how will he come?

Originally posted by saint4God
How do you know? Has God told you He has ignored prayers?

Using eyes, ears, nose, touch, etc. thats how we all know he aint real.
Everything else would appear to be your imagination or well wishes, who can argue with your opinion...but concrete...nothing at all. Thats how sheep stay sheeple.
They believe blindly when not one fact exist.

Peace

dalen

dbrandt
When Jesus returns it won't be as a baby again with another life to live.

queenannie
Who told you that? I KNOW for a fact that you are guessing WRONG.

interesting thread...
queenannie, I am interested in how you 'know'. I don't doubt you for a second- I have things I 'know' as well, that I often get pilloried for on messageboards... anyway, I am very interested in the nature of your knowledge- please feel free to PM me if it is a personal... good to meet you

(second post, and I am already regretting my daft username... it's the name of an insect in a dream I had last night...)

Originally posted by dAlen
Jesus has no reason to come back...what does he have to say?
Gentle Jesus who never did anything to anyone and opposed all violence is to come back and kick a**. I know, I know...quite a contradiction, but many people swallow it. Thats fine, their choice.

Jesus aint coming back...if so, tell him to visit me.

Peace

dalen

You don't know how right you are.... although not exactly in the context.. and you'll all ask how I know this.... I listened to what he said! .... The Christ will come from the west, meaning western civilization... Christ is LOVE mentality, ULTIMATE LOVE for EVERYTHING even rape and murder for those extremists... not meaning he's gonna join them in killing, meaning he will help them, because he loves all....

Christ will walk the earth, (in all of us) ... No person, that is no ONE person is going to come to save us.. remember Jesus is the fisher of men, therefore he caught us all in his Christ net of LOVE, we viewed his pattern and will follow it, .... eventually... eventually.. *sad* ...

You all have to remember the bible is literally the smallest amount of Jesus' (Christs) teachings..

See you don't understand the power of Christ... Jesus the man, could have lived forever knowing/having Christ within him, but he chose to DIE so we would understand more.. and all become Christs... I love you all and would love to be able to express this so you have no doubt, but I suppose thats part of the faith..

Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by dbrandt
When Jesus returns it won't be as a baby again with another life to live.

Who told you that? I KNOW for a fact that you are guessing WRONG.

I'm not quessing, that's what the Bible I read says.

Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by dbrandt
I believe the antichrist will appear to be Jesus Christ returned and that will fool many people.

Like I say, every time: you have already been fooled by your religion which is the true antichrist--working against the very things God stands for.

Christianity=division.
God=Unity.

Christianity=self-righteous judgment of others.
God=long-suffering divine wisdom and mercy.

Christianity=lip service.
God=foot-washing service.

The above is ridiculous and merely your opinion.

Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by dbrandt
Jesus is God and when He returns all He has to do is speak a word and that thing spoken, is accomplished.

Then why the 2000 year wait? Why the seige and destruction of Jerusalem? Why the inquisitions and crusades? Why the plague? Why the civil war and slavery and genocides? Why the two World Wars? Why Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Why the Holocaust? Why the firestorm going on this very minute across the ocean?
Why? Why? Why?

Is He deliberately making us suffer in our perpetual state of 'hurry up and wait' during which we continue to commit more and more heinous atrocities upon one another in the name of God, country, and freedom?!?!?

If He can't save all the world, but can acomplish anything instantly - with just a word from His mouth....what the heck is 2000 years going to do, either way? Why bother when He could have just been done with it way back when?

As far as the 2000 year wait, timing belongs to God. Adam and Eve rejected God, and from them to us we are seeing and living what a world that rejects God is like. God told Adam and Eve not to eat from the one tree, not to eat from it and trust Him or bad consequences would come about. satan came along and said, "You know what, God's lying to you, nothing bad is going to happen as a matter of fact, something good will happen, you'll be a God yourself". satan lied and Adam and Eve chose to believe his lie, and look around bad consequences are abundant. Right now we, and billions of others, are living and have lived in these bad consequences. Why 6000 years of this stuff, because time and ages and their lengths are controlled by God. Be thankful we only have to live it for 70 or 80 years. Adam had to live for 900 plus years experiencing it. God is proving that what satan said is a lie.

Once Jesus returns and cleans this mess up, never again will anybody be able to say, "God I think we can do OK by ourselves, we don't need you". God gave mankind 6000 years to try to create a perfect world, and we can't.

Originally posted by queenannie38

Then why don't you know it NOW? Why do you insist that God won't do as He, Himself, said He would do and SAVE ALL MEN?

The Bible doesn't say that. A person has to read the entire Bible(OT and NT) and apply it all to know the truth.

