Could it just be that some are without a soul?

Ok, say we are one big soul. It's a possibility as is everything else. Now, let's look at where we are now. We are little pieces of consciousness in this one big whole. Let's say someone doesn't want that. It's a free-will universe, right? They want to sell their soul for an easy life. It's their choice. Then that part of the one can be used by another. The other would be soulpart(squared). We can't just not honour the request of someone to not have an afterlife. If they don't want it I'm sure the universe will comply with their request. We can't just give a piece of consciousness free-will to choose and then put on restrictions like you can't sell your piece of consciousness. If there are restrictions there will be resentment. It would only work without restriction or else it's not a free-will universe. And if it's not, then what the h3ll is the point. But I don't think that selling ones soul is the only way to lose it. Just don't use it and I'm sure at some point it can be recycled back into the whole.

Not sure if any of that makes any sense. But I've never been accused of making sense.

I think selling and bartering, and making market commodities of anything - even things that need not have been brought to the marketplace at all - is a unique invention of homo sapiens, allowed to occur because of the lack of free will and determination of various of our ancestors, and brought about by a few power brokers who may or may not have had benign intentions.

Selling your soul for an easy life is not an example of being soulless but it is an example of not having the free will that you think you do.

Originally posted by MaskedAvatar
That's a very useful analogy, especially for anyone who wants to believe that a river has a soul!

Topical songs:

Ol' Man River

and (of course) He'll Never Be An Ol' Man (River) (I'm on the drug that killed River Phoenix)

That is interesting!! I had to look up that song as I am not near the "Musical Encyclopedia" that you are by any measure. But along those same lines it reminds me of a song from "The Doors" most fitting for poor Jim, but made by: The Velvet Underground & Nico. Two lines come to mind quite quickly:

...
When I'm rushing on my run
And I feel just like Jesus' son
...

Thankfully I have never needed such a "Ride" as those "Musical Legend" above to find my own way to flow. I have traveled the "Rough & Rocky Rappids" of the Nevada Truckee River a few times being a good adventure and a good taste of life as well.

Originally posted by Yufamyzm
Ok, say we are one big soul. It's a possibility as is everything else. Now, let's look at where we are now. We are little pieces of consciousness in this one big whole.

Maybe more like little pieces of consciousness in this one big "Hole"

Let's say someone doesn't want that. It's a free-will universe, right? They want to sell their soul for an easy life. It's their choice. Then that part of the one can be used by another. The other would be soulpart(squared). We can't just not honour the request of someone to not have an afterlife. If they don't want it I'm sure the universe will comply with their request. We can't just give a piece of consciousness free-will to choose and then put on restrictions like you can't sell your piece of consciousness. If there are restrictions there will be resentment. It would only work without restriction or else it's not a free-will universe. And if it's not, then what the h3ll is the point.

Free-Will and the Ability to Choose a direction in Conscience could be the distraction keeping you from knowing of the "SOUL" in the first place. Making it very difficult to rid yourself of something you have lost and cannot find, explain, nor understand.

Your Mathematical View would also be a problem since:
Soul=1
SoulSquared is also 1^2=1 or (Soul^2=Soul)

Now if God is All, Everything that IS and WILL BE, then GOD=1 also. So GOD=SOUL or 1=1. GOD is also infinite in all directions and existing as ALL CHOICES and NO Restrictions apply. So perhaps when "ONE" knows and understands "ONE's" "SOUL(SOLE)" then "ONE" is again Complete.

Conscience, Choice and Being "Finite" allowing possible choice is the "Great Show" or "Illusion" keeping you from being on your "WAY". Just like the "LOST RIVER".

But I don't think that selling ones soul is the only way to lose it. Just don't use it and I'm sure at some point it can be recycled back into the whole.

Not sure if any of that makes any sense. But I've never been accused of making sense.

Once again, IMO, You have already Lost it, in that you do not know where or what it is or where to find it. IT has not however LOST you because IT is infinite and encompasses you.

Thinking about this further it would seem that the choices presented to the average human are in fact weighted. If we do have a "piece" of soul and have been made to believe we do not then it would probably not be too fair to hold one to their decision unless they had all the required information. Now at the point all is revealed and they chose to take a route of entrophy then yes that makes some sense. They would have enough correct information to make a free-will choice. Currently, I don't think that free-will choice is available to the majority of humans. So I agree with your assessment, MA. At least what I think your assessment to be. I all too often make the mistake of looking at things from only my perspective. I must break this habit.

I still wonder about that soul-selling website though. Are they simply using the "registered" symbol to make it more authentic or are they serious? And if they are serious the 250 million souls they claim would probably be the humans that thought they do not possess one. If you did believe you possessed one would the contract stand? It would be interesting to do a background check on their company. Maybe they actually believe they can extract souls. Then you could just get some free money for the rest of your life and litterally laugh your way to the bank off the backs of some of the most corrupt corporations on the planet.

