You have been lied to : Christians , Muslims , Jews - all worship the same God

originally posted by: fatkid
a reply to: zosimov

You said

"One of the main tenets of Christianity is the resurrection of Christ. Both Judaism and Islam deny the resurrection. In fact, Islam teaches that Judas, not Christ was crucified"

and

"Jesus taught his followers to love their enemy, to bless those who curse them"

And

"I can assure you, the teaching of Mohammed is not the same as that of Jesus."

And

"I am a Christian and have benefited to the core from my conversion. No amount of ridicule or insults could turn me away from the love of God.

And yes, I believe God created us all so of course there is only one God"

-----
You think that even mentioning that Muslims worship the God of Abraham is ridicule and insults???

Putting words in my mouth again I see. In my first post, I was actually responding to the first several responses (other people) to your original post, the same old dreck about low intelligence and religion being the root of all evil, etc.

As far as the other quotes you mention, I was responding to your comments on the words in the Quran and Bible being basically the same but we have cleared up that misunderstanding if you remember.

The last several sentences of your 1st post do point to making a case for the similarities in the three religions as being proof that they are really the same (Genesis, return of Jesus, flood, etc) which is why I thought I'd point to the differences as many other posters did.

Do I hate adherents of any other faith? NO, I think any kind of faith is powerful and good. But I do prescribe to one and not another, which I came to on my own volition a couple of years ago because of what i read in the New Testament. The OT never had that same effect on me. I can read it with different eyes these days, however. That's just my own view. People choose different faiths based on thier own preferences, and while it's sweet to look at the similarities the fact is people stay with one or another due to the differences. It is a good thing that there are differences in this world. Variety is nice, in my opinion, so is choice.

a reply to: zosimov


I respect your view and I'm not trying to change it...

Muslims and Christians Sharing the same God doesn't change anything about Christianity or your relationship with God...... It just (hopefully) changes the way people view the things they hear on the news....

originally posted by: fatkid
a reply to: zosimov


Muslims and Christians Sharing the same God doesn't change anything about Christianity or your relationship with God...... It just (hopefully) changes the way people view the things they hear on the news....

See you write things like this and I totally agree with you! Maybe I just really did misinterpret your tone. I do apologise for all of the needless bickering.

a reply to: fatkid

I like how you just try to avoid any points others make with a condescending tone. It's quite telling. Way to avoid questions you can't answer.

Fools
Teaching them

1. Proverbs 18:2-3 Fools have no interest in understanding; they only want to air their own opinions. Doing wrong leads to disgrace, and scandalous behavior brings contempt.

2. Proverbs 1:5-7 Let the wise listen to these proverbs and become even wiser. Let those with understanding receive guidance by exploring the meaning in these proverbs and parables, the words of the wise and their riddles. Fear of the LORD is the foundation of true knowledge, but fools despise wisdom and discipline.

3. Proverbs 12:15 The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.



The mouth of a fool.

4. Proverbs 10:18-19 He that hideth hatred with lying lips, and he that uttereth a slander, is a fool. In the multitude of words there wanteth not sin: but he that refraineth his lips is wise.

5. Proverbs 12:22-23 Lying lips are abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are his delight. A prudent man concealeth knowledge: but the heart of fools proclaimeth foolishness.

6. Proverbs 18:13 Spouting off before listening to the facts is both shameful and foolish.

7. Proverbs 29:20 There is more hope for a fool than for someone who speaks without thinking.

8. Isaiah 32:6 For the fool speaks folly, and his heart is busy with iniquity, to practice ungodliness, to utter error concerning the LORD, to leave the craving of the hungry unsatisfied, and to deprive the thirsty of drink.

9. Proverbs 18:6-7 Fools’ words get them into constant quarrels; they are asking for a beating. The mouths of fools are their ruin; they trap themselves with their lips.



They continue in their foolishness.

10. Proverbs 26:11 As a dog returns to its vomit, so a fool repeats his foolishness.



Arguing with them

11. Proverbs 29:8-9 Mockers can get a whole town agitated, but the wise will calm anger. If a wise person takes a fool to court, there will be ranting and ridicule but no satisfaction.

12. Proverbs 26:4-5 Do not answer a fool according to his folly, or you yourself will be just like him. Answer a fool according to his folly, or he will be wise in his own eyes.



Trusting them

13. Proverbs 26:6-7 Trusting a fool to convey a message is like cutting off one’s feet or drinking poison! A proverb in the mouth of a fool is as useless as a paralyzed leg.

14. Luke 6:39 Then Jesus gave the following illustration: “Can one blind person lead another? Won’t they both fall into a ditch?



The difference between an intelligent man and a fool.

