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The Decline and Fall of Europe

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posted on Feb, 15 2006 @ 10:32 PM
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lol dude wheres this thread going and where are we going with our discussion??

all we are really doing is just going back and forth about 'my country's better than yours nernerner!!'

i guess i should starting learning to react to threads a little differently!!
-

you see since ive been on the internet ive learned how a typical american views the world ^ONLY AMERICA EXISTS^.

it's threads like these also:- "the downfall of europe" and trying to down talk us. IT JUST REALLY GETS TO ME!! (probably in the same way you reacted to me down talking your country)


but just one thing off the top of my mind, theres this one site i go to and theres quite a few americans on there!!

straight after the madrid bombings someone made a post about it in the forums and loads of americans responded with things like:-

*yawn*
"who gives a banana?"

stuff like that gets to me, escpically how EVERY country in the world sympathised with your country after 9/11.

i also remember people talking about iraq on this other website, and when someone mentioned that 2 british troops had been killed in action "who gives a fcuk? if its not american lifes noone gives a damn!" - and believe it or not some of these people seem pretty decent - but for me it just shows the 'typical' american views on the world.

whether its from your sports "only one football in the world 'american'" (a topic which is high in discusion on here now), military etc.

i'm a manchester united football fan (socccer as you call it) and we have a few american fans who come on the message board on there, and about 3 times EVERYWEEK you'll get this message "freedy adu future best player in the world SIGN HIM NOW" "america to win the world cup" and your like wtf!! lol


and its like that with EVERYTHING whether you talking about sweets (oh america have the nicest sweets in the world) - toliet paper (america has the smoothest/softest toliet paper in the world) lol

so maybe i should learn that its part of who you are (as people) and its part of your culture
maybe hollywood as a lot to do with it? (i don't know)!! - tv is a big part of the world today and hollywood films often picture that ^only america exists^ so i don't know


anyway i think i'll make the first move and call a truce (before it all gets out of hand)


lol later.




Originally posted by danwild6
Here are are a few more links to back up my arguement.

Link
BBC


Originally posted by st3ve_o
see where i live (just a middle class area nothing special) theres not much poverty, and the places ive been to doesn't support the fact that (1-4) people are in poverty!!


Hey I've experienced the same. My neighborhood is middle-class and pretty prosperous.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
maybe its the fact over here, that if you've got a roof over your head, dvd, tv, car (but NO sky or cable) your classed as poor


US poor are not so poor


Originally posted by st3ve_o
but now from me going from defending back onto the attack!!
- 36 million in 300 million is still a lot dude, especially for the 'worlds richest country'.


Didn't say it wasn't. But we expect different things from people over here. We don't expect the government to take care of us or to shower us with entitlement programs. We've always been a society that aspires to self-reliance. Probably to our detriment.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
3) same here, but that film is not 'fiction' its 'reality tv' - real people with real lifes!!


It is reality to one person who is trying to sell it to others. I have seen many of Micheal Moore's [sarcasm]documentaries[/sarcasm] and have found that he likes to take liberties with the facts.

Fuzzy facts


Originally posted by st3ve_o
6) maybe it makes your stronger as a person (but not in your pocket)
, but the whole point about this debate is about 'living in america' vs 'living in europe' or the UK (is it not?)
- so for me this is a key point!! one factor in living in america is A LOT of natural disasters, in the UK i don't think we've had any!!


Well okay but look at the size of the UK compared to america. We're a continental nation. We are going to have more natural disasters because we span a far larger area.

Besides there's not much we can do about them accept prepare for them. Now granted we did a pretty crappy job last time around but everyone screw up now and then. Unfortunately with Katrina it meant alot of people died.

But I'll take the hurricanes if the rest of the year I can sit on a Florida beach watching some of the most beautiful women in the world walk by me in skimpy bikinis.

