God Vs Secret Societies

Originally posted by warpboost
Let say evolution is real (IMO it is and has been proven many time) well who created all the stuff in the first place so that it can evolve?

Why is it that a lot of people dont seem to be able to accept that there is a god and there is evolution?

Couldn’t' evolution just be part of gods plan to create or change things

Please... don't go there man... just don't go there. This thread was already off topic enough without the great debate showing up to say hello.

Let say evolution is real (IMO it is and has been proven many time) well who created all the stuff in the first place so that it can evolve?

Why is it that a lot of people dont seem to be able to accept that there is a god and there is evolution?

Couldn’t' evolution just be part of gods plan to create or change things

This is a concept I have pondered a few times myself. If you have ever written anything of length, you have no doubt made revisions. Perhaps the Surpreme Being made is perfect creations and then had a better idea along the span of time and made modifications.

The bible does state that incest is a sin. If he only made Adam and Eve how then did we all get here without incest. Perhaps he made hundreds or even thousands of men and women, but it was Adam and Eve who ruined it for all of man kind. At least in the christian version.

PS - This is my first post - please excuse the spelling and lack of board etticate.

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by DigitalTwisted
See this is the problem, blind faith in YOUR OWN INTERPRETATION of the Bible, if you read anything and take it out of context you could miss the point completely, hence this is WHY the bible, although evidence for religion, would be dismissed as a valid context is required, in written or oral evidence given, with no universally accepted frame of context for the bible, it shouldnt be taken seriously in any way shape or form...

I don't know who you're talking about here, but I assure you that I have no blind faith in the Bible. Taken in the context of today's morals and standards, it is a GREAT guidebook for living life.

Should have been clearer there, that was just a general reply, youve never said if u were religious or not, so no it wasnt directed at you personally, sorry for the confusion

OK to anyone who says God / Evolution exist side by side:

In the context of this thread, God and evolution are chalk and cheese, because a DEVOUT (Sp) christian, will not accept evolution. That is someone who lives completely by the word of the bible, im not talking christians who go to church once a month type people.

So the God and Evolution co-existing thought could NOT have come from a strict follower of religion, but rather someone who is religious, but doesnt take literal meaning from the bible.

Thats my point here, its BLIND faith, but NO ONE will allow me and the millions of others out there, to have EVEN A LITTLE faith that the illuminati exist because theres no evidence, but theres NO EVIDENCE for God either.

Its a double standard, thats why this thread was started and NO ONE has been able to tell me why this double standard exists

WHY?

I DONT KNOW THATS WHY I ASKED!

It seems impossible for some people to even entertain the belief that secret societies exist, but GOD hell yes he exists no question!

and that is just accepted, so why if i was to say "THE ILLUMINATI EXIST NO QUESTION", what right does someone have to ram THEIR opinion down my throat, yet no one does it to religious types?

Thats the point here, has been since the start

Secret societies basically have rituals going on that are said to be satanic and is where all their worldly powers generate from. That is why the Christian church apposes Freemasonary for they include pagan type rituals that could open the door for demons. That is why people from these organisations speak out because they say they see these people change in reptile type beings or let these demons in. David Ike for example and his stories explore these issues.

Because Freemasonary is secret and they have 33degrees of secrecy we wonder what they are hiding and the ones who drop out say that they worship baal the ancient god also refered as satan. Some rumours suggest that they think God and satan are the same thing or satan is Jesus's brother.

Then you wonder where these big groupes get there power to rule from and most high ranking people are freemasons or belong to secret societies, some are said to sacrifice humans like in the ancient times and drink blood.

That is the difference between one believing in a good religion to something that may contain anti-religious practices.

I am not a mason but I have been following the post of many of the mason brothers on this site and they have earned my respect. Most of them seem to be very intelligent individuals.

First of all they have 33 degrees of enlightenment not secrecy. Stop reading between the lines because there is nothing there to read. Your mind is playing tricks on you if you think there is.

Secondly, try putting Baal into a search engine and actually reading something about him. You will find that:

"Baal, one of the sons of El [the chief god of the Canaanites], was the executive god of the pantheon, the god of thunder and winter storms, the dynamic warrior god who champions the divine order against the menacing forces of chaos. He is also identified with vegetation and the seasonal fertility cycle. There is little evidence in the Ras Shamra texts of the sexual license, the sympathetic magic aspects of the cult to secure the productivity of Nature, that the Bible writers found so abhorrent. On the contrary there is ample evidence that some of the aspects of Yahweh reflected aspects of Baal as the Divine King, in the destruction of the sea-serpent Leviathan and the concept of everlasting kingly dominion; even some of the liturgical language is strikingly similar, like the wording of Psalm 68: 'To him that rideth upon the heavens of heavens, 'his strength in the clouds', and so on."

www.mystae.com...

Although it is believed that followers of Baal did practice human sacrifice, it is belived that those sacrificed volunteer. Much like the crazy suicide bommer of the present day middle east.

Third, do you have any proof that the masons are in anyway connected with Baal? It seem as though the catholic church MAY be (this all depends on your interpretation of that "evidence").

www.aloha.net...

