Baker Forced to make gay wedding cakes, undergo sensitivity training, after losing lawsuit

I can't believe that I'm seeing what I'm reading...people still actually believe that one chooses to be gay?

I'm sympathetic with the baker, though I think the entire thing is asinine, from him refusing to make the cake, to the couple going to the state with it, and especially with the sensitivity training nonsense.

But, really, the whole "gay is a choice" thing still has legs??

Incredible that those siding with the gay couple can't wrap their minds around the idea that there was no discrimination going on at all; thus making the ruling an illegal attack on the bakers rights.

Dictionary
2. treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit: racial and religious intolerance and discrimination.

The baker didn't care that the couple was gay, he simply didn't want to support their marriage. In no way does this affect how the baker personally thought of the couple as individuals. As has been regurgitated so many times already, he clearly stated that he would provide any other baked goods for them, just not a wedding cake. He simply could not condone something against his belief system. This had absolutely NOTHING to do with who these people were as individuals (individual merit).

If you want to say this is the same as racism, you're showing your ignorance. Racism allows one to deem someone as a lesser being based on the color of their skin and/or their heritage. In NO way did the baker attack the gay couples individual human rights or think of himself in higher esteem. Pull your heads out of your stubborn, indoctrinated, inculcated a$$'s and see this for what it is please.... This is an attack on freedom, under the guise of freedom. It's so utterly ironic and blatant it's not even funny.

I feel desperately sorry for mankind as a whole. This is a train, I'm afraid, no one is going to be able to stop.

In closing, let me just add that I don't agree with the baker's decision, as clearly the couple is going to get married regardless if he provides them a cake or not; however I'm not so jaded as to not understand doing something on principle alone. We are all individuals who should be allowed to hold up our own ideals with or without the consent of the public (it's none of their business). Clearly the stipulation is, as long as it doesn't cause anyone unnecessary pain and/or suffering.

a reply to: Aedaeum

Also what people do not understand that the baker would NOT make cakes for same-sex ceremony FOR ANYONE, be they gay or straight.

The baker will still refuse to make such a cake for STRAIGHT person.

originally posted by: Aedaeum
Incredible that those siding with the gay couple can't wrap their minds around the idea that there was no discrimination going on at all; thus making the ruling an illegal attack on the bakers rights.

In every recent case Christians tried to use their belief as reason to deny gay marriage, they were shot down.

Religious belief does not have standing against gay marriage.

So there you go.

a reply to: Annee

In every recent case Christians tried to use their belief as reason to deny gay marriage, they were shot down.

Religious belief does not have standing against gay marriage.

What does that have to do with his post?

This is about that baker refusing to make a cake for same-sex ceremony.

No discrimination has taken place.

a reply to: Annee

I'm not talking about gay marriage as the issue here. The issue is, the baker has the right to deny service based on his own personal beliefs, as long as they don't infringe on the other persons human rights. As far as Christians trying to ban gay marriage; that was over before it even began. We live in a free country, which upholds our human rights, which means we are able to be who we are. If you are gay, you should be able to get married because that is your own human right. Religion likes to think it holds stake in how people conduct themselves, but when you submit yourself to a government (which upholds equality as its basis to preserve rights), that kind of control is as a fart in the wind.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Annee

In every recent case Christians tried to use their belief as reason to deny gay marriage, they were shot down.

Religious belief does not have standing against gay marriage.

What does that have to do with his post?

This is about that baker refusing to make a cake for same-sex ceremony.

No discrimination has taken place.

Simple. Legal decisions are currently being made that religion can not be used as an excuse to discriminate against gay marriage.

Uh yeah! Keep trying to convince there was no discrimination.

a reply to: Annee

Uh yeah! Keep trying to convince there was no discrimination.

OK.

Will the baker make the cake for same-sex ceremony if the person is straight and is:

-doing it as a joke
-to celebrate
-wanting the cake as a gift to his/her gay friend
-a relative to the gay person
-ANY reason really

If you said no, then is that a discrimination against that straight person?

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Annee

Uh yeah! Keep trying to convince there was no discrimination.

OK.

