I was under thie impression that the beating was only by the higher raked officials under controlled conditions. But then again who knows.

Those crazy Germans, always wanting to beat up on something!!!

Ok serisouly. This is no laughing matter. I didn't know there were beatings. Perhaps it was just the particular lodge?

What a horrible way to go. He wasn't even supposed to go through with it! My condolences to the family. And shame on those involved!

Getting pissed-drunk and receiving paddling during an initiation??

This has to be some sort of un-masonic conduct. Sounds more like a college fraternity.

Originally posted by Arcane Demesne


Ok serisouly. This is no laughing matter. I didn't know there were beatings. Perhaps it was just the particular lodge?

I don't know much about the Prince Hall Affiliation. My Grand Lodge does not recognize Prince Hall organizations, and therefore I've never been inside a Prince Hall Lodge.

However, let me stress that regular Masonry does NOT practice hazing or beatings. The ceremonies of Freemasonry are artistic, colorful, beautiful, and intellectual.

If that Prince Hall Lodge was indeed to blame for that person's death, it is the duty of the Prince Hall Grand Master to publicly and privately renounce all forms of hazing, revoke the charter of the Lodge, and expel all of those involved. Criminal charges should also be filed.

[edit on 9-3-2006 by Masonic Light]

This sort of thing is very common. I've got friends who were beaten-up as part of their induction. It helps set the tone of fear and intimidation under which they operate.

Anyway here's more tales from the invisible world....



Goat was going to be used in Fraternity Initiation Ritual

Last month, police officers happened upon a Kentucky University fraternity party and found a live goat cruelly kept in a storage room that was going to be used in an initiation ritual. In this case, a 19-year-old was charged with a second-degree count of cruelty to animals. According to the report, the university has had three hazing incidents on campus since 1996.

However, the incident involving the death of a 21 year old in Mannheim, is related to being in the army. In the UK, there have been numerous reports in the media of young men dying in similar circumstances, such as the four young soldiers shot dead at Deepcut Barracks in Surrey, although these haven't been reported as Masonic related:

Concern over soldiers deaths
Report by Andrew Hosken

"The Today programme has discovered that the Army has destroyed some of the evidence requested by detectives investigating four fatal shootings at the Deepcut Barracks in Surrey. The Army says that clothes and documents were only destroyed when all civilian and military investigations were complete and that there could be no way of knowing that the police were to re-open some inquiries.

Within 24 hours of talking to his mother, Jim Collinson, a 17 year old Army recruit was dead. He died from a single bullet while on guard duty at Deepcut Barracks in Surrey on March 23rd.

...In the four shooting-related deaths at Deepcut since 1995 there has only been one suicide ruling. Two have been open verdicts and there has yet to be a decision in the Collinson case.

Surrey detectives are again investigating all four cases at Deepcut. But the Today programme has discovered that some of the clothes and documents asked for by the police to help with the inquiry have been destroyed by the Army."

Calls for a public inquiry over the incidents have been turned down.

Freemason Shot Dead in a Masonic Ritual

A Freemason was accidentally shot dead in a Masonic ritual in a Lodge in New York state, in March 2004:

Quote:
Inductee Shot Dead at Long Island Masonic Lodge Rite

A secretive initiation ceremony in the basement of a Long Island Masonic lodge went "tragically wrong" when a member mistakenly pulled out a loaded weapon and fatally shot an inductee in the face, police said Tuesday.

William James, 47, of Medford, N.Y., was pronounced dead at the scene of Monday night’s shooting inside the Southside Masonic Lodge, said Suffolk County Detective Lt. Jack Fitzpatrick.

... Fitzpatrick said the ceremony was designed to create "a state of anxiety" for the inductees. Police also found a guillotine, rat traps, and a wooden board that Fitzpatrick surmised was used in some type of "walking the plank" routine in the basement of the one-story building.

...While officials of the lodge denied that guns play a role in ceremonies, Fitzpatrick said members told police the rite involving a gun with blanks goes back at least 70 years.


Inductee Shot Dead at Long Island Masonic Lodge Rite

Originally posted by Edelweiss Pirate

This sort of thing is very common. I've got friends who were beaten-up as part of their induction. It helps set the tone of fear and intimidation under which they operate.

Not really. They're juvenile and childish stunts done for "entertainment". Needless to say, only a complete idiot would find such a thing "entertaining". I have no sympathy for any fraternity that practices hazing, regardless if they call themselves "Masonic".

Freemason Shot Dead in a Masonic Ritual

I'm familiar with this case: this was not a Masonic ritual. It occured inside a Masonic Lodge, but the ritual was for the "Southside Fellowcraft Club", created by some of the members of that Lodge. They wrote their own ritual, consisting of jokes and pranks. During the ritual, the retard who was supposed to fire blanks fired a real round. He was in his '80's, and thought he had exchanged the bullets for blanks.

