
This is exactly the kind of glib response that typifies the anti-Catholic animus that shantyman was referring to.

Meh. I like glib.

It adds nothing to the content of the original post, yet seeks to inflame and denigrate an organization of over a billion people worldwide based upon the action of a select few.

That 'select few' are the heads of the organization. Its not an invalid point. The RCC is unpopular these days. Can you really blame people for thinking that there's somethign fundamentally wrong with its leaders protect people who repeatedely rape and abuse children? I mean, lots of the critics of the church are loonies who think that the pope is the anti-christ, so their rational is wrong, but the attacks, hell, they're well deserved.

Even most of the mods are anti-Catholic (if they don't say so, you can tell by their scathing remarks).

Like who????

Yeah, that Christmas thing really gets me

First off, if we're talking about the RCC, why the focus on Xmas? Its not specifically Catholic, and the backlash against Xmas has probably got more to do with a backlash against protestant fundamentalists than catholics.

andy1033
also in america people speculate that catholic priests are targeted to be put into comprimsing positions with regard to child abuse and paedophiles etc

Bollocks. These preists are raping kids, and the church is shuffling them around and quitely using money from the collection plates as hush money.

Because it's always been that way for the last 50 years in America.

And for hundreds of years prior to that Christmas wasn't even a big holiday with some fat guy in a little coat.

So why do we need to fix something that isn't broke?

You don't think that thats broken?

so you weren't around when it was different

I more than remember christmas being a huge deal around that time no matter where you went.

.....because it's cool and acceptablep

Thats right, I must be a real 'sheeple' and conformist to think that the church enabling child abuse is bad, or that mixing a religious holiday with sales on t-shirts and underwear is silly.

shantyman
or is this something that you just trot out whenever you see something Catholic? Personally, I think that latter

Yes that's right, I am a well known anti-catholic bigot on this board just itching at the chance to slander it.

As a lay minister, I can tell you that the Catholic Church in America is incredibly transparent now.

Thats fundamentally incorrect. You will not find any account as to how much money is being paid to people claiming abuse. You will not find a record of who is being investigated within the church, or a record of the progress of any such investigations. Nor will you find any record of who's been punished for child abuse within the church and where they've been moved to, or anything like that. Thats transparency.

And without excusing the priest molestations, Doctors, Lawyers, teachers, therapists all have much worse track records.

And when someone calls them a name, or gives them a hard time, we all say, 'good, screw that damned child-molestor'. So why are you complaining about some imaginary attack from 'Secular Humanists'???

Than again, there is always the legion of secular humanist pedophiles out there

Name one.

the Church does make the easy target

Well, thats true. Organizations that enable and protect childmolestors do make easy targets. Nambla, the RCC, etc.

forestlady
I don't like religions that condemn other religlions or beliefs, plain and simple, and I think the Catholic Church does that.

The RCC is part of the ecumenical movement, and recognizes that there are 'multiple paths to salvation', and that you don't even need to beleive in jesus to be saved (ie, jews go to heaven).

zerotolerance
More BS. Typical Catholic bashing propaganda.

What are you talking about? The Pope blessed the Nazi government! It loved Mussolini for giving it some of its old territory back. When it came down to it, the church accepted a land bribe and the hope of power that comes with it from fascists and nazis. There's no getting around it. It was horrible and wrong.

and so does God. Or didn't you know? Maybe you need to take this up with Him (see Bible).

Thats a crock. The RCC has a problem with gays, because god thinks its an abomination, like in levititcus? Then why can the church members eat shellfish, which is condemed, by god, in the bible, in the exact same language, as man on man sex. I mean, seems like an abomination is an abomination, and that shrimp should be as "disgusting and vile" as men having anal intercourse. And yet, its not prohibited by the Church..... could it be because the church members opposition to homosexuality has nothing to do with the bible????

Originally posted by zerotolerance

Wrong again. So misinformed. We are probably the least condemnable of all religions. In fact, the Protestants hate us with so much angst that they have stated they think our Pope is the Anti-Christ. When it comes to Protestants...we turn the other cheek and leave them be, but they hate us.

[edit on 1-6-2006 by zerotolerance]

I don't where you get the term "hate us" from. I am a protestant, but i most certainly do not hate catholics. I do agree on what Martin Luther and other Reformers say that the Papal religious system is the Anti-Christ, but because i believe that its the Anti-Christ, it automatically means i hate Catholics?