NEWS: Leaked Emails From Prosecuters Claim Guantanamo Trials Rigged

Two emails obtained by Australia's ABC claim the Guantanamo Bay military trials are rigged with little evidence against accused suspects. The emails included one from prosecuter Major Robert Preston and contents of the email says the process is perpetuating a fraud against the American People. Major Preston was transfered out from the Office of Military Commissions less than a month after the email was sent.



The second email was sent by Captain John Carr, another prosecuter who also left the department.

The more that comes to the surface on these issues the more the power is returned to the people to make their own informed ideas and thoughts on the matter. If these emails do exist then it shows the whole process is a farce and changes should be implimented immediately.

[edit on 31-7-2005 by Mayet]

[edit on 1-8-2005 by John bull 1]

[edit on 2-8-2005 by John bull 1]

this is great news, hope it is real.

i can imagine the same thing is going to happen in the Saddam trials (an unfair trial) and i can only imagine why it's taking so long to trial him?

I'm not surprised by this at all, in fact I'm certain it is going to be the way of the future. Will Bush or his admin. ever be charged with war crimes now that it's proven that no WOMD were in Iraq? No, I don't think so!

One feels there are a few more 'war crimes' yet to come :/

And apparently, seemingly anyone will believe anything...
Two "emails" prove nothing.
Provide real, tangible evidences are burn them, for they amount to being meaningless.




seekerof

Have military trials ever been fair in any sense of the word? They're mainly for public appeasement. At least from everything I have seen concerning them.

Originally posted by heelstone
Have military trials ever been fair in any sense of the word? They're mainly for public appeasement. At least from everything I have seen concerning them.

What have you seen concerning military trials or courts martial, as they are customarily called? Military trials are as fair as any trial.

[edit on 2005/7/31 by GradyPhilpott]

Remember: Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof

Would be interesting if Bush got charged wouldn't it?

Originally posted by GradyPhilpottWhat have you seen concerning military trials or courts martial, as they are customarily called? Military trials are as fair as any trial.

Please enlighten me.

In a military trial is it required that an individual be proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt to be convicted?

In a military trial is the defendant entitled to trial by jury?

In a military trial can the proceedings be examined by the public?

In a military trial is the defendant entitled to an attorney of his own choosing?
.

Quoted from the article.......

Brig Gen Hemingway says he does not know if the Australian Government has been informed of the claims.

"I can't tell you whether they were informed formally, I have so many contacts with representatives of your embassy here in town, the exchange of information has certainly been constant, open and significant but whether or not we got down into the details of this, I really have no recollection," he said.my emphasis

No recollection.......yeah....and the memories of every prominent military personnel is sketchy.....give me a break. Noone gets to the level of Brigadier General and has a problem recalling information.

Seems that more and more information keeps coming to light.....Not only is the Bush administration having a tough time making generalized ideology pass as factual, but the standards of our military are being retroactively redefined......

This is certainly a hot issue, soon to get much hotter it would seem.

NY Times Op/Ed

Guantanamo a disgrace, says Carter

Newsweek: Secret Memo - Send to Be Tortured

Real Oversight in War on Terrorism

Many of us here on ATS suspected that the "military tribunals" at Guantanamo would be little more than a thinly veiled Kangaroo Court. These new rumors seem to shed light on our suspicions. More data will certainly clarify reality, however, the preponderance of existing evidence certainly indicates there is far more to be concerned about than what is mentioned in the "official line".

Originally posted by df1

Please enlighten me.

I didn't say that I was a lawyer, even though I have some personal experience testifying in a General Court-Martial and having known a number of individuals who have been court-martialed. Military justice is not the same as the civil and criminal justice, but this is not to say that courts-martial are not fair.

Enlighten yourself:

www.fas.org...

www.whitehouse.gov...

usmilitary.about.com...

Google Search


[edit on 2005/7/31 by GradyPhilpott]

An Australian, David Hicks has been incarcerated at Guantanamo Bay for a few years now. His lawyers who are American Military Appointed have been asking for a fair trial for him. David is believed or accused of training with Al Queda in Afghanistan. Today on the news his lawyers said the emails were good news for David's case. it surprised me somewhat that this Lawyer, who is part of this same military, was coming out rather strongly against the regime and trials.

The English told the Americans that the trials were not fair and they successfully had their prisoners released. Australia's weak butted prime minister is still swearing that the trials are fair and just and that David Hicks will get a fair trial by the Americans.

Hicks will get fair trial: PM news.com.au - 04 July 03 found on below link.
www.fairgofordavid.org...

Mr Howard said the issue was in the hands of the US and he had faith in their system of justice.

"I am satisfied on the information that I have, if any Australians are tried in the United States, the basic conditions of the presumption of innocence, access to a lawyer and so forth, all of the things that are basic to the judicial system as we understand it will be applied," he said in south-west Queensland.

The Military are showing by the treatment and trials that really its is no better than the very regimes they seek to crush and stop and they are stooping to wrong levels in their efforts to thwart the terrorism rising. Its no better for those prisoners of Guantanamo than torture and unfair trials of citizens of those regimes such as saddams and i guess its no wonder sometimes why the Eastern world has such a little respect for the western culture and rulership. These emails are showing people that not is as it seems or as they are being told.