Seriously though, you would still probably keep possession of your soul you would just be a slave to the dark side at the next level as well. You can really only have free-will if you claim it. Not sure what the H3LL I was thinking in the last post. I'm just freakin tired.

And now I must do what I am best at, Sleep.

Damn it mOjOm now I got to answer you.

I know what you're saying. I'm not saying it's a separate piece. It's a piece within a whole. And it's your choice to invest your "talent" to expand your piece to show the whole you are thankful. Or something like that. Or you can bury your "talent" and show the whole that you really aren't so interested. But the whole is not going to just be a set thing. What I mean is that the whole would most likely have the ability to be infinite. And if I choose to expand myself within the whole to learn all that the whole knows then I will be adding to the stature of the whole. It is still just 1 but there are an infinite amount of numbers between 0 and 1. I would choose to expand myself thus expanding the whole because that's really the only choice I can see. To bury my "talent" isn't a choice to me. Although, it must exist for either direction to be called a choice.

It's all good that you're looking to the end of the Grand Illusion but you may be jumping the gun just a bit. I'm fairly certain there not many humans (I would say none) here that are even a million years (arbitrarily using time here) from knowing the ONE. The ONE is learning and expanding itself through us. That to me sounds limitless. Now sure, there could be a point where one becomes one with ONE. But giving the nature of infinity and looking across this great society I do not see us anywhere near that.

Of course, I have already lost it. So have you. Or you wouldn't be typing to me because we would already know each other's thoughts. I do however know where to find it. "It is in you and it is outside you" and "know yourself". So, ONE is everything I see (internal and external). My interaction with ONE grows my soul by learning and adding stature to ONE. I like learning and I like seeing the ONE as it is and not how I think it is. Although, that's really damn difficult. None the less, I am not so sure of myself that I would think just because I can fathom ONEness that I am near the completion of my chosen path. This in and of itself sounds like a distraction to my learning. So, as you have given me some advise and your viewpoint I'll give an equal exchange (as you have unverbally requested) and say you may wish to be careful because this type of thinking may put one back to sleep thus loosing the way again. This is the nature of new-age I beleive. It puts one back to sleep by giving certain truths and then the individual things they have it figured out. This closes off the eternal spring of consciousness which cuts off further learning. Not really advisable. I take an approach that tells me I don't know diddly. That way I won't feel secure in my own knowledge and inadvertantly shut off the eteranal infinite ever renewing source of all that is. There's no quicker way to shutting this off that thinking one know's the answer. This is also why I try hard not to go too deep with anyone I don't know too well. Because then I run the risk of causing their eternal flow of consciousness to be hindered. And to try to force my ideas on another is the equivalent (to me) of compartmentalizing the great ineffible ONE. If the ONE wishes to know itself in 6 billion (just talking humans here) ways who the heck am I to try to change that. No, I'll search my own route and bask my intellect in the infinite number of fractalness beings that I inhabit the ONE with.

But that is just my humble opinion. And now I must Sleep.

Originally posted by Yufamyzm
Damn it mOjOm now I got to answer you.

I know what you're saying. I'm not saying it's a separate piece. It's a piece within a whole. And it's your choice to invest your "talent" to expand your piece to show the whole you are thankful. Or something like that. Or you can bury your "talent" and show the whole that you really aren't so interested. But the whole is not going to just be a set thing. What I mean is that the whole would most likely have the ability to be infinite. And if I choose to expand myself within the whole to learn all that the whole knows then I will be adding to the stature of the whole. It is still just 1 but there are an infinite amount of numbers between 0 and 1. I would choose to expand myself thus expanding the whole because that's really the only choice I can see. To bury my "talent" isn't a choice to me. Although, it must exist for either direction to be called a choice.

It's all good that you're looking to the end of the Grand Illusion but you may be jumping the gun just a bit. I'm fairly certain there not many humans (I would say none) here that are even a million years (arbitrarily using time here) from knowing the ONE. The ONE is learning and expanding itself through us. That to me sounds limitless. Now sure, there could be a point where one becomes one with ONE. But giving the nature of infinity and looking across this great society I do not see us anywhere near that.

Of course, I have already lost it. So have you. Or you wouldn't be typing to me because we would already know each other's thoughts. I do however know where to find it. "It is in you and it is outside you" and "know yourself". So, ONE is everything I see (internal and external). My interaction with ONE grows my soul by learning and adding stature to ONE. I like learning and I like seeing the ONE as it is and not how I think it is. Although, that's really damn difficult. None the less, I am not so sure of myself that I would think just because I can fathom ONEness that I am near the completion of my chosen path. This in and of itself sounds like a distraction to my learning. So, as you have given me some advise and your viewpoint I'll give an equal exchange (as you have unverbally requested) and say you may wish to be careful because this type of thinking may put one back to sleep thus loosing the way again. This is the nature of new-age I beleive. It puts one back to sleep by giving certain truths and then the individual things they have it figured out. This closes off the eternal spring of consciousness which cuts off further learning. Not really advisable. I take an approach that tells me I don't know diddly. That way I won't feel secure in my own knowledge and inadvertantly shut off the eteranal infinite ever renewing source of all that is. There's no quicker way to shutting this off that thinking one know's the answer. This is also why I try hard not to go too deep with anyone I don't know too well. Because then I run the risk of causing their eternal flow of consciousness to be hindered. And to try to force my ideas on another is the equivalent (to me) of compartmentalizing the great ineffible ONE. If the ONE wishes to know itself in 6 billion (just talking humans here) ways who the heck am I to try to change that. No, I'll search my own route and bask my intellect in the infinite number of fractalness beings that I inhabit the ONE with.

