The Myth of Hell

originally posted by: buddha
You do one bad thing you go to hell.
so then why bother doing good any more?
or do you Pay money to the church to get out of hell!
like the catholics...

No that's the law, you are either under the law or you are not. That was the entire purpose of Christ's sacrifice. God told Adam that if he ate from the tree of knowledge he would die, that was the law for Adam. He broke that law, he didn't die right away but eventually he did die.

Death then is separation from God who is life. But we have an eternal component to our being, your soul. It continues on after death. God became a man so that He could die in our place, that is He took the sentence of sin upon Himself even though He had led a perfect life and never sinned. It is a substitution, He died in our place so we wouldn't have to.

His resurrection following His death represents the new life we have in Him, if we trust in His sacrifice for us. So we are freed from the law. This confuses many Christians who believe we still have to live according to the law, even after placing our faith in Christ. But that is a misunderstanding of the gospel, then from that confusion arise the predominant theologies of Weslyanism or Calvinism. Weslyans say you can 'lose your salvation' that is if you continue to willfully sin. Calvinists say that certain Christians are pre-destined to salvation, by God's will so that removes the culpability for sin, so neither one is correct.

The correct view is that you are reborn of the Holy Spirit and become a Child of God. Once reborn of the Holy Spirit your future is assured because God would never reject a Child, you are adopted into the Family of God. Then, it becomes an issue of maturity, how much you have allowed the Holy Spirit to change and alter your behavior while you lived in this life.

Catholics are more or less like Weslyans, they believe that you can commit a mortal sin which precludes your salvation despite your beliefs. But this denies the power of the Holy Spirit, which is in reality the only unforgivable sin, denying the Holy Spirit. That is if you are reborn of the Holy Spirit, a real literal rebirth, you become something else, a Child of God.

originally posted by: AMPTAH
I think you forget, some people don't want love and forgiveness.

They want war, strife, love fighting, need opponents to thrive, have a lot of hate to go around, and spending time in hell they would consider fun.

It's heaven where they don't want to go.

I agree 100%...

God will never force anyone against their will to go to Heaven.

As free moral agents, every person makes the choice as to where he will spend eternity...

Jesus: "I'm a gentleman Nick, I'll never force myself on you or anyone.

Jesus: Nick, what would be more unjust and unfair, for me to steal you at the moment of your death and force you to live in my presence and in my will for all eternity.

Jesus: Hell on the other hand is a place where you'll be completely free from all of my "though shalt nots"... FOREVER."

Melisa: But surely no one would choose that if they knew you really existed?

Jesus: Not so, nobody goes into hell blindfolded. In one way or another, I've revealed myself to everyone.

Melisa: But if they could just see you...

Jesus: Not even that would be enough. Look at satan, he stood before me in the very throne room of God. But he thought the beauty and the power bestowed was somehow earned. Gave himself over to pride. Scratch any sin and just below the surface you'll find pride...

Jesus: Everyone dies, Nick, but not everyone needs to fear death. If you abide in me, you’ll be stepping free from this fallen world and into glory.

...out of love, he allowed Lucifer to choose his own way and this is the same freedom the Lord gives to each of us. He's not going to force anyone to go to heaven that chooses that they don't want to, even if they once did. God doesn't make decisions for us, but He allows us to choose for ourselves. This has to be true, since sin entered the world because of bad choices made by Adam and Eve.

The Lord gave each of His created beings a free will. After we have accepted Jesus as our savior, we still have the freedom to turn back to a life of sin and to reject His grace. The Lord speaks about people being in danger of having their names removed from the Book of Life. (Exodus 32:33 & Revelation 3:5)

Can a Christian Lose Their Salvation?

Don't forget the circles of hell they make the most sense in answering the questions. Since the going sentiment around here is all conspiracy is political: Dante's Inferno seems like an apt explanation:



The politicians fit nicely at the high circles.

Heaven and Hell likely don’t exist at all.
Good and evil do though

originally posted by: silo13

originally posted by: Ursushorribilis
Modern day Christianity preaches of Eternal Hellfire. In my opinion this concept of Hell was created to scare and convert people of different beliefs.

Logically it just doesn't make sense.

1. The punishment doesn't fit the crime.
30 years of adultery, or whatever your vice is, doesn't equate to eternal Hellfire.

