Donald Trump: I'd bring back 'a hell of a lot worse than waterboarding'

a reply to: burdman30ott6

You don't support support rectal feeding? Well that's good because I don't think they were sticking tubes up their bum because of a starvation protest. Can you sustain purred food when taken rectally? This all reminds me of that one South Park episode, fans of the show know what I'm talking about.

I'm just gonna assume you're against making a prisoner play Russian Roulette and hanging people out to die?

Btw, lets not pretend every single prisoner in there is guilty. There has been no due process served to them. They are accused and then tortured. This system you support? And this the only site discussed when talking about US, CIA, and torture because let's not forget about all the black sites we have all over the world so we can hide from own laws and do god knows what to the accused.

These places are offsite, as in not the US, so the gov't can hide from that very constitution because the 14th Amendment grants rights to non citizens. Although, GITMO is a US military base therefore US soil so I would take a gander and say GITMO prisoners do have rights?

a reply to: burdman30ott6

I am a conservative, but I cannot go there. It is something that feels so totally against my morals, that I could never condone it. I honestly don't understand why anyone could. For what I feel is right, even if my own child would die without said information, I still could not.

And if it against my own morals and all that I stand for, then I must stand against it also in the public square. If I cannot do such a thing myself, then I can never ask nor stand for another doing it either.

Honestly, the people who could, rather worry me.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: crazyewok

As I've said, the treatment of terrorists in Guantanimo didn't violate any laws of freedom or rights. Ethics? Meh, subjective garbage that shifts with the wind depending on who is in power. My own personal ethics are that, if person A wishes to kill me or my family, person A needs to suffer prior to expiration.

And without duw process what about the innocent peoole the CIA picked up by accident like the guy from Germany who had a similar sounding name? Do they deserve to suffer?

Due process is there to stop that.

Its to stop the CIA accidentally picking you up by accident because your name sounds similar to a suspect.

a reply to: crazyewok

At this point, anyone in Guantanamo is a danger, even if they were innocent when they went in, I can guarantee you they no longer are, they will have more hate, and have been surrounded by the seriously dangerous people for a very long time.

The people in gitmo, kill them all and be done with it. They are our enemies, we can never release them so no sense housing them and feeding them.

Shoot them all, and be done. We are at war, and we cannot set them free.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: Swills

USA is the defacto enforcement arm of the world court... what are we gonna do, arrest ourselves?

International law doesn't mean jack snip to me, man. In terms of US law, they never crossed America's threshold and, thus, those terrorists were never entitled to COnstitutional protections. Screw 'em and any who choose to follow in their footsteps.

And its attitudes like that why the USA is despised in half the world and why people want to kill you.

Its why the the USA has no rights to call itself land of the free home of the brave (try land of the tyrants home of the cowards instead ) and why the USA is a hypocrite when its preaches human rights.




I have lost a lot of respect for some members on this thread.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: Swills
Torture is torture and we have done a lot more than just water boarding so if you support Trump and his views on torture I guess you support all of the above and more?

I don't support the rectal feeding tube thing... if a prisoner elects to starve themselves to death, allow it to happen. Otherwise, as long as it isn't being used against American citizens in violation of the Constitution, I certainly haven't lost any sleep over it.

Just being honest, man.

You honestly have no right right to invoke the constitution or even mention its name.

Its already been legally declared by your supreme court to apply to non citizens.

a reply to: amazing

What I take issue with is the folks here that think that those who are engaging in these practices at the behest of our government, are doing do to get their jollies. I hope that no such thing occurs and this is being used sparingly and to get actionable information.

Yeah, I think the world as a whole is pretty 'f'd' up and this country sold out to the big corporations decades ago. It's pretty much a industrial military complex that rules most of what we see and hear about nowadays.

My point about a family have children kidnapped was narrow in scope, but a couple of you took it to expand those boundaries. NO parent would just sit idly by if one of the perps was at their immediate disposal and the prospect of your kids lives was on the line. I'd rather take action and extract information by any means necessary and live with the consequences, good or bad. At least i did something. How many freaking threads have I read on these forums about the police being a bunch of buffoons....or is that all just in my head as well.

I am NOT for just willy nilly harming my fellow man. I am FOR those RARE occurrences where it is necessary to go an extra step and withdraw information by unconventional means. Does that make me a coward. I don't believe so. Is that inhumane...probably. But if it meant that thousands of people would live, I'd make that decision every time to do so.

And I actually agree with Gryphon66 that if we are engaging in these practices, then we need to remove ourselves from those treaties that prohibit it.

originally posted by: Kitana
a reply to: crazyewok

At this point, anyone in Guantanamo is a danger, even if they were innocent when they went in, I can guarantee you they no longer are, they will have more hate, and have been surrounded by the seriously dangerous people for a very long time.

The people in gitmo, kill them all and be done with it. They are our enemies, we can never release them so no sense housing them and feeding them.

Shoot them all, and be done. We are at war, and we cannot set them free.

And thats the thing. If they had been givin due process from the start the innocent ones would have filtered out from the very start.

This is why state sanctioned torture is a bad idea.

