Pope Francis says he would baptise aliens: 'The doors of the Catholic Church are open to everyone'

How was possible Jesus the Son of God not to leave a historic trace in 30 years if He indeed lived in Nazareth all the time, except for the time in Egypt? They didn't travel so much at that time. Was he absent from that land, and even from planet Earth? Or if He was on planet Earth, wasn't He helped much more by the angels (ET) including for transport to and from Egypt? May be India? I do not advocate the Indian version or any other version, I just put out the fact we know nothing of Jesus in that time. When he comes to Jordan river, He is already mature prophet. Perhaps He was since childhood. We don't know. But even after baptism in Jordan until the Crucifixion we have sporadic episodes and not Chronicles of 3.5 years life. The 3 synoptic gospels seem to be copied from one another or from one same source. They are not written by the apostles or their disciples Mark and Luke. The first physical documents date late 2nd and 3rd centuries. (pls don't ask me what is a physical document - that is the papyrus or tablet, the oldest found). Jesus didn't write a line, neither any of his disciples. Or if they did, those scratches are not preserved. Were the disciples of Jesus'disciples so ignorant for the testimony of Jesus' life? Or was it all destroyed by Romans etc who selectively retold certain story only?

The ET component is absolutely necessary if we have an archangel Gabriel at the Annunciation - the Incarnation of the Son of God. Our religion is Extraterrestrial. It is not "terrestrial". God dwells in "heaven" or "sky" and the word is just the same in the Latin languages. Nobody until now has described what "heaven" means. I talked of cosmology models in another thread, there is a good article in wikipedia. Certainly the heaven is not after the last cloud of atmosphere, as the people imagined at that time. If our religion is extra- terrestrial by origin and by its main episodes (Jesus goes back to heaven ina cloud, or ET ship?), then what's wrong to consider all extraterrestrials participants in God's grand design? It is wrong only for fanatics who want the things the same as Middle ages. Not even as in first centuries. That would not stand. But you should ask yourselves what use the negative ET have with that agenda in the mind of the fanatics. Because they don't plant that agenda for many centuries without a clear goal - for themselves. Perhaps they are among that 1/3 of celestial beings who after all followed/will follow Satan and his angels (Revelation 12). Be careful whom you choose to follow. If you choose to follow Middle ages agenda or Constantine agenda, you may be sure it is not the same of the early Christians.

So, where is Jesus and where are His angels? In a non-substantiated heaven in clouds? Or "My Father has been working until now, and I have been working." John 5:17
New King James Version (NKJV)) In unending mission until now for somewhat less than 2000 years among countless planets in the vast universe. We are invited in that mission. The pope just formulated it in the way not to be rejected outright by fanatics. "What If Martians come". The ET are already on Earth and they have means of transportation. It depends on our good will to "go and baptize all the universe" as Jesus mandated to all of us in His last words before His ascension from this planet. Think about it, you who call yourselves disciples and may be missionaries of Jesus Christ! You who want the Church to continue beyond the apparent crisis on earth that may end this or that way. Do you really want the Church to continue after our natural lifespan?

a reply to: 2012newstart
You make some good points 2012newstart. 1 just likes to see the open-mindedness demonstrated by the VATICAN as opposed to doom and fear of what IS reality in its more objective forms...

As far as deceptions placed upon the consciousness of many here with religious influences distracting and degrading many from acknowledging beyond man.
1 is aware, it is why caution is within the steps forward taken by my SOUL/SPIRIT/INTERNAL ENERGY (H.S.) to prevent as best possible imposterfaker deception upon the. So cautious but allowing space for learning new things/remembering old things or change is how 1 operates.

Was/is there some hidden non native negative influence affecting man, not sure and don't like to point fingers. But further in-depth compiled religious research from ALL* religions may provide better answers as well as direction.

Question is do any feel religions or religious like activities go on beyond EA*RTH? and maybe its just part of a process to awaken many to who Truly may be the Guides or Overseers...

To 1 the VATICAN knows some past deeds that it may not condone today or be happy with being associated with. But at least they are trying to keep the LORDs presence within the consciousness of man.

What would happen if the LORD/GOD was erased from mankind's consciousness would the world spin better or worst for man? 1 wonders... will mankind be safer or in danger the species cannot even fathom?

originally posted by: BO XIAN

originally posted by: uncommitted
. . .
You said that this wouldn't have been heard from the Vatican 10 - 20 years ago. Although I appreciate Pope Francis initiated this particular one, I've yet to see any evidence from the relatively modern age where any quotes legitimately attributed to the Vatican say they absolutely do not believe in the possibility of ET life - not one, yet a lot of people assume otherwise.

