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Western Christian stereotyping of Islam is at best, ignorant, and more likely hypocritical and bigot

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posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 08:18 AM
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a reply to: babloyi

You don't even know the history of the Quran. Wait, who said all that about the Quran? Islamic scholars. If it is hearsay, then blame your own scholars for saying that.

Tell us, just off your head, who was Uthman? Can you also tell us about the parts of the Quran eaten by the goat? Where did I get that from? Oh yes, the Hadith. Are you one of those anti-Hadith Muslims?

I can go on posting Hadith if you like, and if you don't like it, then you aren't a good Muslim if you reject Hadith as well, you know you are supposed to believe the Hadiths as well.

But if you want some rollicking good fun, let's read the Hadiths as well. Here's one, about how your horse even gets you blessed for fighting jihad..


Sahih Bukhari Volume 004, Book 052, Hadith Number 044. Narated By Abu Huraira : A man came to Allah's Apostle and said, "Instruct me as to such a deed as equals Jihad (in reward)." He replied, "I do not find such a deed." Then he added, "Can you, while the Muslim fighter is in the battle-field, enter your mosque to perform prayers without cease and fast and never break your fast?" The man said, "But who can do that?" Abu- Huraira added, "The Mujahid (i.e. Muslim fighter) is rewarded even for the footsteps of his horse while it wanders bout (for grazing) tied in a long rope."


Awww, you even get blessed by your horse. But see, this is the thing about Hadiths, you are commanded to read the Hadiths because they explain Quran.

For those who wish to read Sahih Bukhari, here is a good site and a good site for explaining hadiths. If you wish, we could have fun all day with these Hadiths.




posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 08:27 AM
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a reply to: WarminIndy

Like you said - what would you know about that? You can only know what you know I guess

I've been on the receiving end (for years now) of many, many anti-Muslim emails (and in-person real life rants). I've heard and read all the many sordid stories and videos. Some of them came from people I thought I knew. People I respected

You know what WarminIndy? I've seen you make intelligent arguments

When it comes to this sort of thing I can't help but feel disappointed

I think babloyi is right. There really isn't much point in continuing this discussion

What does it matter who you hurt while you're marching towards your reward?

Sometimes I think hate must be like crack - it only takes a little to get you hooked



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 08:42 AM
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a reply to: Seede




Firstly, if one is an American then they are an American first above all other identification.


Yes I have seen that sickness spread, especially just after 9/11 and what being identified as American means, even above the identification of human.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 08:43 AM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

IMHO, its not "Western Christians" demonizing some group (in this case Moslems), its Western governments unrelated to religion.

You have to realize, Moslems are the new boogeymen (the brown scare). During the "cold war", it was the red scare.

Its standard operating procedure.

These governments need a constant enemy. It helps to justify the hundreds of billions of dollars spent on the Military Industrial Complex. Its to the point now where they actually have to create the groups (ISUS, al-CIAeda etc.).

It also allows them to exert control over their populations. Fear = control.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 09:32 AM
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Jesus made it very clear who was a Christian and who wasnt

True and False Prophets

15“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

True and False Disciples

21“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

So many will call themselves Christian but wont be accepted in to Gods kingdom.
Just a title or acknowledging Christ doesnt a Christian make.

Your point is valid, I know some wonderful Muslims, I know the violence the Koran calls Muslims to do, as well.
Jesus abhors violence. So should Christians, does the Koran call Muslims to turn the other cheek? Jesus does.

I dont think the OP fully understands the teachings of the bible.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 10:26 AM
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a reply to: EaglesFan

It's no run around I assure you and not talking about stars or kings but Jesus who has been raised, is invisible, eternal and immortal just as it was prophesied verbatim and has spoken in our time

John 5 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice

though

Genesis 1 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years

how old Job?

Job 9 Which maketh Arcturus, Orion, and Pleiades, and the chambers of the south.

38 Canst thou bind the sweet influences of Pleiades, or loose the bands of Orion?
Canst thou bring forth Mazzaroth in his season? or canst thou guide Arcturus with his sons?



On March 19, 2008 the brightest event ever recorded by man occurred ..If this is not a sign in the heavens, we've never seen one!..This sign appeared in the region of the sky known as Bootes, a decan of the constellation Virgo. The meaning of Bootes is, "He Cometh," a reference to the coming of the Messiah in judgment..The Greeks called him Bo-o-tes, which is from the Hebrew root Bo (to come), meaning the coming..It is probable that his ancient name was Arcturus * (as referred to in Job 9:9), for this is the name of the brightest star, a (in the left knee). Arcturus means He cometh.
theopenscroll.com...

