More Shame n' Judgement Please

a reply to: chadderson

Trust me, kids are thinking about it whether they see body parts or not. You mean you never thought about girls "in that way" until you saw some actual breasts?

Seeing a transgender teen who talks like a girl, walks like a girl, dresses like a girl, thinks like a girl is not going to turn a heterosexual teen girl on.

a reply to: queenofswords

Then there are those in the middle that would like a discussion on what we can do to accommodate all of our society.

A quasi-reasonable attempt to make a kinda reasonable argument. Good job. But then - uh oh - what's this?!

You can accept people, but realize that something may be "in the water" and find definitive answers to possible causation.

PC crowd is always used as an insult these days - because nothing good can possibly come from being politically correct

The PC crowd doesn't like the thought of anything other than total acceptance of whatever the minority demands. Another crowd just wants them to stay hidden or in the background and not expose us to their "issue".

Well, whoever this PC crowd might be (snicker) I would say that at least some of them are saying things that to you are not politically correct. It makes you uncomfortable. Call it what you want, but to say that little transgender children should be allowed to make potty where they feel the most comfortable is not acceptable to some people - and so not politically correct

Some people think that what they believe is correct - and to push out the corners of that uptight, prudish, morally rigid envelope is a very big no no

I'm sure it's something in the water - hopefully we can fix that

:-)

a reply to: kaylaluv

I am saying it amplified my feelings to the point of thinking about it all day every day. Until seeing breasts, it was not like that. I was driven to the point of a sexual relationship, just as I am saying young women would at the sight of a penis.

a reply to: chadderson

I don't think nudity is wrong, it is simply not a positive thing to force upon kids going through puberty. Childhood pregnancy is a bad thing. Single parents are less than ideal. I am an advocate of children coming after a heterosexual marriage. Keeping the opposite sexes separated when nude is a good thing in that regard. Would you agree?

You made this reply to Kaylaluv, but it turned up in my reply box - just so you know you may not be replying to the right person

There is lust without nudity and nudity without lust

No - I don't agree. Kids are going to get pregnant even if you don't let a transgendered child use the girls restroom

originally posted by: chadderson
a reply to: queenofswords

Indeed, and here we are. Where do you stand on the situation, fellow ATS'er?

I'm in the middle. The discussion about restrooms and locker rooms is very concerning for our particular society. It requires a see change.

For transgender people to demand others conform to their demands and just toss mores and taboos out the window to accommodate their feelings discounts everybody else.

I believe in acceptance and a middle ground on accommodation. I believe more research should be done without PC pressure and grant-money influence as to why this dysphoria happens, whether it be hormonal imbalances in utero or during the gender-identity phase in infancy. I'm not a biologist, geneticist, endocrinologist, nor any other medical "ologist", but I do know the sources of grant money is a huge influence and it should be given without a PC demand.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Yes they will get pregnant regardless, but we can influence the rate at which it happens. A lesser rate is more favorable, and therefore my stance will be upheld.

This is like saying, crime happens anyway, why have a police force to influence its rate.

originally posted by: queenofswords

originally posted by: chadderson
a reply to: queenofswords

Indeed, and here we are. Where do you stand on the situation, fellow ATS'er?

I believe more research should be done without PC pressure and grant-money influence as to why this dysphoria happens, whether it be hormonal imbalances in utero or during the gender-identity phase in infancy. I'm not a biologist, geneticist, endocrinologist, nor any other medical "ologist", but I do know the sources of grant money is a huge influence and it should be given without a PC demand.

Should we force left handed students to learn in a separate room until science finds out if its inherent or choice?

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: queenofswords

originally posted by: chadderson
a reply to: queenofswords

Indeed, and here we are. Where do you stand on the situation, fellow ATS'er?

I believe more research should be done without PC pressure and grant-money influence as to why this dysphoria happens, whether it be hormonal imbalances in utero or during the gender-identity phase in infancy. I'm not a biologist, geneticist, endocrinologist, nor any other medical "ologist", but I do know the sources of grant money is a huge influence and it should be given without a PC demand.

