Nigel Farage To Address Trump Rally.

a reply to: UKTruth

Which facts? The stat's that a handful of towns or council borough's have a high percentage of Muslims in the UK?

I'm in full support of equal restrictions on 'needed' immigration for anyone from any country in the world. That is sensible. If someone is useful to the UK then welcome with open arms, but if they are not needed or fleeing from oppression then no.
We agree in part, just not the fear of the average Muslim thing and the rate of population increase.
...the fear mongering bit.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

Would I want my area to be majority Muslim? Nope, I'd prefer a street full of Sikhs or Hindus for my own perceived and experienced integration reasons.
What exactly do you want though? A ban on Muslims breeding?
I'm interested in your plan more than your fear mongering.

The facts do not constitute fear mongering.
The solution, if one is needed, is simple - apply quota's on those granted entry. Those quota's should be calculated using existing and projected demographics in combination with required skills. There should also be no access to benefits for at least 5 years from entry to the country.

By the way, I agree with you. Sikhs and Hindus (the latter of which is my ancestry on my father's side) are far more successful at integrating in my experience too.

So you are suggesting applying a quota based on religion now? And pray tell how does that actually work Alf? You really are starting to show your true colours now aren't you?

originally posted by: uncommitted

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

Would I want my area to be majority Muslim? Nope, I'd prefer a street full of Sikhs or Hindus for my own perceived and experienced integration reasons.
What exactly do you want though? A ban on Muslims breeding?
I'm interested in your plan more than your fear mongering.

The facts do not constitute fear mongering.
The solution, if one is needed, is simple - apply quota's on those granted entry. Those quota's should be calculated using existing and projected demographics in combination with required skills. There should also be no access to benefits for at least 5 years from entry to the country.

By the way, I agree with you. Sikhs and Hindus (the latter of which is my ancestry on my father's side) are far more successful at integrating in my experience too.

So you are suggesting applying a quota based on religion now? And pray tell how does that actually work Alf? You really are starting to show your true colours now aren't you?

What do you mean starting to show true colours???
I think I have been pretty clear - reduce the inorganic growth of the Muslim religion in the UK by applying quotas, which quite obviously can be done through applying said quotas to particular nations.

This is one of the major issues that the people of the UK decided to leave the EU on, so the people have shown their 'true colours' - which is the preservation of the British way of life and a rejection of changing the fabric of the society of this country through artificial methods.
Farage led the way and his message is resonating around the world too.

Geert Wilders' Party for Freedom in the Netherlands is another voice. He now has the most popular party leading into the 2017 elections and has just called for a complete shut down of all mosques and a total ban on the Koran. In my view this is extreme, however it's a consequence and a reaction to the same problem Farage has been talking about. La Pen in France also leads the popular vote going into next year's French elections.

There is a real problem with immigration and the uprising of people all across Europe should tell you that. Crying 'racist' at this point will only further divide and make things worse. Real solutions to a very real problem are required.

originally posted by: UKTruth
I think I have been pretty clear - reduce the inorganic growth of the Muslim religion in the UK by applying quotas, which quite obviously can be done through applying said quotas to particular nations.

This is one of the major issues that the people of the UK decided to leave the EU on, so the people have shown their 'true colours' - which is the preservation of the British way of life and a rejection of changing the fabric of the society of this country through artificial methods.

The UK already has full national control over immigration from non EU countries, and always has had that control.
The only potential change regarding immigration after the UK leaving the EU is control over the free movement of people who are citizens of EU nations.
The leave vote is irrelevant to your musings about Muslims moving to the UK. Which EU nations exactly are Muslim nations?

Ah, that's right, none.

Face it, you have started on a rant in this thread, clearly anti-Muslim, posting propaganda youtubes with little substance and much inaccuracies, then show you have no clue about the immigration issue and EU membership.
Britain already has control over immigration from the 'Muslim countries' you appear to dislike so much.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: UKTruth
I think I have been pretty clear - reduce the inorganic growth of the Muslim religion in the UK by applying quotas, which quite obviously can be done through applying said quotas to particular nations.

This is one of the major issues that the people of the UK decided to leave the EU on, so the people have shown their 'true colours' - which is the preservation of the British way of life and a rejection of changing the fabric of the society of this country through artificial methods.