And I'll also take the earthquakes here in California which created the mountains which created the San Joaquin valley in which I live. And over the past week have experienced the best weather in the world. 70* Farenheight in mid-winter.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
so making you stronger as a person is a totally different issue to finacally!! - being in poverty can make a 'stronger person!!'

being bulled at school can make you 'stronger person' - but being a stronger person or not, doesn't come into this topic


Not totally. People who become stronger mentally and spiritually are by far more likely to succeed in life. Wouldn't you agree?


Originally posted by st3ve_o
ps:- reading back at your last post i forgot one thing, you mention MRSA and how its 'virtually unknown in the US' thats why one of every 166 children in America catch it and why it costs american tax payers $17 billion to $30 billion per year!!


Cold you provide a link to your statistics. I've found one that says we might be talking about two different things.

link


Originally posted by st3ve_o
but we don't have rabies in this country, maybe you should bath your animals more?


Most of the animals in the US aren't pets their wild animals. You try bathing a mountain lion or grizzly bear


[edit on 15-2-2006 by st3ve_o]

Mod Edit: Quoting Etiquette – Please Review This Link.

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 16-2-2006 by DontTreadOnMe]




posted on Feb, 15 2006 @ 11:09 PM
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Originally posted by st3ve_o
lol dude wheres this thread going and where are we going with our discussion??


We'll from my pont of view we were having a rather civilized discussion.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
all we are really doing is just going back and forth about 'my country's better than yours nernerner!!'


Believe me I get what your saying. I do happen to think my country and in particular my state is the best place to live. But I can understand how you would think differently.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
you see since ive been on the internet ive learned how a typical american views the world ^ONLY AMERICA EXISTS^.


Believe me I don't believe that. I'm a proud american but I understand that the rest of the world see's us as arrogant and why they see us as arrogant.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
it's threads like these also "the downfall of europe" and trying to down talk us. IT JUST REALLY GETS TO ME - just one thing off the top of my mind, theres this one site i go to and theres quite a few americans on there!!


Yeah but I have to say I get the same thing from people from other countries. Like how America's about to implode or how china's going to conquer us. Or how crappy america is and before I know it I'm getting defensive. As far as yanks being on ATS well there isn't probably alot anyone can do about that. But whispers don't tell anyone this there are sometimes were if I could I would blast a great proportion of the people in this country into space if I could


Originally posted by st3ve
straight after the madrid bombings someone made a post about it in the forums and loads of americans responded with things like:-

*yawn*
"who gives a fcuk?"

stuff like that gets to me, escpically how EVERY country in the world sympathised with your country after 9/11.


I'm really sorry about that st3ve_o. But I've always thought one of the reasons I travel to other countries is to show that most americans are people like you. As far as people who spout that kind of garbage there is a special place in hell for them.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
i also remember people talking about iraq on this other website, and when someone mentioned that 2 british troops had been killed in action "who gives a fcuk? if its not american lifes noone gives a damn!" - and believe it or not some of these people seem pretty decent - but for me it just shows the 'typical' american views on the world.


Well again you shouldn't listen to those people. I don't know if they were serious or not but they obviously weren't decent people if they were saying things like that and I hope you believe me when I say that most americans don't feel that way.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
whether its from your sports "only one football in the world 'american'" (a topic which is high in discusion on here now), military etc.


Again americans can be very arrogant but that doesn't mean there evil. And I know the thread your talking about and you shouldn't take those things so seriously. I don't think they are meant to hurt you just to give the typical macho man impression.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
i'm a manchester united football fan (socccer as you call it) and we have a few american fans who come on the message board on there, and about once everyday you'll get this message "freedy adu future best player in the world SIGN HIM NOW" "america to win the world cup" and your like wtf!! lol -


lol I can see why that would piss you off.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
and its like that with EVERYTHING whether you talking about sweets (oh america have the nicest sweets in the world) - toliet paper (america has the smoothest/softest toliet paper in the world) lol


Well just to set the record straight. Germans have the best beer. Italians have the best food. Japanese have the best video games. You Brits have the best army. But I do agree we yanks do have the best toilet paper


Originally psted by st3ve_o
its just things like this thread gets to me
but maybe i should learn that its part of who you are (as people) and its part of your culture


Yeah it is part of our culture. If your ever over here just turn on the history channel and you'll find out why. We've been taught since we were kids how america saved the helpless world over and over again.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
anyway i think i'll make the first move and call a truce (before it gets out of hand)


Agreed truce.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
lol later.


