Satan and his Decendants

Yes, Nakash, you are accurate in the most part, as well as being HASTY.

To start, I wish to again note, these texts can be found at the following for review.

King Jame Bible 1611 Version
www.jesus-is-lord.com...

And the various chapters of Enoch can be found at
www.sacred-texts.com...

Both the King James Bible and the Books of Enoch links are to the whole text, but I am sure you can locate chapters as with Enoch 6 (VI) thru 11.(XI), and the Book of Genesis, in the KJV.

The Intro of Enoch explains the status of this work and some considerations to reflect upon. Review of this is important. There are some valid questions about this text, but as a confirmation of events outlined in Genesis 6, it supports the matter, and offers further details of what was going on in a short few chapters.

The review of this is to clearly understand what was taking place, and establish a period, or better said, a time frame, to see how long this was taking place.

To continue with the last Post, a review of those two chapters will be quite short.

Chapter Ten deals with with each Archangel being told what to do.

Uriel goes to Noah, and the task of the Ark is being taken care of.

Raphael is to bind Azazel, and there is something specific noted here in Chapter X verse 8

'8. And the whole earth has been corrupted through the works that were taught by Azâzêl: to him ascribe all sin.'

I am curious though, why Azazel is noted here, of having the 'sentance' imposed on him, as described. This, I have not quite understood, since the Bible does assign this to a single enitity, Satan. He alone, from the begining of the Recreation to the end of this Earth Age, is noted as being JUDGED, and sentanced.

Gabriel is instructed to deal with the Spawn of the Fallen, and as noted previously, this seemed quite easy, since, as in the case of the Giants, they did not play well together.

And Michael, is instructed to bind Semiazaz and his followers.

Chapter XI, is the the coming event, the Flood

I will open the store chambers of blessing which are in the heaven, so as to send them down ⌈upon the earth⌉ over the work and labour of the children of men.

And the result is to bring Truth and Peace to man

We close with this, and put Enoch away, except for reference sake.



So, over the last few day, I have attempted to do onething, and this is to ensure we are clear by what is implied in the Genesis account of Chapter 6.

The Fallen, and the leader of these, turned from their duties and came to Earth and took the Daughters of man.

From what is noted, we must consider the following. We can have two views from this.

1: The Fallen came and, regardless of Race or Family lines, intermingled Globally, teaching man (the Races & Family Line) and fornicating with the Daughters of the same......

OR

2: The Fallen came and, regardless of Race and with a Specific Family Line, intermingled Globally, teaching man, (the Races and a Specific Family Line) and fornicating with the Daughters of the same................

We have noted, there is a relationship between one of the Fallen, Azazel, who had unique knowledge, and Tubal Cain, the first Metal Smith.

Nakash also noted Shemyaza as being a Syrian diety. .

I expect many of these, made homes in various cultures, but also within the decendants of Cain, for the following reason.

Genesis 6 verse 8 & 9 state as follows

6:8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. 6:9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

What is being noted here? What does this suggest?

Perfect in the Hebrew is tamiym meaning; without blemish, complete, full, perfect, sincerely sound, without spot, undefiled, uprightly whole.

Generations, in the Hebrew is toldah, meaning as it implies, generations, but from the root yalad meaning to show lineage, declare pedigrees

So Noah's family had one thing. A pure, unblemished pedigree to Adam. What 'blemish' could have upset this pedigree? The Fallen and their pastime of Fornication with the daughters of man.

This had not occured in Noah's family, so I would be led to believe those prior to Noah, and his sons, had maintained a pure and unspoiled existance away from the intermingling of the Angels with man.

So this means, we have one family, (and without doubt, several of the Sixth Day Peoples) that did not intermingle with the Fallen. This pure Pedigree will be important to recall, as this progresses. This is an important pedigree.

In closing, we'll see what we can findout about Tubal Cain, and see what history offers in respect to him in the next post.

Until then

Ciao

Shane

[edit on 18-5-2006 by Shane]

So, lets just look at some names. See what we can find. Some may be familiar to many. Tales of renown may infact be part of their fame.


First, we had Cain

Then we get Tubal Cain

How about Gengish Cain (Khan) or Kublia Cain (Khan) ?

After all, we do pronouce Tubal Cain as too bal' kah' yin (in the Hebrew).