Should we force left handed students to learn in a separate room until science finds out if its inherent or choice?

~~~ shakes my head at the ridiculous comparison.

a reply to: Annee

Left handedness does not destroy their ability to procreate. Left handedness is not counter-intuitive to the human biological processes. This is a poor comparison.

a reply to: chadderson

A lesser rate is more favorable, and therefore my stance will be upheld.

Maybe for yourself, but you're wrong about the bigger picture. The times are changing

Gay people can now live their lives out in the open same as anyone else. We can expect the same thing for the transgenedered. Society is constantly reevaluating it's views on life and it's approach. We're constantly reevaluating and challenging what's been accepted for centuries. There's no going back now

“It’s no longer the exception … It’s just how we work.”

One Colorado school district has become a model in instilling acceptance and understanding for transgender youth. Boulder’s approach attracted 15-year-old Shannon Axe and her parents, and word is spreading.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

You are supporting a higher rate of childhood pregnancies? More childhood single parents? More childhood STDs? This is part of the reason we have so many on welfare, part of the reason we pay higher taxes, part of the reason unemployment is so high. Please answer.

Yes I know gay and trans are living their lives out in the open more freely, this is part of the reason the PC crowd wants to allow them to impose those values upon the majority that are not on the same boat, and in turn part of the reason we are seeing more come out.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

This post does make some sense. When a teenager comes to me frustrated that his/her parents just don't understand that they need more independence and less coddling, I tell them that just as they are going through a transition into adulthood, their parents are also going through a transition from nurturing their child to understanding their growth. It takes awhile to absorb the changes. It will all work out once you get past that transition stage, as long as you keep realizing you love them and they love you.

So transgender people need to cut society a break, and society needs to keep working toward understanding and acceptance of their difference.

Meanwhile, lets continue to research the issue and get some definitive answers, not just because it is the right thing to do, but because these people suffer. They suffer psychologically, socially, and physically. If it doesn't have to be, let's make sure we KNOW that no stone was left unturned.

a reply to: chadderson

Putting a trans teen who has long hair in a pony tail, wears makeup, dresses like a girl, walks like a girl, talks like a girl and acts like a girl in every way into a boys locker room is also going to turn some boys on, believe me.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: chadderson

Putting a trans teen who has long hair in a pony tail, wears makeup, dresses like a girl, walks like a girl, talks like a girl and acts like a girl in every way into a boys locker room is also going to turn some boys on, believe me.

Agreed. And the problem with that, is if the guy didn't know at the beginning he was being turned on by a trans teen and finds out later, that teen risks being hurt. Straight guys don't appreciate that and some of them are less than nice about the way they express their anger.

a reply to: queenofswords

I hope you will accept my reply the way I mean it - I have to disagree with you on these two points:

So transgender people need to cut society a break, and society needs to keep working toward understanding and acceptance of their difference.

They can't cut society a break - it's not up to them. Society is changing - and tolerating other people's beliefs does not include choosing to live under the radar so that some people can feel more comfortable

It's unfortunate - and we can see how emotionally charged things have become in the past however many years - but it was the constant battle for people's rights that finally brought change. It's uncomfortable to the point of infuriating for some people - I understand

Making someone feel uncomfortable is not a crime. Do you really want to have a genuine argument about political correctness? Traditional values are no excuse for treating other people badly - and if certain parts of society have to get up in your face about it - it's going to happen

Meanwhile, lets continue to research the issue and get some definitive answers, not just because it is the right thing to do, but because these people suffer. They suffer psychologically, socially, and physically. If it doesn't have to be, let's make sure we KNOW that no stone was left unturned.

Causation again - in search of a remedy?

That's a big conversation. Let me ask you - do we want to research in order to find a remedy so they don't have to suffer, or is this really about maintaining the status quo?

I don't see it as a condition that needs to be fixed. Personally - I'm fine with living in a world where there is no cookie cutter standard that we all have to fit into

Vive La Différence. It's a beautiful world, full of beautiful people. Naked or clothed - gender and gender preferences included just the same. Beautiful

a reply to: kaylaluv

When you say trans teen in this instance, you mean a boy dressing up like a girl right? I am sure you are right also, but the thing here is, as soon as the clothes come off so does the attraction to the boy in disguise. We are talking about locker rooms, nudity, and the establishment forcing this upon our students.

If that boy could dress up and act like a girl without exposing his genitals you have a valid point; but we both know he would be exposed.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Remedies are sought in the light of illness. Transgender/homosexuality is a developmental cognitive birth defect. We seek to cure and help downs syndrome, why would we not seek to help trans/gays? They are what they are, inherently, but they are clearly living life through the lens of a defect. Remedies must be sought so they do not suffer, as well as so they can be integrated into the normal way of life.

a reply to: chadderson

...so they can be integrated into the normal way of life.

Who is in charge of deciding what's normal?

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Take a lesson from the human anatomical functions. Penises are made for vaginas. When a penis wants to pair with another penis, something is wrong. The proof is in the pudding.

a reply to: chadderson

T&Cs are going to get in the way of this conversation - but have it your way

Do you ever put your finger in your mouth? :-)

Nature doesn't have a rule book. Sex and affection happen in thousands of different ways

Again I'm asking - who gets to decide what's normal? You?