But that is just my humble opinion. And now I must Sleep.

That was a bit confusing but I think I get what you mean. I also agree. You are correct that You and I (as far as this theological discussion is concerned) have "Lost It". (In more ways than One. No pun intended) That was fun though, yes?!?!

Now, You better go get some sleep cause I am tired and Our Soul is "NOT ONE that would DENY" Us what We need.

Yes. Everyone has a soul, sort of. It's more commonly referred to as your brain. It's just that no one can seem to tell the difference between their brain and their heart, much less their soul and consciousness. All you have is consciousness and imagination. What you do with it is your business. If you want to imagine that your consciousness is a "soul", that's definitely your prerogative. Tell me, does a vegetable have a soul? Someone who can no longer do anything but drool in bed and stare at things that aren't even there for hours? I don't think so.

Originally posted by Satyr
Yes. Everyone has a soul, sort of. It's more commonly referred to as your brain. It's just that no one can seem to tell the difference between their brain and their heart, much less their soul and consciousness. All you have is consciousness and imagination. What you do with it is your business. If you want to imagine that your consciousness is a "soul", that's definitely your prerogative. Tell me, does a vegetable have a soul? Someone who can no longer do anything but drool in bed and stare at things that aren't even there for hours? I don't think so.

I'm not sure who you were talking to but as far as what I was saying is that Consciousness is NOT your soul, but the other way around. Consciousness is "The Show" or "Illusion" allowing for Choices to be made and observed. The soul being ONE & INFINITE is all choices along with all outcomes therefore choice is irrelevent. Using your same logic, if someone gets brain damage or something, changing the body & brain so much you seem like a different person has nothing to do with your soul. So the Vegtable Person is from the perception within "The Show" while the Soul is unchanged.

Morals, Reasoning, Choices, Decisions all are things of the Conscious mind. Good vs. Bad...Pain vs. Pleasure...etc, etc...The World of Duality where "The Reality Show" is played out. The Soul is beyond this as ONE or GOD and infinite.

You could think of it like the SOUL or GODHEAD encompases the Infinite which is all possible realities. Conscious Reality is the Soul or Godhead experiencing Itself from each and every infinite perspective individually. Each of those perspectives being trapped into seeing only it's own perspective but obviously created from the Soul/Godhead the whole time.

For Example: (Don't take too literal, it's a metaphor) A forest of trees, each tree experiencing reality individually as their own. Some viewing the world from the edge of the forest and others from within. What is unknown to each tree however is that if you were to uproot them all you would find that they all share only ONE ROOT system and are actually not individual Trees at all but ONE "Tree" percieving itself as a Forest.

Is that better???? Maybe I didn't explain it well enough before....It is difficult to have to write ideas like this.

i believe that what u speak of may be the age of a soul, i think alot of people are new souls, because of the population growth, and thus there are few with aged souls and many with new ones

And guess what!!! Science supports Mojom's post...

Check it out right here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

One third of people do not have souls. Probably 10% of people have sold their souls to the dark side. That leaves 56% of people that are souled and mostly good. Of course the truly good people are a much smaller number still.

And what is your proof of this???

I have proof but It would not not likely be acceptable to you.

So I say it for those that can feel it for what it is.

Then show it...

(Unless it's from a personal experience)



[Edited on 22-9-2003 by TheBandit795]

Your soul is your body. The Breath of God which is the Spirit of God, made the body of Adam living: He became a living soul. To kill a man is to kill a soul God have created to live. We are all dead in Eve and we are all unclean in Eve, for we are all born of women who are unclean by nature because of the original sin. Then clones must be clean, you might think. No, before the first successful clone is made by the hands of men or women a lot of innocent and unclean blood has been spilled, and they still need an empty egg cell from a woman, which makes a clone atleast as unclean as any man or woman. Did I mention that a clone has the unclean spirit of a frog? Well the first successful clone that was made was that of a frog. They have their lives from frogs and their creators' hands are full of blood.

Blessings,
Mikromarius

Maybe some people have newly created souls, while others have old reincarnated ones. The new ones probably dont have past lives because they are new. Just an idea, though. I have had a couple past lives.

My mind says that its not possible for people to be born without a soul, but my heart says otherwise. I have seen too many cold-hearted people just like that - soulless.