2. It's anti-christian. Christianity preaches love and forgiveness. Hellfire is in direct conflict with the entire message of Christianity.


What do you think?

First of all 'Modern' Christianity is DOWNPLAYING hell fire. They call it 'eternal separation from God' - instead of the hellfire it is.

Second - Sin - is sin. Without Christ? You're going to be toast. It's not a pleasant thought, but it's a truth. There can be no justice without consequences.

Yes, Christ is the message of love and forgiveness. Without it? You will take the consequences of sin.

Isn't it great that all we have to do is believe on Christ - and we bypass all the hellfire crap?

Pretty simple message that.

For God SO LOVED the world, He gave His only begotten son, so whosoever believes in Him will NOT perish, but, have EVERLASTING LIFE!

WOOOHOOO!

Best. Thing. Ever!

I challenge you. Say a person does nothing but good things in their life, helps out the needy, sacrifices their own well being for the comfort of others in a time of need, etc. They are also not a believer in Jesus Christ. Do they "burn forever" in hell?

EDIT: In fact, I present this challenge to anyone who says they are an intelligent religious person. Either you cannot explain it, accept the ideals may be wrong, or you find a way to send a good person to hell, in which is being anti christian. It's an arrogant win-win for me in this scenario. This is something I love presenting to people who believe they know the answers because of the bible saying so.

a reply to: Soulece

EDIT: In fact, I present this challenge to anyone who says they are an intelligent religious person. Either you cannot explain it, accept the ideals may be wrong, or you find a way to send a good person to hell, in which is being anti christian. It's an arrogant win-win for me in this scenario. This is something I love presenting to people who believe they know the answers because of the bible saying so.

You know that there are other religions in the world that have a "Heaven" yet don't worship Jesus, right? In other words, your "arrogant win-win for me" scenario fails when applied to virtually any religion that isn't Christianity.

a reply to: Ursushorribilis
ANNUNAKI Related data predating BIBLE interpretation of Hell or Netherworld.

The attempt to not believe does not equate to what may actually be...

Where did Moon Goddess INNANA go? 🤔
What will it be like for a unaware human soul to be there?

The Descent of Inanna

Inanna’s most important myth begins with the great goddess opening “her ear to the Great Below”. She abandons her temples in the seven cities of her worship, abandons, in fact, all of the glories of heaven and earth, and prepares to make the journey “from which no traveler returns”. She gathers together seven attributes of civilization, which she transforms into such feminine allure as her crown, gold jewelry, and royal robe to serve as her protection. She also instructs her faithful servant, Ninshubur, what to do in case of her return -- to seek out her fathers, urging them not to let their daughter die.

Arriving at the outer gates of the Underworld, she announces herself as “Inanna, Queen of Heaven, on my way to the East.” Neti, the chief gatekeeper of the underworld, is skeptical and questions her further. Whereupon, Inanna replies that she wished to descend because of her older sister, Ereshkigal, and to witness the funeral rites of Ereshkigal’s husband, Gugalanna. Neti is still uncertain and tells Inanna to wait, while he delivers her message to his queen.

When Neti tells his queen, Ereshkigal, of the glorious Inanna at the palace gates, robed in the seven attributes of her feminine allure, Ereshkigal is enraged. After dwelling on the news, she tells Neti to bolt the seven gates of the underworld, and then, one by one, open each gate a crack, let Inanna enter, and as she does, remove her royal garments, one by one. Ereshkigal also tells Neti to “Let the holy priestess of heaven enter bowed low.”

Neti does as he is told, bolting the seven gates of the underworld and then allowing Inanna to enter through each gate. As she does, he removes one of her garments, beginning with her crown, then her earrings of small lapis beads, the double strand of beads about her neck, her breastplate called, “Come, man, come”, her golden hip girdle, the lapis measuring rod and line in her hand, and finally her royal breechcloth. Each time, when Inanna asks, “What is this?”, Neti answers: “Quiet Inanna, the ways of the Underworld are perfect. They may not be questioned.”