I have little sympathy for the real terrorists but the CIA didn't just pick up terrorists , they picked up anyone that was brown and had similar sounding names to suspects.

originally posted by: Kitana
a reply to: crazyewok

At this point, anyone in Guantanamo is a danger, even if they were innocent when they went in, I can guarantee you they no longer are, they will have more hate, and have been surrounded by the seriously dangerous people for a very long time.

The people in gitmo, kill them all and be done with it. They are our enemies, we can never release them so no sense housing them and feeding them.

Shoot them all, and be done. We are at war, and we cannot set them free.

That sounds like fascism.

Would you say that is a "final solution"?

#utterlydisgusted

a reply to: Kitana

For a system that doesn't hold a trial nor do their accused get a lawyer, it's kind of scary you would just assume they're all guilty and should die. Actually, that's about as ignorant as it gets and the fact you would knowingly murder innocent people makes you as bad as your enemy. Good job!

For the past month, CNN has been upping its frequency of negative coverage of Trump. The more CNN hates on Trump, the more I like the guy.

originally posted by: aorAki
a reply to: illustratum

What is your solution?

Lowering yourself to the lack of standards of others?

Barbarity?

I'm not advocating torture that disfigures or permanently harms, but at the same time giving someone a harsh swirly with a field medic standing by is not barbarity.

originally posted by: carewemust
For the past month, CNN has been upping its frequency of negative coverage of Trump. The more CNN hates on Trump, the more I like the guy.

Negative coverage? Trump brings all the heat down on himself by running his mouth. He doesn't care what he says because he is going to bail on this campaign soon. He's not stupid...he knows the GOP will never nominate him for POTUS.

a reply to: Swills

Look, you do realize that the leader of ISIS in prison in Iraq. He was with al-qaeda, and was captured and placed in prison for a time. It was decided, eventually, that there was not enough evidence against him, and he was set free.

It was only after he was imprisoned, that he began ISIS. Now, he was definitely with al-qaeda in iraq, but he was fighting for his country, and does not seem terribly extreme prior. I could be wrong here, but prior to going into prison his vision was for Iraq only. It was only after prison that changed. Now, it could have been in his heart all along and simply did not come out until his senior in their al-qaeda group died, this I do not know.

I know though, that by the time he was released his guards said it was a mistake to release him, so in prison something was seen, something had changed by the time of his release, from his actions prior to prison.

So, while rooted in a more extreme ideology, a transformation took place sometimes surrounding prison time. Was it prison which caused this change? was it torture?

I think it is entirely possible. I think torture changes people, sometimes forever changes them. I do not know his eyes prior to prison, but I do know when he came out, his eyes were dead.

All of these people in Guantanamo, now pose a danger, and possibly very serious ones. I for one, do not think it is worth the risk of releasing any of them at this point.

a reply to: carewemust

Who cares about CNN? Aren't their ratings in the dumps? They need anything they can get and Trump is a blessing for them.

a reply to: crazyewok

I would agree with this sentiment - although I disagree that they picked up just anyone brown.

a reply to: Kitana

I'm well aware of him and the controversy surrounding him. Feel free to do an ATS search because there's plenty of talk about it.

Are you aware that Americas foreign policy created terrorism? Do you think taking in ONLY the accused and keep them detained indefinitely while torturing them, and worse, isn't already apart of a long standing problem that needs to be addressed ASAP?

I can think of a lot worse things myself for example having to be Donald Trump's toupee. Having to listen to Ted Cruz complain about not getting g respect Dir his win. Having to work in Jeb Bushes campaign imagine how boring that must be with no one there. Having to shave Carlie Fiorina. Having to run the controls for Marco Rubio during his speeches. And finally being a dietician for Chris Christie who can't pass a mcdonalds.


And the worst having to watch a debate on fox news I lasted about 15 minutes figure I could go a lot longer being water torture.

a reply to: Swills

There was terrorism in the middle east well prior to recent actions by the US. In the beginning of Islam was conquest, conquest, and more conquest. They almost got all of Europe before they were finally stopped.

Once they were stopped in conquest, they turned inward on their own. Gorilla warfare against each other, against other sects, is a fact of life that has existed in the middle east since outward Islamic conquest stopped.

Conquest and terrorism of the west, only stopped for a short time. Did we ramp it up with our own actions? I agree we have some responsibility in that, but far far from all the responsibility. This is Islam, this is simply life as they know it.

originally posted by: Kitana
a reply to: Swills

There was terrorism in the middle east well prior to recent actions by the US. In the beginning of Islam was conquest, conquest, and more conquest. They almost got all of Europe before they were finally stopped.

Once they were stopped in conquest, they turned inward on their own. Gorilla warfare against each other, against other sects, is a fact of life that has existed in the middle east since outward Islamic conquest stopped.

Conquest and terrorism of the west, only stopped for a short time. Did we ramp it up with our own actions? I agree we have some responsibility in that, but far far from all the responsibility. This is Islam, this is simply life as they know it.

Attacks never stopped people just have a shirt memory and think it all started with Bush.