The UK already has full national control over immigration from non EU countries, and always has had that control.
The only potential change regarding immigration after the UK leaving the EU is control over the free movement of people who are citizens of EU nations.
The leave vote is irrelevant to your musings about Muslims moving to the UK. Which EU nations exactly are Muslim nations?

Ah, that's right, none.

Face it, you have started on a rant in this thread, clearly anti-Muslim, posting propaganda youtubes with little substance and much inaccuracies, then show you have no clue about the immigration issue and EU membership.
Britain already has control over immigration from the 'Muslim countries' you appear to dislike so much.

Absolute tosh.

A large part of the EU vote was about immigration, regardless of your denials.

Yes part of it was about free movement in Europe - and part of it was about millions of Muslims 'refugees' who gain entry to other European nations, and then travel to the UK freely after gaining citizenship (which will take less than a decade). Part of it was also about the threat of Turkey being given EU membership in years to come and the resultant open door to any of the 70m Muslims there. Try and at least understand the issue, please. , before spouting off nonsense
It's probably why you are so upset about the people of the UK voting to leave - you didn't understand the long term issues. I am so glad people who think like yourself on this issue lost the referendum.

As for quota's of course it would involve non EU countries too, as it should.

a reply to: UKTruth

Haha you knob, I voted leave as well!
Don't believe me just go back through my posting history...hahaha fail!

Just because I don't spout the clear hatred you have for Muslims doesn't mean I wanted to remain in the EU, my reasons were control over free movement of EU country citizens, sovereignty of government, and frankly the #ing waste of money being a member of an expensive club.

You don't speak for the nation, you have your opinion as do I, but thinking I voted remain because I don't hate on Muslims like you do is funny as #! I voted leave, I just don't hate Muslims lol!

*Edit*
UK Truth? ...UK bull# more like!

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

Haha you knob, I voted leave as well!
Don't believe me just go back through my posting history...hahaha fail!

Just because I don't spout the clear hatred you have for Muslims doesn't mean I wanted to remain in the EU, my reasons were control over free movement of EU country citizens, sovereignty of government, and frankly the #ing waste of money being a member of an expensive club.

You don't speak for the nation, you have your opinion as do I, but thinking I voted remain because I don't hate on Muslims like you do is funny as #! I voted leave, I just don't hate Muslims lol!

*Edit*
UK Truth? ...UK bull# more like!

You certainly didn't understand the immigration issue as your previous post shows. If you did vote to leave - bravo - hopefully you will now take the time to further your understanding on immigration and the long term implications.
The people speak for the nation - and it was not about hating muslims, which I have not said I do. You are projecting and attacking me personally as you don't seem to have any other valid argument.

To reiterate, the question was; are areas of the UK being overtaken by muslims and are areas of the UK changing as a result - answer is undeniably yes. No amount of accusations of hate or pearl clutching in the face of uncomfortable truths is going to change that fact.

Is it a fact that the EU vote was driven in part by the threat of open borders and specifically Muslim immigration? - yes. Undeniable fact. You were wrong, plain and simple. It's ok to be wrong from time to time, but not to then lash out and accuse others of hatred and prejudice because you were wrong.

Now, you can continue with baseless accusations of hate and prejudice all you like - it's just a hollow sound these days and has no effect.

originally posted by: UKTruth
You certainly didn't understand the immigration issue as your previous post shows. If you did vote to leave - bravo - hopefully you will now take the time to further your understanding on immigration and the long term implications.

Nope, I understand the immigration details very well, both EU and non-EU, as well as the situation of people being naturalised in another EU nation first.

The people speak for the nation - and it was not about hating muslims, which I have not said I do. You are projecting and attacking me personally as you don't seem to have any other valid argument.

Nope again, I'm just reading your posts and you appear to have a major problems with Muslims.
I interpret that as a form of hatred or fear. Your posts speak for themselves.

To reiterate, the question was; are areas of the UK being overtaken by muslims and are areas of the UK changing as a result - answer is undeniably yes. No amount of accusations of hate or pearl clutching in the face of uncomfortable truths is going to change that fact.

Yeah, a handful of towns and council boroughs have a high Muslim population as I stated previously.
The Muslim population UK wide is around 5% yet still you are wetting your pants about the scary Muslims.

Is it a fact that the EU vote was driven in part by the threat of open borders and specifically Muslim immigration - yes. Undeniable fact. You were wrong, plain and simple.

