Weird Argument about removing statues

This all reminds me of Seattle. A Civil War memorial was defaced over the weekend, and people are crying that it should go since it honors people that fought for the confederates at the time, then moved to the Seattle area and lived normal lives and in some cases made a difference in the area. Some of these people did good things, some not so much, but the desire to tear it down because of
"Cancel Culture" is just like choosing to be ignorant. Funny thing is that Seattle's 9th mayor was a southern state sympathizers.

From: The WIKI: Beriah Brown I know it's wiki, but it's easy to use, and it's hard to get info on this guy.

In 1858, he was an unsuccessful candidate for the United States House of Representatives from Wisconsin. He moved to California in 1862 and became well known for his pro-Confederacy views. As the editor of the Democratic Press in San Francisco, he amassed a large library; when news arrived of the assassination of Abraham Lincoln, a mob ransacked Brown's office and burned 20,000 volumes. He later supported the establishment of a white supremacist colony in Sonora, Mexico, and opposed the Civil War.

"So what?", you might say. Well here's the rub, If people started to really push the notion of tearing down statuaries of people that died because they might offend somebody some where, we're going to be tearing down every statue every where. People still get offended by the statue of David by Michelangelo, there are people that get offended by the Statue of Liberty. people get offended by everything, but that shouldn't be a reason to tear it down. Many of these statuaries are/were important to the history of these areas, and by removing them they leave a hole in their own history. That real sad part of all this is that most of the people that want these statuaries torn down really need to go find out about why those statuaries were put up in the first place.

Btw, they've torn down Ulysses S. Grant because he received a slave from his father whom he promptly let go, and they are also after a statue of Teddy Roosevelt outside a natural history museum.

I seem to recall something about museums being the right place for these statues ...

Hmmmm ...

Guess not, and even weirder, putting ol' Teddy there is completely appropo.

originally posted by: ketsuko
Btw, they've torn down Ulysses S. Grant because he received a slave from his father whom he promptly let go, and they are also after a statue of Teddy Roosevelt outside a natural history museum.

I seem to recall something about museums being the right place for these statues ...

Hmmmm ...

Guess not, and even weirder, putting ol' Teddy there is completely appropo.

FDR said that he was never going to let a black man (not his exact words) back into the White House. I wonder if anyone wants to tear down his socialist loving statues?

originally posted by: Guyfriday

originally posted by: ketsuko
Btw, they've torn down Ulysses S. Grant because he received a slave from his father whom he promptly let go, and they are also after a statue of Teddy Roosevelt outside a natural history museum.

I seem to recall something about museums being the right place for these statues ...

Hmmmm ...

Guess not, and even weirder, putting ol' Teddy there is completely appropo.

FDR said that he was never going to let a black man (not his exact words) back into the White House. I wonder if anyone wants to tear down his socialist loving statues?

He was also responsible for the closest thing we've had to concentration camps where lots of Americans were interned during WWII, too.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Guyfriday

originally posted by: ketsuko
Btw, they've torn down Ulysses S. Grant because he received a slave from his father whom he promptly let go, and they are also after a statue of Teddy Roosevelt outside a natural history museum.

I seem to recall something about museums being the right place for these statues ...

Hmmmm ...

Guess not, and even weirder, putting ol' Teddy there is completely appropo.

FDR said that he was never going to let a black man (not his exact words) back into the White House. I wonder if anyone wants to tear down his socialist loving statues?

He was also responsible for the closest thing we've had to concentration camps where lots of Americans were interned during WWII, too.

And yet they look to his statue for answers and not for freed up real-estate.

They had this cancel culture back in ancient Egypt too, what they couldn't tear down, they covered with sand.

It was a dream of a great statue with a head of gold, arms and chest of silver, belly and thighs of bronze, legs of iron, and feet of mingled iron and clay. A great stone, not cut by human hands, fell on the feet of the statue and destroyed it, and the rock became a mountain that filled the whole world.