15. Proverbs 10:23-25 Doing wrong is fun for a fool, but living wisely brings pleasure to the sensible. Doing wrong is fun for a fool, but living wisely brings pleasure to the sensible. When the storms of life come, the wicked are whirled away, but the godly have a lasting foundation.

16. Proverbs 15:21 Folly is joy to him that is destitute of wisdom: but a man of understanding walketh uprightly.

17. Proverbs 14:8-10 The wisdom of the prudent is to give thought to their ways, but the folly of fools is deception. Fools mock at making amends for sin, but goodwill is found among the upright.

18. Ecclesiastes 10:1-3 As dead flies cause even a bottle of perfume to stink, so a little foolishness spoils great wisdom and honor. A wise person chooses the right road; a fool takes the wrong one. You can identify fools just by the way they walk down the street!



Fools say there is no God.

19. Psalm 14:1 For the choir director: A psalm of David. Only fools say in their hearts, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, and their actions are evil; not one of them does good!

20. Psalm 53:1 1 The fool says in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, doing abominable iniquity; there is none who does good.

21. Psalm 74:18 Remember this, O LORD, that the enemy has reviled, And a foolish people has spurned Your name.



Can a Christian call someone a fool? This verse is speaking of unrighteous anger, which is a sin, but righteous anger is not a sin.

22. Matthew 5:22 But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.



Reminder

23. Proverbs 28:26 Those who trust in themselves are fools, but those who walk in wisdom are kept safe.

24. Proverbs 29:11 Fools vent their anger, but the wise quietly hold it back.



Example

25. Matthew 23:16-19 “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple. Blind fools! Which is more important–the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. How blind! For which is more important–the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred?

a reply to: filthyphilanthropist

I like where your head is at- although I would argue Jesus has always existed wit hGod the Father and the Holy Spirit.

a reply to: zosimov

No problem, we are all intellectuals.

The point of philosophy is to learn and ask questions, I like to examine a view in its entirety, before I abandon the process.

I prefer to remain neutral. But I like to explore an dea even while it is under attack, to see how well it holds together.

Just because I argue a point doesn't mean that I believe that idea is true or false, it means I am exploring its possibilities of being true.

It is how I learn new things.

a reply to: nomad4chr1st

You didn't pose a question you only posted a bunch of scripture with zero context.

The only statement you made is that I am avoid your statement, but you didn't even offer me something to avoid.

a reply to: filthyphilanthropist

In your opinion

If this were a democracy you would only have 33% of the vote being two to one. Because Jews certainly do not agree with the "former" glory thing

a reply to: filthyphilanthropist

Dp

a reply to: fatkid

I would quote you but I am too lazy.. something to the tune of ...I'm not going to do the research for you... ring a bell? The context is surrounding the scriptures. I know better than take a scripture out of its context.

Do you read ancient Arabic?

a reply to: nomad4chr1st

Do you read ancient Sumerian? Or Greek? Or Latin?

originally posted by: fatkid
a reply to: nomad4chr1st

You didn't pose a question you only posted a bunch of scripture with zero context.

The only statement you made is that I am avoid your statement, but you didn't even offer me something to avoid.

If you were referring to the post about fools.. yea read between the lines. With that being said, I don't see any valuable philosophy coming from you, but hey you got a few flags. I will continue to enjoy reading others replies.

a reply to: nomad4chr1st

"whoever says, ‘You fool!’ shall be in danger of hell fire” (Matthew 5:22)

That's what Jesus said at least .....

Stop trying to derail the thread

originally posted by: pthena
a reply to: blueman12

Fools qoute the bible or other holy books like they are saying profound things.

Strategy is for the Rabbis to pretend to 'like Jesus as a good Jewish boy' while eliminating all that would claim that he is anything but a good Jew eg. divinity, pre-existence, sonship, uniqueness, savior capacity, etc.

Oh yeah, should have said divine firstborn* son of God. To make sure I had that covered as well.

* = "firstborn of all creation" (Col. 1:15)

Btw, if Jesus isn't the firstborn of creation as many Trinitarians, Jews and Muslims would have you believe (by claiming "firstborn" means "preeminent" and some even take that 1 step further and change "of" to "over" in their bible translations such as the NIV, in spite of the fact that Paul already uses the Greek word for "preeminent" a couple of verses later, if he meant preeminent in verse 15 he would have used that word and not the word for "firstborn" and he wouldn't have said "of" either if he meant "preeminent over"); who was the firstborn of creation, the first created living intelligent being?