Take care.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 04:50 AM
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Just asking why are we debating which country is better?
In reality the countries are governed and run diffrently , funded diffrently, fed and supplied diffrently.

But saying that I do agree we are very similar with the US mainly due to the fact that it was a UK colony then we had that dissagreement.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 10:01 AM
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I guess the point is, the world is hell, and getting worse.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by Radekus
I guess the point is, the world is hell, and getting worse.


That sort of nihilism is exactly why you eruos are going extinct. Sadly for too many countries in Europe, there little chance you'll pull out of your demographic death spiral. Sharia law in Europe is closer than you think

Life is only getting better. We living longer, healthier, wealthier (especially if you an American) lives. We have more outlets for recreation and leisure. 100 years ago no one could have conceived all of the entertainment, recreation and life options available to people in western countries.

Suck it up.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 06:37 PM
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each country as different laws in europe/different cultures and different backgrounds, to be honest when you talk you seem to think of us as the 'united states of europe' we are not, nor will we ever be!!

its like me saying the US as ties with argentina, brazil, mexico etc (just because they are from the continent AMERICA).

you should probably know this because, your not truelly american your only an 'american citizen' (same for canada and australia)- the only TRUE american are the natives, everyone else are immigrants.

your blood is probably from a european background/s.america/asia or maybe africa?

which is why many americans (even though they are now americans because you was born and brought up in that country) still share their bloods culture and traditions.

so stop thinking that THE WHOLE of europe is one


i agree with what the dude (who you quoted) was saying, THE WORLD IS HELL!! - is the world not at war with terrorism? (you should know this being american),

was it not only 4 years ago one of your famious land marks was destroyed? - is your country not going to war this year (iran).

open your eyes dude.




Originally posted by ElTiante

Originally posted by Radekus
I guess the point is, the world is hell, and getting worse.


That sort of nihilism is exactly why you eruos are going extinct. Sadly for too many countries in Europe, there little chance you'll pull out of your demographic death spiral. Sharia law in Europe is closer than you think

Life is only getting better. We living longer, healthier, wealthier (especially if you an American) lives. We have more outlets for recreation and leisure. 100 years ago no one could have conceived all of the entertainment, recreation and life options available to people in western countries.

Suck it up.




[edit on 16-2-2006 by st3ve_o]



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 07:18 PM
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The World Trade Towers were knocked down more than 5 years ago.

I was born in Boston, MA (Go Red Sox!) of the United States of America. I'm a citizen of the most successful and powerful nation the world has ever seen. There was a relative of mine who served in every conflict this great nation has endured from WWI to Vietnam. I am an America.

Conflict and struggle are inherent to the human condition. The socialist utopia you euros have created will be you undoing. When government does too much, nobody else does much of anything.

Evil exists and it must be dealt with. Just like America defeat world fascism and world communism America will defeat world islamic terrorism

[edit on 16-2-2006 by ElTiante]



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by ElTiante
Evil exists and it must be dealt with. Just like America defeat world fascism and world communism America will defeat world islamic terrorism.


You sir... Are a fine American. I just wonder if we have the same support we did while taking out Fascism and Communism. Seems most of us Americans are getting soft. Already believing this is a war that will never end.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by st3ve_o
you should probably know this because, your not truelly american your only an 'american citizen' (same for canada and australia)- the only TRUE american are the natives, everyone else are immigrants.


Well actually it depends on your point of view. Don't forget the native americans also immigrated from other parts of the world. They just came alot longer ago than we did.


]Originally posted by st3ve_o
your blood is probably from a european background/s.america/asia or maybe africa?


Actually I have native blood in me. So what does that make me? Most of the people in latin america are of mixed race so what does that make them?