I definitely agree with you on that, seems like a real down to earth guy.

Although... lol... I would love there to be some crazy underlying meaning.

.

The Vatican Observatory officials have been INCREASINGLY AND INCREMENTALLY seeding into the public awareness, the notion that the Vatican will take this stance for a decade or more.

It is a hideous thing.

It is like openly inviting demonic forces to hold a Black Mass in St Peter's.

It's like nothing of the sort. You have to live with your own paranoia, why try and spread it on everyone else? The Vatican since at least the 18th Century has never, not once said there is no possibility of life elsewhere - they doesn't mean they think there is, but they are open minded to the possibility. I'd love you to prove me wrong on that with an extremely clear quote from someone in a position to make such a statement - not someone who happens to live near someone else.

a reply to: Ophiuchus 13

Thank you Ophiuchus!
Your points are as good or better and I'd like to have an answer to them...

Meanwhile, let me put forward that: If Jesus didn't sit on a cloud for all those 1980 years after His ascension but still worked for His Father's plans throughout the Universe, it is more likely than not that Jesus would have met other beings on planets of His choice. Perhaps in far away distant galaxies that our telescopes have not reached yet, because He knows we couldn't possibly go there even by the ET tech... I don't know. However hypothetical that leaves the door open for more than one church, for thousands churches established by Jesus on the planets he visited after his resurrection on Earth. That might interest Vatican enough to discuss it. But you see Jesus is not the one who will take away the mission of His Church on Earth. The opposite, He gave that mission in His last words, and that doesn't mean to baptize every Chinese who doesn't want it. Sure our galactic neighborhood is our own missionary zone. It is we who have to baptize Grey, Pleiadians, etc if they want that. Perhaps we will be given a full length record of the life of Jesus (you will need 33 years to watch it or listen to it). That info is preserved in the Universe via waves that spread at speed of light or may be waves we still don't know about. If all the TV programs are preserved as signal in the near space since the beginning of radio and TV era, then... Then the ET from our neighborhood know the story of Jesus' life better than we do and without any historical refits. What they don't have though are the sacraments.

It would be nice if the discussion started by the Pope himself doesn't end there. If bishops and priests and common Christians from all churches start to develop that and get ready for the mission Jesus wanted them to do. Perhaps that's what the ET wait for to appear.

With or without cataclysm awaiting the Earth. I don't know which scenario we are following now, after 2012 fail to materialize. Changed timelines? Let me not speak of that here and now.

Ophiuchus, and all, let we all be open for new scenarios. Let the churches be. I try to be as much as I can.

originally posted by: iamhobo

Pope Francis has said that he would be willing to baptise aliens if they came to the Vatican, asking “who are we to close doors” to anyone - even Martians.

Human arrogance has no limits...

a reply to: SpaceGoatFarts

Those who know me best declare I score high on such measures.

Evidently you missed the part about Yeshua driving the money changers out of the Temple with a cat of 9 tails.

a reply to: 2012newstart

Perhaps these verses have been torn out of your Bible:

Galatians 1:8
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Galatians 1:7-9

Galatians 1:9
As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Galatians 1:8

New Living Translation (NLT)

8 Let God’s curse fall on anyone, including us or even an angel from heaven, who preaches a different kind of Good News than the one we preached to you

Some things are crucial.

Taking theological information as valid from fallen angels is hideous, blasphemous, deadly. . . . as well as tremendously unBiblical.

It is interesting to see how much more DEEPLY AND INTENSELY the GREAT DECEPTION has taken root since the last time I discussed such hereon.

That's fast.

Clearly the chute to hell has been oiled and greased excessively.

.

a reply to: uncommitted

1 John 4:2
Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

1 John 4:3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

1 John 4:2-3

New Living Translation (NLT)

2 This is how we know if they have the Spirit of God: If a person claiming to be a prophet[a] acknowledges that Jesus Christ came in a real body, that person has the Spirit of God. 3 But if someone claims to be a prophet and does not acknowledge the truth about Jesus, that person is not from God. Such a person has the spirit of the Antichrist, which you heard is coming into the world and indeed is already here.