All mankind has sinned, everyone, so everyone is in need of salvation. God prescribed that salvation is received in one way only, through faith in a substitutionary sacrifice. In the OT they looked forward in faith, since Jesus we look back in faith to His death,burial and resurrection and the payment for sin it brings.

Jesus death was sufficient for every sin, and as such anyone who wants to can be saved when they trust/believe/place faith in Jesus and what He accomplished. You seem to think that a christian doesn't want everyone to be saved, of course we do, hell is awful and lasts forever.

Jesus is the salvation for all men. Not mohammed, not budha, not david koresh etc., but it is done by faith in Jesus, and yes that faith is even a gift from God, but guess what, some people reject that gift of faith and choose to live their own way.

Right now, 2 we know of for sure who will be in hell forever are the antichrist and the false prophet. And a third is the richman in the parable with Lazarus. I believe that story is a true one. Another appears to be Judas Iscariot. As far as anyone else, we don't know only God does. But the Bible tells us some will receive the mark of the beast and refuse to repent and turn to Christ. And it isn't a sin to look back in history and see famous and infamous people and use them as examples. For instance Hitler. 99.9999% of what we know would lead us to believe he is in hell. Could he have repented and received Christ as he was waiting for his suicide act to result in death, sure but his heart was awfully hard and he allowed himself to be used as an instrument in satan's plans for a long time and if you reject God long enough there is a point of no return.

Originally posted by dAlen
Jesus has not reason to come back...what does he have to say?
Gentle Jesus who never did anything to anyone and opposed all violence is to come back and kick a**. I know, I know...quite a contradiction, but many people swallow it. Thats fine, their choice.

"Now, brothers, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying, "Peace and safety," destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape." - 1 Thessalonians 5:1-3

Originally posted by dAlen
Jesus aint coming back...if so, tell him to visit me.

Peace

dalen

"Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—" - John 1:12

I can always ask, but per above would be much more effective if you did.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by saint4God]

If Jesus came back today he had better be careful where he comes back. If it's 'Israel' then he'll probably get shot, anywhere else he'll most likely end up being rendered to Guantanamo Bay.

The powers that be weren't very happy about him the first time around, what do you think they will make of him this time?

Originally posted by dAlen

Originally posted by saint4God
How do you know? Has God told you He has ignored prayers?

Using eyes, ears, nose, touch, etc. thats how we all know he aint real.

"But to this day the LORD has not given you a mind that understands or eyes that see or ears that hear." - Deuteronomy 29:4

"Son of man, you are living among a rebellious people. They have eyes to see but do not see and ears to hear but do not hear, for they are a rebellious people.' - Ezekiel 12:2

Originally posted by dAlen
Everything else would appear to be your imagination or well wishes, who can argue with your opinion...but concrete...nothing at all. Thats how sheep stay sheeple.
They believe blindly when not one fact exist.

Peace

dalen

How can you say my faith is blind without seeing the proof I have been given?

Here is the only fact that matters:
"God has raised this Jesus to life, and we are all witnesses of the fact." - Acts 2:32

Originally posted by kickoutthejams
If Jesus came back today he had better be careful where he comes back. If it's 'Israel' then he'll probably get shot, anywhere else he'll most likely end up being rendered to Guantanamo Bay.

The powers that be weren't very happy about him the first time around, what do you think they will make of him this time?

The first time he humbled himself to become man, yet could walk on water, quiet storms, heal the crippled, and raise the dead. He himself is now risen from the dead and eternal. There's no need to worry about him getting killed or imprisoned. The "powers that be" are powerless under God.

"And the God of all grace, who called you to his eternal glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, will himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast." - 1 Peter 5:10

"regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David, and who through the Spirit of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord." - Romans 1:3-4

Originally posted by saint4God
How can you say my faith is blind without seeing the proof I have been given?

What proof, all Bible verses...lets step back and see the whole picture outside of one compiled religious book.

have fun with it...

I will say this, if your gonna be a Christian do it with all you have and seek with all you have...
...eventually you will come out to the other side.
If its real it will be with you, if not you will go on.

However, mediocrity will keep you in the depths of what may be a lie (Christianity) until you go into it all the way to see whats on the other side.

(may take you 32 years)

Peace

dalen

dAlen, I am curious, what is it you believe and dont believe?

I have not totaly understood your stand on the subject.

Originally posted by dAlen

Originally posted by saint4God
How can you say my faith is blind without seeing the proof I have been given?

What proof, all Bible verses...lets step back and see the whole picture outside of one compiled religious book.

