Quit "looking up" and start "looking facts up".

originally posted by: supergravity
a reply to: Rob48
Rob 48 you need to read waynos's post that states atmospheric oxygen effects ocean systems just as I tried to tell you,dead zones can be an indication of lower oxygen in the atmosphere.

Waynos's link says no such thing. I don't think you understand the science at all.

As for jet engines "sucking in 2 million cubic feet per minute", I think you need to read up on how modern high-bypass engines work. The vast majority of that 2 million cubic feet passes straight through the engine and is not involved in combustion at all.

You quoted the 777. Well that has a bypass ratio of 9:1 meaning 90% of that air never passes through the combustion chamber.

a reply to: Rob48
Thanks for that info, so your saying it will take 20 minutes for the 777 to suck 2 million cubic ft of life giving air and spit out crap. Wow I feel a lot better.We can all sleep tonight.

a reply to: supergravity
no. A 777 will "spit out crap" right from light up.

As will your car. What's the point??

a reply to: supergravity
If you are seriously concerned by what you've presented, then give this a read scienceandpublicpolicy.org...
If you still have concerns, voice them in a reasonable manner and we all can discuss them.

originally posted by: supergravity
a reply to: network dude
It seems I was mistaken on the statement I made that oxygen was at 30% in ww2 but My point that Oxygen is decreasing and we will suffocate if we do nothing, still stands.

originally posted by: supergravity
a reply to: Rob48
Rob 48 you need to read waynos's post that states atmospheric oxygen effects ocean systems just as I tried to tell you,dead zones can be an indication of lower oxygen in the atmosphere. ALL systems of the earth are connected even if SCIENTIST have not found them.The systems of the earth are very fragile and balance is the key word and we should never say never when it comes to the life of the planet . SNIP..

You should always provide a link to your source material if you want to be taken seriously.

Sorry but in this case the information you quoted is not only incorrect according to everything I can find, the source is a noted crank ....

A directory for Oxygen Depletion issues, technologies, resources.

Peswiki is ran by Sterling D. Allan, who not surprisingly is a business associate of the infamous cold fusion scammer Carlo Rossi.

Just google free energy scam and his name is everywhere, the Search term Sterling Allen Fraud returns 363,000 hits

Regarding oxygen depletion.....

With forest resources--"the lungs of the Earth"-- under attack in many regions, some have raised concerns about the planet's oxygen supply. A leading geochemist assesses these claims and finds that we can probably breathe easy

AN OFT-HEARD WARNING with regard to our planet's future is that by cutting back tropical forests we put our supply of oxygen gas at risk. Many good reasons exist for placing deforestation near the top of our list of environmental sins, but fortunately the fate of the Earth's O2 supply does not hang in the balance.

Simply put, our atmosphere is endowed with such an enormous reserve of this gas that even if we were to burn all our fossil fuel reserves, all our trees, and all the organic matter stored in soils, we would use up only a few percent of the available O2.

No matter how foolishly we treat our environmental heritage, we simply don't have the capacity to put more than a small dent in our O2 supply. Furthermore, the Earth's forests do not play a dominant role in maintaining O2 reserves, because they consume just as much of this gas as they produce.

In the tropics, ants, termites, bacteria, and fungi eat nearly the entire photosynthetic O2 product. Only a tiny fraction of the organic matter they produce accumulates in swamps and soils or is carried down the rivers for burial on the sea floor.

While no danger exists that our O2 reserve will be depleted, nevertheless the O2 content of our atmosphere is slowly declining--so slowly that a sufficiently accurate technique to measure this change wasn't developed until the late 1980s.

Ralph Keeling, its developer, showed that between 1989 and 1994 the O2 content of the atmosphere decreased at an average annual rate of 2 parts per million. Considering that the atmosphere contains 210,000 parts per million, one can see why this measurement proved so difficult.

This drop was not unexpected, for the combustion of fossil fuels destroys O2. For each 100 atoms of fossil-fuel carbon burned, about 140 molecules of O2 are consumed.

The surprise came when Keeling's measurements showed that the rate of decline of O2 was only about two-thirds of that attributable to fossil-fuel combustion during this period. Only one explanation can be given for this observation: Losses of biomass through deforestation must have been outweighed by a fattening of biomass elsewhere, termed global "greening" by geochemists.

Although the details as to just how and where remain obscure, the buildup of extra CO2 in our atmosphere and of extra fixed nitrogen in our soils probably allows plants to grow a bit faster than before, leading to a greater storage of carbon in tree wood and soil humus. For each atom of extra carbon stored in this way, roughly one molecule of extra oxygen accumulates in the atmosphere.