Note that the reaction (or nonreaction) of some people to the quotations in the video below (mostly Trinitarian scholars) often reminds me of the way fans of evolutionary philosophies react once you start quoting their teachers and gurus to them saying something they don't want to acknowledge (see my thread Watch "Gradual Change of Things" or "Development" (Over Time) in Action and in particular the reactions to the quotation from Shapiro using the phrase "philosophical belief system". I've had Trinitarians make similar 'you're quote mining' accusations. Or any other type of excuse to ignore or not acknowledge what is said in the quotation.

a reply to: fatkid

Well that is the thing about context comes into play here. This passage is addressing anger. Do a word study on the word fool from original translations. I WILL do the research for you this time.

but whosoever shall say thou fool, shall be danger of hell fire.
The word "fool" does not signify a man of weak parts, one that is very ignorant in things natural; this the word Raca imports; but a wicked reprobate man; in which sense Solomon often uses the word. The Persic version renders it here "wicked". There is a manifest gradation in the text from causeless anger in the breast, or reproachful words; and from thence to a censorious judging of a man's spiritual and eternal estate, which is what is here condemned. "Thou fool", is, thou wicked man, thou ungodly wretch, thou graceless creature, whose portion will be eternal damnation. Calling a man by such names was not allowed of by the Jews themselves, whose rules are:

``he that calls his neighbour a servant, let him be excommunicated; a bastard, let him be beaten with forty stripes; (evr) , "a wicked man", let him descend with him into his life or livelihood F26.''

here is another excerpt

Thou fool - Moreh, probably from מרה marah, to rebel, a rebel against God, apostate from all good. This term implied, among the Jews, the highest enormity, and most aggravated guilt. Among the Gentoos, such an expression was punished by cutting out the tongue, and thrusting a hot iron, of ten fingers breadth, into the mouth of the person who used it. Code of Gentoo Laws, chap. 15: sec. 2. p. 212.

I am referring to you as being a fool because you are being ignorant. Your lack of understanding the context or actual meaning is not your fault. It just shows your inability and lack of discipline in attempting to understand the texts you make such great claims about. LOL

Seriously though. You're a brother. All of you are brothers and I am to love everyone. I study other religions to understand and relate and to break down barriers so I can truly follow Christ's example. I don't care about being right, I care about spreading truth and love. If i didn't I would have dropped this thread a while back. I want to say I am glad you are thinking critically, but I just don't see the fruits of a thorough study. I see shock factor to promote yourself. That's ok though. Just don't expect it not to be called out or challenged in a forum like ATS.

a reply to: nomad4chr1st

Yeah man, if you think the scripture was handed to man for you to make a foundation of personnel insults to people, I'm sorry to Inform you that you completely missed the point.

It is intended to be used to bring man close to God.....

What you are doing is heartbreaking....

The thing about all of your links is that you link what other people have said ABOUT the bible, I linked what Jesus said IN the bible

a reply to: whereislogic

Good stuff thank you for the video

a reply to: rickymouse

But, if you can get people to realize that everyone else in the could be a part of the problem

But we are all also a part of that problem,

Once we start to believe that we are not at fault and every other group is to blame, is when we begging to experience turmoil -expecting the world to change to suit our needs.

originally posted by: fatkid
a reply to: rickymouse

But, if you can get people to realize that everyone else in the could be a part of the problem

But we are all also a part of that problem,

Once we start to believe that we are not at fault and every other group is to blame, is when we begging to experience turmoil -expecting the world to change to suit our needs.

It appears to be part of human nature.

a reply to: fatkid

Yes but you cannot simply ignore the root words in which it was translated from. Clearly you must understand that?

I am sorry if I have offended you. I am human and imperfect. But the points I made are valid nonetheless. I find it truly heartbreaking that you believe a lie which you stand in your OP. And furthermore that you wish to push it on others. Let those who seek answers find them for themselves. Because everything you have posted is a mans thoughts and opinions.

See the difference between you and I is that I believe the Bible in its entirety was inspired by God. Yes men wrote it, men inspired by God. I don't think anything I said is going to convince you or change your mind. But I have studied into what your OP states and have found it inaccurate in my OPINION. I only encourage others to study for themselves and not to blindly follow as you put it. After all the OP is your OPINION.

The truth is the Christian gospel IS offensive. It requires people to look inside themselves and examine. It challenges us to admit that we are wrong about some things. It's also offensive because Jesus himself claims to be the only way to God. So yes the gospel message of Jesus Christ is offensive. But that doesn't mean it can't be portrayed with love, humility and gentleness. That is something I am working on. But to say my God is the same as another who contradicts His teachings is not something I afford not to speak up about. It is less to disagree with you and more to offer an alternative to others reading this thread.

Proverbs 27:17New American Standard Bible (NASB)

17 Iron sharpens iron,
So one man sharpens another.