You tell me and the rest of ATS, go on, where's your source that Muslim immigration was the decider in the EU vote?
Come on, a decent sized poll or something is all you have to present, because right now all you have is your personal anecdotal assertions.

Now, you can continue with baseless accusations of hate and prejudice all you like - it's just a hollow sound these days and has no effect.

Nopoe, again, I perceive you to have major issues with Muslims as in your posted words and I deem it to be inspired by either hate or fear.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: UKTruth
You certainly didn't understand the immigration issue as your previous post shows. If you did vote to leave - bravo - hopefully you will now take the time to further your understanding on immigration and the long term implications.

Nope, I understand the immigration details very well, both EU and non-EU, as well as the situation of people being naturalised in another EU nation first.

The people speak for the nation - and it was not about hating muslims, which I have not said I do. You are projecting and attacking me personally as you don't seem to have any other valid argument.

Nope again, I'm just reading your posts and you appear to have a major problems with Muslims.
I interpret that as a form of hatred or fear. Your posts speak for themselves.

To reiterate, the question was; are areas of the UK being overtaken by muslims and are areas of the UK changing as a result - answer is undeniably yes. No amount of accusations of hate or pearl clutching in the face of uncomfortable truths is going to change that fact.

Yeah, a handful of towns and council boroughs have a high Muslim population as I stated previously.
The Muslim population UK wide is around 5% yet still you are wetting your pants about the scary Muslims.

Is it a fact that the EU vote was driven in part by the threat of open borders and specifically Muslim immigration - yes. Undeniable fact. You were wrong, plain and simple.

You tell me and the rest of ATS, go on, where's your source that Muslim immigration was the decider in the EU vote?
Come on, a decent sized poll or something is all you have to present, because right now all you have is your personal anecdotal assertions.

Now, you can continue with baseless accusations of hate and prejudice all you like - it's just a hollow sound these days and has no effect.

Nopoe, again, I perceive you to have major issues with Muslims as in your posted words and I deem it to be inspired by either hate or fear.

Hopefully you are learning about immigration and your new recognition of the route through Europe is an encouraging sign you are starting to get it.

Your interpretation of what I think is irrelevant to me.

Immigration and musim refugees and the threat of Turkey (with a 97% muslim population) joining the EU were key reasons people decided to leave the EU among other reasons (not 'the decider' which you seem to have introduced as new language in the discussion- a key sign you lost the argument), .

Here is the BBC's take on it:
8 reasons Britain voted leave

Here is the poll MORI did on the key issues prior to the vote:
MORI poll - EU referendum key issues
Immigration was number 1.

We've already talked about the percentages of Muslims and I have already corrected your rather vague comment that it's been at 5% 'for a while', when in fact it has nearly tripled since 1991 and is projected to double again by 2030.

As with you interpretations, your perception is also irrelevant to me.

originally posted by: UKTruth
Hopefully you are learning about immigration and your new recognition of the route through Europe is an encouraging sign you are starting to get it.

I already knew it, I've learned nothing from you other than you have a particular problem with Muslims.

Your interpretation of what I think is irrelevant to me.

Cool, your posts speak for themselves.

Immigration and musim refugees and the threat of Turkey (with a 97% muslim population) joining the EU were key reasons people decided to leave the EU among other reasons (not 'the decider' which you seem to have introduced as new language in the discussion- a key sign you lost the argument), .

Here is the BBC's take on it:
8 reasons Britain voted leave

Here is the poll MORI did on the key issues prior to the vote:
MORI poll - EU referendum key issues
Immigration was number 1.

No mention of Muslims like you are banging on about.

We've already talked about the percentages of Muslims and I have already corrected your rather vague comment that it's been at 5% 'for a while', when in fact it has nearly tripled since 1991 and is projected to double again by 2030.

So hopw many Muslims is too much for you?
What is your plan to stop the increase then?
Ban Muslims from breeding or have quotas specifically on Muslims immigrating?
Come on, you are the one wetting your pants about Muslims, so what do you advocate as a course of action which will enable you to keep your pants dry?

As with you interpretations, your perception is also irrelevant to me.

Again, cool

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: UKTruth
Hopefully you are learning about immigration and your new recognition of the route through Europe is an encouraging sign you are starting to get it.

I already knew it, I've learned nothing from you other than you have a particular problem with Muslims.

Your interpretation of what I think is irrelevant to me.

Cool, your posts speak for themselves.