My proof did not come from the Book. I received my proof and then was directed to the Book.

Originally posted by dAlen
have fun with it...

Thanks ^_^, I can say I do enjoy life a whole lot more now. I hope for you the very best as well.

Originally posted by dAlen
I will say this, if your gonna be a Christian do it with all you have and seek with all you have...

I do.

Originally posted by dAlen
...eventually you will come out to the other side.

Define "the other side". It's been 17 years so far...and counting. In all fairness though, the proof will last me more than one lifetime. I cannot deny what I've experienced, else I'd forsake the truth altogether.

Originally posted by dAlen
If its real it will be with you, if not you will go on.

Agreed.

Originally posted by dAlen
However, mediocrity will keep you in the depths of what may be a lie (Christianity) until you go into it all the way to see whats on the other side.

(may take you 32 years)

Peace

dalen

By the way, I've come from the "other side", not going to it . No plans on going back.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by saint4God]

what proof do you have that jesus is going to come back besides the allegorical book written by a crazed exile on patmos (sp)?

besides the bible, what proof do you have that said event will happen

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
what proof do you have that jesus is going to come back besides the allegorical book written by a crazed exile on patmos (sp)?

I have the Bible. I'm not familiar with this allegorical book by a crazed exile you're speaking of. That's by Lovecraft, right? Perhaps you share the title of it sometime.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
besides the bible, what proof do you have that said event will happen

Being that it isn't happening right here and now, I've not searched for additional proofs. I'm more concerned about God existing now, and the promise Christ has that applies to this time.

I'd like to see more focus on the actual topic of the thread though. The topic is not:
A.) Will he come?
B.) Does God exist?
C.) Is the Bible valid?

but rather:

"how will he come?" with "he" being further defined by the originator as Jesus Christ. It isn't a hot topic as far as application goes, but am interested in discussing the details based on what we do know.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by saint4God]

How about Jesus never was the saviour of men. The evil power that be have used Jesus to make us beleive we cannot save ourselfs, to make us beleive we do not possess the power to save ourselfs.

We sit and wait for a saviour to come, we give our energy to him/her/it, we give money to the cause, we worships in man made buildings with man made words, translated by various races and cultures to suit there ends. There is more of so called GOD in a natural wonder then there is in a church.

What if we are gods! what if within each of us sleeps a shard of light that if woken will make us realise the human race is a god like race. Whatever you believe, something evil walks among us and if I was that evil and I knew the power we possess, I would convince us to focus outwardley on a false source instead of the light within.

Just some thoughts.........

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
How about Jesus never was the saviour of men.

How about reading what I just posted above yours?

I'd like to see more focus on the actual topic of the thread though. The topic is not:
A.) Will he come?
B.) Does God exist?
C.) Is the Bible valid?

but rather:

"how will he come?" with "he" being further defined by the originator as Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
The evil power that be have used Jesus to make us beleive we cannot save ourselfs, to make us beleive we do not possess the power to save ourselfs.

If it were appropriate for this thread, I'd ask you to demonstrate how believing in Christ is evil. But, it's not.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
We sit and wait for a saviour to come, we give our energy to him/her/it,

Who's sitting and waiting? The saints have got a lot of work to do.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
we give money to the cause,

Didn't know Christ's return was dependant on a telethon to have enough for his coming.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
we worships in man made buildings with man made words, translated by various races and cultures to suit there ends.

Speak for yourself. I'm not included in this "we".

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
There is more of so called GOD in a natural wonder then there is in a church.

Which is what they tell you in church. Ironic really.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
What if we are gods! what if within each of us sleeps a shard of light that if woken will make us realise the human race is a god like race. Whatever you believe, something evil walks among us and if I was that evil and I knew the power we possess, I would convince us to focus outwardley on a false source instead of the light within.

Just some thoughts.........

On the contrary, evil wants us to believe that we are gods:

"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." - Genesis 3:4-5

This is when all our troubles began.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by saint4God]

Originally posted by dbrandt

Right now, 2 we know of for sure who will be in hell forever are the antichrist and the false prophet. And a third is the richman in the parable with Lazarus.

(Bolding mine).

Interesting wording, when you think about it, eh?

At least you know I'm reading...

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
How about Jesus never was the saviour of men.

How about reading what I just posted above yours?

I'd like to see more focus on the actual topic of the thread though. The topic is not:
A.) Will he come?
B.) Does God exist?
C.) Is the Bible valid?

but rather:

"how will he come?" with "he" being further defined by the originator as Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
The evil power that be have used Jesus to make us beleive we cannot save ourselfs, to make us beleive we do not possess the power to save ourselfs.