The Grand Master acted promptly, and expelled all the members of this "Southside Club" from Masonry. Criminal charges were also filed for criminal negligence and voluntary manslaughter, as they should have been.

Real Masons will countenance no form of hazing in Masonic Rites, and no man has ever been killed during a legitimate Masonic ceremony.

Thank you for replying Masonic Light, I must say however that I do not recognise the Masonry you describe. Maybe you are a Blue Degree mason, this would account for your positive view of the craft.

From what I have observed,of the higher realms of Masonry there is much that is very sinister indeed. The mysteries of initiatic science, the birthright which is kept from the profane, is little short of black magic and is used (again from what I have observed) to create nothing short of a mind controlled international army which at any time can be mobilised to perform any task without consulation of individual conscience and under strict, military style orders.

I do not need to remind readers here about the type of actions these individuals may carry out. This information has been repeatedly exposed to the public in movies, on TV and even some of the press, in an attempt to wake them from their slumber, from which sadly they still choose not to be roused...







[edit on 9-3-2006 by Edelweiss Pirate]

Originally posted by Edelweiss Pirate

Thank you for replying Masonic Light, I must say however that I do not recognise the Masonry you describe. Maybe you are a Blue Degree mason, this would account for your positive view of the craft.

I'm a Blue Lodge Mason, a 32° Scottish Rite Mason, a Masonic Knight Templar in the York Rite, a Royal Ark Mariner, Secret Monitor, and a great many other side degrees. Furthermore, I'm the Director of Work at my Scottish Rite Temple, which means I'm in charge of making sure the degrees are staged properly for the 4° - 32°. Simply said, I've been through practically every regular degree in Masonry, and there is no hazing involved in any of them.

Since we are talking here about hazing instead of "black magic", I'll save my comments on the Black Arts for another time.

In regard to your reply Masonic Light, that there is no hazing involved in Masonry, I am surprised as I consider it quite apparent that the well-known 'initation' procedure where the candidate is 'hoodwinked', has a dagger thrust to his breast and his threatened with all manner of torture and punishments if he reveal any secrets, to clearly be an example of hazing.

This procedure is only the public image of the initiation, much much more is involved. Hazing is used to disorder the thinking of the candidate to such a point that they become 'suggestible'. It is also a way of breaking the candidates preconditions about reality itself. This is not peculiar to Masonry however, many of the great religious sects use this to conditioning to 'illuminate' their disciples.. It is and was quite common in Christian Convents and Monasteries. Anywhere people seek to control others by spiritual means.



[edit on 9-3-2006 by Edelweiss Pirate]

Originally posted by Edelweiss Pirate

In regard to your reply Masonic Light, that there is no hazing involved in Masonry, I am surprised as I consider it quite apparent that the well-known 'initation' procedure where the candidate is 'hoodwinked', has a dagger thrust to his breast and his threatened with all manner of torture and punishments if he reveal any secrets, to clearly be an example of hazing.

Being hoodwinked is not hazing. Masonic ceremony is a symbolic drama, and the candidate is not hazed by putting a blindfold on. The hoodwink is representative of being blinded by the gross materialism of the world. The purpose of Masonry, and the culminating point of the ceremony, is to remove the hoodwink.

Furthermore, regardless what you've heard, there are no daggers thrust to anyone's breast, nor any torture or punishments inferred with the exception of those Grand Lodges which use the traditional symbolic penalties in the wording of the obligation. Since the candidate is aware that this wording is only symbolic, carried over from the middle ages, I hardly consider this hazing either.

This procedure is only the public image of the initiation, much much more is involved. Hazing is used to disorder the thinking of the candidate to such a point that they become 'suggestible'. It is also a way of breaking the candidates preconditions about reality itself. This is not peculiar to Masonry however, many of the great religious sects use this to conditioning to 'illuminate' their disciples.. It is and was quite common in Christian Convents and Monasteries. Anywhere people seek to control others by spiritual means.

I've never met a single Mason whom that could be applied to. Care to give us an example?

Originally posted by Edelweiss Pirate

In regard to your reply Masonic Light, that there is no hazing involved in Masonry, I am surprised as I consider it quite apparent that the well-known 'initation' procedure where the candidate is 'hoodwinked', has a dagger thrust to his breast and his threatened with all manner of torture and punishments if he reveal any secrets, to clearly be an example of hazing.

I hope you'll forgive me for jumping in here, but I consider this a very ignorant and misleading post.

- Being blindfolded with your own consent is not hazing any more than pin the tail on the donkey is.

- A blunt symbolic instrument placed on or near to a person to illustrate a point is not hazing.

You are minimizing and belittling those poor unfortunates who have suffered real hazing by exaggerating and inflating these claims against masonry.

And as for being threatened with all manner or torture you should do your homework better. The masonic penalty for revealing the secrets is to be...

