About the Vegas Killer... newest info

a reply to: firerescue

well to be fair to he did work for Loughead Aircraft Manufacturing Company, the predecessor of Lockheed Martin almost thrity years ago from 1985 to 1988. does that make him a spook? hard to say. but i would say, no he wasn't because of all the other things he has done and was doing after that. not much time to be doing spooky things with all he was into and did.

a reply to: matafuchs

I'm pretty much right there with you -- but maybe a little farther because I do believe there were multiple shooters at multiple locations... but I don't believe for a minute that Paddock was one of them. I still think Paddock was working for the feds, the cameras were for the feds to watch the meeting in real time, and they know exactly what happened. I also suspect they were on-site -- perhaps in those adjoining rooms? -- and were there long before the LVMPD.

And if they had been able to explode those tanks, then everyone would have been running from the explosion right into the gunfire.

a reply to: Boadicea

I 100% agree wkth you. Paddock was working for feds and never fired a weapon.

Has anyone thought Campos and maybe the maintenance man are agents also? Maybe the ones in the adjoining room watching it all go down?

I have always wondered if Campos was an agent....and he ran to protect the agency (No blown cover) and the police shot him before he could identify himself.

a reply to: pale5218

I think those three single shots in the beginning were into the crowd because they started to move towards the gates before the first burst of rapid fire. Now they could have been concerned just from hearing the gun fire but I don't think that's plausible. Something was evident to some of the crowd before that first burst.

This is something I noticed as well. Several of the eyewitness accounts from close to the stage claim someone set off fireworks. One guy -- either Palermo or Rios -- claimed it was so close it blew out his ear. Those three shots are clear, distinct and spaced. I don't think anyone would mistake those shots for fireworks. So either someone did set off fireworks and folks were moving away from the fireworks... or there was gunfire other than the three spaced out shots.

Or am I missing something?

It occurs to me that for someone at an elevation, they could clearly see fireworks being set off on the ground... so could the setting off the fireworks below could be a signal for the shooter(s) to start firing?

a reply to: Boadicea

I still think Paddock was working for the feds, the cameras were for the feds to watch the meeting in real time, and they know exactly what happened.

if working for the feds or any other alphabet agency he wouldn't be the one putting in the cameras, their techs would. and they aren't going to be sloppy enough to place the camera on the cart under plates that can be seen or leave wires exposed, running under the door. where any body looking down would become suspicious if they saw them. in fact they would have more than likely used wyfi. or at least put them where nothing was exposed.

originally posted by: nikkib0421
a reply to: Boadicea

I 100% agree wkth you. Paddock was working for feds and never fired a weapon.

Has anyone thought Campos and maybe the maintenance man are agents also? Maybe the ones in the adjoining room watching it all go down?

I have always wondered if Campos was an agent....and he ran to protect the agency (No blown cover) and the police shot him before he could identify himself.

I have to confess that I initially bought the official story about Campos and thought he was a hero... but several here pointed out huge gaping holes in the story, and if I remember correctly there have been suggestions or musings about him working for the feds...

I think your scenario is very possible -- at least according to what we know. In the heat of things, who knows what could have happened.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Yes, that was pretty darn sloppy work IF that's how it was actually originally set up... but that's a very big IF. That's also pretty darn sloppy work if the cameras were intended to see down the corridor, but it seems that the cameras on the cart were positioned to monitor the stairwell door across the hall -- not the corridor.

Bottom line: Neither of us knows. We can only surmise and speculate.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: pale5218

I think those three single shots in the beginning were into the crowd because they started to move towards the gates before the first burst of rapid fire. Now they could have been concerned just from hearing the gun fire but I don't think that's plausible. Something was evident to some of the crowd before that first burst.

This is something I noticed as well. Several of the eyewitness accounts from close to the stage claim someone set off fireworks. One guy -- either Palermo or Rios -- claimed it was so close it blew out his ear. Those three shots are clear, distinct and spaced. I don't think anyone would mistake those shots for fireworks. So either someone did set off fireworks and folks were moving away from the fireworks... or there was gunfire other than the three spaced out shots.

Or am I missing something?

It occurs to me that for someone at an elevation, they could clearly see fireworks being set off on the ground... so could the setting off the fireworks below could be a signal for the shooter(s) to start firing?

It could have sounded different closer in the area because of the music. The guy recording was out by the perimeter.

One reason I don’t think it was firework, other than what we hear. Watch the people leaving around 3:40 before the first burst of rapid fire, some are looking back over their shoulder as if expecting someone comIng up behind them. It’s seems they were right on the verge of panic but not there until the rapid fire.

a reply to: Boadicea

It always struck me odd that in the beginning the Sheriff said Campos worked in tandem with their officers to seaech rooms. In some accounts they have Campos even leading the police in the search. Now, what LEO in their right mind allows an unarmed security officer to knock on doors when they don't know what lies behind those doors?

Unless, of course, he identified himself as fbi (or some other agent). Then, I would imagine, he would be given the lead.

The only thing i don't understand is why they changed the timeline of him being shot. The only thing i can thing of is the fbi found out the hotel was complicit in the attack to some degree. Instead of outting them (and the botched agency sting) they set it up so the hotel will be sued . Almost like paying a fine.