If it were appropriate for this thread, I'd ask you to demonstrate how believing in Christ is evil. But, it's not.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
We sit and wait for a saviour to come, we give our energy to him/her/it,

Who's sitting and waiting? The saints have got a lot of work to do.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
we give money to the cause,

Didn't know Christ's return was dependant on a telethon to have enough for his coming.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
we worships in man made buildings with man made words, translated by various races and cultures to suit there ends.

Speak for yourself. I'm not included in this "we".

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
There is more of so called GOD in a natural wonder then there is in a church.

Which is what they tell you in church. Ironic really.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
What if we are gods! what if within each of us sleeps a shard of light that if woken will make us realise the human race is a god like race. Whatever you believe, something evil walks among us and if I was that evil and I knew the power we possess, I would convince us to focus outwardley on a false source instead of the light within.

Just some thoughts.........

On the contrary, evil wants us to believe that we are gods:

"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil." - Genesis 3:4-5

This is when all our troubles began.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by saint4God]

We could argue to the cows come how no doubt. My post is just thoughts of a wandering mind. Unlike some I can entertain and explore these thought without fear of going to hell or thinking I am turning evil.

However, we can agree on the chosen few having a lot of work to do. You never know, maybe 'saints/spirit guides' are trying to enlighten us both at this very moment....!

To quote an ancient Native American saying:

In a Native American parable, the Creator gathers all the animals and says: "I want to hide something from humans until they are ready for it - the realization that they create their own reality -" "Give it to me. I'll fly it to the moon," says the eagle. "No, one day soon they will go there and find it." "How about the bottom of the ocean?" asks the salmon. "No, they will find it there too." "I will bury it in the great plains," says the buffalo. "They will soon dig and find it there." "Put it inside them," says the wise grandmother mole. "Done," says the Creator. "It is the last place they will look.

No doubt the devil told the Native Indians that belief........

Christianity is a young belief compared to the ancient teachings by the races that use to walk our Earth. The truth does not rest in any one place.

About the topic, how will Jesus come:


Who knows!!!!!

[edit on 14-8-2006 by 7th_Chakra]

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
We could argue to the cows come how no doubt.

I agree, which is why I think it's important to remained focus on the topic. Ballooning it with rabbit trails of a different subject can be diversionary despite intention.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
My post is just thoughts of a wandering mind. Unlike some I can entertain and explore these thought without fear of going to hell or thinking I am turning evil.

Most people do not fear going to hell or turning evil. I think those who think there is a God, but realize they've not made any motion to believing or finding out. I'm open to correction here.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
However, we can agree on the chosen few having a lot of work to do. You never know, maybe 'saints/spirit guides' are trying to enlighten us both at this very moment....!

I cannot enlighten myself.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
No doubt the devil told the Native Indians that belief........

I don't see where it says we're gods in this parable.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
Christianity is a young belief compared to the ancient teachings by the races that use to walk our Earth.

If you believe that it does not carry the roots of Judiasm, which it does, then you may have a case.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
The truth does not rest in any one place.

It doesn't?

"Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth. This then is how we know that we belong to the truth, and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything." - 1 John 3:18-20

So it looks like it's your word against...His

Originally posted by saint4God

"Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth. This then is how we know that we belong to the truth, and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything." - 1 John 3:18-20

So it looks like it's your word against...His

If you believe they are his words or a HE for that matter! See we are already going in circles . Whatever our disagreement I am sure we both want the same outcome for our desperate race.

Maybe you and me understand the word God a little different. So don't take my meaning of us becomings gods or 'god like' like Your meaning of 'The God'.

I added a picture to my above post, it may interest you, or maybe not.

[edit on 14-8-2006 by 7th_Chakra]

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
If you believe they are his words!

I do. Fortunately for me, I'd been given the proof necessary to not have to rely solely on faith. I'm weaker because of the dependance of proof, but stronger against the sway that comes with opinions.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
See we are already going in circles

.

Nah, I tend not to do that anymore. I like being progressive and take a different approach if I'm not.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
Whatever our disagreement I am sure we both want the same outcome for our desperate race.

That's a comforting thought.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
Maybe you and me understand the word God a little different. So don't take my meaning of us becomings gods or 'god like' like Your meaning of 'The God'.

Just pointing out the issues with using the language that way.

Originally posted by 7th_Chakra
I added a picture to my above post, it may interest you, or maybe not.

On a cloud sure, halo not so sure. The halo is more of a representation than something found in the Bible. Looks like some more artistic stylizings and added things from the account given, but I think the idea is there.

Mark 14:62
"I am," said Jesus. "And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."