Cain, Spawn of Satan?
Azazel, teaching Tubal weapons craft?
Kubla and Genghis are some really nice fellows, seeming hellbent on a path of civility, aren't they? They excelled, in the arts of Weapons use.

Is anything curious in any of this?

Let's look at them for a minute. Are there 'Others' that have suggestions of who these people may have been?

en.wikipedia.org...

Although, I have some difficulties with some of the text, there are comments that should be noted and considered.

There are various interpetations offered. He was a metal smith. He is associated with the sword, and save this for later, the spear. He did go to Nod, but this is missleading to some extend.

(Adam and Eve, where banished from Edin, and they were sent East of the Garden. After Cain has spoken to God, he departs East, to the land of Nod.

If you hit the Wiki link for this(The Land of Nod), it refered to a place east of the Edin, but it truly is further east than implied. Cain and Abel where born, East of Edin, (Sorry I am doing it again) Eden, so Cain is really moving much further east from Eden (I got it that time) ).

Wiki offers little for Tubal Cain

en.wikipedia.org...

This gets redirected to Lamech, Decendant of Cain, and I must say, for an attempt of denote a Factual Representation or work for this subject, the first paragraph makes clear of the knowledge available within this topic in Wikipedia.

Lamech is refered to, two people in the Genesis.

First, is in Genesis 4, when covering the generations of Cain. Lamech is the Sixth Generation from Cain, and born roughly 600 years after Cain went to Nod, give or take some 100 years eitherway.

The Second reference to Lamech is in Adam's pedigree to Noah found in Chapter 5. Lamech is Noahs Father. Noah is born roughly 1000 years after Adam was formed, and Lamech was 182 Years old when Noah was Born.

THESE ARE DISTINCTLY DIFFERENT PEOPLE, much like John, and John. They are just both named John. There are simliarities to all of the names in both family lines.

The balance of the text offers thoughts, but it really did not get into Tubal Cain.

Maybe else where someone has something to say about him.

Oh to the googling gods. Good heavens.
Tubal Cain, the Secret password of a Mason
freemasonrywatch.org...

The Clan of Tubal Cain
members.aol.com...

Secret Masonic Handshakes, Passwords, signs, and Grips for the Entered Apprentic
www.ephesians5-11.org...

Peace Sign (Scroll down, Tubal is found within text about the Vulcan, live long and prosper part)
www.nisbett.com...

You'll never think the same way again...the revelation
www.theforbiddenknowledge.com...

This has the Wiki page cut verbatim.
www.answers.com...

Tubal Cain Poem
www.phoenixmasonry.org...

This is the result of two words, Tubal Cain. 9 links, one which came up, 'Page can not be displayed', and the previous note wikipage, show up on the first result page alone for the search. Answers.com, copies the wiki site verbatim.

But is it clear, Tubal Cain, has some curious associates. 7 of these 8 different links telling us Tubal is something else, just in the very first Google page. I really mean, a Man of Renown. Worshiped comes to mind.

The second google page contains similiar topics, but you can google that and check those on your own.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

So, lets just look at where this leads, Let's just see where Khan leads to.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

We seem to be able to flow, without much difficulty to here, going from Kublia back to Genghis, and tracing back the Khan line to the Huns. Here we are stopped, since the next personage to follow may be mythic, named Kama. The Link Siwngs into Hindu beliefs.

Hitting Kings of the Huns though, give a link to a pedigree.

freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com...
freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com...
freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com...

We'll end here and pickup on this

Running out of Space.

Ciao

Shane

Not sure yet where all this is heading ,though i am finding it interesting this far Shane.

A little more on Tubal Cain or as the Masons have it "two ball cane" which can be seen in the picture marked "C".

freemasonrywatch.org...

Or a larger pic here,at the bottom of the page.

www.nisbett.com...

Well, this isn't making too much sense:

-If Azazel was bound (which he was according to both Enoch and the Bible) how can he be teaching things to (of all people) the Khanates? Are you aware that Genghis Khan was highly friendly with Christians by the way, and that he was for half his life a just ruler looking after his people's interests (though undoubtably brutal in his conquest of China, that I cannot dispute) before his embassador had his head sliced and sent in a plate by a bunch of Islamic fanatics? You would be speaking Turkish today if it wasn't for him that I can assure you

- Are you attempting to link any group of people with Satan? This is what your inferring, that somebody is the SPAWN of Satan. Hardly diplomatic

-I have never seen any Tubal Cain in Masonry. This sounds like another Hiram Abiff or Jahbulon hoax....

just some thoughts....