The author,Wallace S. Broecker, is a world renowned climate scientist who developed the idea of the Thermohaline circulation which I believe you are trying to cite as an argument in your rebuttal to Rob48.

Broecker has authored over 450 journal articles and 10 books. He is perhaps best known for his discovery of the role played by the ocean in triggering the abrupt climate changes which punctuated glacial time, in particular the development and popularization of the idea of a global "conveyor belt" linking the circulation of the global ocean.

However, his contributions stretch far beyond the "conveyor"; his work is the foundation of carbon cycle science, and his applications of radiocarbon to paleoceanography are landmarks in the field.

His work with chemical tracers in the ocean is integral to modern chemical oceanography; indeed, his textbook "Tracers in the Sea", authored with Tsung-Hung Peng, is still cited in the contemporary literature 25 years after its publication.

originally posted by: supergravity
a reply to: Rob48
The intelligent curve has been found to circle around to stupid.

Sorry but Pot meet Kettle, you are arguing nonsense based on misinformation from a known scam artist.

Your passion is admirable but misguided.

originally posted by: mrthumpy
originally posted by: network dude
originally posted by: mrthumpy

[I]mrthumpy[/I]What altitude where the planes flying at?

[I]network dude[/I]You're kidding right?

[I]mrthumpy[/I]With so many details in the story, knowing the approximate altitude should be easy. He knew they were lower than commercial planes and higher than crop dusters, so perhaps we can all learn about this special chemtrailing program going on only in southern Arizona. I have never seen anything like this in my lifetime, so I am intrigued.

[I]network dude[/I] well that went as well as could be expected. I'm left wondering what an indecent pattern would look like though...

You talk amongst yourselves without addressing me; an indecent pattern would be this back and forth conversation between you both without inclusion of my input.

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
Killing prairie grass we learned back in the thirties will kill the prairies and cause a new dust bowl. It took a decade of living in the dirt to repair the damage done the last time the grasses were killed off so we know they can't be doing that. If you really think that they are trying g to kill off the prairie grasses please explain why they would do that?. e reply to: vethumanbeing

You bring up a very good question AutumnWitch. For those here that graze (have done so for decades) cattle on federal, state or BLM land at one dollar a head per year; perhaps they (the government, state or federal) just don't want to honor those legacy (100 year old) arrangements anymore. I have no idea why other than mineral rights here are valued (YOU DONT OWN THEM even on your own property; strike a gold vein on your property; it can be ceased by the state); if you are grazing your cattle on an area found to be mineral rich you as .gov might try to remove ancient grazing rights (this is difficult as grandfathered through generations) or just kill off all the prairie grasses instead so the cattle have nothing to eat; might as well stock yard them; Arizona is getting rid of 'free ranged cattle ranching' and I do not know why.

originally posted by: supergravity
a reply to: Rob48
Thanks for that info, so your saying it will take 20 minutes for the 777 to suck 2 million cubic ft of life giving air and spit out crap. Wow I feel a lot better.We can all sleep tonight.

Well no, if it is 10 times as long then it would be 2 million cubic feet every 10 minutes, or 12 million cu ft per hour.

Which might sound a lot, but consider that the effective volume of the atmosphere is about 1.5 x 10^20 cubic feet, so it would take the 777 you mentioned about 1.25 x 10^13 hours to suck all that air through.

That's about 1.5 billion years, or one third of the age of the Earth.

And in fact it would be a lot longer than that, as the air at cruising altitude is only about one quarter as dense as it is at sea level, so that 2 million cubic feet would only be half a million cubic feet at standard pressure.

So call it 6 billion years. I'll sleep OK tonight.

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Just so I can completely understand your claim, the 12,000 foot spray planes only come around twice a year, once in the spring, and once in the fall. They spray tic tac toe grids directly over you and you can taste the air and wipe off what they spray. And the planes are small fighter jets, like A-10's.

And with this anomaly going on, and all your neighbors talking about this, not one of them got any pictures or footage of this happening. In 2014 where every cell phone has those capabilities.


ETA: oh, and it made everyone of you sick.


Have I got any of that wrong?

originally posted by: vethumanbeing

You talk amongst yourselves without addressing me; an indecent pattern would be this back and forth conversation between you both without inclusion of my input.

So if someone asks me why I posted a question to you, I am not allowed to answer them unless I include you in the conversation that everyone with internet capabilities can read? I could see if we flaunted our U2U's outright, but nothing was said that you couldn't read. Again, if you feel like the T&C is being broken alert the staff, otherwise, quit whining.

a reply to: Drunkenparrot
Thanks for the constructive criticism ,nobody is perfect, I just feel we are at risk of losing vital earth systems because there are thought of as rock solid when in fact many are fragile and teetering on the edge . I will go through the information you provided.

originally posted by: vethumanbeing


Best calculation? 12,000 feet. I am nowhere near a major airport and watching a decent pattern by commercial airlines. These planes are smaller and very maneuverable (no noise).

