Was there really an advanced race living before the ice age?

a reply to: Viperion

Thank you, well spoken and resonates well with me. I think the first and foremost objective of us to stop denying this and the advanced technology and wonder how and why they were able to do these things.

Obviously if the technology is presented, we can in due course, replicate it. Is this going to do more harm than good? This is an ethical debate of sorts but I sincerely think it is the time for us to acknowledge this as a people and thus learn from the past our great mistakes and see if we fare a better chance of escaping them.

I believe there are very few truly bad people out there in the world. I believe the current established system exploits the negative side of human behaviour to no end and hence we are in the mess we are in with wars and low wages and debt. The over all objective for us collectively however (IMO) would be to achieve the peace and life we desire, a true Utopia that benefits both singularity and community. It is but a pipe dream but I firmly believe this is the way and possibly one of the only ways we will be able to accomplish this.

Our society is so broken it needs a way out of the dark hole it has created. The minds of those fixed in the established views are hard to ignore, but in due time it will all be exposed and then they will feel silly for a while but eventually come to terms with it. Or likewise I would be wrong and feel silly for thinking the way I do.
If that happens, which I actually do doubt, I will move on in my life slightly more informed than I am now so there is no great loss regardless.
A bruised ego can only heal.

originally posted by: Blarneystoner
OP...Part 1

There is other evidences of this as well...

well........... Part one crapped out on your link and on the YT presentation at ~ 18:19 minutes
all ATS'ers are hereby forewarned

I ain't that interested in rehashed crap that is termed as 'new'

give me a synopsis... was my earlier post that included Atlantis before the last ice-age start around 100,000 bce near the target or just cult thinking?

a reply to: St Udio

Link is not broken, possibly one of the best documentaries I have seen in a while. In terms of documented material science this sums up what I know and more, quite well. In fact I feel like I am going to have to re-title my book that I am currently writing now, because the objects I am focusing on thus will not be known as "OOPART's" they will just be relics from a civilization before us.

Pity it finished at the most impressive epoch however, it doesn't overly dwell on how advanced we actually got, just shows systematically how we were essentially where we are now, 20'000 years ago approximately and therefore 8000 years or so ahead of where we are now by 12000BP. Until another bottle neck took place.
It dwells more on much earlier civilizations such as Cremo focuses on.

This however doesn't address any spiritual sciences or dualism. Which options I believe also need to be explored much more including the science involve in (aether, chi, orgone, resonance, god or whatever you want to label it.) but this definitely collaborates out material evidence quite well.

I am obviously going to check his sources first. But this is very interesting and I think a much watch for anyone interested in archaeology and the origins of modern humans.

originally posted by: Judgie
It dwells more on much earlier civilizations such as Cremo focuses on.

Take a good look at Cremo before you bet the farm, eh?

People have been researching this subject for some time, and I think the answer is yes there were many advanced races living before the ice age.

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

People have been researching this subject for some time, and I think the answer is yes there were many advanced races living before the ice age.

Then surely you should have no problem showing us some evidence of such fantastic claims?

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

www.youtube.com...

Check out this video here from (LAH expedition). It is kinda slow and boring if you are not interested, but quite clearly shows signs of tool marks on the ancient structures. Tool marks we haven't the ability of using today hence the "advanced" notion of the matter. Some sort of circular saws and tube drills that are made of a material stronger than we have thus can shape stone to finer precision than us which can be seen by looking at the size of the groves left by the tools. This also shows some models of technology we haven't even got a theoretical model of, like some sort of alchemy maybe that actually softens the rock? Its hard to say. The only fact that needs to be taken out of this, is somehow a long time ago, they were able to do things we cannot now.

I have not been able to find a rebuttal for the video yet that contradicts what they are trying to say. In fact this is another area of my own research I got fixated on for some time, trying to disprove or prove this. If you can disprove this I would be interested in finding what is fake and what is wrong.

There is a systematic failure of people like myself to get fixated on a concept sometimes and having a devils advocate can sometimes be a wise idea. So please tear this video apart and show me how these advanced tool workings are not more advanced than anything we can do now.

originally posted by: Judgie
a reply to: AdmireTheDistance



www.youtube.com...