Great thread. My eyes hurt. You obviously put a lot of time and effort into this.
Could you elaborate on the Edin/Eden thing? Also do you know the present day location of Eden or Nod? Do you think the decendants of the fallen are running the world today?

Hello Shane, Congratulations on a great thread

I have read the book of Enoch and find it fascinating, and some of the stuff that you have put forward makes great sense now, so thank you.

Quick question, with regards to the Garden of Eden, why do you refer to it as Edin?

Thanks

Well made points Nakash.

Azazel or any of the Fallen had a period of time on earth, of some 1000 Years, at the very least, and may well have a period of time going back to the point of the Sixth Day of Recreation. This of course is because the Bible's account of Satan and the history of his fall recounted thoughout the scriptures. It is clear in the Garden with Eve, he was not acting or doing what he was supposed to be doing. But we will get to that later.

And Yes, Cain is the Spawn of Satan. That's the Premise, and I am sticking with it. This is as far I will will assert. Cain and his decendants are another matter, and I am just pointing out what Genesis 4 verses 11 thru 17 note.

4:11 And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand; 4:12 [i]When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth. 4:13 And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear. 4:14 Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me. 4:15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him. 4:16 And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden. 4:17 And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.

Now, this is not portraying Harrison Ford hiding from the Law or the LORD. Homeless, I doubt this as well, since in the later part, Cain Built a City and named it Enoch, after his first son. Will it mean, he will need to sustain himself, much like the races, from the Fruits of the Trees, and the beasts and the fowl of the Earth, I think so, since as we know, a Farmer is not a wanderer. He tills the earth, and the earth nurtures the Seed and the crops grow. Cain was banished for his act and the earth itself, will no longer nuture the seed to grow and be fruitful.

Do you understand what I mean Nakash?

And lets be clear. Being a decendant only denotes a history. It does not mean, Attlia the Hun, as he sacked Roman Soliders and bloodletted and slaughter the enemy in such a manner, was doing so inspired by Satanic influences. Genghis Khan may well have been civil with Christians, but as you note he certainly had his moments.

It is all too easy to over look this one thing. The Huns, the Khans and the Steppes people from in and around the Black Sea, and the Bulgars carry forth an expertises, that during their specific period, was unmatched. Attila, may have held more land, than anyone in History. If I understand his background, Atilla's influence was from France east to western Asia, as well as a large portion of what the Romans and Greeks refered to as the ends of the earth, being the eastern areas from the Black Sea.

And most importantly, I am not trying to place all these peoples over this quick 4000 Years of History from the Khans to the Huns, to Hu. This is a history, already united. When I started this last few posts, I had no Idea that the Hun's and the Khans had this relationship, and kinship, and appear to have a common Bloodline.

I did expect Khan/Kain/Quyan/Quan/Cain similiarities would be able to be found, but a presumed pedigree going well past 1800 BC was not the result I had expected.

These Tribal Wandering Nomadic people had the Best Weapons for the Age of their Warfare, and abilities to use these far better than anyone at their time. To me, this is THE CURSE of CAIN, in his decendants. Whether that Curse, has benefits, that a point of speculation, but I suggest it does.

As for Masonry this was just the result of Googling Tubal Cain. Nothing there is fabrication of my imagination. That is just a observation of a Google result, trying to see what secular texts may have to note about Tubal. But we will also get to this more closely, just prior to finishing with Satan.

Thanks for your thoughts, because again, they are questions that should be asked Nakash

Ciao

Shane

Hello Elmo777

I will say this and be to the point for a change.

Edin/Eden are one and the same. My thoughts is this was the Place God resided on Earth during the Recreation. The Sixth day man inhabited their specific areas sustaining themsleves as they have all throughout history and can still be seen today.

Edin/Eden (This is pure specualtion on my part) was removed from earth when God removed his seat from earth. It's not here right now. This I will note with confidence. Will we find it or see it? This generation shall not pass, til all these things take place, to paraphrase a scripture in Matt 24.

And yes, to your last question. Is this not obvious? It is one huge, intermingle mass of deception, readying us for the days ahead. The days Daniel spoke of.

Ciao

Shane

Originally posted by DodgeG1

Quick question, with regards to the Garden of Eden, why do you refer to it as Edin?

