Russia says will retaliate if U.S. weapons stationed on its borders

originally posted by: MrSpad

originally posted by: victor7
a reply to: Zaphod58

Machines like M1s already in place, sneak the troops in like even 1000 spec ops and then it becomes a matter of few hours before a major town near border is taken. Unless this force (machines and men) is equally matched with, it will be a scenario of total surprise. Half a dozen such movements on various borders and lots of important towns are gone.

Although, land war comes few steps behind in the US way of fighting. It is the air war via missiles and then planes that is first used.

But still, Russia is right in saying that it will counter any force build up with forces of its own. In a way that is also trying to disperse the strength of the Russian army. With that so, Russia will have to find an appropriate way to counter such a move, even if that means hiring more soldiers and making more active use of the reserves.

This is not a video game, it is real life. An invasion force would require a large logistical tail that would have to be moved into place to keep up with an advance. The fact is Russia own actions have brought this on. They though that they could frighten the Eastern NATO states and neutral states like Finland and Sweden into moving away from NATO. That might have worked if anybody thought Russia could defeat NATO. Instead Russia's threats and actions simply unified them. And those state have called upon the rest of the alliance to make sure any Russian invasion would be quickly dealt with. Putin has underestimated the US, NATO and the rest of Europe along over estimation support he would get from place like China. That has lead to Russia's isolation, instability and economic woes.

Sorry but you have to be pretty ignorant and have been living under a rock for the past 25 years if you think the Russian's are responsible for triggering the current situation/crisis.

With a weak Russia after the collapse of the USSR, the Americans started pushing NATO expansion into the Soviet/Russian sphere.
It's come to the point where NATO is on Russia's borders. There is no more buffer.
The Russian's couldn't respond back then, but come Georgia 2008, they were able to respond, and they did.
Come Ukraine 2014/5, they responded again. And this time they took Crimea for keeps as well. Whose going to go take it back from them? Nobody.

If our leaders in the west want a nuclear war, then they should keep pushing the Russian's in the Russian Federations back yard right on it's borders.

Last I checked the Russian's had all but retreated their military presence at the collapse of the USSR.
It is only NOW after being provoked time and again in THEIR back yard on THEIR borders, that they've started sending out more bombers and submarines on long range patrols across Europe and towards the USA.

It is only AFTER being provoked countless times, that they responded by partially invading Georgia, and that only happened AFTER the American backed, trained and equipped Georgia attacked the Russian peace keepers(there under UN mandate) in the breakaway republics.

It's clear as day who is at fault for creating this situation.

Of course I do not think the Russian's are innocent and perfect and haven't done anything wrong.
But I also do not think they are to blame for starting it this time. You have to view this as the bigger picture in terms of geopolitical gains and losses.

a reply to: mortex

Russia definately caused the problems even caused maiden with their defunct policies towards Ukraine. You don't think they could continually raise the costs of gas to the point they were paying more than europe. Then ban sales of ukrainian products in Russia and when Ukraine threatened to do the same they would threaten to cut off gas supplies. And after dexades of Russias unfair business practice it finally hit the point where 75 percent wanted closer relations with the EU. And thats when Russia tried to blackmail victor causing him to change his min on EU intergration. This of course outraged the people who wanted to have dealings with the EU and started the riots. The Riots where a direct result of Putin's policies in Ukraine. You can only kick a dog so many times before it decides to bite you.

a reply to: mortex

you obviously didn't get the memo.

it's obviously all putins fault.
he had millions of clones made.
he's driving every tank
teaching in every school.
he implanted everyone in the russian political system with brain control devices or had them erased from time if they didn't comply.

how could it be the fault of the g7. look how mega awesome their heads of state are.

I found the memo quite hard to believe to. but what reason do we have to not trust them?

The build up of heavy weapons is nothing new. And has been going off and on since the Cold War began back in the 50's. Its not like America is about to strike Russia, the US is just putting these weapons and equipment in countries that may need back up. Tensions are high since the invasion of Ukraine, and world economies are near the brink of total failure. I dont blame some of these European Countries either asking or accepting help from the US. Its better to be prepared than have nothing in your arsenal, and fall victim to any invading country. Heck it doesnt even have to be Russia invading, it could be a number of different countries, so why not be prepared.

a reply to: Glassbender777

g7 is already fighting the bric countries in a hundred proxy wars all over the world.

difference is the g7 were never that successful when russia was weak.

and now russia is no longer weak.

a reply to: mortex

It's clear as day who is at fault for creating this situation.

Anyone and everyone but...

originally posted by: devilmoon
a reply to: Glassbender777

g7 is already fighting the bric countries in a hundred proxy wars all over the world.

difference is the g7 were never that successful when russia was weak.

and now russia is no longer weak.

Please list all one hundred wars and explain how Brazil, Russia, India and/or China is involved.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Yes I agree....it's kinda gone way off but that's partly my fault for getting into an argument.
Still..it's interesting though.

Just read yesterday that Russia has started beefing up its Military and has 40 new ICBMs planned.
What we are doing is just antagonising them further I think.

www.telegraph.co.uk... html

a reply to: DJW001

will do. there's a thread coming. just been to busy with more interesting things.

you could actually help if you wanted.
list all the current conflicts and let's see how many of them are really bric vs g7.