Then, naked and bowed low, Inanna enters the throne room. Ereshkigal rises from her throne, as Inanna starts toward her. The Annuna, the judges of the underworld, surround Inanna and pass judgment against her. Ereshkigal fastens on Inanna the eyes of death, speaks against her the word of wrath, utters against her the cry of guilt, and strikes her. Inanna is turned into a corpse, a piece of rotting meat, and hung from a hook on the wall.

After three days and nights, when Inanna has not returned, Ninshubur begins to lament and beat the drum for Inanna. She goes to Inanna’s paternal grandfather, Enlil, and then to Inanna's father, pleading with each of them not to let their daughter be put to death in the underworld. But both are angry at Inanna for her actions and refuse to help.

Then Ninshubur goes to Enki, Inanna's mother’s father, begging for help. Enki, however, is troubled and grieved for Inanna. To save her, Enki creates two creatures, the kurgarra and the galatur, to whom he gives the food and water of life, and instructs them to enter the underworld like flies. He tells them that Ereshkigal will be moaning with the cries of a woman about to give birth, complaining of her inside and her outside, and that they are to echo her cries. This would please her, and she would offer them gifts. They were to ask her only for the corpse hanging on the wall. Then when they had sprinkled the food and water of life on Innana, she would rise.

The kurgarra and the galatur heed Enki’s words and enter the underworld like flies. Ereshkigal is moaning as if about to give birth. She complains of her inside and outside, her back, heart and liver; and each time the kurgarra and the galatur echo her pain. When Ereshkigal stops to look at them, she asks who they were and why they are moaning with her. She offers her blessings: first the water gift, the river in its fullness, and then the grain-gift, the fields in harvest; but each time the kurgarra and the galatur decline the gift. When Ereshkigal asks them what they do want, they ask for the corpse hanging on the hook. Ereshkigal gives them the corpse, whereupon they sprinkle the food and water of life on Inanna, and she rises.

Inanna is about to ascend from the underworld when the Annuna seize her and tell her she must provide someone in her place. They send with Inanna, the galla, the demons of the underworld, who cling to her side until she chooses the person who will take her place.

As Inanna exits the palace gates, with the galla, Ninshubur, dressed in soiled sackcloth, throws herself at Inanna’s feet. The galla are willing to take Ninshubur, but Inanna refuses, well aware of Ninshubur’s support and her part in rescuing her. Inanna also refuses to send her sons, who had also mourned her death. But when Inanna arrives in Uruk and finds her husband, Dumuzi sitting on his throne, dressed in his finest, and seemingly oblivious to her absence, Inanna tells the galla to take Dumuzi away.

Dumuzi tries to escape by having the god, Utu, change him into a snake, and then into a gazelle. But each time, the galla find him. Dumuzi’s sister, Geshtinanna, tries to protect her brother, even under torture by the galla, but to no avail. Eventually, Dumuzi is betrayed by a friend, whom the galla bribe with the water-gift and the grain-gift.

Geshtinanna, mourning for her brother, cries out that she would share his fate. Inanna, moved by such grief and self-sacrifice, intervenes and decrees that Dumuzi and Geshtianna will each go to the underworld for half the year, and that each will spend half the year in the world above. Both of them, Inanna places in the hands of the eternal, making them immortal. The myth ends with praises being sung to Holy Ereshkigal.

Good luck, to those who dont believe in Balance time here is intentionally set to limited to prevent the permeation of ignorance from spreading into the beyond.

NAMASTE*******

Notice LORD ENKI helping hands, why others provided her with no help.
Just like the deluge story with Utnapishtim.
Some ANNUNA seemed passive aggressive with the outcome for mankind after or before/during the flood deluge but EA seemed to be there...
Multiple GODS as interpreted by mankind.
Eye for an eye-LLU
Turn the other cheek-EA

a reply to: Ursushorribilis

Christianity doesn't make any sense.

a reply to: Soulece

I challenge you. Say a person does nothing but good things in their life, helps out the needy, sacrifices their own well being for the comfort of others in a time of need, etc. They are also not a believer in Jesus Christ. Do they "burn forever" in hell?

EDIT: In fact, I present this challenge to anyone who says they are an intelligent religious person. Either you cannot explain it, accept the ideals may be wrong, or you find a way to send a good person to hell, in which is being anti christian. It's an arrogant win-win for me in this scenario. This is something I love presenting to people who believe they know the answers because of the bible saying so.