Thanks

Some sad misconception I may harbour in the back of my mind, that revolves around the Most Wonderful and Glorious Place that "mayhave" been on this Earth. It seems to promote this freudian slip thing,

I may also have answered more of this previously to Elmo

Ciao

Shane

So we have an ancestory going back to Hu 'Son of Heaven' as this last noted link indicates.

freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com...

This shows Hu, is the beginging of this pedigree, and it predates 1800 BC and ends.
So I wonder what can be found googling Hu 'Son of Heaven'?

Not very much, is evidence in many areas to review. We can, be brought back to the Five Hu, the Nomadic Warrior like Non Chinese peoples/tribes causing problems for the Han Dynasty in and around 300 AD., where we started with the Khans in the first place.

Wiki again has a link, as follows en.wikipedia.org...

It gives accounts of the Hu, and confirms their nature and tendancies. It also defines them again, in the Regions of the Steppes and the Black Sea and Eastern Hu is refered to several times. They did live West of China, so this region is quite easy to locate.

Earlier it was noted, Cain did move east of Eden, but further east than where he was born, after the expulsion from the Garden of Eve and Adam. The Land of Nod, is defined as a Nomadic Place, and this area fits well, within the realm of possibles for this Land.

But from a perspect of 'Others', this is likely the best that can be amassed, in a view days of review.

I've never done this previously, and there is much to review and consider, but here, the intent was to see what 'Other's could offer.

From this, we seem to hit a period that is nearing the dawn of Civilized Man, and certainly a period of developing cultures and the start of the Bronze Age.

Of course, we could root through the worship of peoples, but again this will really only show, the intermingled gods and dieties (The Fallen) and ccme to that point where speculation would carry the thread to confusion.

So we'll return in the next post, and review some of what is found elsewhere, in the Bible.

Ciao

Shane

So, what evidence can be amassed to direct us to believe Satan rebelled and lead the Fallen with him.

Well let look at another Old Testament Book, JOB.

www.jesus-is-lord.com...

Well It seems we do not have to look to hard.

1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil. 2 And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters.

3 His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east.

4 And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them. 5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

So we find a man named Job who like his decendant Noah, maintained a honest life and was perfect and upright, in the same sense as Noah was.

He does have a blessed family with 10 Fine Children.

He is also a well off perosn, judging from his 'substance' and seems to be following the husbandry of Abel in the stewardship of his lifestock, which is an impressive total of beasts.

He is also maintianing the sacrafice, and duties all should, in accordance to the laws of God.

Here is where we become reintroduced to this Satan. Despite what many, in pulpits around this globe may suggest, he is quite free, in his travels, and is mingling with Angels (sons of God). We will also see, he is living up to his name.

But maybe, we sould review his name first, so we can see what his traits are.

Satan Strongs # 7854 Satan an opponent; the arch-enemy of good ; -adversary,

Satan from the Root # 7853 satan;- to attack (figuratively) accuse:- (be an) adversary

Just so we know who we are discussing.

And we pickup the tale.

6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.

7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou?

Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?

9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought? 10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land. 11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.

12 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD

So, Satan is Coming and going, in his Spiritual Body, where ever he may please. He makes no attempt to hide this.

The Lord then asks of Job, and Satan's impression of him, and the responses seem quite clear.

Satan, as his tendancy is, manipulates the matter, and presents God with a theory, and suggests He (God) put forth his hand and destroy this nice life Job has, to see if Job would them curse God for his coming string of unfortunate circumstances.

God's response is quite clear. You Satan, can do as you wish with all Job has, but you can not take Job's life. And Satan departs for earth.

You can review the text yourself as we go along.

First, we see news arriving that the 'Sabeans' have come and taken the Oxen and Asses and slew all there, except this messenger who escaped.

[Sabeans in the Hebrew is sheba meaning the name of three of the early progenitors who later form the tribes, and of an Distict in Ethiopia;- Sheba, Sabeans]

Second, theres more news arriving claiming Fire came from the heavens and burnt all the sheep and servants, except this messenger who escaped.

Third, While this is going on, more news arrives, and this time those Chaldeans (made up of three bands/Groups) came and have taken the Camels, and slew all the servants, except this messenger who escaped.