External source: Emulation ritual
branded a willfully perjured individual, void of all moral worth, and totally unfit to be received into this worshipful Lodge, or any other warranted Lodge, or society of men who prize honour and virtue above the external advantages of rank and fortune.

You might also be interested in the following snippet, after the traditional (symbolic) penalties are outlined the Worshipful Master says

External source: Emulation ritual
The inclusion of such a penalty is unnecessary, for the Obligation you have taken this evening is binding on you for so long as you shall live.

You would be much better doing proper independent research rather than taking other peoples poor work. Don't take my word for it - there is an Emulation ritual up on eBay as we speak.

This procedure is only the public image of the initiation, much much more is involved. Hazing is used to disorder the thinking of the candidate to such a point that they become 'suggestible'. It is also a way of breaking the candidates preconditions about reality itself. This is not peculiar to Masonry however...

Indeed it does not feature in freemasonry at all. I recommend that you don't take 'public image' as reality, as I would humbly suggest to you that what the public thinks and what actually happens in reality can often be two entirely different things. Sometimes there is a conspiracy where none is suspected, and sometimes vice versa.

I don't have any connection with masonry, but I have a passing interest in Magick and possess various symbolic props including an athame, which is bascially a blunt dagger. That is used for ceremonies but you are never to use it in a negative way, and to cut, injure or kill anything with it would be sacrilege.

Sorry to hear that. Hazing should be a thing of the past for all practices...

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by Arcane Demesne


Ok serisouly. This is no laughing matter. I didn't know there were beatings. Perhaps it was just the particular lodge?

I don't know much about the Prince Hall Affiliation. My Grand Lodge does not recognize Prince Hall organizations, and therefore I've never been inside a Prince Hall Lodge.

However, let me stress that regular Masonry does NOT practice hazing or beatings. The ceremonies of Freemasonry are artistic, colorful, beautiful, and intellectual.

If that Prince Hall Lodge was indeed to blame for that person's death, it is the duty of the Prince Hall Grand Master to publicly and privately renounce all forms of hazing, revoke the charter of the Lodge, and expel all of those involved. Criminal charges should also be filed.

[edit on 9-3-2006 by Masonic Light]

I knew this was coming as soon as i read the 1st post of this thread. There are no bad masons, just the rest of the world kill each other. Just like Calvi

Hi Edelweiss,

Thanks for highlighting the abuses which took place in this Masonic Lodge.

I sincerely hope the Prince Hall grand lodge that has jurisdiction over the lodge in which Wilder was active, gets its house in order, propmpto.

I'd also like to take this opportunity in wishing my sincerest condolences to the family, they must be devastated.

When Masons seek to control the spirits of the elements and demons, for their own ends, they end up getting controlled by the beings they conjure up.

Reading the original article critically, something occurs to me: I thought that all PH lodges were in the US?

I wonder, then, why the poor soul was raised in Germany? He was in the military, as the story goes...so maybe he was initiated and passed in the States prior to deployment. But this isn't the way the news article will lead one to believe. It's interesting to notice that not only does the article vilify Masons, but also tries to imply a racial angle.

Originally posted by Damocles357
Reading the original article critically, something occurs to me: I thought that all PH lodges were in the US?

I wonder, then, why the poor soul was raised in Germany? He was in the military, as the story goes...so maybe he was initiated and passed in the States prior to deployment. But this isn't the way the news article will lead one to believe. It's interesting to notice that not only does the article vilify Masons, but also tries to imply a racial angle.

I did a little more investigating. According to some other sources, the guy has been a Prince Hall Master Mason for several months, and his death has nothing to do with any initiation ceremony or hazing. An autopsy is under way, and apparently alcohol poisoning is suspected. Once the facts come in, we'll see what's really going on.

Does it occur to some people that while some will view Masonry as some sort of ritual for evil and be afraid of it, some will embrace that idea and carry it out, calling themselves Masons on the way? You'll probably find things like that are a lot to blame for the more unpleasant rumours that circulate.
When you think about it, rumours originating from the unpleasant actions of a minority are more likely to propogate too as it's human nature to be more interested and pay attention to bad things rather than good.

What I find interesting is this:

If this initiation ceremony and "hoodwinking" is as bad as what is suggested by the thread starters article from "digbig.com" or whatever other unauthenticated information buckets he has found, why is it that you don't see or hear from literally THOUSANDS of men who have been the 'new guy' in the ceremonies and then thought "oh crap this stuffs evil/strange" and run outta there never to return????

I mean puhleeze, there is very rarely/if ever a case of a newly initiated Mason running for his life in fear because of the ceremony or anything else in Masonry.

Think facts people, not gossip and innuendo that comes from people who haven't even BEEN to an initiation ceremony and yet claim to KNOW so much.....its laughable.

[edit on 10-3-2006 by sanse_nz]