OP/ED: Ending the Dark Days, page 4

Originally posted by WyrdeOne

Hoo boy. Where to start? Well, I guess with the original suggestions made by Sofi. I don't think we can make anybody do anything,

Hmm. Wasn't talking about making anyone do anything. ...Just providing information for self-defense against manipulation, that would help "deny ignorance." Joe called it ATS kung-fu-ko. Good name, IMO.

...The research project will help frame the problem and answer the key questions.

Polarization Research

What we want is a humanity (and by proxy an ATS) that can think for itself, without resorting to sound-byte philosophies and pre-fab enemies. We want to be taken seriously as individuals, not lumped in with a group of people that we ourselves may despise. It burns me up every time someone labels me liberal, my political allegiance is granted on an individual basis, the same as my personal allegiances. To suggest otherwise is to question my intelligence, and to question my intelligence is an insult, pure and simple. I respond to insults in kind, against my better judgement, and the perpetual cycle continues.

My position exactly. ...I generally manage to ignore the insults and don't respond - which has it's own negative repercussions...

The labelling is obnoxious, widespread, and it incites a great deal of anger. It is the fault of both sides for engaging in it, and moreover it is the fault of the conspirators for making it so acceptable to de-humanize people. Since we can't stop the conspirators from wanting to play us off each other, we must stop ourselves, and if possible each other, from falling into the two neatly defined categories. We have to reject the categorical denial of our 'selves',

Agreed.

we have to somehow punish those who reinforce the stereotypes.

Which requires a witchhunt - so you wanna know who's on my list?

...IMO - tis better to neutralize the manipulators by describing their tools and methods - and letting everyone decide for themselves if and how they are being manipulated.

We have to send clear signals to the partisan weenies that their influence is unacceptable, unwarranted, and will result only in their isolation from the community.

Exactly.

If we wanted Rush's opinion, or Hannitty's opinion, or O'Reilley's opinion, we would turn on the damn TV. We come to ATS to converse with our fellow human beings, and too often we end up confronting the very visage of slavish stupidity that drove us to the alternative media in the first place. We're trying to get away from mainstream, politically acceptable discourse, not wallow in it.

My thoughts exactly.

How am I supposed to engage in reasonable conversation with people whose heroes are contemporary mouthpieces for the control schemata I so desperately despise? It's frustrating, and difficult, and largely fruitless.

I don't think fruitless. IMO - almost everyone here comes for new information, discussion, and a certain kind of 'intellectual thrill' - to shake up their own paradigm. ...Also IMO - if the manipulators were removed from the equation, then things would be a LOT more exciting around here.

Presenting facts and logical analysis gives men the tools to shape their own beliefs, but it can't give them the will to do so. Badgering with emotionally charged opinion and insults only crystalizes resistance and resentment on the part of the defendant.

Maybe the goal should not be to "change" people? But rather to understand their perspective, and develop an environment and relationships where they are more likely to respect others' opinions, paradigms and experience?

There are quite a few members who are eggregious offenders, and we should try to contain, limit, and cure their disease if possible. They know who they are, you know who they are, so what are we going to do about them?

First of all - I think we need to give them the benefit of the doubt. I am almost certain we have professionals working our crowd but at the same time - a lot of people fall in without conscious purpose. ...So IMO - there's no point going on a witchhunt - we just need to disarm and neutralize the effects by understanding the process and communicating same, in context.

Incentives are required, above and beyond points and titles.

Like what? Concrete suggestions?

We must not allow ourselves to be waylaid by those groups and those individuals who stand to profit from our ignorance and our in-fighting. Whether our enemy is malevolent aliens, greedy bankers, or corporate energy concerns, we must identify the opposition and unite against it. Men have always been in competition against each other for land, resources, and presitge. Perhaps it's inevitable. But maybe, just maybe, the future of human development hinges on finding common ground and standing firm against our innate tendency towards competition.

I'm a huge proponent of evolution. I study it, I love it, I live it. I also see a future where it is no longer necessary to compete with each other. I see a future where competition against the universe unites all mankind.

cooperation is not a luxury, but a necessity for those beings at the mercy of larger forces.

then let's evolve. Let's embrace a common goal, and through that common goal, an allegiance to The Cause, the only meanigful endeavor, the struggle for the survival of the human race.

Good thoughts about competition, like em.

The enemy wishes us to choose sides, fight amongst ourselves, and ignore their hand in all this. We must unite, fight against common enemies, and reveal their manipulations for all the world to see.

I'm sorry if I've simply repeated what others have said.

Summary and synthesis is good. I'd say you've covered all the angles.