Immigration and musim refugees and the threat of Turkey (with a 97% muslim population) joining the EU were key reasons people decided to leave the EU among other reasons (not 'the decider' which you seem to have introduced as new language in the discussion- a key sign you lost the argument), .

Here is the BBC's take on it:
8 reasons Britain voted leave

Here is the poll MORI did on the key issues prior to the vote:
MORI poll - EU referendum key issues
Immigration was number 1.

No mention of Muslims like you are banging on about.

We've already talked about the percentages of Muslims and I have already corrected your rather vague comment that it's been at 5% 'for a while', when in fact it has nearly tripled since 1991 and is projected to double again by 2030.

So hopw many Muslims is too much for you?
What is your plan to stop the increase then?
Ban Muslims from breeding or have quotas specifically on Muslims immigrating?
Come on, you are the one wetting your pants about Muslims, so what do you advocate as a course of action which will enable you to keep your pants dry?

As with you interpretations, your perception is also irrelevant to me.

Again, cool

You're now going round in circles.
Good luck with that.

I'll conclude with this from 9 months before the vote:

HSBC pointed out that a Survation poll commissioned by the Mail on Sunday, published on September 6, revealed that support for Brexit has a 51% lead. More tellingly, "of those who wanted to stay, 22% said they might change their minds if the migrant and refugee crisis deepened."

So far you've learned about Europe being a gateway to free movement from non European countries, a rising percentage of Muslims in the UK population, UK places being changed with Muslim majorities close to be being a reality, and the leave vote which Farage championed being driven in a key way by immigration and moreover the threat of the refugee crisis from Muslim nations. There's no charge, but I'll leave you to continue your education on your own.

originally posted by: UKTruth
I'll conclude with this from 9 months before the vote:

HSBC pointed out that a Survation poll commissioned by the Mail on Sunday, published on September 6, revealed that support for Brexit has a 51% lead. More tellingly, "of those who wanted to stay, 22% said they might change their minds if the migrant and refugee crisis deepened."

So 22% might have changed their mind if the migrant and refugees crisis deepend.
That's the best you've got to support your claims that concerns about Muslim immigration effectively swung the vote for leave?!
That's lame at best...again no mention specifically about Muslims, try again.

So far you've learned about Europe being a gateway to free movement from non European countries,

Nope, I knew that already many years ago.

a rising percentage of Muslims in the UK population, UK places being changed with Muslim majorities close to be being a reality,

Nope, I knew that as well before engaging with you.

and the leave vote which Farage championed being driven in a key way by immigration and moreover the threat of the refugee crisis from Muslim nations.

Nope again, Farage focused on the inability of the UK to control immigration from within the EU. He was careful not to mention Muslims, but you clearly are focused on Muslims specifically.

There's no charge, but I'll leave you to continue your education on your own.

You keep saying that like a petulant child, here, I'll repeat it in case you missed it, you have taught me nothing in this thread...see the above points, perhaps re-read them or ask a friend if I've used words which you don't understand.

Well, saying that, you have taught me that you have a problem with people who are Muslim, specifically.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: UKTruth
I'll conclude with this from 9 months before the vote:

HSBC pointed out that a Survation poll commissioned by the Mail on Sunday, published on September 6, revealed that support for Brexit has a 51% lead. More tellingly, "of those who wanted to stay, 22% said they might change their minds if the migrant and refugee crisis deepened."

So 22% might have changed their mind if the migrant and refugees crisis deepend.
That's the best you've got to support your claims that concerns about Muslim immigration effectively swung the vote for leave?!
That's lame at best...again no mention specifically about Muslims, try again.

So far you've learned about Europe being a gateway to free movement from non European countries,

Nope, I knew that already many years ago.

a rising percentage of Muslims in the UK population, UK places being changed with Muslim majorities close to be being a reality,

Nope, I knew that as well before engaging with you.

and the leave vote which Farage championed being driven in a key way by immigration and moreover the threat of the refugee crisis from Muslim nations.

Nope again, Farage focused on the inability of the UK to control immigration from within the EU. He was careful not to mention Muslims, but you clearly are focused on Muslims specifically.

There's no charge, but I'll leave you to continue your education on your own.

You keep saying that like a petulant child, here, I'll repeat it in case you missed it, you have taught me nothing in this thread...see the above points, perhaps re-read them or ask a friend if I've used words which you don't understand.