When he once mused on TV that the Star of Bethlehem had in fact been a supernova, now pulsar PSR 1913+16B, he added ogleearth.com...

the most intrinsically bright object ever observed by humans in the universe..
In less than a minute, this dying star output more energy than the Sun will in its entire ten billion-year lifetime! Although it was observed in March 2008, the explosion itself happened some 7.5 billion years ago: that’s longer than our Sun has existed, and more than half the age of the universe itself. Ever since then the light has been streaming towards us, more than half the observable universe away, while we were busy evolving brains and building telescopes suitable to pick it up

Universe's most powerful blast visible to the naked eye..With four bursts, Wednesday was the busiest day in Swift's life so far. The second of the four bursts, GRB 080319B, occurred at 0613 GMT in the northern constellation Bootes..


And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring; Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. Luke21

sun and moon?


THE RAREST LUNAR ECLIPSE KNOWN AS ‘SELENELION’
some of you will be able to witness the total eclipse of the moon and the rising sun at the same time. This effect is called a ‘selenelion.’..a phenomenon that celestial geometry says cannot happen.

edit on 15-10-2014 by Rustami because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 10:28 AM
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a reply to: babloyi


So what you're saying is that God required extreme violence before (and made no mention of stopping that requirement), but now he doesn't? Is this due to some personality disorder or something? Are you okay with commanded genocide because it was a phase God was going through? Also, I think you missed where I quoted from the Bible, all the wonderful things Jesus was going to do when he returns (kill all the heathens and oppress them).

To be fair in trying to explain the God of Abraham I want you to realize that I am not an apologist for God. The records speak for themselves, if that is possible. I only repeat that of what I understand to be truth and I can be wrong on many points of my understanding. So with that mindset I am not trying to be a know it all or above you in any way. You may very well know the Hebrew bible better than myself.

God did and does and shall allow and require extreme violence in His creation. God has a perfect will and God has a permissive will. Naturally His perfect will is that His creation should love. His permissive will is that once He gave His creation knowledge they must learn to love by a free mind to choose this love above evil.

The misconception that many people have is to blame God for their own misgivings. The Hebrews were no different than any other tribal people. They were heathens and barbaric in every sense of the word. They committed the same sins as their neighbors. As a matter of records the Hebrews were punished just as severely as their neighbors. The difference being that the entire tribal congregation agreed and accepted God as He proposed His agreement with them. They had a covenant of blood with their God and they broke every rule in that covenant. As you read the entire OT you can see that in order for them to survive as a nation they must play fire with fire or become exterminated. Violence was the order of the day and still is today.

God has not changed. He still allows violence simply because you and I still have that same choice to do evil and we are no less guilty of violence than the Hebrews were in their day. Not one nation upon the face of this earth is sin free. Every nation that exists today or has ever existed has had no problem in promoting violence. According to the Christian bible this will continue up to and including the end of this age.

Now along with continuing violence there are some people who will conform to the perfect will of God and as they learn to overcome hate and love this creation they then are rewarded with various gifts from God. The entire purpose of God is to eventually have a family of His creation who have learned to love and to give them everlasting life with Him. You are correct. All the rest of this creation who will not learn to love will eventually be destroyed. This does not set well with most people because it interferes with their choice to do what they want to do.

Now babloyi, my own belief is that those who learn to love can be from all walks of life and not just one corner of the world. Jesus is the doorway for me. You may have another door to another god and that is your prerogative and should not spawn a hatred from me to you. Who is right or who is wrong is our choice but one thing is very clear to me and that is that God is not to blame for my sins against His perfect will.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 10:47 AM
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originally posted by: borntowatch
Your point is valid, I know some wonderful Muslims, I know the violence the Koran calls Muslims to do, as well.
Jesus abhors violence. So should Christians, does the Koran call Muslims to turn the other cheek? Jesus does.

I dont think the OP fully understands the teachings of the bible.


I don't think many people do, considering what's been stated in this thread (and ATS in general). There are a lot of broad generalizations being thrown out there, especially this idea that 'westerners' wish to kill off all Muslims or demonize them for some impending offense or danger. No one I know (myself included) wishes to put an end to all Muslims for the sake of fear. A human is still a human after all. However, this doesn't excuse my personal experiences with Muslim folk which had no hints of false flag or media influence whatsoever.