I don't put much stock into the conclusion of this second site, but much of the evidence it provides is valid. Things that make you go hmmmmmmmm.



[edit on 29-6-2005 by CowboyKnight]

[edit on 29-6-2005 by CowboyKnight]

[edit on 29-6-2005 by CowboyKnight]

Originally posted by DigitalTwisted
GOD VS SECRET SOCIETIES

Science has PROVEN evolution happened, which completely destroys the notion of most if not all religion, so WHY do over 90% of the people on this planet still believe in what has been PROVEN not to exist, cause last time i checked christians werent claiming evolution happened AND God put us here!

Science has proven nothing ? IT'S A THEORY !

Science can prove evolution but does not support the theory. It can and does also prove creationism. People in general are getting a lot more informed and technology is proving that science is going down the tubes when it comes to support "Darwins theory of evolution ". Evolution just means change. There has been a lot of change after the original design or creation.

Too much to discuss but check this site out if you are serious. Pretty interesting stuff for the one who is open and intellegent.

www.khouse.org...

It discusses the EVIDENCE of design in the origins of creation.

Now back to my tree. I feel my monkey limbs turning human

Originally posted by The time lord
Secret societies basically have rituals going on that are said to be satanic and is where all their worldly powers generate from. That is why the Christian church apposes Freemasonary for they include pagan type rituals that could open the door for demons. That is why people from these organisations speak out because they say they see these people change in reptile type beings or let these demons in. David Ike for example and his stories explore these issues.

Because Freemasonary is secret and they have 33degrees of secrecy we wonder what they are hiding and the ones who drop out say that they worship baal the ancient god also refered as satan. Some rumours suggest that they think God and satan are the same thing or satan is Jesus's brother.

No offense or anything, but you have NO idea what you are talking about. Don't come in here and post misinformation as FACT, because it is not. You can prove NOTHING of what you said because it's simply not true. I suggest you read some legitimate sites for information, then try again:

en.wikipedia.org...

www.masonicinfo.com...

www.freemason.org...

Here's a great site that will debunk all of that nonsense you posted above:

www.masonicinfo.com...

Science can prove evolution but does not support the theory.

Science supports the theory but can't prove it. Rather.

It can and does also prove creationism.

No, certainly not. And posting links to confused bible studies doesn't make your claim any more valid. This place should be for denying ignorance, not spreading it.



[edit on 2005-6-30 by EyesOfTheFuture]

Originally posted by EyesOfTheFuture

Science can prove evolution but does not support the theory.

Science supports the theory but can't prove it. Rather.

It can and does also prove creationism.

No, certainly not. And posting links to confused bible studies doesn't make your claim any more valid. This place should be for denying ignorance, not spreading it.



[edit on 2005-6-30 by EyesOfTheFuture]

Confused bible studies ?? What are you talking about ? Have you personally invested the time to research the other side of the coin without slandering first ? If so you would know why the theory of evolution in Darwins terms are being debunked daily !

Technology is moving forward and proving things that we could only imagine or have faith to believe a few years ago.

It's time to update your reading skills and your library !
Truth !

Originally posted by CowboyKnight

Although it is believed that followers of Baal did practice human sacrifice, it is belived that those sacrificed volunteer. Much like the crazy suicide bommer of the present day middle east.

Third, do you have any proof that the masons are in anyway connected with Baal? It seem as though the catholic church MAY be (this all depends on your interpretation of that "evidence").

www.aloha.net...

I don't put much stock into the conclusion of this second site, but much of the evidence it provides is valid. Things that make you go hmmmmmmmm.

[edit on 29-6-2005 by CowboyKnight]

[edit on 29-6-2005 by CowboyKnight]

[edit on 29-6-2005 by CowboyKnight]

Hhhhhmmm- I have visited the Hellfire Caves in West Wycombe, England, home of the Hellfire Club of Sir Francis Dashwood and his aristocratic band of satanic fun-lovers. On top of the site is his Temple of Baal
Freedom-lover Benjamin Franklin was a member of this selfsame Hellfire Club, and his English home was in recent times found to be a repository of human bones

I haven't posted or read anything on ATS in months. After scanning a few of the Secret Societies I can see that the same old tired debates raging on. Believe whatever you like, I see nobody on this thread qualified to speak for God.

To those that are interested, I followed thru and received my Master Mason degree in April through Beaver Valley Lodge #753 in Ohio. I received my first 2 degrees in the traditional fashion and my Master Mason degree in a one day class.

Cya in a few months or years.

Originally posted by df1
I haven't posted or read anything on ATS in months. After scanning a few of the Secret Societies I can see that the same old tired debates raging on. Believe whatever you like, I see nobody on this thread qualified to speak for God.

To those that are interested, I followed thru and received my Master Mason degree in April through Beaver Valley Lodge #753 in Ohio. I received my first 2 degrees in the traditional fashion and my Master Mason degree in a one day class.

Cya in a few months or years.

So this makes you "qualified " to speak for God ?