[Chaldeans: Hebrew for an astrologer from the Prime Kesed a decendant of Abraham]

Fourth, further news arrives and Job is told his Children are all dead, when a wind blew the home down upon them, except for this messenger who escaped.

Sad, sad story. In mere moments, everything this man accomplished with the blessing of the Lord is gone, inclusive of his family.

Ciao

Shane

Originally posted by Nakash
MAYBE, but this whole thing on bloodlines and so forth- just reminds me of David Icke and his weird ideas on Serpent Gods, reptilians, etc.

Isnt it weird?! Its like a religious and atheist version of the same story! Ive read some Billy Myers stuff and it references books like Enoch and *thinks* cant remember, some other gnostic stuff to back up the alien presence.

These theories have lots of evidence to back 'em up too, which can be scary. I mean if you look at the 'evil' corporate empire and the type of people it encourages to become successful in it *shudders* the psychopathy and narcissism that is blatantly rewarded (see Robert Greene). I know Im keeping an open mind but Im not believing in anything, especially the religious angle as they always seems to end with "Jesus is Lord" and that doesnt sit right with me.

So JOB an his wife have just lost everything he had.

And what does Job do?

20 Then Job arose, and rent his mantle, and shaved his head, and fell down upon the ground, and worshipped, 21 And said, Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD. 22 In all this Job sinned not, nor charged God foolishly

How is that for living for the LORD.?

Again, we see the Coming and going of Satan, and coming to God.

3 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? and still he holdeth fast his integrity, although thou movedst me against him, to destroy him without cause.

4 And Satan answered the LORD, and said, Skin for skin, yea, all that a man hath will he give for his life. 5 But put forth thine hand now, and touch his bone and his flesh, and he will curse thee to thy face.

6 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life.

7 So went Satan forth from the presence of the LORD, and smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown.

Satan has done his best here, and through these hardships, and these discussions, going from dispair, along with various other emotions to the LORD Speaking from a Whirlwind, what is the result?

JOB is still as noted earlier, not Blaming or Cursing God.

And what does Job gain. More Blessings than he had prior to Satan and his misguided attempt to destroy one's faith in his God.

But again this was covered for two reasons. To show what Satan is doing, even to this day, and that he does have influence. He caused that wind (tornado?) to destroy Job's Children in that house, and has the ability, to create fire (from the Sky?) to destroy those Sheep and Servants as well.

This is beyond what is normally accustomed to being associated to Satan. Of course the Sebeans and Chaldeans both where influenced in the more normally accepted method Satan uses. But it was in Satan's hand to do what he did to Job, all be it with God's approval. He is the master of this earth, so it is not difficult to believe, he has control over things such as this here. Divine authority to do has he pleases, would be an overstatement, but he was part of the assembly of those in Heaven and is quite a being, and far more than mere mortal man.

And actual discription and account of his failings, is noted in Ezekiel 28. It references the prince of Tyrus, and discusses this princes failings and what God will do about it.

In verse 11, we see another reference to the King of Tyrus, but this is no king. It is
but one of those terms associated with Satan throughout history. The Price of Tyre, a man and no god, of course follows the King. Does his bidding, so to speak.

We'll pickup here

11 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, 12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him,

Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. 13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created. 14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. 15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. 17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness:

I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee. 18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee. 19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

The first part is what he was blessed with, the middle part covers his sins, and the last part will occur after the millenium, when Hell is opened and those who choose, can leap into this fire, and be as their master, 'and never shalt thou be anymore'.

More to come

Ciao

Shane

Hello

I got side tracked this last while. I was bothered by how the End of a Line came to a conclusion, without much information, when we looked at what details Other's could offer about Cain.

For some silly reason, I had believed Khan = Cain, as in Tubal Cain, was just a different application of Cain and that this was implying Genghis and Kublai were decendants of Cain.

We looked and could Identify them as not being Chinese, and where extremely adept as warriors and at the weapons crafts. They inhabited a region around the Black Sea and the Steppes region. Frequently Warred, but where a mainly Nomadic Peoples, with no specific dwelling place. I found several had long Blonde hair, according to the texts previously offered.

They Warred North, South, East and West, and whenever their habitation place is refered to, it is the edge of the world, or unkown regions. When these peoples hit their most influencial periods of their rich history, they encompassed more of the Globe than many of our Western Leaders of History.

A Family rich in glorious deeds, mighty men, men of renown.