Those who acknowledge the Truth about Yeshua on ATS seem to be rather sparse . . . and seemingly increasingly shouted down and off threads.

Interesting.

a reply to: 2012newstart

What a pile of balderdash about the text.

Perhaps your sources are hopelessly biased, poor and dated.

There are much earlier copies of the Gospels--plenty within 50-90 years of the events.

Josh McDowell and others have documented such things well.

originally posted by: BO XIAN
a reply to: 2012newstart

Perhaps these verses have been torn out of your Bible:

Galatians 1:8
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Galatians 1:7-9

Galatians 1:9
As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Galatians 1:8

New Living Translation (NLT)

8 Let God’s curse fall on anyone, including us or even an angel from heaven, who preaches a different kind of Good News than the one we preached to you

Some things are crucial.

Taking theological information as valid from fallen angels is hideous, blasphemous, deadly. . . . as well as tremendously unBiblical.

It is interesting to see how much more DEEPLY AND INTENSELY the GREAT DECEPTION has taken root since the last time I discussed such hereon.

That's fast.

Clearly the chute to hell has been oiled and greased excessively.

.

Bo, that's why the pope said he baptize them if they asked...apparently the pope doesn't believe there are martians. I don't think aliens actually count as angels because they would still be fleshly. And if there are, and God created them, then maybe God revealed Himself to them. We don't know, because this is the planet we were assigned to.

I think this planet is what we should be concerned about.

If the writers of the Torah and Tanakh really believed there were aliens, then there would be more references, but there simply aren't. That Ezekiel's wheel within a wheel, could have been anything, we really don't know. We weren't there and there was no other description given.

People read all the things about Nephilim, however, these men were apparently well-known when they were on the planet, because the Bible says "giants were in the land, men of renown", that means they did something that made them famous. But the word is giants. But whoever they were, they were famous. Perhaps they were written about and those writings had been lost by the time Moses came along.

I looked up the word, it does not seem to be Sumerian, but Canaanite.

Nephil

There may be some connection to Anak, the father of the Anakim or the Amorites. They would have been Ba'al worshipers.

originally posted by: BO XIAN
a reply to: SpaceGoatFarts

Those who know me best declare I score high on such measures.

Evidently you missed the part about Yeshua driving the money changers out of the Temple with a cat of 9 tails.

You mean "your friends".

I'm talking about your relationships toward the rest of the world, like the people you disagree with on an internet forum. Don't they also deserve your patience and open-minded and understanding you?

Anyone not sharing your interpretation of the scriptures or even your religion is just plain wrong? That's the kind of vibe you give in your posts.


Also you are fear-mongering about aliens, WWIII and the end times. Typical stuff from an American mixing his religion with conspiracy (thus why so common on ATS). Why would you spread fear and not love?


What do you consider the most important as a Christian; the Bible or the words and actions you offer to the world?

It's not a trick question, I know it's a fundamental difference between many Catholics and Protestants and that totally explains why you don't really understand them and think they are heretics.

a reply to: BO XIAN

Paul's writings also do not date back to Paul's time but are "found later". The oldest manuscripts are usually "part of...a letter". So we assume it existed virtually but only a part of it is found. Much later the other parts. Strange.
If something is entitled to Paul that doesn't mean automatically Paul wrote it. It could be the Roman pagan priests as I explained already. Letter to Hebrews and Acts changed authors after investigation. If they changed it once, they could change it again.

Would you please provide a link to a document dated back to 50-90 AD? I'd be glad to see it and to correct my views about that.
Oh you say 50-90 years from the events that would make 83 - 123 AD already nobody was alive. Still it is interesting to see a photocopy. Because I PROVIDED a link to Apocalypse 1-2 preserved from late 2nd century (like 170-190 AD) and that is the earliest found document of the entire Apocalypse of John. I did so in another thread, it wil take me a time to repeat that work (for what purpose or benefit?) The document's photo is uploaded to Wikipedia, along with other papiruses and someone may find them. I don't say I have found every ancient document of every part of the Gospel. Archaeology is something that is updated constantly. Tomorrow we may indeed have a document dated back to 50 AD when the apostles would have been on Earth. It is crucial. Without hard evidence we have only elaborated thoughts and arbitrary judgments stamped first by Constantine then by others may be worse than him. Sorry but it is it.

P.S. your arguments will be stronger if you cut off the demonisation part. If you provide solid arguments, why not to listen to them, either I or anyone else who reads it.