Your Title means nothing !
And neither does your conflicting views based on a Masonic God !

Read the Word of God and see the Truth that awaits you !

Truth !

Originally posted by Truthisoutthere
Read the Word of God and see the Truth that awaits you !

Wow, I'm amazed, yet again, gotta love this forum. Proselytizing at it's finest.

One question, could you see a different point of view than the one you have now?

I'm really curious.

Originally posted by Truthisoutthere
Your Title means nothing !
And neither does your conflicting views based on a Masonic God !

the theory of evolution in Darwins terms are being debunked daily !

I can see that you still hold the same idiotic, absurd notions as you did, along with some new, but not surprising, ones! You know what makes us human, Truth? Our amazing ability to learn and correct ourselves. The fact that you can't seem to be able do this, in my opinion, makes you sub-human.

Originally posted by TruthisoutthereConfused bible studies ?? What are you talking about ? Have you personally invested the time to research the other side of the coin without slandering first ? If so you would know why the theory of evolution in Darwins terms are being debunked daily !

It's certainly not being debunked. It's being attacked by confused bible students, and there's a slight difference.

Technology is moving forward and proving things that we could only imagine or have faith to believe a few years ago.

Yes, technology and science has been and are making progress, no thanks to your church though, but rather despite it.

It's time to update your reading skills and your library !

Yes, I will immediately throw away my extensive collection of scientific literature and invest in non-biased books about creationism. Thanks for the advice.

I have no problem with freemasonary I've worked around hundreds at a time and never bothered me. There are just hundred of rumours that go on about it and I think what ever organisation there its bound to be some corruption or an opposite and that's in our nature. The public do'nt trust the church or the politicians any more. So freemasonary will get a harder time from the outsiders.

From what I mean about Baal worship is the influence of symbols that yes the chatholic church and freemasons share. For example the obelisks symbol of fertility derived from ancient phallac symbolism. Baal has satanic connections maybe not from the start but how it developed over time like the five pointed star turned up side down represents satan. Its how the meanings have changed for certain symbolism.

www.freemasonrywatch.org...
www.remnantofgod.org...

Sorry to offend anyone Im just saying why 'God vs Secret societies'
what makes one different in how they understand each other even if people get their facts wrong or things are untrue. Its just what a lot of people think of each other and why church leaders in England in the past have opposed freemasonary as to what influences they may have, even protestants oppose catholics. Yes there are good people out there and why should freemasons be all seen as evil?

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by Truthisoutthere
Your Title means nothing !
And neither does your conflicting views based on a Masonic God !

the theory of evolution in Darwins terms are being debunked daily !

I can see that you still hold the same idiotic, absurd notions as you did, along with some new, but not surprising, ones! You know what makes us human, Truth? Our amazing ability to learn and correct ourselves. The fact that you can't seem to be able do this, in my opinion, makes you sub-human.

Hey Seba my Friend !

Wonderful ! It's a good thing your mind that has formed an opinion doesn't matter in my life, yours or any others !

Your opinion is based on " That you believe that I am closed minded because I don't embrace or entertain the ideoligies of secular humanism ?

I am sorry you (think) It's "closed mindedness."

To God and Christians as myself its called Being protected from Deceit.

I am the LORD, and there is no other; apart from me there is no God. (Isaiah 45:5)

1Cr 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

Truth !

Originally posted by Truthisoutthere
I am sorry you (think) It's "closed mindedness."

To God and Christians as myself its called Being protected from Deceit.

You have put too much trust in your faith, and too little trust in your own thoughts and research. You are small-minded because you allow others to do the thinking for you.

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by Truthisoutthere
I am sorry you (think) It's "closed mindedness."

To God and Christians as myself its called Being protected from Deceit.

You have put too much trust in your faith, and too little trust in your own thoughts and research. You are small-minded because you allow others to do the thinking for you.

Actually-If you think about it, why wouldn't I just reverse your statement and say:

You are like a small sail boat being tossed to and frough by the wind with no direction. You would rather accept anyone elses humanistic philosophy and ideologies and not look and research the one and only way to God !

That is also a parable in the Holy Scriptures.

So with that I would have to say that you are closed minded looking for anything or everything else but the Truth !


When you talk about faith, Isn't that what walking with Christ is all about ? (Faith) - Remember we are all made out of the same three componets- Mind, Body and Spirit. God was the one whom created us with these componets for a reason. You mentioned that you were a Christian. Do you have any faith ? If so what is your faith about ?

Why do you doubt faith as a director, guide and provider of an individuals walk and journey through life. This seems shallow and intolerant to me ?

Doesn't God in His Words command his children to walk in Faith and gain Wisdom and Knowledge ?

FAITH- Luk 7:50 And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace.

WISDOM Pro 13:10 Only by pride cometh contention: but with the well advised [is] wisdom.

KNOWLEDGE Hsa 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

In regards to your last statement: You are absoultely correct- I do not let others sway me into any other direction. That would be of a week mind. If you found the truth would you through it aside and keep looking ?

Rom 4:20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;