Socialism is Not a 4 Letter Word

originally posted by: introvert

Half of the funds used to build and fix roads come from federal funds.

You're welcome.

Roads are necessary so the corporations can profit from commerce.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: introvert

Half of the funds used to build and fix roads come from federal funds.

You're welcome.

Errr...taxes are not always socialist in nature... It depends on the form of tax being implemented...

You are welcomed...

Oh, so now there are socialist taxes and capitalist taxes? Taxes are collected and used to benefit the public good. Those dollars are used to pay people that provide a service or product for the common good.

Taxation is socialist.

Taxation is criminal but, that's another conversation.

a reply to: greencmp

Don't get me wrong, Hitler did have at least one good idea.

It was not Hitler's idea to build the Köln-Bonn Autobahn. The first parts or sections were built before he even came to power.

Also, Mussolini built the autostrada 5 or 6 years earlier. Thank Mussolini.

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: introvert

Half of the funds used to build and fix roads come from federal funds.

You're welcome.

Errr...taxes are not always socialist in nature... It depends on the form of tax being implemented...

You are welcomed...

Oh, so now there are socialist taxes and capitalist taxes? Taxes are collected and used to benefit the public good. Those dollars are used to pay people that provide a service or product for the common good.

Taxation is socialist.

Taxation is criminal but, that's another conversation.

Taxation, depending on how it's acquired and used, is part of our constitution.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: greencmp

Don't get me wrong, Hitler did have at least one good idea.

It was not Hitler's idea to build the Köln-Bonn Autobahn. The first parts or sections were built before he even came to power.

Also, Mussolini built the autostrada 5 or 6 years earlier. Thank Mussolini.

I'm actually not well enough versed on the subject to challenge that but, it was my understanding that Eisenhower was smitten with the transport capability of the roads and insisted on them.

I took that to mean that most of the cross country heavy roadways were constructed during his military buildup.

a reply to: greencmp

I'm very well versed on all things Nazi and what I have posted is correct.

And you are correct about the US highways. Eisenhower began it's construction in, I believe, 1955 or about then.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: greencmp

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: introvert

Half of the funds used to build and fix roads come from federal funds.

You're welcome.

Errr...taxes are not always socialist in nature... It depends on the form of tax being implemented...

You are welcomed...

Oh, so now there are socialist taxes and capitalist taxes? Taxes are collected and used to benefit the public good. Those dollars are used to pay people that provide a service or product for the common good.

Taxation is socialist.

Taxation is criminal but, that's another conversation.

Taxation, depending on how it's acquired and used, is part of our constitution.

Tariffs are but, not income taxes until the sixteenth amendment though, the states were never precluded from having them.

I think that is the interim solution to federal funding while we dismantle most of the bureaucracy. Repeal the 16th and let the states raise their income taxes to compensate initially. State competition for talented people in the form of competitive tax rates should drive down the amount of revenue that they are able to raise without causing an exodus.

a reply to: greencmp

Yes, Eisenhower justified them for national defense purposes. Of course, we won't talk about all the small towns that more or less died because the Interstate networks passed them by, but all you have to do is take the often roughly parallel US highway route and you will see them.

The idea of the Interstate was to have, among other things, stretches of wide open straight roadway that could be used as makeshift runway and as open arteries for easy military movement should it be necessary.

That federalized the network.

originally posted by: The Vagabond
a reply to: greencmp

Kudos on the vocab and syntax but you just said that the 800 pound gorilla keeps the lesser monkeys in line, but that if we changed 800 pound gorillas from governmental to corporate that suddenly the lesser monkeys would be the ones keeping the gorilla in line.

We can compete on the merits of our products, but if my product is beating people into submission and I am the best in the business, then we're gonna be practicing the kind of anarchy where everybody does what I say.

If I were wrong about this, then petty criminals should have overthrown the mafia. That's what an unregulated free market looks like.

I'm not sure that analogy works for a variety of reasons but, I will try to work with it.

It could be possible that small time criminals have no interest in usurping the power of the mafia which tends to target legitimate businesses. they probably just steer clear of them unless they have a hankering to be made.

The mafia, like the state, relies almost entirely upon intimidation so the comparison should work but, I just can't think of a liberal open society as comprised exclusively of small time criminals and mafiosos.

a reply to: introvert

Riiight...

It's not like Hitler unified not only all Germans because the Treaty of Versaille had separated them after WWI, and also unified all German languages into "Großdeutsches Reich". The unification of all German people, not as individuals, but as a collective.

What about the "People's Car"?... you would know it as the "Volkswagen"... That's what Volkswagen means, "People's Car"... It was a dream by Hitler that every family would have one and he ordered it's construction.

That's apart from the organized farming, and organized industrialization that i have already mentioned and was controlled by Hitler and his third Reich.

What about the German film "Metropolis" from 1927? A film that emphasized "a oneness of the people"... A film that was priced over five million Reichsmarks. Hitler's Use of Film in Germany, Leading up to and During World War II

NAZIS not only preached about a classless society, they strived to make one with Hitler as their leader to reach such goals...

Who is to forget the "free public health".

Didn't you also know that the NAZIS were die hard environmentalists? I am not saying that all environmentalists are NAZIS btw...but NAZIS were die hard environmentalists.

Anyone who was found mistreating in ANY way any animal was sent to a concentration camp

What about the "Worker's welfare program" implemented by Hitler?

Are you going to claim none of the above is true?

What about not only affordable housing, but environmental housing which were put in effect under Hitler in Germany?

As a side note, a lot of what we know today, even our knowledge about hypothermia comes from the Germans. Thanks to the experiments the NAZIS did on prisoners. The Germans studied the use of torture such as inducing hypothermia, they invented sarin gas, etc, etc.