Well get out and produce photographic evidence of them! On the other thread I've already provided you with a list of Arizona Chemtrail believers on You Tube. How hard is it to get a group together to record what you claim to be seeing?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Why don't you contact GeoEngineering Watch

Mailing Address

Dane Wigington
P.O. Box 9
Bella Vista CA 96008

Online contact form

www.geoengineeringwatch.org...

www.geoengineeringwatch.org...

Think of the contacts that Dan Wigington has available to document what you are witnessing? It is that simple yet you seem just to put obstacles in the way such as 'old Kodak cameras, etc'. There is a whole network out there and in Arizona so why not get assistance to document this 'smoking gun'?

And yet again what has the lack of a major airport got to do with it?

originally posted by: supergravity
a reply to: network dude
It seems I was mistaken on the statement I made that oxygen was at 30% in ww2 but My point that Oxygen is decreasing and we will suffocate if we do nothing, still stands.

Thanks for admitting your error. That shows integrity. Something lacking in this forum.
While I appreciate your concern, I don't share it. Our percentage of oxygen has remained relatively constant for a very long time.

If the plankton starts to disappear, then I think we will have a right to be concerned. Until then, there are many other issues that would be better avenues for concern IMHO. Alternative fuel being the most important.

originally posted by: [post=18152389]network dude[/post
]originally posted by: vethumanbeing

[I]veteranhumanbeing[/I]You talk amongst yourselves without addressing me; an indecent pattern would be this back and forth conversation between you both without inclusion of my input.

[I]network dude[/I]So if someone asks me why I posted a question to you, I am not allowed to answer them unless I include you in the conversation that everyone with internet capabilities can read? I could see if we flaunted our U2U's outright, but nothing was said that you couldn't read. Again, if you feel like the T&C is being broken alert the staff, otherwise, quit whining.

You have done that "alerted" the mods and quashed something I said surround about you; so what; ( you cried foul) I DON'T; I CHOSE TO FIGHT MY own BATTLES without involving moderators (they know best anyway). Some of your conversations should be limited to PMs is all; they seem to be personal attacks upon character (not just mine btw you realize we are listening).

a reply to: network dude

You have everything right (except for your close mindedness WRONG).

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: vethumanbeing

Just so I can completely understand your claim, the 12,000 foot spray planes only come around twice a year, once in the spring, and once in the fall. They spray tic tac toe grids directly over you and you can taste the air and wipe off what they spray. And the planes are small fighter jets, like A-10's.
And with this anomaly going on, and all your neighbors talking about this, not one of them got any pictures or footage of this happening. In 2014 where every cell phone has those capabilities.
ETA: oh, and it made everyone of you sick.
Have I got any of that wrong?

Not at all; except you haven't disclosed this: WHERE DO YOU LIVE?.

a reply to: vethumanbeing

I'd rather you know what I am saying about you so there is no talking behind anyone's back.

As far as my location, if you look at my avitar, under "location" it gets you to within 6.5 miles of my residence. I do live in the country, but my address is still Dunn, NC. I am not afraid of anyone and have no reason to hide my location. I have displayed it since the start of my account.

Why are you afraid of anyone knowing the town closest to you?

originally posted by: vethumanbeing
a reply to: network dude

You have everything right (except for your close mindedness WRONG).

Your claim is incredible, as I have mentioned before. If you brought some proof of this claim, it would make sense, and it would change the whole paradigm of thinking in the chemtrail community. I doubt you comprehend how big this would be if true. So, until you can do better than "trust me, it happened", I will hold out belief.

originally posted by: vethumanbeing
a reply to: network dude

You have everything right (except for your close mindedness WRONG).

A person's mind could be open to the possibility of this happening, but it would be wrong for someone to believe you just because you say "I saw it".

Sheeple do that (blindly believe what someone claims without any corroborating evidence). I'm an independent thinker, not a sheeple. I'm not going to blindly believe what you say simple because you said it.

Granted, I can't prove you are making it all up, either, but until you provide evidence of this semi-regularly scheduled spraying at 12,000 feet in a grid pattern, then your claims will simply be unsubstantiated until a time that you can substantiate them.

Until then, mind mind is only open to the possibility of such an event, but not the actual occurrence of such an event.

a reply to: vethumanbeing
Does this look like what you saw?