Well, saying that, you have taught me that you have a problem with people who are Muslim, specifically.

You thought the EU Leave votes had nothing to do with immigration, including Muslim immigration - you were wrong (it's actually a really odd position to take and sounds like you just got yourself entrenched because you can't admit when you're wrong). You've now been shown a study which specifically links a worsening refugee crisis to people saying they will vote leave. You dismiss it because it said 'refugee' and not 'muslim'. You are also making up more language like 'effectively swung the vote' when it was never claimed. More of the same deflections to try and extract yourself from claiming something that is obviously true to be not true. Amusing. No matter, more on that below...

You thought there was no link between EU membership and Muslim immigration to the UK - you were wrong.

You thought the percentage of Muslims in the UK population had not risen - you were wrong.

You are now hiding behind the absence of a BREXIT poll specifically on Muslims, despite immigration being the number one issue for leavers, of which Muslim immigration is a key part. YouGov did actually run a poll on British attitudes toward Islam - 55% said “there is a fundamental clash between Islam and the values of British society”. But lets' forget what people actually say, eh, and assume it did not contribute to the BREXIT vote? Nah... you're wrong again.

British people do not think that Islam is compatible with British values

This kind of information is easily accessible and you are just being wilfully ignorant - presumably because all of your arguments have proven to be false positions.

You now think that Farage did not mention muslims, yet he ran a poster of refugees flooding into the country during the campaign and said this:

Nigel Farage has warned there is rising public concern about immigration partly because people believe there are some Muslims who want to form “a fifth column and kill us”, and that there has never before been a migrant group that wants to “change who we are and what we are”.

So you were wrong again.

You keep making false statements. I assume because you just didn't research it enough.

As I said - all you have are irrelevant attacks on my character. (which I find even more amusing - the fall back "racist!" or "bigot!" cry as soon as other arguments have been shown to be false)

The feeling British people so obviously have - the majority - is being reflected in the US (not quite a majority yet) and that is why Farage was cheered so loudly by thousands of people in America. Lack of control on borders and specifically the threat of Muslims extremism is an issue you can't hide from or make go away by accusing others of bigotry.

a reply to: UKTruth

Ah, I'll leave you to your hatred for Muslims fella...it is clear in your posts and the propaganda youtubes you posted.
Continuing to engage with you leaves an unpleasant taste in my mouth.
I would wish you well but your apparent bigotry against people just for being Muslim draws me against doing so.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

Ah, I'll leave you to your hatred for Muslims fella...it is clear in your posts and the propaganda youtubes you posted.
Continuing to engage with you leaves an unpleasant taste in my mouth.
I would wish you well but your apparent bigotry against people just for being Muslim draws me against doing so.

Like I said - when all other arguments are proven to be false- cry 'bigot'.
I actually do wish you well, though. I don't blame you for not doing enough research... there's lots to find out.

a reply to: UKTruth

Evil Muslims eh, taking our jobs and turning the UK into a Sharia zone!!!
Lol, yeah, your fear or loathing is evident in your posts.

UKTruth you should of stopped posting a few pages back, your posts are coming across as both ignorant and racist.

Take a step back, compose yourself and re-think your approach because so far its not looking good for you.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: UKTruth

Evil Muslims eh, taking our jobs and turning the UK into a Sharia zone!!!
Lol, yeah, your fear or loathing is evident in your posts.

I didn't mention jobs or Sharia. You seem to be running down multiple paths at the same time and are somewhat confused.

Again, the simple question was whether areas of the UK are changing and being overtaken by muslims. The answer is , yes they are.
Your follow up challenge on the EU vote being influenced by British attitudes towards Islam has also been dealt with.

I don;t think it's really worth discussing the job market and sharia law - other than to say that some muslims do want to change laws to reflect sharia in the areas that they dominate - though I suspect that number is small (at least vocally). As for jobs, it's kind of been covered in that I said I believe immigration should in part be skills based.

originally posted by: SudoNim
UKTruth you should of stopped posting a few pages back, your posts are coming across as both ignorant and racist.

Take a step back, compose yourself and re-think your approach because so far its not looking good for you.

If you can point to a single ignorant or racist comment then go ahead.
Hint : you can't.

Interesting take on the speech from Farage.
Farage on his speech

I did find the headline comment funny.

Farage: Maybe If I Donate To The Clinton Foundation Hillary Won’t Attack Me