Will the baker make the cake for same-sex ceremony if the person is straight and is:

-doing it as a joke
-to celebrate
-wanting the cake as a gift to his/her gay friend
-a relative to the gay person
-ANY reason really

If you said no, then is that a discrimination against that straight person?

He makes cakes. It's that simple.

Why someone wants a cake is none of his business.

He can believe whatever he wants. But, he can't use that belief not to make a cake.

a reply to: Annee

FINE.

However, no discrimination has taken place. That's the point!

oh and...

But, he can't use that belief not to make a cake.

YES HE CAN!!! As been pointed out many many times in this thread.

Do you think he will make a cake with dildo on the top of it for anyone? Why or why not?

originally posted by: undo
a reply to: Gryphon66

i don't think anything short of Jesus himself, could have a centrally controlled government that actually didn't decay into an orwellian nightmare

Even a government headed by Jesus himself would fall apart. Simply because the Republicans would be against him from day one. Feed the poor, Heal the sick, love your enemy way too much hippy socialist stuff for the Republicans.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien

FINE.

However, no discrimination has taken place.

One question.

Why do you insist on believing that?

Can somebody, maybe a lawyer here, answer me this question?
Can they force a church, synagogue or any religious body to have a gay marriage ceremony in their house of worship?
And if not, why not?

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Annee

FINE.

However, no discrimination has taken place. That's the point!

Yes there was.
He said he didn't want to bake the cake.
Why didn't he want to bake the cake?
He cried it was against his faith.
This was the sole reason for not baking the cake that makes it discrimination.
A business cannot use faith for the reason to deny service to a person in Colorado based on a persons sexual preference.

a reply to: Annee

Believe what?

As people have pointed out (even those who are on gay couple's side) in this thread many times, the baker can make specific cakes for ALL or NO ONE at all. No discrimination there.

a reply to: andr3w68

OK, let's re-examine the fact... The baker didn't refuse service because the men were gay. He refused service because the men ordered a celebratory cake for a same-sex marriage. If the gay men ordered a cake for a birthday party, there would not have been a problem because God teaches us to love and greet all persons including our enemies -- yes, even our wicked, corrupt national leaders. But... a Christian, a bible believing Christian, should always refuse to participate in anti-Christian behavior. Therefor, as Christianity goes, contributing to the celebration of an unchristian marriage would be against God. So no, he should not have just baked them the cake.

Why would the gay couple still want him to? I wouldn't be worried about the baker tampering with my food, but I'd want to find someone who is happy for my fiancé and me.

This is another case of intolerance in the name of tolerance. OK, gay people can get married in several states now, cool, but don't tread on other peoples' rights to establish your own. The courts in Colorado ordered the baker to turn his back on his faith in Christ. I for one pray he does NOT comply, for we are to obey all the laws of the land UNLESS they go against the laws of God.

a reply to: buster2010

As it has been asked many times in this thread. WOULD the baker make a cake for same-sex ceremony for a STRAIGHT person?

YES or NO?

originally posted by: Willtell
Can somebody, maybe a lawyer here, answer me this question?
Can they force a church, synagogue or any religious body to have a gay marriage ceremony in their house of worship?
And if not, why not?

Pastors, Rabbis, Ministers, Priests are not required to marry anyone they don't want to.

Sometimes marriages are denied because of divorce, domestic violence, or even if the clergy thinks the couple is too young.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien

Do you think he will make a cake with dildo on the top of it for anyone? Why or why not?

You're reaching. There are bakeries that advertise novelty cakes and will make whatever you want.

This baker made wedding cakes.

He can not deny something he makes for other customers.

Now he makes no wedding cakes. That's equality.

a reply to: buster2010

A business cannot use faith for the reason to deny service to a person in Colorado based on a persons sexual preference.

Then Colorado has a problem on its hands because a Christian cannot disobey the laws of God to comply with conflicting laws of the land.

Also, discrimination has taken place against the baker too. How can you not recognize that? As explained in another post, he didn't refuse service because they were gay -- a birthday cake would have been fine. He refused service because it was for a gay wedding. According to the faith, he would have been going against God, i.e, it's a violation of sacred values (religion). What happened to the freedom of religion? Shouldn't that be a concern to non-Christians too?