Probably old Danny boy kicked it off.

originally posted by: SaturnFX

originally posted by: cognizant420
a reply to: SaturnFX

Call them rebels if you want. But a lot of them southerners thought of them as heroes. Maybe not all sure but was enough to get some statues put up

Sure, lots of people think rebels are heros
No doubt Osama Bin Ladin has plenty of people back in his home that see him as the hero of the story.

Point is, the US won...so its weird when public tax paid dollar areas have statues of traitors erected to begin with.
What if your city hall erected a statue of the unibomber...wouldn't make a lot of sense. Sure, some people may see him the hero...but since when does that count.

If we use that criteria, what about the Viet Nam War memorial. We didn't "win" that one. Does that one get taken down about 11:15 or do we need to reschedule so as to rest up from the 19th?

Far in the future, Martians will be destroying statues of Elon Musk, I think.

a reply to: SaturnFX

People keep using the word treason to describe the South during the Civil war. One would think those living then would have said something about that, yes? They kept Jefferson Davis, President of the Confederacy in chains at Fort Monroe for 2 years after the war debating what to do about him. Fact is they could not make a legal case for treason which is why no one was ever charged with it after the war.

They did hang the commandant of Andersonville prison camp even though he had no food to give his own soldiers, never mind the thousands of prisoners. After Sherman swept through Georgia starvation was the rule for everyone in the South. They hung a man for what was essentially Union wartime strategy.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

Sherman's strategy was brutal, but he treated the south like territory to be conquered and southerners like the enemy. It is how we would have treated any other enemy people. The main difference here being that southerners were former countrymen with whom Lincoln wanted reconciliation.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: JAGStorm

One question.

If there are ZERO statues of Hitler in the world, Zero..

Is history forgotten?

Not a single person has answered this. HOW are we able to remember Hitler if all his statues were taken down???

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: JAGStorm

One question.

If there are ZERO statues of Hitler in the world, Zero..

Is history forgotten?

Not a single person has answered this. HOW are we able to remember Hitler if all his statues were taken down???

Have you ever heard of a Holocaust denier? Just curious.

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: JAGStorm

One question.

If there are ZERO statues of Hitler in the world, Zero..

Is history forgotten?

Not a single person has answered this. HOW are we able to remember Hitler if all his statues were taken down???

Did we have lots of statues of Hitler erected in the US? I'm just curious.

a reply to: ketsuko

Did we have lots of statues of Hitler erected in the US? I'm just curious.

No, it's a funny thing, Germany doesn't like celebrating/honoring it's loser.
Somehow here we are OK with glorifying losers/traitors.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: ketsuko

Did we have lots of statues of Hitler erected in the US? I'm just curious.

No, it's a funny thing, Germany doesn't like celebrating/honoring it's loser.
Somehow here we are OK with glorifying losers/traitors.

That's not what I asked you. I don't care what Germany does. And they certainly had statues of Hitler since he was the leader there for so long.

I was asking you if *we* had statues of Hitler erected in the *U.S.* to make your point relevant.

a reply to: network dude

Viet Nam War memorial.

If anything that memorial signifies how much we indeed LOST

a reply to: ketsuko

That's not what I asked you. I don't care what Germany does. And they certainly had statues of Hitler since he was the leader there for so long.

I was asking you if *we* had statues of Hitler erected in the *U.S.* to make your point relevant.

Of course it's relevant. Can people remember history if they don't have statues, that seems to be what is being asked. Of course they can. Germany is a perfect example.

No we don't have Hitler statues, but we have some that feel the same way to a lot of Americans

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: network dude

Viet Nam War memorial.

If anything that memorial signifies how much we indeed LOST

Yes, those statues do signify how much we LOST as nation and as a people. Like it or not, those men on those horses were Americans.

a reply to: ketsuko
Believe it or not, there were a few in the Los Angles area, but they were torn down during the 1970's. Now in the LA area they refuse to acknowledge their area's part in the rise of NAZIism. See how that works? Remove reminders of history then you can dictate how history is remembered.

A grave was not given to Bin Laden,
Memorializing the wrong people can have un wanted effects.
When it come to statues, martyrs are more powerful than heros.
the meanings of symbols change.
the swastika for instance, is now not a symbol of anything good.
it's almost a hex.