Wow, you asked a question and then answered your own question with a win, win in condemning any who could disagree with you.

I cannot be a judge of any person. That has not been given to me to know and if I don't know and then judge then that is not of Jesus. When John said that --

John 3:16-18
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
(17) For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
(18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

In that of which John has said, the entire matter is between each and every individual and the Creator.

a reply to: Soulece


They say the road to hell is paved with good intentions... but thats simply because the world does not work that way with so many I am's running around doing the opposite. When people use the term only god can judge me they are subconsciously talking about themselves but yet use little mindfulness other than their craving or sensual desires to investigate who is actually craving or desiring and saying it's ok to put that grasped self as first among all others.

Of course the female of most species know the path of self sacrifice and effacement; putting their children first, trying to make sure they are safe and taken care of, and males of species can learn a lot form that and what it takes to be that in support. So when someone yells feminism blah... do they protect or look after all as if they were their children, or only self interests?

Gender roles try to insure that men and women are polar opposites instead of fostering the strengths of both into one whole being. This is why the world is so mental and messed up, it is teaching separation and sociopathism to be someone or something you are not which goes against the natural current of being itself.

originally posted by: richapau
a reply to: Ursushorribilis

Christianity doesn't make any sense.

Only the Damnationist variety fails to make sense.

Consider: Hell is said to be both hot and cold...hot as hell...cold as hell. You must be dead to go to Hell, but you must be alive to suffer eternal conscious torment...but you're dead.

The whole confusing mess is based on the concept of the Immortality of the Soul, which comes to us from pagan Greek philosophy. Hell itself comes to us from Norse mythology.

What a crazy quilt...and then a Damnationist has a sparkle in his/her eye as they tell you that you're going to Hell, you sinner.

originally posted by: richapau
a reply to: Ursushorribilis

Christianity doesn't make any sense.

Only because we have all been brainwashed on a massive scale.

Like a quote says below: our CULT-ure is an elaborate psy-op.

Modern "culture" is a product of the Luciferian conspiracy against Christian Civilization.

www.henrymakow.com...

The good news is that modern culture, based on the premise there is no inherent purpose or positive design in human life, has been exposed as a long-term Illuminati psy-op designed to demoralize us. It will fail.

The Satanic Origin of Modern Cult-ure

...historians, educators and journalists collaborate by upholding a false reality and distracting us from the truth. Our world, our perception of the human experience, are shaped by an occult secret society. Our culture is an elaborate psy-op.

The Satanic Cult That Rules the World

POPULAR CULTURE = BRAINWASHING. "Popular culture" (music, TV, movies, books, fashion etc.) is NOT spontaneous but corporate controlled and manufactured. "Today's mass culture operates like the opium trade: The supply determines the demand."

Bankers Are Behind The Counter Culture

Modern Western culture is based on denying objective truth and erecting a false reality in its place. The New World Order is dedicated to replacing Truth with a solipsism created by the same people who create money from nothing and charge interest.

Modern society is based on a solipsism created by Illuminati (Cabalist) Jewish bankers and their Masonic minions. The word "solipsism" means a self-created reality that has little or no connection with Truth. Instead of being dedicated to Truth, humanity has been hijacked by the bankers. The "New World Order" is a solipsism that stymies and enslaves mankind while increasing the bankers' power and wealth. We are being drawn into a solipsism that inverts good and evil; truth and lies. We are being inducted into a satanic cult.

WESTERN CULTURE BASED ON DENYING REALITY

Thus kulture is contrived. How do we know what we know? We are taught by the mass media and the education system. But what if they were subverted by a satanic secret society, i.e. the Illuminati? The mass media and education system promote this suspension of reality. Truth is suppressed. Lies are promulgated. Negative or self-destructive behavior is portrayed in a positive light.

How the Illuminati Control Culture

originally posted by: Ursushorribilis
Modern day Christianity preaches of Eternal Hellfire. In my opinion this concept of Hell was created to scare and convert people of different beliefs.

Logically it just doesn't make sense.

1. The punishment doesn't fit the crime.
30 years of adultery, or whatever your vice is, doesn't equate to eternal Hellfire.

2. It's anti-christian. Christianity preaches love and forgiveness. Hellfire is in direct conflict with the entire message of Christianity.


