*****Republican National Convention thread. Let the games begin.*****

a reply to: UKTruth

Perhaps you should set aside your political bias and just give her credit. To be fair to most of the pundits, that's what they did.

I have not said anything on this issue to give the appearance of a bias. All I said is that if this was someone on the Left, the right would be in an uproar.

It would probably be creeping towards making the front page of ATS and even one of the main headlines on Drudge Report.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: introvert

And guess what? the predictable crew are in here saying she plagiarized.

Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

Rightfully so. Wouldn't you be making a big deal out of this if it was the Democrat nominee's potential first lady that appeared to have plagiarized someone else's speech?

Be honest now.

a reply to: DJW001

The theme was Make America Safe Again. Foreign policy or why anything is better than letting Hillary have access to the keys to the country after what we know? It seems they took mostly the latter route after what we know.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I don't know. What about Biden?

Biden is a serial plagiarizer, and everyone excuses him all the time because "that's just Joe" but he has a clear pattern of it and did it while he was running for president. Melania is just the wife of the candidate.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: ketsuko
Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

How to Recognize Plagiarism

If the summary contains a sequence of 7 or more words taken from that source which is not properly acknowledged, then word-for-word plagiarism is also committed.

Yup. It passes as plagiarism. There are several places where more than seven words were EXACTLY the same. There's one place where 23 words are the same.

The writers obviously knew they were plagiarizing, because sometimes they left one word out or changed just one or two words... It's not her fault, it's the incompetent campaign... run by an incompetent politician.

originally posted by: ketsuko
You never answered if you would be treating Jeb!'s wife like this.

Would you be making excuses if Barack Obama's wife had copied someone's speech?

Incompetent politician... sounds refreshing. Someone not used to the veil of bull# then.
Meanwhile for real incompetence let's refer back to a secretary of state leaving classified information that put lives at risk on her home brew server in her basement

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I don't know. What about Biden?

Biden is a serial plagiarizer, and everyone excuses him all the time because "that's just Joe" but he has a clear pattern of it and did it while he was running for president. Melania is just the wife of the candidate.

Nice red herring.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: ketsuko
Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

How to Recognize Plagiarism

If the summary contains a sequence of 7 or more words taken from that source which is not properly acknowledged, then word-for-word plagiarism is also committed.

Yup. It passes as plagiarism. There are several places where more than seven words were EXACTLY the same. There's one place where 23 words are the same.

The writers obviously knew they were plagiarizing, because sometimes they left one word out or changed just one or two words... It's not her fault, it's the incompetent campaign... run by an incompetent politician.

originally posted by: ketsuko
You never answered if you would be treating Jeb!'s wife like this.

Would you be making excuses if Barack Obama's wife had copied someone's speech?

Incompetent politician... sounds refreshing. Someone not used to the veil of bull# then.
Meanwhile for real incompetence let's refer back to a secretary of state leaving classified information that put lives at risk on her home brew server in her basement

And yet another red herring.

It's a logical fallacy double play!

a reply to: introvert

Not to mention, from the same piece:

According to Plagiarism Today, Obama was running against Hillary Clinton in the primary when he gave a speech in Wisconsin that “quoted a series of well-known speeches and documents from U.S. history, including those by Martin Luther King Jr, John F. Kennedy as well as the Declaration of Independence and asked if they were ‘Just Words.”

As in the Melania speech, it didn’t take long for someone to unearth a YouTube speech of a 2006 talk given by Deval Patrick, the governor of Massachusetts, says the site. Says Plagiarism Today, “In Patrick’s speech, he used many of the same quotes as well as very similar phrasing.” Obama said he shared ideas with Patrick, who defended him after the allegations were made, said Plagiarism Today.

What Melania is accused of doing is very similar to what Obama was accused of doing with one of Deval Patrick's speeches when he was running against Hillary in the 2008 primary.

Of course, Patrick had Obama's back since all good Demcrats do that and I doubt the same courtesy will be extended here whether there was or was not a conscious lifting of the words.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

Perhaps you should set aside your political bias and just give her credit. To be fair to most of the pundits, that's what they did.

I have not said anything on this issue to give the appearance of a bias. All I said is that if this was someone on the Left, the right would be in an uproar.