My mind recalls a certain Muslim fellow who would frequent our college philosophy club meetings in silence. With our club founder being the stereotypical atheist professor as he was, it was only a matter of time before a comment was thrown out there that triggered the fanaticism. This guy went off harder than any Christian individual I've seen; he threw his Qur'an out on the table and started thumpin' the Muhammad out of it while fervently explaining to everyone in the room why we were wrong to discuss such things. There was a certain wildness in his eyes that I haven't seen in a person since then. Considering the private nature of this affair, I doubt this was a false flag operation of any sort. My girlfriend has also told me of the rising population of Muslims in Michigan, especially near her home town in Coldwater where there exists a large community of them. They've become increasingly more violent and bold, with crimes on the rise no doubt due to the recent ISIS activity. Her parents are afraid because of this, not because of some force fed media agenda. There's a real threat here.

My point is, there's a reason people are nervous around Muslim folk. As opposed to the tired, often misinterpreted quotes from the Bible, the Qur'an flat out says to kill folks if they don't believe. Can we not see how that would lead to some suspicion? Never mind any sort of demonization agenda from the media, the proof is in the pudding... or in this case the cook book. I am all for believing in human integrity, and wish things were different. You can't expect thousands of years of tradition to change over night sadly.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 11:05 AM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis

And the assumption is that if we strongly disagree with an ideology then we must be filled with hate. I must strongly disagree with the political ideology that is inherent within Islam, like I said, if they could remove that politicization then I have no problem with them expressing their religious views.

The whole problem is with the political issues, the numerous human rights violations, the continual extortion over subjected people within Islamic countries. THIS is the problem that NEEDS to be addressed and the failure to do so only causes more people to be injured under this banner.

I don't care if a woman wants to wear the hijab, what I am opposed to is the forcing of women to wear the hijab. I don't care if they don't drink alcohol, that's not my problem if they do, but they are hypocritical in forcing others not to when their alcohol sales are through the roof in the very countries they stone people to death. See, these are the things that I take issue with, not because it is part of their religion, but because they are violently forcing a movement that they call peaceful. There is simply no peace because someone is subjugated.

On this very thread there are people who are pouting and boohooing because they think we hate all Muslims, no, we do not hate all Muslims, we hate the stoning of people, we hate the burning of schoolgirls, we hate the mustard gassing of neighbors, we hate the honor killing and we hate the enforcement of Sharia. Now, if there are any on this thread who defend any of those actions by saying "my Muslim brother that did this isn't really Muslim", well then, what else are they?

When you have a religion that does not allow the members to exercise free will and conscience, and threatens death to any who does, then how is this defensible in 2014?

When they start addressing those problems, then we can take them seriously, but it shouldn't have to be us who points these things out to them. I don't care if they don't eat pork and prevent themselves from passing gas in the mosque or what have you, that's not my problem. But when you have a million people starving to death because someone else was afraid to say a word to the terror groups, then how am I supposed to have sympathy for them when the terror groups are killed? Only when I hear Muslims saying to other Muslims to stop the gross human rights violations, to end the stoning and burning, to do away with beheadings and mutilations of "infidels", then will I no longer have to say anything.

That's what I want to see, but all I have heard so far is "You all hate Muslims". No, we hate what Muslims are getting by with by those who are too afraid to say a word. They can practice their religion all they want, it is when the practicing of their religion causes great harm to the weaker and innocent that I hate.

I want to hear them say to their imams and scholars that have held sway for too long, that some of their policies are damaging. I really don't think God looked down from heaven and approved the murders of 275 innocent little girls who were burned to death for not wearing burkhas. And if their Allah approved it, then that Allah is not merciful nor just.

All I can say is this, when the day of judgment comes and these men who did this in the name of Allah and Mohammed stand before God with the blood of those girls on their hands, where are they going to stand in that day? Will Allah accept their "righteous" deed? And for every Muslim who cowered from them in their act, and approved it, then what judgement should be on them?

Christians and Jews have struggled a long time to get where we are today, but when it comes to human rights violations today, who has perpetrated the most? In 2014, tell me where there are no human rights violations in the Islamic world. Can you name one place? When a little girl is forced to marry an older man, that is a violation of her human rights. When little girls die because the man killed her while having sex, that is a violation of her human rights. When a woman is stoned to death because of "adultery" that wasn't tried, then that is a violation of her human rights. And since when has Christians and Jews stoned adulterers since 3,000 BC? That's right, not one single Christian stones adulterers ever and no Jew has done that since the time of Moses. But in 2014, it happened in Afghanistan.