Its just saber rattling on both sides. What the real shame is when people cheer war and mass death of thier fellow human beings. USA has nothing they can really ever do, same with Russia. Just a waste of time, energy, resources, and all of our illusionary money making obsolete weapons if you ask me.

originally posted by: Kromlech
Cuban Missile Crisis 2.0?

I wouldn't be surprised if Venezuela would soon host Russian weaponry ..

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord
Its just saber rattling on both sides. What the real shame is when people cheer war and mass death of thier fellow human beings. USA has nothing they can really ever do, same with Russia. Just a waste of time, energy, resources, and all of our illusionary money making obsolete weapons if you ask me.

I think things will be different this time .. we have peaked in our ability to elect and re-elect psychopaths, who have thrown out the constitution, enslaved the people, suppressed their voice and rights with militarized police, and much more.
The psychopaths have their own hiding places for themselves and their families, and inner circles of cronies.
They don't care at this point how many people will die because of their wars .. they just want it at any cost ..

originally posted by: junglimogli

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord
Its just saber rattling on both sides. What the real shame is when people cheer war and mass death of thier fellow human beings. USA has nothing they can really ever do, same with Russia. Just a waste of time, energy, resources, and all of our illusionary money making obsolete weapons if you ask me.

I think things will be different this time .. we have peaked in our ability to elect and re-elect psychopaths, who have thrown out the constitution, enslaved the people, suppressed their voice and rights with militarized police, and much more.
The psychopaths have their own hiding places for themselves and their families, and inner circles of cronies.
They don't care at this point how many people will die because of their wars .. they just want it at any cost ..

There is no safe place, no one has anywhere to hide if the shi ... hits the fan and a real global war ever broke out. Even the nano sized robots will perish.

a reply to: FormOfTheLord

now. as long as the tools in charge can remember that. we should be fine.

although I kinda dispair that they do appear just stupid enough to test out if you are right.

originally posted by: devilmoon
a reply to: FormOfTheLord

now. as long as the tools in charge can remember that. we should be fine.

although I kinda dispair that they do appear just stupid enough to test out if you are right.

No they know full well they and all future life robot or otherwise will be gone from this planet if there is another world war, in fact the whole planet will be less than an astroid belt, could become a second sun if we do it just right. Then only spirit light beings will be able to incarnate on ignighted fuel we once knew as the earth.

a reply to: FormOfTheLord

its really nice of you to say that.

but have you met or even seen those guys and gals?

full blown psychopaths.

originally posted by: devilmoon
a reply to: FormOfTheLord

its really nice of you to say that.

but have you seen those guys and gals?

full blown psychopaths.

Most people in the military and governments are a bit psycho, but then a few smart folks who work with them will have to read them the numbers and they will be like ummm errr are you sure the whole planet will be gone? Whats our contingency plan for that doomsday scenario? Oh we dont have any feasible means of survival even our nano dust will be gone. . . . Umm I guess we will do some more saber rattling until we come up with a workable countermesure that doent involve the destruction of the planet. . . .

Oh I know how about we have some off world colonies. . . . Oh they will be targeted too. . .. Damnit I need answers. .. Um sir youve been ordered to stand down on any attack scenarios because they are all stupid.

a reply to: mortex

***SNIP*** After the fall of the USSR it was the US who offered and spent billions of dollars helping to rebuild and reintegrate Russia into the modern system. Russia was offered NATO membership, to which they demanded a special position and eventually rejected the offer. NATO is a defensive alliance, take note of the keyword here which is DEFENSIVE. NATO doesn't ask your nation to join, you must formally apply to join NATO. Many of the Eastern European and Baltic nations still remember the dark, violent, brutal days of being under Russia's thumb. Can you blame them for wanting something better for their people? Should they be subjected to political assassinations? Rape and torture? Murder and genocide? Rampant corruption? I don't think so.

Russia needs to accept responsibility for its own actions and failures. It's time to stop acting like children and man up. That's the difference between the US and Russia, the US admits its failures and often tries to learn from them to become better people. The Russians on the other hand prefer to rewrite history to white wash the horrendous crimes they have committed while putting the blame on everyone else but themselves.

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: mortex

Russia definately caused the problems even caused maiden with their defunct policies towards Ukraine. You don't think they could continually raise the costs of gas to the point they were paying more than europe. Then ban sales of ukrainian products in Russia and when Ukraine threatened to do the same they would threaten to cut off gas supplies. And after dexades of Russias unfair business practice it finally hit the point where 75 percent wanted closer relations with the EU. And thats when Russia tried to blackmail victor causing him to change his min on EU intergration. This of course outraged the people who wanted to have dealings with the EU and started the riots. The Riots where a direct result of Putin's policies in Ukraine. You can only kick a dog so many times before it decides to bite you.

Actually Russia's policies and stance on Ukraine were a reaction to American and European interference in Ukraine.
The West was trying to pull Ukraine away from Russia by interfering in the political process in Ukraine, and by using their political puppets in Ukraine to bring Ukraine into the Western sphere with economic agreements with the EU and so on.

Take note of the fact that before the West started playing these games in Ukraine, that Ukraine-Russia relations were practically the polar opposite to what they are today.

SNIP