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originally posted by: buddha
In the old days this never happen'd.
why is it happening now?
they just dont care any more.
it is setting the stage for another Hitler.
in the second world war
people did things they would Never think of doing normally.
they are being dehumanized.
so they will do any thing the next Hitler will tell them to do.
originally posted by: bigman88
originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: FraggleRock
Let me start by saying that I think this a a huge tragedy and think that raids like this should essentially be done away with. The risks far outweigh the reward. There are far too many mistakes made. Most of these SWAT teams are not trained well enough, and suck far too much money from the taxpayer while simultaneously endangering everyone involved (or in the vicinity).
That beautiful little girl didn't need to die.
In response to your question though:
Because they charged him with involuntary manslaughter. Involuntary manslaughter is reckless behavior that kills someone (without any intent) like a DUI, or killing someone on accident while committing another crime.
Of course everyone is going to say he was acting recklessly since he had his finger on the trigger and was bumped (which I don't buy), or that just participating in a no knock raid is reckless (which I agree with most of the time, certainly in this instance). But were his actions actually reckless?
I don't think anyone can say definitively. I don't know how to phrase this without it sounding jackbootish, but it wasn't his job to pick the door he went through. He didn't make the massive f-up getting the incorrect address. An analogy that I admit is a bit of a stretch would be being the guy that hits the button to demolish a building and kills someone because the person in charge of assuring that wouldn't happen did a crappy job. I think he is indeed a scapegoat.
So the problem here is that there is no 100% proof. Juries are instructed that if there is reasonable doubt they can't lay blame. There is reasonable doubt that Weekley wasn't bumped by the grandmother, just as there is reasonable doubt that he was. Yes, the girl is dead and we know who pulled the trigger, but if there is still some doubt the jury shouldn't be sentencing. You have to take two people at their word, and when that happens there is enough doubt. The same would be true if they were trying to charge the Grandmother.
Now do I think the Grandmother bumped the gun? I was going to say I was 90% sure she couldn't have, but I was thinking about how my place is set up. The couch is a LOOONG way from the front door in my home. If these folks had the couch right next to the door, I can see someone being startled and smacking at a gun. I don't think it's entirely unreasonable unless I see a layout of the house at the time of the raid.
So unless there is 100% proof that the cop was negligent (to a level that would satisfy a court) I can certainly see how the case keeps getting thrown out. It's distasteful, but it should be that way.
I think we all want someone to be punished when a child is shot in the head, but I don't think this thing is that black and white. The law isn't about vengeance. There is a reason for these protections. We should all be assured them.
+++++I'm going to use this as an opportunity to say that ALL cops need to be wearing body cameras. ESPECIALLY guys on SWAT teams. They will pay for themselves by knocking out frivolous lawsuits that routinely end up as settlements because it's cheaper than having the lawyers fight. They've been proven to drastically reduce reports of brutality. If this cop was wearing one the trial would have been over in minutes.+++++
Reasonable and logical. I'm with you, but up to a point.
a stun grenade was tossed right onto the coach where they were lying though. Or right next to it. One of things blowing up that close to you means you can't see anything but a sheet of bright white light in your eyes, and you can't here anything but muffled noises, it would be HIGHLY improbable of grandma to get up and do any mp5 sub machine gun smacking.
Then they did not arrest the grandma immediately, which they would have done if she did smack a gun. Then the family's accounts of the police making the family sit around in the blood of the little girl while they rummaged through the house.
Make an example of him and the person who ordered that family's home raided. Put them in general population for life.
originally posted by: HawkeyeNation
First off I am deeply saddened by this tragic event. A child should never have their life cut short.
I understand why people are blaming the SWAT team here and rightfully so. But full scale the blame is on the stupidity of the american people. 100's of millions of just plain stupid people. There is a reason we have the police state the way it is. It's all of these stupid people that ruin it for the smart one's like myself. (By smart I mean not putting myself at risk or my families at risk because of illegal activity).
originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: Anyafaj
Did you read Any of it???
The father of the girl was an accomplice in the murder...
Duplexes have different addresses, therefore the agents would only enter the area that was designated in the warrant. If the warrant said duplex apartment "A" and "B" they would search both. If it only named one apartment they would only be able to search that one unless there was just cause to enter the other area. If it did not specify either one but simply the address, it might be a valid warrant regardless if both or only one apartment were searched. The legality of such a warrant is determined by several factors, state and/or federal law, the circumstances and of course the judge's ruling, if it came to that.
originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: Bundy
Yeah thats insane. You would make an excellent bad cop.
EDIT TO ADD:
This proves my point however that bad cops come from an imbalanced civilian population...Our society is rotten.