Furthermore, the play with anathemas was pretty useful ina time of illiteracy when the emperor-supported hi priests wanted to kill the soul. They were not satisfied with the killing of the body, that was done by burning since early ages of "Christian Roman empire". The history played ironic on those anathemas. First North Africa was invaded and from flourishing Christian land it turned to bloody Muslim fundamentalist land for eons. Then Byzantium fell to Muslims. The Western countries all in the "Christendom" didn't end bloody conflicts all the time of history. Finally, on Vatican 2 the anathemas of 1054 between Rome and Constantinople were lifted. Today no one puts anathemas. So I doubt that the historical Paul who should have lived shortly after Jesus would say "anathema" in a time when there wasn't any structural and political power of early Christian communities who were Jewish. It just doesn't fit. As many other moments in both Gospels and Letters, that apparently are added much later, centuries later. I would not believe until I see manuscript dated physically back to the time of Paul and Peter. All the rest could be fabricated. Didn't I speak of martyred entire communities? Why so? For the Romans that would be unprofitable. The explanation I suppose is: those communities kept holding original teaching that the Roman agenda didn't envision to be preserved in the so shaped "Christian religion". Long before Constantine stamped the final draft. It is a process and it took centuries. Just put on your time scale the End of the Cold War until now. Or the Cuban crisis until now. Here we talk of centuries in illiteracy, very slow transportation, tyranny etc. The words of the Caesar were called "Gospel". Then the word was taken by the Christians. The list is long. Sure Jesus didn't establish THAT. Yes I could use caps too if there is anyone to reflect on it. I bet there is.

originally posted by: BO XIAN
a reply to: uncommitted

1 John 4:2
Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

1 John 4:3
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

1 John 4:2-3

New Living Translation (NLT)

2 This is how we know if they have the Spirit of God: If a person claiming to be a prophet[a] acknowledges that Jesus Christ came in a real body, that person has the Spirit of God. 3 But if someone claims to be a prophet and does not acknowledge the truth about Jesus, that person is not from God. Such a person has the spirit of the Antichrist, which you heard is coming into the world and indeed is already here.

Those who acknowledge the Truth about Yeshua on ATS seem to be rather sparse . . . and seemingly increasingly shouted down and off threads.

Interesting.

You always do this don't you? Why don't you answer the question I actually asked? That Biblical quote mentions NOTHING (see, we can both do caps) about the potential of life not from this Earth. It's also not a quote from the Vatican from the last 300 years or so which is what I asked for.

Please provide meaningful input or don't bother.

Put yourselves in the aliens place:
Imagine us going to Mars and finding bustling cities and what not of beings far less intelligent than us. Here comes some religious alien running to you, wanting you to sign on. Would you abandon everything you believe and do it? lol Or would you shoot him with your disinigration beam gun?

originally posted by: Fylgje
Here comes some religious alien running to you, wanting you to sign on.

There's a big difference between wanting and offering. I don't think the Pope ever said he wants aliens to convert. Just saying...

originally posted by: Fylgje
Put yourselves in the aliens place:
Imagine us going to Mars and finding bustling cities and what not of beings far less intelligent than us. Here comes some religious alien running to you, wanting you to sign on. Would you abandon everything you believe and do it? lol Or would you shoot him with your disinigration beam gun?

How do we know life on other planets is more advanced or intelligent?

Just because Ancient Aliens says so doesn't make it so, because they haven't actually been on other planets. This is a huge assumption on our part.

Question...we know that to build things, we must have opposable thumbs, but most alien pictures I have seen, there are no opposable thumbs. So how do they build things without the necessary biological mechanism required? And why would they need multi-colored lights on their crafts? For us to see them?

We are advanced because of our thumbs. Without them, we couldn't build things.

Doesn't he know the heavenly host wont need baptized.

originally posted by: Stormdancer777
Doesn't he know the heavenly host wont need baptized.

Did you miss the quote "If they ask"?

He's not forcing it on them, he is saying that if they ask, then yes. But it's a joke on his part. Don't you get it?

He was trying to be funny about a question that has been asked a gadzillion times to priests, ministers and other Christians. My goodness people, stop asking the question of Christians if you don't want the answer. It has been a trick question all along, he answered the trick question.