Going from the name premise, we started with Genghis and Kublai, and tried to see where we would end, and it was Sort of depressing ending with to details only. Chungvi, ruled the Huns around 1800 BC, and he was decendant of Hu, 'Son of Heaven'

Reviewing what I could locate, I came across some supporting evidence, to confirm the Chinese opinons of the Wei Hu, or Hu, but ran across a difference in the Name as an original. See the Following

www.gateserver.net...

Huns

Many historians consider the '''Huns''' (meaning "person" in Mongolian language) the first Mongolian and Turkic peoples|Turkic people mentioned in European history. They originated from lands between modern day Siberia and Korea, then migrated progressively westward. References in Chinese sources to peoples called the Xiong-Nu (Hsiung-nu) go back to 1200 BC. Their Xiong (匈) rulers, first mentioned as a family in 1766 BC in the story of Chunwei and the fall of the Xia dynasty, may be the ancestors of the later, better-known (to western scholars) Huns, though not all scholars agree. Korean legend takes the stand that an alliance of northern Altaic tribes under a "Huan" ruler from 7193 BC pre-dated the establishment of China.

Huan established rule of the Altaic tribes in 7193 BC

I started wondering about this. We see a name we know from the previous pedigree, dating about 1800 BC. Here it is specified to 1766 BC. Could Huan be Hu 'Son of Heaven'? Huan, Son and God, a Sun God. It makes perfect sense, but we would need to consider the following.

The Great Flood

For some background, see the following Wiki Site.

en.wikipedia.org...

It dates a Flood Occuring around 5600 BC. Robert Ballard has confirmed, 300 ft down, there is evidence of Habiation around what would have been costal areas prior to this flood.

We also must consider the Ark. It was not a Power Ark, nor Sail Ark, but a Floatation Craft, made solely to harbor Noah and his Family. Would it be difficult to expect, the ark to at least reside or be attributed to have landed somewhere within the region that it originated? Say within 500 to 1000 Miles? Because it is suggested the ark is today, in Turkey.

And saying this, it was 1661 Years after the Creation of Adam, to when Noah and his family climbed into the Ark.

5600 BC + 1661 Years from Adam to the Flood = 7261 BC to the Time of Adam's Creation. We do not know who long after that Creation took place that Adam would have 'known' Eve. We do not know how long it was till they departed the Garden. But we have 68 Years, from Huan's united some of the Atlaic Peoples and ample time for Cain to have been born, growup, kill Abel and be banished.

This following link decribes the Black Sea, and the Flood, but it's basis is to refer to the Atlantis Story and Plato's date of that flood to 9600 BC. It confirms the 5600 BC Flood Occured, but it offers some unique Maps and some comments are interesting, although again, it's main effort is to support Plato and find Atlantis.

atmo.info...

In the Credits, there was a Reference to the following, The Altai Flood??

66.102.7.104...:LV1I2rbyQJEJ:www.mines.edu/academic/geology/faculty/klee/altai.doc&hl=en

But I completely agree with many who read this. THIS IS SPECULATION, OBSERVATION, and only CIRCUMSTANCIAL AT BEST.

We are aware, preflood peoples had a life span considerably longer than today. (10x's). Would it be fair to suggest those 8 or 9 Missing Links between HU and ChengHu would have been just those Generations between the Creation of Adam to the Flood?

I do find this quite curious, and would agree, this maybe something to consider at lenght.


Ciao

Shane

[edit on 21-5-2006 by Shane]

Originally posted by Dae

Isnt it weird?! Its like a religious and atheist version of the same story! Ive read some Billy Myers stuff and it references books like Enoch and *thinks* cant remember, some other gnostic stuff to back up the alien presence.

May I ask, what would be your thoughts of an Alien Presence?

Beings with powers and controls that are far superior to yours?

There are many such names for Being's of this nature.

I know Im keeping an open mind but Im not believing in anything, especially the religious angle as they always seems to end with "Jesus is Lord" and that doesnt sit right with me.

And if those choices come down to two, who would your choose? Thats the situation or angle you should keep inmind.

Thank's for your comments though

Ciao

Shane

Originally posted by Shane
May I ask, what would be your thoughts of an Alien Presence?

Quite possible, from casual observers to full out manipulation, its possible as I said.

There are many such names for Being's of this nature.