Originally posted by st3ve_o
i agree with what the dude (who you quoted) was saying, THE WORLD IS HELL!! - is the world not at war with terrorism? (you should know this being american),


The world is certainly in a terrible shape but hell is not the word I would choose for it. The world is going through some tough times but not really anymore than usual. Its just that its happening to us now.


Originally posted by st3ve_o
was it not only 4 years ago one of your famious land marks was destroyed? - is your country not going to war this year (iran).


If we do go to war it won't be with out international support this time. We just don't have the resources.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 07:46 PM
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Originally posted by ElTiante

Evil exists and it must be dealt with. Just like America defeat world fascism and world communism America will defeat world islamic terrorism

[edit on 16-2-2006 by ElTiante]


dude, i'm not going to reply to you anymore, your just a waste of spunk in my eyes!! - your one of those people who i was talking about.

do yourself a favour and learn about WORLD HISTORY and not just AMERICAN HISTORY.

thats all i'm going to say to you, i have better things to do with my time than to try and educate someone who only lives in one world called ^america^.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 07:59 PM
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Originally posted by LostSailor

Originally posted by ElTiante
Evil exists and it must be dealt with. Just like America defeat world fascism and world communism America will defeat world islamic terrorism.


You sir... Are a fine American. I just wonder if we have the same support we did while taking out Fascism and Communism. Seems most of us Americans are getting soft. Already believing this is a war that will never end.


I agree. But the world has changed in the past 50yrs. We have gotten soft but that could be a good thing too. I think the only way we can be defeated is if we turn into those blood thirsty savages that were fighting against. The war will end. How it will end is another matter.

I remember talking to my mother who grew up during the cold war. She told me that as a child and as a young women she thought the conflict would go on for centuries and she certainly never believed it would've ended in her life time. But look what happened.

So don't give up hope my friends the war can be won. Not by military might alone but it can be won. How? I believed by giving people hope which would deprive the terrorists of their only weapons fear, anger and hatred. which are born out of hopelessness and dispair.



posted on Feb, 16 2006 @ 08:10 PM
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Originally posted by st3ve_o
dude, i'm not going to reply to you anymore, your just a waste of spunk in my eyes!! - your one of those people who i was talking about.


Then don't reply but please lets all just lay off the insults and name calling.



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 12:28 PM
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America is the best nation on earth...?
Well...
there are many reasons why this is not so.
All though, yes, you can be rich in america,
it doesn't mean that you will be intelligent.
With all the propaganda spirling about,
and young kids getting their heads stuck in
classroom chairs, I see no reason why America should
be any better than another nation.
American culture is too sexual. It focuses
sexuality as the most important of all, making
kids sexually messed up. No wonder you have 12
year olds who loose their virginity, I mean,
Britney Spears tells them to dress as whores.
I could go on, but it would be pointless ranting,
figure it all by yourself.

[edit on 17-2-2006 by Radekus]

[edit on 17-2-2006 by Radekus]



posted on Feb, 17 2006 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by Radekus
America is the best nation on earth...?
Well...


We certainly think so.


Originally posted by Radekus
there are many reasons why this is not so.


So you've found a country were there are no problems?


Originally posted by Radekus
All though, yes, you can be rich in america,
it doesn't mean that you will be intelligent.


I don't believe that was his point. His point was that america more than anyother nation allows people to live to their full potential.


Originally posted by Radekus
With all the propaganda spirling about,
and young kids getting their heads stuck in
classroom chairs,


Propoganda is hardly unique to america my friend. In fact I'd put money on it that were not the only ones exposed to it. And I'm also sure your country probably has its fair share of stupis kids as well.


Originally posted by Radekus
I see no reason why America should
be any better than another nation.


You're just jealous.


Originally posted by Radekus
American culture is too sexual. It focuses
sexuality as the most important of all, making
kids sexually messed up. No wonder you have 12
year olds who loose their virginity,


Clearly another case of the pot calling the kettle black. European culture is just as sexually inclined as ameican if not more so.


Originally posted by Radekus
I mean, Britney Spears tells them to dress as whores.
I could go on, but it would be pointless ranting,
figure it all by yourself.