Not one single Christian kills any other Christian for leaving Christianity, we don't cut their hands off. No Jewish person is ever killed for converting to something else. We can go on comparing, but the truth is, in 2014, the bulk of human rights violations are from Islamic countries. And since the year 2000 we have seen it happen in Western countries. That's why I want to see any of these Muslims on ATS make a stand against other Muslims for committing genocide before I believe it is a religion of peace instead of trying to make it look like Christians and Jews are to blame.

What Christian or Jew is to blame for this?


Who did this? NO Christian or Jew. And THIS is what I hate and want Muslims in Western countries to take a hard look at what their "Muslim brothers" are doing. And THEN after they condemn this behavior to those MUSLIMS who did this, then they can ask for us to help them. There ARE Muslims who would love to get out from under Islam, but are not allowed. But it isn't Christians and Jews preventing them, it isn't any Western government preventing this, it is they themselves who do this. And they want my sympathy? The only ones who get my sympathy are the children and women who can't escape.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 11:27 AM
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a reply to: WarminIndy

Are you, a non-muslim, a non-muslim who's ONLY source of Islam is bigots in this forum (and ridiculous propaganda websites and Fox News) seriously thinking you know more about Islam than me? You didn't even know about the violence in your own Bible.
You think with knowing the name "Uthman" and knowing the word "Hadith" you somehow have gained some secret inner knowledge that the general muslim populace is not privy to? Even a 10 year old muslim can name you the first couple of Caliphs of Islam, you think that is some secret undercover knowledge?

I have no problem with Hadith. Do you even know anything about Hadith, or did you just pick up the word because you read somewhere about something you think points out "badness" in muslims? Do you even know about the levels of authenticity of Hadith? The chains of narration? The major books and collectors? And you're seriously thinking of lecturing ME on that stuff?


"You aren't a good muslim if you reject Hadith"?

Like I said, I have no problem with Hadith (to be fair, I probably have greater knowledge of them than you), but seriously, you think YOU have the authority to dictate who is a good muslim or not? I'm sorry, who appointed you Imam of the world?

It is none of your business or even within your understanding to be dictating whether a follower of Islam (a religion you seem to know next to nothing about) is "good" or not.

It is interesting that you STILL have not answered any of the questions I posted as my response to you earlier. I guess it is easier to resort to "I am better" arguments. I'm sorry to have written such a dismissive response to you, but you really amazed me with your apparent belief that you know my religion better than me, as if I just one day woke up and suddenly decided on a whim "Hey, you know what, I don't know the first thing about the religion, but why don't I become a muslim?!"

a reply to: Seede
Hey Seede!
You talk about God allowing violence in his creation, but that is quite a different matter from actually commanding it in his instruction manual to the world. And you can understand how "Everyone who does not love will be destroyed" can give cause for hesitation and pause?
Either way, I can't fault you with your conclusion. Like I said, it is certainly not my intention to lecture Christians about Christianity. All I was doing was pointing out that Islam is not some magical unique devil-religion that is full of violence and murderings and oppression, while all other religions are cupcakes and rainbows.
edit on 15-10-2014 by babloyi because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 11:58 AM
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a reply to: WarminIndy




Only when I hear Muslims saying to other Muslims to stop the gross human rights violations, to end the stoning and burning, to do away with beheadings and mutilations of "infidels", then will I no longer have to say anything.

That's what I want to see, but all I have heard so far is "You all hate Muslims".


Again this crap of I want to see Muslim condemning the atrocities.

So search ATS if you are too lazy to Google, what you want to see is right here on ATS.

Threads about Imams condemning the actions of sick individuals in the middle east and else where.

Even a ATS MOD spouted this crap a week or so ago, I replied in the same fashion asking how can MOD of this site say such a thing, are they not aware that what has been asked by so many here on ATS is actually available in numerous threads.

Links have been posted in other threads to the threads that show Muslims speaking up, its usually the same people posting in these threads yet the same old ignorance gets spouted, is it some sort agenda?

You wonder why the impression many get that you hate all Muslims well its the repeated comment not just by you but by many not just on ATS but all over the media, the Bill Mahar show with Ben Affleck is good example, I believe Bill used the same line, 'where are all the Muslims condemning the Atrocities'.