It would probably be creeping towards making the front page of ATS and even one of the main headlines on Drudge Report.

Bias takes many forms, including the things one does not say. I am yet to hear a rounded and balanced assessment from anyone on this thread not supportive of Trump and his campaign. When that is the case it undermines everything else one could say, even if true.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: ketsuko
Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

How to Recognize Plagiarism

If the summary contains a sequence of 7 or more words taken from that source which is not properly acknowledged, then word-for-word plagiarism is also committed.

Yup. It passes as plagiarism. There are several places where more than seven words were EXACTLY the same. There's one place where 23 words are the same.

The writers obviously knew they were plagiarizing, because sometimes they left one word out or changed just one or two words... It's not her fault, it's the incompetent campaign... run by an incompetent politician.

originally posted by: ketsuko
You never answered if you would be treating Jeb!'s wife like this.

Would you be making excuses if Barack Obama's wife had copied someone's speech?

Incompetent politician... sounds refreshing. Someone not used to the veil of bull# then.
Meanwhile for real incompetence let's refer back to a secretary of state leaving classified information that put lives at risk on her home brew server in her basement

And yet another red herring.

It's a logical fallacy double play!

Not really - the charge was incompetence. I am merely pointing out that the clearest case of incompetence relating to the two candidates is that of the ex secretary of state. That is unless you believe not fully vetting a speech is more incompetent than leaving classified information on an unprotected server in your basement.

a reply to: ketsuko

And another...so much for honesty, huh?

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: ketsuko

And another...so much for honesty, huh?

Again, cuts both ways. You only have to look at your post history on this thread to know that you have been dishonest.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: UKTruth

Perhaps you should set aside your political bias and just give her credit. To be fair to most of the pundits, that's what they did.

I have not said anything on this issue to give the appearance of a bias. All I said is that if this was someone on the Left, the right would be in an uproar.

It would probably be creeping towards making the front page of ATS and even one of the main headlines on Drudge Report.

Bias takes many forms, including the things one does not say. I am yet to hear a rounded and balanced assessment from anyone on this thread not supportive of Trump and his campaign. When that is the case it undermines everything else one could say, even if true.

That is illogical nonsense. I know you are biased in your politics, but you could at least not try to insult our intelligence with that sort of garbage.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: ketsuko
Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

How to Recognize Plagiarism

If the summary contains a sequence of 7 or more words taken from that source which is not properly acknowledged, then word-for-word plagiarism is also committed.

Yup. It passes as plagiarism. There are several places where more than seven words were EXACTLY the same. There's one place where 23 words are the same.

The writers obviously knew they were plagiarizing, because sometimes they left one word out or changed just one or two words... It's not her fault, it's the incompetent campaign... run by an incompetent politician.

originally posted by: ketsuko
You never answered if you would be treating Jeb!'s wife like this.

Would you be making excuses if Barack Obama's wife had copied someone's speech?

Incompetent politician... sounds refreshing. Someone not used to the veil of bull# then.
Meanwhile for real incompetence let's refer back to a secretary of state leaving classified information that put lives at risk on her home brew server in her basement

And yet another red herring.

It's a logical fallacy double play!

Not really - the charge was incompetence. I am merely pointing out that the clearest case of incompetence relating to the two candidates is that of the ex secretary of state. That is unless you believe not fully vetting a speech is more incompetent than leaving classified information on an unprotected server in your basement.

Yes, it was a red herring because you are trying to change the focus of attention to someone other than the topic at hand.

a reply to: introvert

Nope, not at all.

The point is that you cannot make a stand on the moral hill of you are too biased when your own closet contains skeletons.

Fact is, this lifting of words has been done and I am pretty sure you'd be excusing it ... more or less the same things you are accusing us of. If it's a non-issue, then it's a non-issue. Not an issue only when you want it to be.

So is it an issue or isn't it? And if it is, then we have to talk about all these events, not just Melania Trump.

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: ketsuko

And another...so much for honesty, huh?

Again, cuts both ways. You only have to look at your post history on this thread to know that you have been dishonest.

Dishonest about what?

By the way, you do realize that you are using the "I know you are, but what am I" argument, right?