Yup, the religious angle calls them demons/satan and the alien view, well calls them aliens. You also have religious people who dont believe that satan is running rampant just like you have alien believers who dont think any harm comes from them.

And if those choices come down to two, who would your choose? Thats the situation or angle you should keep inmind.

That is the crunch eh. Ive thought a bit about this and still will give it thought. My working conclusion is to be mindful, Im certianly going to keep alert to any manipulation - Im not going to be taken in by any cheap miracles thats for sure.

So a 'While' ago, we were looking at Cain and his decendants, and we'll pickup from there and dispose of the Backtrack aspect from 'Others' for a while.

So, who is this Satan. We saw a breif discription of him in Ezekiel, as noted, and the fall from grace he took.

In the New Testament, we see a distinct difference from the varied manner inwhich the Adversary is denoted.

Christ, in several scriptures indicates Beelzebub and Satan are one and the same in his implications to the Pharisee and their questioning of Casting out Demons.

Matthew 12

24....Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: 26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? 27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. 28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

Matthew 24 speaks of another reference as:

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

We are seeing a direction that is unlike the Old Testament. Whether this is due to the beliefs of the our Jewish Brothers, and the oversight on thier part, of what Christ represented is another debate. We are being told, of the other attributes Apollyon, the Destroyer has, as suggested in Revelations.

Other areas desribe Satan as the Devil, or the Evil One, even though the reference or matter being discussed is similiar, as in Matthew 13:19, Mark 4:15 and Luke 8:12. All three are discussing the Same topic.

Paul refers to Satan and his works as:

2 Thessalonians

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. 7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: 9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

This alone was in respects of questionable thoughts already surfacing with this Church regarding the return of Christ. Already, Satan was at work twisting truth.

Wikipedia have a very extensive outlook on this, which echos some of the matter here, as well as outlooks from Other Religious orders

en.wikipedia.org...

And see the following. It represents many additional names for this Unique Individual.

en.wikipedia.org...

Quite a listing of names, and review of these labels, offer a wealth of detail to review, if for nothing else, to see how inter-related the whole concept of Satan and the Fallen have been interwoven into our mutually respects histories.

This was just so we know, who we are discussing and the influence he has pettled around the globe.

Ciao

Shane

Hello Again

I am not intenting to spend much time on this, but Wikipedia have a Section for the Wu Hu, (Five Hu) that I found interesting. See the following

en.wikipedia.org...

Han definition for Xiongnu

Traditional historians interpreted Hu as barbarians; some further stretched this obsolete analogy to equate Hu with the Xiongnu. Others objected to such similarities, stating that Wu Hu were substantially civilized before the turmoil of the Western Jin Dynasty.

Xiongnu was in fact the most powerful non-Chinese ethnic group neighboring the Chinese Han Dynasty therefore the Han simply referred to them as the Hu (the non-Chinese or the barbarian). Both terms were used concurrently. Nevertheless, Hu later became the collective term for non-Chinese ethnic groups and was often preceded by Chinese numerals and characters such as Wu (five) and Zhu (numerous). A diplomatic message in Han Shu defined Hu as the proud son of heaven (天之驕子) (Chapter 94).

I just thought that was curious. Not only is Hu 'Son of Heaven', but he carries the trait of Cain's forefather, PRIDE.

The Decendants of Cain. Who are they?

Well I feel I have given this an honest attempt, and from my prepsective they are the peoples that would have habitated 'past the second' Mountain Range from Edin, (sorry) Eden. Cain departed east, from where Adam and Eve took up residence, after being escorted out of the Garden.

I believe, Geology had a major role in cultures, and (Mountain Ranges) would have been commonly used as markers for regions, I believe Adam and Eve would have habitated somewhere east of the next Mountain range from Eden. Hence, I would expect no less of Cain. I would therefore expect, I would locate Cain, within that Black Sea region, knowing, Cain is from 'ADAMIC' stock, apposed to those who would have dwelt in the region originally. He did find a Wife or more "IN the land of Nod."

I have seen many notes and comments in respects to a People refered to as Kenites, which of course, could be associated and carried the name, but are not the problem, Cain, and His Seed are.

Today, we have people who claim decendancy throught Cain, to Adam. They are also insinuating by implication, that they are therefore hiers to David's Throne. Nothing short of this could be considered, but the problem is again, part of prophesy,.........

Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and
between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

This 'emnity', is eternal. It's a statement of fact. It is ever occuring. Today, it is occuring.