Is there an agenda to keep people ignorant of the fact that many Muslims are and do condemn these types of actions by the media and other alternative media to either turn a blind eye or worse follow some agenda to keep such news from people to keep the hatred is Islam strong.

Which in turn gives support for any military action needed in the middle east.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 12:26 PM
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Just two examples of american Muslims condemning radicals. They have condemned every attack by Muslim radicals ever but the mainstream media refuses to acknowledge it. Propaganda at its best and the ignorant American just eats it up. Muslims are mostly good just like any large group is generally good. America is far more of a danger to the world than Muslims as we've seen time and time again.

www.cair.com...

www.cair.com...



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 01:07 PM
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a reply to: babloyi


I'm not accusing Jesus of anything. I quoted directly from the Bible, what God wanted done to the heathens, and what Jesus plans to do to the heathens when he returns (kill them all and oppress them).
~
Except...well, Jesus isn't any nicer in the NT. When he returns, it'll be bringing God's vengeance, there's going to be bloodshed, he'll be leading armies, killing all the leaders, slaughtering so many that every people will mourn, at which point he'll rule with an iron rod.


You mean the certain as in beyond any shadow of a doubt eternal consequence against murderers and those followers yolked with them? I can see why that would seem oppressive

so to you when Jesus returns (you know He is the Spirit now right?), He'll physically be violently murdering folks?

in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures 2Peter3

Why couldn't you just answer the question? Here it is again -if no murderer has eternal life can you explain to us how He was raised, is immortal and rules eternally? here's some more pertinent's

Acts 13 And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead, now no more to return to corruption

Now the Lord is the Spirit and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.2Corinthians3

And another incorrect assumption~ all the tribes OF THE EARTH will, know any murderous man based "religion"/"heaven"?

Romans 1 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man

Matthew 24 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now. Galatians4

Are you saying these are false?



Persecution of Christians can be traced historically from the time of Jesus in the first century to the present time.[1]..has reported that over 100,000 Christians are violently killed annually because of some relation to their faith.[140] According to the World Evangelical Alliance, over 200 million Christians are denied fundamental human rights solely because of their faith.[141] Of the 100-200 million Christians under assault, the majority are persecuted in Muslim-dominated nations.[142] Christians suffer numerically more than any other faith groups or groups without faith in the world. Of the world's three largest religions Christians are the most proportionally persecuted with 80% of all acts of religious discrimination being directed at Christians[143] who only make up 33% of the world's population.[144]

Every year, the Christian non-profit organization Open Doors publishes a list of the top 50 countries where persecution of Christians for religious reasons is worst. The 2014 list has the following countries as its top 10 offenders:[145]

North Korea
Somalia
Syria
Iraq
Afghanistan
Saudi Arabia
Maldives
Pakistan
Iran
Yemen

en.wikipedia.org...

Most people in the West would be surprised by the answer to the question: who are the most persecuted people in the world? According to the International Society for Human Rights, a secular group with members in 38 states worldwide, 80 per cent of all acts of religious discrimination in the world today are directed at Christians.

The Centre for the Study of Global Christianity in the United States estimates that 100,000 Christians now die every year, targeted because of their faith – that is 11 every hour.www.independent.co.uk...

Why are Christians, as a new Pew report documents, the most persecuted religious group in the world? And why is their persecution occurring primarily throughout the Islamic world?..these faiths tend to be coterminous with their respective ethnicities: Buddhists, Asians; Judaism, Jews; Hinduism, Hindus.. www.frontpagemag.com...



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 01:07 PM
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I agree with you op. I my self am not religious and not in an atheist way I just simply don't care to worry about the larger picture or what created us or life after death ect. I live for the now. Al tho I do enjoy learning about religion as it intrigues me, people who follow invisible beings so devoutly.
I've have read the bible and have read the Koran, I have also spoken to many people over the years on their faiths and when comparing the big 2 that are out there right now the Christians and the Muslims by face value the Muslim religion is much more A) believable and b) peaceful. (yes there are extremist that use the faiths as trail mix and pick choose what to follow) But unfortunately I believe the Christians fell threatened by the Muslim faith, and are doing the exact same thing they did with the pagans for example...and by demonizing a religion you will eventually destroy it.... I just wonder what parts of the Muslim religion they will eventually try to steal ...if they can destroy it



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 02:08 PM
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a reply to: Rustami
I'm sorry, I honestly have no idea what you're talking about. In the Bible, Jesus's return doesn't herald the slaughter of "only murderers", despite what one unconnected verse in John 3 says. it is EVERYONE who isn't a follower.