What do you believe, the government who has proven over and over it lies, just the WMD comes to mind there. Or do you believe the whispers, the conspiracies, was it all a fake, was 9/11 not what it seemed, Is Bin Laden innocent or funded directly by the US. Is everyone really being fooled into thinking "we need this war". Is the terrorism part of the scheme of terror to frighten people into the new world order. What is really what it seems. Most importantly how long will it go on for or will it just bulldoze on through until they don't even bother to hide these things for conspiracy sites to discover, when they have society retrained to believe everything dished up on the platter.

I see Johnny Howard saying that trials will be fair, then I read about these emails, who am I supposed to believe, the one man who has lied over and over and over, we wont have a gst, we wont fully sell telstra, medicares fine..... or these emails that come from the very heart of the matter.

i watched the news reader read this broadcast out after I had submitted this story. When Hicks lawyer started saying about lack of evidence and these emails showing Mr Howards so called fair trials were not so fair, she showed distate that anyone would challenge her beliefs in the gov, and she cut him right off with a real grimace on her face. If the media who is supposed to be impartial, is towing the party line how can the masses possibly see it from all angles. it's hook line and sinker.

I will be watching this one as I think these emails will snowball and it will be so good to see how Lil johnny handles the egg on his face from the fallout.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpottI didn't say that I was a lawyer...

So what you are saying is that you don't know anything about military trials, none the less you represent that they are as fair as any other trial.

It is my understanding that the defendants representative in a military court is not even required to be an attorney, so you can qualify to represent the defendants without one of those silly law degrees or any legal knowledge at all.
.

Originally posted by df1

Originally posted by GradyPhilpottI didn't say that I was a lawyer...

So what you are saying is that you don't know anything about military trials, none the less you represent that they are as fair as any other trial.

I don't know what your major malfunction is, but I didn't say that I didn't know anything about military trials. I lived under the Uniform Code of Military Justice for four years of my life. I was schooled in it to the extent that my training included classes on the UCMJ, so that I and my fellow Marines would know how to survive.

I have never been court-martialed, although I had two Article 15 Non-Judicial Punishments. I testified in a General Court-Martial and I have known Marines and others who have been court-martialed. I know a retired Colonel who was court-martialed twice and acquitted both times.

So, I do believe that I am qualified to judge that military justice is as fair as its civilian counterpart even though it is different. Do I know of abuses? Yes, but such abuses are not limited to the military and I am not saying that miltary justice is perfect. I am only saying that military justice is just.

So, there you have it. I've lived it, been judged by it, participated in it and have friends who have been judged by it and my conclusion is that military justice is fair.

[edit on 2005/7/31 by GradyPhilpott]

Originally posted by GradyPhilpottI don't know what your major malfunction is...

I don't know what your major malfunction is either.

So, there you have it. I've lived it, been judged by it, participated in it and have friends who have been judged by it and my conclusion is that military justice is fair.

It was your choice to join the military abdicating certain rights and to be subject to a military code of conduct.

A civilian has not made this same choice.
.

Originally posted by df1

It was your choice to join the military abdicating certain rights and to be subject to a military code of conduct.

A civilian has not made this same choice.

Your changing the subject. There are no civilians subject to the UCMJ. If you are speaking of prisoners at Gitmo, then you are speaking of combatants against the US, who do not have the benefit of the UCMJ and are subject to military tribunals. So, I would say that these individuals chose to carry out acts of war against the US outside the Geneva Conventions.

Here is some info on military tribunals that differ from the courts-martial:

cfrterrorism.org...

Bleeding hearts might not like it, but they're getting good treatment and justice far beyond what any US military captive might hope for.

Interesting.

Even MORE Dirty about the Prison Camps.

I mean, if these Camps are so "GOOD" as some members here Claim they are - where are these "GOOD" news then?

All I see is titles like this, when talking about Guantanamo Bay or any other Prison Camp that US Military Holds around the Globe.

And LOOK - again come the Ex-Military Members of this Forum and start defending them.

Again.

Semper Fi, huh?

Is this volley number two?
First volley fell short, remember that one?
Prisoner abuse. The non-existent scandal.

Unless there is more evidence than 2 e-mails. I give this about a 36 hour shelf life..

Volley 3 anyone?

A lawyer for Australian Guantanamo Bay detainee David Hicks says new revelations from two former US military prosecutors prove that the process being used to try his client is biased.

In separate leaked emails, the two men allege that the military commission system is rigged in favour of the prosecution and the cases it is pursuing are "marginal".

Meanwhile an international legal body says the emails highlight a dangerous culture of prosecution and conviction.

The president of the International Commission of Jurists' Australian section, John Dowd, backed calls for the military commissions to be scrapped and replaced by an independent court.

www.abc.net.au...


This ranked as one of the last news items on our national news tonight and was glossed over by the news readers. Even a silly story about "the water police", meaning people who go around fining people for using to much water washing cars made huge headlines and a much larger news segment.

This story was buried just before the weather and a gov spokesman grinned and scoffed and said all is well.

All is not well, as more and more stories like this are uncovered, more and more questions about right and might should be asked not only of ourselves and our own beliefs but of our leaders too, who we trust to do the right thing by the people.....