And how about Kylie Monogue hanging her rear out on international television? Again another clear cut example of european hypocrisy.



posted on Feb, 18 2006 @ 04:53 AM
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Another pointless pissing competition?

How about we simply recognise and agree that for most of us we are quite happy where we are and with what we know so well?

It might also help if people could be a lot less narrow in their ideas of what constitutes the benefit of living somewhere and being 'well off' or 'rich'.

I am not especially 'rich' compared to many of my 'western' counterparts but compared to my fellow man (and not forgetting all those who have gone before) I am, easily, in the top 10%.

Maybe if folks just got on with enjoying this amazing life they seem so determined to wave at others?
(or is that the problem, maybe it's a reflection of deep insecurity and they don't really think they're so well off afterall, hmmmmm?
.....or just silly kiddies hoping to provoke a reaction?)

[edit on 18-2-2006 by sminkeypinkey]



posted on Feb, 22 2006 @ 02:48 PM
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Again another clear cut example of european hypocrisy?

I live in Canada bro. I talk about what I see here, I don't live in Europe.
Anyways, I see that I'll have to explain everything...
Indeed, Europe is becoming as much corrupted as American
culture, two thumbs up for that, yay...
Now, besides the immoral behaviour of everyone living
in these so called "rich" nations, there is the poverty issue,
there are people who work minimum wage jobs just to survive,
like me. we are not lazy, we are underprivilaged.
I would be very thankfull if someone gave me a job that payed 10$
an hour, full time, really. I could actually live with that.
And don't give me the, if you work hard enough you can make it
nonesense. I work as much as I can, and I don't see why I should stop
eating and sleeping in order to fulfill my eating and sleeping needs,
a fine paradox if you will. We are not drones, we have needs, working
all the time is impossible. I recently had fever, and I still feel dizzy while wanting to puke because I didn't have enough sleep because of work.

[edit on 22-2-2006 by Radekus]



posted on Feb, 22 2006 @ 02:54 PM
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Sorry about that Radekus didn't know you were a canuck. I see what your getting at. But at least you live in Canada which means your entitled to help most americans have to do without. I'm one of the lucky few I guess I'm poor enough I qualify for enough help to get me through.



posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 02:57 PM
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Yeah, umm, just because the television media tells you that we in Canada have advantages doesn't mean that it's a reality.
Like I mentioned before, the government doesn't want to help me, in fact, it's using me in order to enrich their pockets. The hypocricy...
And, yeah, maybe if I whine enough, I might finally get governmental assistance, but I doubt it. As far as The US goes, I find it hard to understand why the poor haven't formed an anti-government militia yet...
The really crappy treatment that the poor get, amazing...



posted on Feb, 23 2006 @ 06:21 PM
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It probably has to do with the mentality of the working class here in america. The people who make up underclass here in the US largely blames themselfs for their postion. No BS. The poor have become convinced that they are the reason they are in poverty. Why? Personally I think it has something to do with how we are raised. Were told that if we work hard enough we will get anywere in life. And if we ultimately don't achieve our goals well I guess that means we haven't tried hard enough.

Again sorry about my ignorance about how it works up their in Canada. My mother and sister took a trip to Canada in Sept. 2000. They talked to Canadians about their healthcare(my mom is in the healthcare industry here). And everyone seemed pretty pleased with it. With the execption of the lack of Dental coverage.



posted on Feb, 24 2006 @ 08:33 AM
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no need to be sorry, I'm not mad at you, I am mad at the world, muhahahaha. I find this continent really bad now, people blaming themselves for their misery, wow. If Americans had the mentality of Eastern Europeans, America would be ending it's civil war by now...

How else can you brainwash a population by telling them that they're happy, and if they get screwed, that it's their own damn fault.
The government isn't respocible for it's citizens, SINCE WHEN!?

No wonder talks of armageddon, world war 3, civil war, and alike go around, people are pretty mad. I see this ending really poorly, a sponge can absorb so much water before overflowing...



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