I'm not sure what you're talking about what question I didn't answer either, Rustami. For the record, I don't accept the Bible as gospel (
) truth, so I don't need to justify how one thing happens in it when another bit may possibly contradict that.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: tavi45
a reply to: Ironclad2000

The bigots are the bigots. They exist in every culture and religion......


Yes, but it seems the religious have a monopoly on hatred and bigotry.



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 02:58 PM
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originally posted by: WarminIndy

originally posted by: babloyi
a reply to: WarminIndy
Join up? Join up what? Islam? Yeah, because OF COURSE every convert did it for that. It is almost like you went to and got straight As in Hate-Islam Propaganda school.

I'd be amazed if you found even a single muslim convert who joined up because they "get 72 virgins in heaven". Interestingly enough, particularly in Europe, the vast majority of converts are local women (and no, before you say "they were forced to marry muslim men", conversion to Islam is not a requirement for women who want to marry muslim men).


What were you promised for converting?

Surely these people weren't convinced that no drinking is the prime reward of converting.


Wow, your vitriol and hate here has taken me by surprise and like someone else said I had no idea you were such a piece of work. You are indeed a perfect illustration for the thread's theme.

Your last comment is interesting, have you been drinking?



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 04:13 PM
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a reply to: babloyi

I can see that. "EVERYONE who isn't a follower" of who?-

and all the world wondered after the beast. And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast..And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. Revelation13

looks like convert or be killed?

for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth. Revelation18

I think you and many misunderstand what "you must be born again" and the "sword of His mouth" means

2 Thessalonians 2 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming

1 Corinthians 15 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

1Peter 1 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away

corrupt man-

When this evidence is evaluated systematically, the only rational conclusion is that Islam's lone prophet was a ruthless terrorist, a mass-murderer, a thief, slave trader, rapist and pedophile. www.prophetofdoom.net...

"And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray." Matt 24:11.

Satan would seek out and try to use false prophets. Muhammad, as a false prophet, was certainly successful. For people to choose to follow Muhammad means they are rejecting what Jesus taught; they are rejecting Christ Himself.
answering-islam.org...





We would do well to note that not only did Muhammad resemble those who Jesus cast demons out of, but that Muhammad never once healed a blind man or made a lame man to walk. Muhammad was not a man of miracles. But, as we shall see, he was a man of murder and mayhem.

“Violence and terrorism are endemic to Islam. It makes “converts” by the threat of death and holds them by fear. The penalty for attempting to leave this “religion of peace” is death. Worldwide terrorism is encouraged by a covering and obsequious West that has licked the boots of Islam to keep the oil flowing. Truth, justice and right have been sacrificed to evil on the altar of compromise, intimidation and fear.”
bbfohio.com...


not corrupt-
How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? Hebrews9
edit on 15-10-2014 by Rustami because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 04:26 PM
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originally posted by: WarminIndy
a reply to: Spiramirabilis

And the assumption is that if we strongly disagree with an ideology then we must be filled with hate. I must strongly disagree with the political ideology that is inherent within Islam, like I said, if they could remove that politicization then I have no problem with them expressing their religious views.

The whole problem is with the political issues, the numerous human rights violations, the continual extortion over subjected people within Islamic countries. THIS is the problem that NEEDS to be addressed and the failure to do so only causes more people to be injured under this banner.

I don't care if a woman wants to wear the hijab, what I am opposed to is the forcing of women to wear the hijab. I don't care if they don't drink alcohol, that's not my problem if they do, but they are hypocritical in forcing others not to when their alcohol sales are through the roof in the very countries they stone people to death. See, these are the things that I take issue with, not because it is part of their religion, but because they are violently forcing a movement that they call peaceful. There is simply no peace because someone is subjugated.

On this very thread there are people who are pouting and boohooing because they think we hate all Muslims, no, we do not hate all Muslims, we hate the stoning of people, we hate the burning of schoolgirls, we hate the mustard gassing of neighbors, we hate the honor killing and we hate the enforcement of Sharia. Now, if there are any on this thread who defend any of those actions by saying "my Muslim brother that did this isn't really Muslim", well then, what else are they?

When you have a religion that does not allow the members to exercise free will and conscience, and threatens death to any who does, then how is this defensible in 2014?