Check out this video here from (LAH expedition). It is kinda slow and boring if you are not interested, but quite clearly shows signs of tool marks on the ancient structures. Tool marks we haven't the ability of using today hence the "advanced" notion of the matter. Some sort of circular saws and tube drills that are made of a material stronger than we have thus can shape stone to finer precision than us which can be seen by looking at the size of the groves left by the tools. This also shows some models of technology we haven't even got a theoretical model of, like some sort of alchemy maybe that actually softens the rock? Its hard to say. The only fact that needs to be taken out of this, is somehow a long time ago, they were able to do things we cannot now.



I have not been able to find a rebuttal for the video yet that contradicts what they are trying to say. In fact this is another area of my own research I got fixated on for some time, trying to disprove or prove this. If you can disprove this I would be interested in finding what is fake and what is wrong.



There is a systematic failure of people like myself to get fixated on a concept sometimes and having a devils advocate can sometimes be a wise idea. So please tear this video apart and show me how these advanced tool workings are not more advanced than anything we can do now.

Here is your video, nice post by the way.

a reply to: Wolfenz

I can see you put a lot of work into that comment

Well they are technically dimensional tho the dimension is not exactly a place it's a state of being. Since they are animated particles they can just change into what ever they want to *With the exception of the color coding scheme available and shadow/light depth* They can phase between them all. So it's not nessisarly that they *Came* from that specific universe or what have you *Alternate Existance*. All they did was contain their consiousness and life source-coding within an animated particle so as to exist extistencially outside of a flesh and blood body.

It's sort of like what humans are doing now with the uploading their brain to a a computer hard-drive. But its a little more complicated, As the actual consiousness itself is contained within the particle. In this case black matter ( When condensed) And black energy when unpressurized. A black hole will suck in anything *Almost anything anyways* And spit it back out the other side. A black hole is kinda like an Hourglass, With a wide *Cone* at the top funnneling to a tiny hole where only something so tiny can even escape. The flow of velocity is what drags it, With traffic entering and exiting the center followed by the gamma bursts that leek through the *hole* along with the escaping matter. That's my theory anyways. I'v read stories about these same beings iv encountered and they cannot be shot or killed. There are reports of farmers shooting what would be described as *Skinwalkers* or large black dogs or warewolf like shadow creatures and they would just stand there and take the bullets. Or take off at unattural speeds either hovering off the ground or bouncing away at incredible speeds.

If such a thing created us, We would defenantly have left monuments ect in their likeness and would have many stories as well. Which we do. These things tho come from another planet. Assuming their spawning planet or galaxy is even still alive. They seemed quite ancient, it's more likely the galaxy that birthed them has been destroyed a long time ago, Leaving them to roam the stars in search of new homes. However the universe isn't full of vacent lots. And The milkyway is not vacent.

They had a crazy looking saucer that was made of black-bluish metallic metal, So i highly doubt they are from another state of existance and most likely well... a dead galaxy i guess or one of their colonies that were set up after their Galaxy went BOOM.

originally posted by: peter vlar


Which Archaeologists or Anthropologists state this? It's pretty widely accepted that a mass exodus out of Africa occurred at roughly the same time period as the Toba catastrophe(~ 70 KYA ) with HSS populating nearly the entire world with the exception of the America's within a few tens of thousands of years post Toba.

New Evidence Puts Man In North America 50,000 Years Ago

I think you're confusing the YD event with the Toba event. The Toba even(~69 KYA-~77 KYA) is indeed genetically linked with a bottleneck in human populations worldwide. Essentially every living human today is descended from 3-10,000 breeding pair of HSS. The YD Impact had a more localized effect, predominantly affecting the Western Hemisphere and is a likely candidate for the loss of mega fauna in North America ~ 12,900 BP. It did not however, have a noticeable impact on human populations. At least not in terms of numbers. It is somewhat linked to the end of Clovis Culture but even that is up for debate. The Toba event is one of the largest documented volcanic eruptions that we are currently aware of in all of Earth's history. It is postulated that due to the amount of material ejected into the upper atmosphere, there was the equivalent of a nuclear winter that lasted 6-10 years and led to a millennium long cooling event as documented in tree ring and ice core samples. That doesn't mean it was the result of an actual nuclear event though.

I may be a little confused but there was a population decline in the northern hemisphere as a result of the YD event (impact is speculation).