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: ketsuko
Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

How to Recognize Plagiarism

If the summary contains a sequence of 7 or more words taken from that source which is not properly acknowledged, then word-for-word plagiarism is also committed.

Yup. It passes as plagiarism. There are several places where more than seven words were EXACTLY the same. There's one place where 23 words are the same.

The writers obviously knew they were plagiarizing, because sometimes they left one word out or changed just one or two words... It's not her fault, it's the incompetent campaign... run by an incompetent politician.

originally posted by: ketsuko
You never answered if you would be treating Jeb!'s wife like this.

Would you be making excuses if Barack Obama's wife had copied someone's speech?

Incompetent politician... sounds refreshing. Someone not used to the veil of bull# then.
Meanwhile for real incompetence let's refer back to a secretary of state leaving classified information that put lives at risk on her home brew server in her basement

And yet another red herring.

It's a logical fallacy double play!

Not really - the charge was incompetence. I am merely pointing out that the clearest case of incompetence relating to the two candidates is that of the ex secretary of state. That is unless you believe not fully vetting a speech is more incompetent than leaving classified information on an unprotected server in your basement.

Yes, it was a red herring because you are trying to change the focus of attention to someone other than the topic at hand.

Rejected. Hillary Clinton is most relevant to the topic at hand considering the whole convention last night was about the alternative to her.

a reply to: ketsuko

So is it an issue or isn't it? And if it is, then we have to talk about all these events, not just Melania Trump.

Yes, it's dishonest and illogical. You are diverting focus.

Do you believe what she or the speech writers did is wrong, if what Biden did was wrong?

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: ketsuko
Did she plagiarize or paraphrase?

How to Recognize Plagiarism

If the summary contains a sequence of 7 or more words taken from that source which is not properly acknowledged, then word-for-word plagiarism is also committed.

Yup. It passes as plagiarism. There are several places where more than seven words were EXACTLY the same. There's one place where 23 words are the same.

The writers obviously knew they were plagiarizing, because sometimes they left one word out or changed just one or two words... It's not her fault, it's the incompetent campaign... run by an incompetent politician.

originally posted by: ketsuko
You never answered if you would be treating Jeb!'s wife like this.

Would you be making excuses if Barack Obama's wife had copied someone's speech?

Incompetent politician... sounds refreshing. Someone not used to the veil of bull# then.
Meanwhile for real incompetence let's refer back to a secretary of state leaving classified information that put lives at risk on her home brew server in her basement

And yet another red herring.

It's a logical fallacy double play!

Not really - the charge was incompetence. I am merely pointing out that the clearest case of incompetence relating to the two candidates is that of the ex secretary of state. That is unless you believe not fully vetting a speech is more incompetent than leaving classified information on an unprotected server in your basement.

Yes, it was a red herring because you are trying to change the focus of attention to someone other than the topic at hand.

Rejected. Hillary Clinton is most relevant to the topic at hand considering the whole convention last night was about the alternative to her.

Trump's wife's potential plagiarism has nothing to do with Hillary.

a reply to: ketsuko

I can never get any "heavy" links to work. But if Biden used 7 or more words from another speech, then he plagiarized. I FULLY acknowledge that! I haven't seen a word for word on his speeches. Let's take a look...

'Why am I the first Kinnock in a thousand generations to be able to get to university?'' Then pointing to his wife in the audience, he continued: ''Why is Glenys the first woman in her family in a thousand generations to be able to get to university? Was it because all our predecessors were thick?''

''I started thinking as I was coming over here, why is it that Joe Biden is the first in his family ever to go to a university?'' he said. Then, pointing to his wife, he continued: ''Why is it that my wife who is sitting out there in the audience is the first in her family to ever go to college? Is it because our fathers and mothers were not bright? Is it because I'm the first Biden in a thousand generations to get a college and a graduate degree that I was smarter than the rest?''

Source

I can't find 7 words that are the same, in the same order. But I would admit that he obviously based this paragraph on another speech. It's the difference between paraphrasing and plagiarism, which is what I looked up.

But when the shoe is on the other foot, you defend "your guy" and refuse to acknowledge it. If you're going to try to make me look hypocritical, be sure you're not exposing your own hypocrisy in doing so...