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Personally, I think the Fed's were watching in a nearby room, but most likely not with this setup. I am leaning towards the food cart was set up after the fact to look like a novice intentionally.

originally posted by: nikkib0421
a reply to: Boadicea

Now, what LEO in their right mind allows an unarmed security officer to knock on doors when they don't know what lies behind those doors?

Especially if Campos had been shot in the leg.

More holes in the story than in the door.

originally posted by: nikkib0421
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Personally, I think the Fed's were watching in a nearby room, but most likely not with this setup. I am leaning towards the food cart was set up after the fact to look like a novice intentionally.

originally posted by: nikkib0421
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

I am leaning towards the food cart was set up after the fact to look like a novice intentionally.

You may be right. I didn't see any bullet damage to the white table cloth that covered it. After 200 rounds fired into the hallway, at least a few should have hit that cart.

Edit to add: Have any photos of the bullet-ridden hallway been published?

a reply to: pale5218

It could have sounded different closer in the area because of the music. The guy recording was out by the perimeter.

Definitely. The guy on the perimeter probably didn't even hear whatever it was that others described as fireworks. Those accounts came from the folks right next to the stage.

One reason I don’t think it was firework, other than what we hear. Watch the people leaving around 3:40 before the first burst of rapid fire, some are looking back over their shoulder as if expecting someone comIng up behind them. It’s seems they were right on the verge of panic but not there until the rapid fire.

But I would expect folks to move away from someone lighting fireworks in the crowd as well, and they could be looking back over their shoulders in annoyance or disgust -- not fear. There have been so many reports of fireworks or firecrackers from so many different people, that I'm sure they heard something, we just don't know what.

originally posted by: nikkib0421
a reply to: Boadicea

It always struck me odd that in the beginning the Sheriff said Campos worked in tandem with their officers to seaech rooms. In some accounts they have Campos even leading the police in the search. Now, what LEO in their right mind allows an unarmed security officer to knock on doors when they don't know what lies behind those doors?

Excellent point. Also, why would the police be leading guests into the same corridor that the gunman just shot 200 bullets into? So he wasn't shooting at that moment... that's no reason to believe he couldn't start at any moment.

Unless, of course, he identified himself as fbi (or some other agent). Then, I would imagine, he would be given the lead.

That may be. And it would fit with my thought that the feds were already on scene long before the local LEOs.

The only thing i don't understand is why they changed the timeline of him being shot. The only thing i can thing of is the fbi found out the hotel was complicit in the attack to some degree. Instead of outting them (and the botched agency sting) they set it up so the hotel will be sued . Almost like paying a fine.

There I disagree... if anything, the feds are trying desperately to blame this on the hotel to cover for themselves... I would sooner believe that the feds told Mandalay/MGM that they were going to take the fall for this and to just suck it up or the feds would ruin them completely...

a reply to: carewemust

Yep. To my knowledge, zero pictures of of the hallway have been published. At least zero with buffet holes...mor even casings.

a reply to: Boadicea

then explain why there are the same kind of wires running across the hall in the image of the gun in the door? you do remember he had peep hole camera installed right? where if anybody walks in could see them.



i can hear them now,

1st FBI agent: i know lets put in hard wired cameras in the hall and peep hole.
2nd FBI agent: yea that'll work no body will ever question wires run all over the place. that way if things go sideways we can say he did it.

yea right. as i said if it was a under cover sting they wouldn't be that sloppy, and to think that they pre planned to make it look that sloppy is just ludicrous and highly doubtful. if done on the fly profilers would have probably thought of how he would have done it and looking at all his other gear, chances are they would have seen him as a wyfi kinda guy.

originally posted by: nikkib0421
a reply to: hounddoghowlie

Personally, I think the Fed's were watching in a nearby room, but most likely not with this setup. I am leaning towards the food cart was set up after the fact to look like a novice intentionally.

Exactly! We have no idea how or where the cart was initially set up, and we have no idea what or how that set up changed.

In fact, in some of the diagrams showing where weapons were found in the hotel room, there was one weapon placed in the kitchen area. And was in a perfect position to hit anyone and everyone entering the room from the side -- before anyone entering could even see them. This makes more sense to me than shooting into a corridor blindly and hoping you strike someone/something.

Also, if those cameras were to monitor the hall, who was monitoring the cameras? If it was a lone gunman, then I would expect laptops next to each shooting position in order to actually watch those monitors... but if it's a lone gunman, I would expect him to be focused on the job at hand. Can't watch the monitors and shoot up a crowd at the same time.

It all just doesn't add up.

a reply to: Boadicea

You could very well be right with the hotel being told to take the fall. Actually, that makes more sense than my scenario.

a reply to: Boadicea

You're right. I have seen the diagram you're talking about. That setup (with the guns in the kitchen) almost implied at least 2 shooters. To me anyway. Have someone manning that position at the ready...just in case.

Have they mentioned Campos' exact location when hiding from gunfire? I would imagine, if it happened like they claim, the shooter would be watching from inside the room? Did Campos play dead right where he was shot? One would assume if you shot at a person and saw him limp away....that he would be calling 911. How in the world did the shooter(s) feel safe enough to fire on the crowd for 10 minutes after?

Unless they expected to get shot by police, but obviously that didn't happen.