Multiple lines of evidence for possible Human population decline/settlement
reorganization during the early Younger Dryas

All three datasets, projectile points, quarries, and SPA data,
indicate that a major human population decrease (bottleneck), or
alternatively population reorganizations (i.e., dramatic changes in
settlement patterning), occurred over broad areas of North America
at the onset of the YD cooling episode w12,900 cal BP. The SPA
results provide evidence that similar declines or changes occurred
across much of remainder of the Northern Hemisphere with the
exception it, seems, of the Middle East. In addition, the SPA results
suggest that a population decline also occurred during the Altithermal
in the Mid-Holocene, beginning ca. w9000 years ago and
lasting for 1000 years or more.

Oppenheimer himself believed that a nuclear war took place in ancient times. Anecdotal evidence is found that supports the notion of ancient nuclear war in Greek, Roman, viking and Indian texts. Physical evidence of nuclear war exists in the form of desert glass from the middle east, irradiated cities in India, radioactive "hotspots" in the Great Lakes region of N. America.... etc...

originally posted by: St Udio

originally posted by: Blarneystoner
OP...Part 1

There is other evidences of this as well...

well........... Part one crapped out on your link and on the YT presentation at ~ 18:19 minutes
all ATS'ers are hereby forewarned

I ain't that interested in rehashed crap that is termed as 'new'

give me a synopsis... was my earlier post that included Atlantis before the last ice-age start around 100,000 bce near the target or just cult thinking?

edit on th28142317996405462015 by St Udio because: get that I....i friggin tab fixed... ATS is being slack ! this has been a problem for over 365 days now

What in the world are you saying? I can't make any sense of your response....

...and thanks for the "warning"...

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

originally posted by: Blarneystoner
The sharp increase in C14 at the onset of the Younger Dryas cooling period may be the direct result of Thermonuclear detonations. There is other evidences of this as well...

Sure. Why not.

This is exactly the kind of response I have come to expect from you. It's so much easier to be glib and condescending than it is to actually engage in civil discourse, isn't it?

Ancient atomic war is always a good topic. . . . .

originally posted by: Blarneystoner

The Younger Dryas extinction event, about 12.6 thousand years ago narrowed the human population to less than 20,000 individuals, according to Genetic studies. The cause for YD extinction event is unknown, but I personally think it was a "nuclear winter"....

NOT.

Human population at 10,000 BCE is estimated to be over 2.4 million individuals.

You should consider not posting disinformation. Or, if that's not the case, perhaps you should consider that there are many members here that know better than the utter falsehoods you elect to post, for whatever reason.

Harte

originally posted by: Blarneystoner
This ("Sure. Why not.") is exactly the kind of response I have come to expect from you. It's so much easier to be glib and condescending than it is to actually engage in civil discourse, isn't it?

Au contraire, mon frere! You'll note that all through this thread I have tried not only to refute the nonsense factor, but I have also sought to engage posters in a process that might lead them to come to some critical decisions themselves. And, that is generally my practice on this forum.

However, some times there is just not a damn thing I can say beyond "Sure. Why not."

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: Blarneystoner

The Younger Dryas extinction event, about 12.6 thousand years ago narrowed the human population to less than 20,000 individuals, according to Genetic studies. The cause for YD extinction event is unknown, but I personally think it was a "nuclear winter"....

NOT.

Human population at 10,000 BCE is estimated to be over 2.4 million individuals.

You should consider not posting disinformation. Or, if that's not the case, perhaps you should consider that there are many members here that know better than the utter falsehoods you elect to post, for whatever reason.

Harte

Archaeologists have a bad habit of saying they "know", when the truth is that it's your best guess based upon the extremely limited archaeological evidence. While I'm sure that your reputation precedes you, claiming to "know better" only indicates that you have a high regard for yourself. I may be mistaken with regards to the number of individuals but I believe that new evidence suggests a significant decrease in human global population especially in the Northern Hemisphere at the ONSET of the Younger Dryas period. I've posted links to those studies in previous responses to this thread.

Your dismissive responses to me in this thread and in the past do nothing to convince me of your arguments. I, like many others believe that mainstream archaeologists spend their careers with their head in the sand, only agreeing with the accepted norms. While I'm sure that you have very impressive credentials, your interactions here aren't impressive at all.

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

originally posted by: Blarneystoner
This ("Sure. Why not.") is exactly the kind of response I have come to expect from you. It's so much easier to be glib and condescending than it is to actually engage in civil discourse, isn't it?