When they start addressing those problems, then we can take them seriously, but it shouldn't have to be us who points these things out to them. I don't care if they don't eat pork and prevent themselves from passing gas in the mosque or what have you, that's not my problem. But when you have a million people starving to death because someone else was afraid to say a word to the terror groups, then how am I supposed to have sympathy for them when the terror groups are killed? Only when I hear Muslims saying to other Muslims to stop the gross human rights violations, to end the stoning and burning, to do away with beheadings and mutilations of "infidels", then will I no longer have to say anything.

That's what I want to see, but all I have heard so far is "You all hate Muslims". No, we hate what Muslims are getting by with by those who are too afraid to say a word. They can practice their religion all they want, it is when the practicing of their religion causes great harm to the weaker and innocent that I hate.

I want to hear them say to their imams and scholars that have held sway for too long, that some of their policies are damaging. I really don't think God looked down from heaven and approved the murders of 275 innocent little girls who were burned to death for not wearing burkhas. And if their Allah approved it, then that Allah is not merciful nor just.

All I can say is this, when the day of judgment comes and these men who did this in the name of Allah and Mohammed stand before God with the blood of those girls on their hands, where are they going to stand in that day? Will Allah accept their "righteous" deed? And for every Muslim who cowered from them in their act, and approved it, then what judgement should be on them?

Christians and Jews have struggled a long time to get where we are today, but when it comes to human rights violations today, who has perpetrated the most? In 2014, tell me where there are no human rights violations in the Islamic world. Can you name one place? When a little girl is forced to marry an older man, that is a violation of her human rights. When little girls die because the man killed her while having sex, that is a violation of her human rights. When a woman is stoned to death because of "adultery" that wasn't tried, then that is a violation of her human rights. And since when has Christians and Jews stoned adulterers since 3,000 BC? That's right, not one single Christian stones adulterers ever and no Jew has done that since the time of Moses. But in 2014, it happened in Afghanistan.

Not one single Christian kills any other Christian for leaving Christianity, we don't cut their hands off. No Jewish person is ever killed for converting to something else. We can go on comparing, but the truth is, in 2014, the bulk of human rights violations are from Islamic countries. And since the year 2000 we have seen it happen in Western countries. That's why I want to see any of these Muslims on ATS make a stand against other Muslims for committing genocide before I believe it is a religion of peace instead of trying to make it look like Christians and Jews are to blame.

What Christian or Jew is to blame for this?


Who did this? NO Christian or Jew. And THIS is what I hate and want Muslims in Western countries to take a hard look at what their "Muslim brothers" are doing. And THEN after they condemn this behavior to those MUSLIMS who did this, then they can ask for us to help them. There ARE Muslims who would love to get out from under Islam, but are not allowed. But it isn't Christians and Jews preventing them, it isn't any Western government preventing this, it is they themselves who do this. And they want my sympathy? The only ones who get my sympathy are the children and women who can't escape.


This is the point I made in another thread a while ago. I recently got accused of slandering Islam for merely quoting Islams "holy book" on some of the most pertinent matters, such as what it says about their God "Allah", how it views Jesus, what it says about love and tolerance towards others, and what it states about Jihad. There is nothing more slanderous than a Muslim or anyone else claiming Allah and Yahweh to be one and the same. Since Islam slanders the divinity of Yahweh, I will slander the living hell out of Islam in retaliation, real simple. The Koran makes the case for Jihad, the Koran commands its followers to show no love towards its enemies, the "infidel" but instead encourages the exact opposite.

The verses exemplify why we see a clear difference between the most radical Christian and the most radical Muslim. The Koran makes the case for its followers to commit violence even towards each other should they attempt to stray from the faith. Christianity and Islam are diametrically opposed to each other at the most fundamental level. This is why the Middle East never has and never will see stability or any kind of peace with its mosaic of theocratic governments, because these people, can't even live among themselves without a conflict breaking out somewhere. Its always been this way with or without "western" influence or media hype.
edit on 15-10-2014 by BlackManINC because: (no reason given)

edit on 15-10-2014 by BlackManINC because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 15 2014 @ 04:35 PM
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a reply to: BlackManINC

Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all worship the same God. The differences are cultural. It's like saying Catholics and Protestants worship a different God. There are thousands of Christian sects so don't act like Christianity is any better. I would expect less bigotry from an African American. You enjoy the benefits of overgeneralizing people and culture every day. The programming is strong in you.



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