We have Movies suggesting as much, with the Da Vinci Codes, and books galore. Is it any wonder, Satan and his Horde are Primetime Television.

But again, I do draw attention that Cain was Adamic and thus, is different from the Other Races, who accepted him, for what he was. He was Trained in Animal husbandry. He was an agricultural person who could work and fabricate tools inorder to do his tasks. He was educated as such from a child. He knew the Holy Days, (as did all the races at one point). He was quite unique, to those living in the Land of Nod.

Nomadic peoples living in the Steppes region of the Black Sea. History suggests they may have been the Altaic people who according to, (One) pedigree support that and atests to the fact that from the Altaic peoples came the Huns, and Khans through the Hu.

(I never did find an definition for Altaic, anyone?)

I am in no way advocating that these peoples are the problems, but I expect Cain, and through him, Tubal Cain had direct in mutually agreeable relations including cohabitant and families, who, would have maintained the Khan (King) line from Cain. But I also expect there are many on this planet that have relations in some respect to these people, as the evolved to what they became. There could be relatives of Attila from the west of Europe to the Coasts of Asia. Rape and Pillage warfare was the theme of the day. This, along with the obvious technology provided by Tubal Cain in Metal Work, did seem to afford these peoples a very interesting life style to say they least.

Now we will have maybe two or three other pieces that need to be addressed. Half of the previous posts was due to curiousity, and look where we ended. I found that startling, to say the least.

Not spoken much about yet, are the other families that came out of the Region, with just as much of an lineage known as the European Hun's. We'll carry on in respects to this shortly.

We'll also be discussing the Fallen's Offspring, and the Flood for a moment or two.

And some Conjecture, which claims are no less valid than current beliefs, since exact evidence is at a complete loss.

And that should wrap it up.

Until then

Ciao

Shane

So if Cain was the son of Adam, that means when he went to "The land of Nod" he would of met his sister and married her? as there wouldn't be anyone else present on Earth? Is that right?

Originally posted by DodgeG1
So if Cain was the son of Adam, that means when he went to "The land of Nod" he would of met his sister and married her? as there wouldn't be anyone else present on Earth? Is that right?

I hope that was just a silly question, DodgeG1

Genesis Chapter 1

26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. 29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. 30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so. 31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

No my friend. The land of Nod was occupied by Sixth Day man. As was Africa, Asia, Austrailia, South Amercia, North America and Europa. The Races came from the Original Recreation. Not from Interbreeding between siblings, as much of Christianity wishes you to believe.

These people can be indentified by what they where given, by God, and up until the last few centurys, we could see Sixth Day Man providing this Stewardship with the Land, as outlined in these few verses.

Adam, was created solely for 1 reason, which was to tend the garden, as you will see, further on in the Second Chapter of Genesis.

www.jesus-is-lord.com...

Just for you!

Now, it is clear, a day means little, to God, and a Day could well intent to mean 2000 Years, or 500000 Years. So the Population at this time, would have been stable and growing, long before Adam, and Eve, (who was created because Adam had no one to share his life with LIKE HIM). Adamic means ruddy Complextion, or able to Blush, implying he was a Caucason, apposed to the Beautiful Nubeans, or Proud Asians, or Aboriginies, or American Native Populations.

So please, ensure, the next time you speak to the wingnut who ever suggested that interbreeding within the Family is the reason the Bible Accounts for these Beautiful and Vibrant Cultures, let them know they can ask for me for an Education. (And I hope this did not come from a Pulpit, because lies like these, will be dealt with harshly in the next few years. Wolfs, leading the Sheep astray, will be punished accordingly)

And I hope you also are not then of the mind that Everyone came from Noah, as some misguided freaks have implied in this Post earlier. Again, look at Cultural Lore, and you will find Africans do not have many accounts of Floods.

Much like that twisted mindset that suggests the Flood was global and everything was killed. The only thing that was killed are the Lessor gods and dieties, and those infected with the impure bloodline.

Sorry, if I have come across harshly, since I did not mean to, but this sort of misrepresentation of Scripture, irks me, since all it takes is reading it for yourself. Then you have those answers. Listening to Man, and the doctrines constructed inorder to ensure 10% for Tithes, and compliance amoungst the sheep, is foolish. It is not according to the Word of God.

Ciao

Shane




[edit on 23-5-2006 by Shane]