While in a way i agree "to some extent" that people do have certain inalienable rights, and of course disagree with their views on anti-semitism and other atrocities they committed. I also disagree with the "forcing" induced by regimes such as the NAZIS, and other socialists and communist regimes of socialist programs.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Ah, volksgemeinschaft, pre-hitlerian but, a deep cultural belief masterfully leveraged by the Nazis.

Oh, and btw, forgot to include one of the many examples of HItler's Germany sending a fisherman to a concentration camp for "cutting up a bait frog", which was against environmental policy.

...
If this isn’t enough irony for you, consider the amazing number of animal rights laws the Nazi’s created and enforced. The Nazi’s banned commercial animal trapping and vastly restricted hunting among other things like restricting the shoeing of horses and banning boiling of lobsters. One fisherman was even sent to a concentration camp for cutting up a frog for use as bait. After passing many of these animal rights laws, Hermann Goring, a prominent Nazi party member, said those who “still think they can continue to treat animals as inanimate property” will be sent to concentration camps… *head explodes*
...

www.todayifoundout.com...


While I disagree with "certain animal cruelty", it is extreme to send people to concentration camps for cutting up a frog which was going to be used as bait, among other cases...

"" Socialism is Not a 4 Letter Word ""

after this topic so far, it's close.

a reply to: greencmp

It wasn't pre-Hitler...

German Propaganda Archive


Background: The Volkswagen was a centerpiece of Nazism’s claims to benefit ordinary Germans. Hitler proposed to build a cheap car that almost anyone could afford. He gave it the name “KdF Wagen,” which we know as the Volkswagen. KdF was the abbreviation for “Kraft durch Freude" (Strength through Joy), a subsidiary of the Deutsche Arbeitsfront (German Labor Front), headed by Robert Ley. This chapter on the beginnings of the Volkswagen is taken from a book celebrating the achievements of “Kraft durch Freude.” As it turned out, not many people got their cars until after the war. As the chapter notes, the first deliveries were planned for early 1940, at which point the factory had been turned over to war production.
...

www.bytwerk.com...

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Ok, now you're throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks. The overall premise of what you're talking about now has already been covered by the ultra-nationalism issue discussed earlier.

You are flopping around so bad that you have to bring up Volkswagen and propaganda films.

Also, you are projecting modern issues, such as environmentalism as a Leftist ideology, to that of Nazi Germany.

Can you dispute the previous quote or not? Now this just seems ridiculous and you're pulling crap of off Right wing sites that wish Hitler to be a socialist because it fits their political agenda.

a reply to: introvert

But it sure sounds pretty close doesn't it.

originally posted by: xuenchen
a reply to: introvert

But it sure sounds pretty close doesn't it.

Sounds close to the uneducated.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: greencmp

It wasn't pre-Hitler...

German Propaganda Archive


Background: The Volkswagen was a centerpiece of Nazism’s claims to benefit ordinary Germans. Hitler proposed to build a cheap car that almost anyone could afford. He gave it the name “KdF Wagen,” which we know as the Volkswagen. KdF was the abbreviation for “Kraft durch Freude" (Strength through Joy), a subsidiary of the Deutsche Arbeitsfront (German Labor Front), headed by Robert Ley. This chapter on the beginnings of the Volkswagen is taken from a book celebrating the achievements of “Kraft durch Freude.” As it turned out, not many people got their cars until after the war. As the chapter notes, the first deliveries were planned for early 1940, at which point the factory had been turned over to war production.
...

www.bytwerk.com...

It was certainly a central tenet of Naziism but, I thought it was popularized in WWI but went back to the 19th century or earlier.

a reply to: greencmp

I appreciate you humoring me but you might have to beat me over the head with what's wrong with the analogy, because if the analogy holds it doesn't matter if the mafia is only trading on the threat- the fact is that they have succeeded in creating cartels which hold virtual monopolies repeatedly throughout history, and they could succeed in it in ALL industries if there was no government to stay under the radar of.

Which brings up another point: the government is where all the reports would go if I had thugs beating up customers at my competitor's store, and they are the ones who would come down on me.

Where do the reports go in anarchy? YouTube? What if I own YouTube? A small time drug dealer doesn't even know who the mafia boss is- he doesn't know who what when where why and how it came about that gorillas roll him and tell him they'll be back next week if he's still in business- he can't fight back. Ditto for the consumers without some kind of centralization to organize and contextualize data from 400 million people spread across 3.8 million square miles.

You can't seriously think that anybody is a street corner dope dealer making about what he would at Walmart and giving the rest to his gang thinking, "man I sure wouldn't want to be El Chapo... better that I stay here getting arrested for his benefit and know my place, even though I could obviously deal with him if I called up my buddy Teener and his primo who just got out of prison" and that if the same thing then happened to the people at Walmart, then this dealer and the Walmart cashiers would finally say that's the last straw and roll through EME like it's cool.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

If you don't want to accept the written speeches by Hitler and his goons, here is a video showing a NAZI propaganda film which has subtitles in English.

At 2:46 you can start reading the subtitles, and then tell me that's not a socialist mantra.

Yes, it's propaganda to get the support from socialists that were being defiant against the Nazi ideology.

Again, it's PROPAGANDA!

That is debatable (A debate I will not have with someone who is obviously as biased as I am in their own direction). But whatever the case, it seems to have worked pretty well. It seems socialists are fairly easily manipulated into mass murder. Whichever way you want to look at it, history is not kind to this particular brand of collectivism.

But people have to learn the hard way. Who knows. Maybe the socialists will finally get their way and history will just plain "forget" the wrongs they have perpetrated in the name of the almighty greater good.