Do you people really think he was serious?

a reply to: 2012newstart

to preserve the link...
Of course here it is! The Roman pagan priests put in the mouth of the historic Paul the words of anathema if an Angel talks a different gospel...why? Because they knew very well at one point in history their faked gospels and letters will be exposed, by those ET who served Jesus and not by their false gods-evil-aliens who fabricated much inside the books. Why otherwise Paul would speak like that? Why the doubt an angel would like to change what Paul says? In the years to follow the Resurrection, everyone would know the truth because everyone of the elderly would remember the events. Paul himself is nearly the age of Jesus, little younger. Paul doesn't need to call for angels and to say they were hypothetically wrong if they say otherwise. Were there angels who said otherwise in the time of Paul? Were there angels who testified the events were different and were recorded wrongly? That way of reasoning brings the idea of an early split between the angels accompanying Jesus and at least Paul may be other apostles or disciples. Thus we read of an angel who freed Peter from prison, but no angels saved anyone during the time of persecutions later. Does it mean somehow the apostles or some of them did not comprehend/accept the divine intervention and the kingdom of God in real terms in history, and instead they rejected that help that could turn the history at that point?


I favor this explanation instead of the above:
Not the historical Paul, but the created image of Paul that appears in much later composed "letters", says that. We do not discuss real historical Peter, Paul John. We discuss their created images later based on what remained written, and it dates much later than their actual historical lifespan. Sure some part of the writings is true, but another is not. I can't say which part is which. But I can understand not everything written dates back to the customs in the time of Jesus. It dates centuries later to customs of Christian communities. It is especially apparent in the Paul's letters that differ quite much from the Gospel and introduce Roman-Greek customs.

Then we talk of agenda that did all of that for a purpose. Not to record the life of Jesus but to plant an agenda in the minds of believers for centuries to follow. Because those who composed them, thought of more than one generation. Because they were evil ET or their servants, the Roman gods and their priests. Only above human mind could plan it for 1900 years or more ahead of time. They did it. Now we eat their fruit.

All that wording doesn't bring to the table the true story of Jesus who lived on planet Earth 33 thirty three and a half years. We don't have chronological record of his life. We have selected parts, for a purpose. Since nothing can disappear,the words of Jesus are preserved not only in the Heavenly kingdom up there, but also in the material physical Universe where we are living in. They will appear, be it in the form of a papyrus or otherwise.

It is very ill understood saga if we start demonizing the angels who accompanied Jesus throughout his entire earthly life, whos erved in Egypt and in the desert, and who are only briefly mentioned in the texts after their Roman purge. Then we side not with Paul but with those who put in his mouth the above words, and those are the same who started burning people and put anathemas to the extend to divide churches in early centuries, and then to fall prey to Muslims and others as consequence. It is not me who will prove anything, but what is presented as true image of apostles is just an impostor image. It is further proven by absurd theological interpretations that burned even more people in the Middle ages and justified forceful christianization of nations. Let alone the crusaders. Let alone the religious wars. It is an absurd that has nothing to do with Jesus and His teaching, even that part that remained to our days after fierce unscrupulous and cruel persecution of the word and its living bearers. This is NOT what Jesus seeded on Earth. Why did Jesus allow that to happen, when He saw it in advance in the future? Sure it has to do with the free will of sinful men who chose the course of history. At one point there will be intervention though. And because we speak of ETs on both sides, Jesus' side and the other side of Roman gods, then we should keep in mind both sides are smart enough to plan for thousands years ahead of time. Perhaps this time is now, hope so. Not necessarily the time of Second Coming. If you consider 2 Peter, he speaks of an event of fire that will consume the earth, different from: Second Coming when Jesus will reign on Earth, or from rapture when the Church goes up and the Trib starts down. The 2 Peter event is neither of them. It is not the big end of the Universe either, spoken of in the final chapters of Apocalypse. (assuming it is recorded as it should be) 2 Peter event is only burning the planet not the Universe. Because Peter speaks of New Heaven (understand sky, stars) and New Earth (planet). At 2 Peter the righteous ones will be transported to a new planet under new sky. It is not the end of the world neither the Second Coming. Does it precede the Second Coming or it is after that? It likely precedes it, because the Second Coming of Jesus on Earth could happen only after the evangelization of the Universe has taken place. Not all ETs who come to Earth believe in Jesus. We still have a work to do. Pity many Christians do not understand that. Good the pope finally said it! May be the final pope on Earth before 2 Peter event. I don't know and it is hard to predict with failure of prophecy like Fatima.