What do you think?

Christians are taught to ask for forgiveness. You don't go to hell for adultery, you go to hell for not believing.

originally posted by: Ursushorribilis
a reply to: silo13

Before Christ there is no hell. Then our "savior" arrives and all the sudden we have an eternal Hellfire. Makes no sense at all.

No but there was an underworld that people would go to before Jesus was born and started preaching Christianity. It was the dawn of a new age and people didn't have to pray to Jupiter and Zeus anymore.

originally posted by: Ursushorribilis

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: Ursushorribilis
a reply to: silo13

Before Christ there is no hell. Then our "savior" arrives and all the sudden we have an eternal Hellfire. Makes no sense at all.

Actually there were three different versions of "the afterlife"

the whole Hell/lake of fire thing was likely written into the narrative to push fear and conversion

Most definitely added to the narrative to instill fear.

Well one thing is for sure, I can 110% guarantee you that you're going to find out whether you're right or wrong in the near future. Are you confident enough about a nonexistent hell to push it all aside?

originally posted by: Seede
a reply to: Soulece

I challenge you. Say a person does nothing but good things in their life, helps out the needy, sacrifices their own well being for the comfort of others in a time of need, etc. They are also not a believer in Jesus Christ. Do they "burn forever" in hell?

EDIT: In fact, I present this challenge to anyone who says they are an intelligent religious person. Either you cannot explain it, accept the ideals may be wrong, or you find a way to send a good person to hell, in which is being anti christian. It's an arrogant win-win for me in this scenario. This is something I love presenting to people who believe they know the answers because of the bible saying so.

Wow, you asked a question and then answered your own question with a win, win in condemning any who could disagree with you.

I cannot be a judge of any person. That has not been given to me to know and if I don't know and then judge then that is not of Jesus. When John said that --

John 3:16-18
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
(17) For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
(18) He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

In that of which John has said, the entire matter is between each and every individual and the Creator.

I am not condemming. I am merely stating fact. If you send a good person to hell because they dont believe in Jesus, yet did nothing but good on this planet and helped others, that is contradicting. I dont make the facts, they make themselves.

originally posted by: Willtell
Anyone who believes in eternal hell is making the devil an equal to God.

God created EVERYTHING
Ultimately he’s even responsible for the devil and all the sinners since he created them


Think about it. If you created something you also created its nature, or what makes it tick. If you make it evil then that's its nature you exposed it to.

He also gave us the freedom to choose.

originally posted by: Barcs

originally posted by: silo13
First of all 'Modern' Christianity is DOWNPLAYING hell fire. They call it 'eternal separation from God' - instead of the hellfire it is.

Yeah it sure seems like they are totally downplaying hell. I mean I don't get threatened with eternal fire constantly by Christians in youtube comments on a daily basis or anything. I'm not sure what interpretation you are referring to, but I it seems each sect interprets it a bit differently.

Isn't it great that all we have to do is believe on Christ - and we bypass all the hellfire crap?

Not every Christian sect believes that. Many sects do believe in good deeds, and require forgiveness and repentance to get to heaven, not exclusively believing Jesus. No offense, but that interpretation is extremely harmful and detrimental to morality. You basically tell somebody that they can sin all they want as long as they believe in some magical demigod guy and accept him as your savior. It defeats the purpose of all of Jesus' teachings about benevolence, tolerance and loving all people (even sinners). Nobody should teach that crap to their children. Pay attention to what Jesus actually taught and teach them that. That was what he intended, not for everyone to disobey god constantly and still get a free phase to heaven just for belief.

MASTURBATORS?????? Aw damn man!

originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: Soulece

EDIT: In fact, I present this challenge to anyone who says they are an intelligent religious person. Either you cannot explain it, accept the ideals may be wrong, or you find a way to send a good person to hell, in which is being anti christian. It's an arrogant win-win for me in this scenario. This is something I love presenting to people who believe they know the answers because of the bible saying so.

You know that there are other religions in the world that have a "Heaven" yet don't worship Jesus, right? In other words, your "arrogant win-win for me" scenario fails when applied to virtually any religion that isn't Christianity.

Well my question is for all these people in this thread saying if you dont believe in Christ you go to hell. So no, it does not fail. I'm well aware there are other religions in the world.