Au contraire, mon frere! You'll note that all through this thread I have tried not only to refute the nonsense factor, but I have also sought to engage posters in a process that might lead them to come to some critical decisions themselves. And, that is generally my practice on this forum.

However, some times there is just not a damn thing I can say beyond "Sure. Why not."

Why the mods here let you get away with it is beyond me.

I suppose I'll just have to ignore your "civil discourse" in the future.

originally posted by: Blarneystoner

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: Blarneystoner



The Younger Dryas extinction event, about 12.6 thousand years ago narrowed the human population to less than 20,000 individuals, according to Genetic studies. The cause for YD extinction event is unknown, but I personally think it was a "nuclear winter"....

NOT.



Human population at 10,000 BCE is estimated to be over 2.4 million individuals.



You should consider not posting disinformation. Or, if that's not the case, perhaps you should consider that there are many members here that know better than the utter falsehoods you elect to post, for whatever reason.



Harte

Archaeologists have a bad habit of saying they "know", when the truth is that it's your best guess based upon the extremely limited archaeological evidence. While I'm sure that your reputation precedes you, claiming to "know better" only indicates that you have a high regard for yourself. I may be mistaken with regards to the number of individuals but I believe that new evidence suggests a significant decrease in human global population especially in the Northern Hemisphere at the ONSET of the Younger Dryas period. I've posted links to those studies in previous responses to this thread.



Your dismissive responses to me in this thread and in the past do nothing to convince me of your arguments. I, like many others believe that mainstream archaeologists spend their careers with their head in the sand, only agreeing with the accepted norms. While I'm sure that you have very impressive credentials, your interactions here aren't impressive at all.

It happens, they get it wrong at times but believe they are right on everything. . . . Kinda sad really.

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

The two do not follow. Besides, there is proof of evolution, and there is no proof of 'advanced civilizations before us, assuming you mean something of a scale equal or greater than modern-day.

Your definition of "advanced" is obviously biased. If you do not consider ancient cultures with knowledge of advanced mathematics and engineering to be advanced then you must be biased. Would they need to have to be considered "advanced" by you?

Evidence. How about artifacts found within an indisputably sealed context and excavated by scientists of high repute? That's what it took at Monte Verde in Chile, and the whole 'clovis first' paradigm collapsed.

You mean the archaeological site that provided evidence which overturned widely held beliefs by mainstream archaeologists? Archaeologists were wrong? Go figure....

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

originally posted by: Blarneystoner

originally posted by: Harte

originally posted by: Blarneystoner



The Younger Dryas extinction event, about 12.6 thousand years ago narrowed the human population to less than 20,000 individuals, according to Genetic studies. The cause for YD extinction event is unknown, but I personally think it was a "nuclear winter"....

NOT.



Human population at 10,000 BCE is estimated to be over 2.4 million individuals.



You should consider not posting disinformation. Or, if that's not the case, perhaps you should consider that there are many members here that know better than the utter falsehoods you elect to post, for whatever reason.



Harte

Archaeologists have a bad habit of saying they "know", when the truth is that it's your best guess based upon the extremely limited archaeological evidence. While I'm sure that your reputation precedes you, claiming to "know better" only indicates that you have a high regard for yourself. I may be mistaken with regards to the number of individuals but I believe that new evidence suggests a significant decrease in human global population especially in the Northern Hemisphere at the ONSET of the Younger Dryas period. I've posted links to those studies in previous responses to this thread.



Your dismissive responses to me in this thread and in the past do nothing to convince me of your arguments. I, like many others believe that mainstream archaeologists spend their careers with their head in the sand, only agreeing with the accepted norms. While I'm sure that you have very impressive credentials, your interactions here aren't impressive at all.

It happens, they get it wrong at times but believe they are right on everything. . . . Kinda sad really.

The amount of data they have to work with is extremely limited. It's like trying to put together a puzzle with only 10% of the pieces and no picture to work from. They interpret evidence based upon their current perspectives and commonly held beliefs but those interpretations are merely opinion when you boil it down to it's essence. I will acknowledge that they have more knowledge with regards to accepted evidence but I only ask that they not insult me with dismissive BS as if they "know". Anyone with half a brain will tell you that no one knows for sure. My thoughts on ancient advanced civilizations are speculative but I think there is a great amount of anecdotal evidence that supports ancient advanced global civilizations prior to the Younger Dryas.