In defense of lazy Employees

When I worked in local lumber factories, there was always a click at work I called the kiss ass click. This is how they worked.

1. They would get to work ridiculously early before shift starts.

2. They would stay ridiculously late after the shift had ended.

3. They would kiss copious amounts of ass to the supervisors and shift leaders. I mean obvious stuff like bringing them fish they had caught, helping them move when they are off, laughing at every lame joke they say and just generally brown-nosing in the most nauseating way.

4. They will snitch on other employees in a heartbeat if you do or say something that the company would not like.

Now me? I would get to work maybe 1-5 minutes before my shift started. I would leave as soon as the clock said it was quitting time. I would take all of every 15 minute break the company said I could, and I would never get in a hurry when I worked running around like a chicken like my head cut off like the kiss ass click did. I never said anything to the boss or anyone in authority that was not work related. And you know what? I was paid the same as the kiss ass click was. Why the hell should I go above and beyond the call of duty to work for people that would put my nuts on the chopping block to save a dollar anyway? I still made my little 8-9 bucks an hour just like they did.

One year the factory I was working made over a Billion dollars profit. Know what they did for us employees that made that possible for them? They gave us nice little shiny keychains that said a billion dollars on it. As soon as the supervisor handed them to us I dropped mine in the trashcan and walked away utterly offended.

So to all the "take pride in your work" folks on here saying you should totally bust your ass for any of these companies that would screw over their workers in a heartbeat, which is pretty much all of them, I say give me one good reason to. While you may still find some mom and pop establishments that would pay a good wage, those places are getting to be less and less to the point where they are rapidly going extinct, and the big corporations and retail outlets get to be more and more large and powerful. Lets face it, the bigger a company is, the more likely they will screw over their employees. Ever hear of anyone loving their job that worked at Wal mart? MickyD's? etc.?

If your employer / supervisor is allowing you to freeload like that, you and your company deserve to suffer when the one or two good heads keeping it afloat and holding your slack get sick and quit. It will happen, or they'll get sick and fired cause no scapegoat is good if he's not there to take the brunt, right?

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: James1982

So one day you could be the employer? or are now? would you accept a lazy employee? would you just accept his lazyness because you may be paying him/her minimum wage? even If you paid more to them and they still thought they were not getting paid enough and were lazy would you still accept it?.

Buy buying the businesses product I am paying the business owner. What if I don't accept their way of doing things? I still want the product so I have to pay for it but that doesn't mean I'm accepting of their business practices. ISP's would be a good example here. They're monopolies, they stole billions from us to build their network, then they charge us to use the network we gave them, and on top of that they spy on us. Yet if I want access to the internet (as I need for my job skills) I have to pay for access.

Payment doesn't mean approval.

originally posted by: Cancerwarrior
So to all the "take pride in your work" folks on here saying you should totally bust your ass for any of these companies that would screw over their workers in a heartbeat, which is pretty much all of them, I say give me one good reason to. While you may still find some mom and pop establishments that would pay a good wage, those places are getting to be less and less to the point where they are rapidly going extinct, and the big corporations and retail outlets get to be more and more large and powerful. Lets face it, the bigger a company is, the more likely they will screw over their employees. Ever hear of anyone loving their job that worked at Wal mart? MickyD's? etc.?

Pay is irrelevant. Either you have a good work ethic or you don't.

Just because the corporation is going to screw you over in the future or isn't paying you enough isn't a reason to do a bad job.

a reply to: boymonkey74

You sound like a sharp and caring manager.

Congrats. That's exceedingly sensible and a great humility road as well. I'm impressed. Just don't tell boymonkey! LOL.

I suspect you had far higher loyalty as well as typically much more responsible workers with your stance and modeling such an attitude and behaviors. Right?

Some experts assert that it takes a company employing a new person TWO YEARS before the employee begins to make money for the company. TURN-OVER IS COSTLY but is often ignored by even big corporations who should definitely know better.

Thx thx.
.

a reply to: Cancerwarrior

3M Company has long had a reputation for treating their employees fairly if not well. I hope that's still the case.

The yearly surveys of such things are often telling. The same companies year after year float to the top and tend to stay there.

The liberal Home fix-it big box store has a reputation for being horrid. Small wonder their customers also tend to cite their employees as insensitive, unavailable etc.

The the other such store has a reputation for being better but is still quite calloused toward their employees. In NC, they even do not allow them a break for 4 hours on their feet at the registers. I thought that was illegal. Sheesh.

When I catch managers of such places on the floor, I usually give them a piece of my mind on such matters.

a reply to: James1982

I agree with you. What the employer does to the employee should be reciprocated. However most don't see it this way. The believe the bull line that a hard days work is it's own reward. This is only the case when its what a human being WANTS to do.

No one takes a job that includes being abused, berated, and taken advantage of unless they are desperate. Certain types of employers count on this to destroy any dignity the employee might have. Just like abusers they enforce and reinforce the message "where else you gonna go?"

This is a pet peeve of mine. It is an epidemic in the US in my opinion.

I am one of the long term unemployed. I feel like there is a black cloud over me because I can not find work, however when I do work, I do not complain, I do my job and then some if there is nothing better to do, I am not lazy. I make sure thing get done when I'm there, I suppose it is in my nature.

Every job I have ever worked there are always many co-workers who are lazy, those who will do the bare minimum and complain the entire time. Somehow those types can keep a job, and I get laughed at when I go to a job interview.

One thing I have noticed about the lazy types that can keep a job is they know how to climb the social ladder in a work place, and/or they have squeaky clean credit and criminal records.

originally posted by: Aazadan
Pay is irrelevant. Either you have a good work ethic or you don't.

Just because the corporation is going to screw you over in the future or isn't paying you enough isn't a reason to do a bad job.

Used to believe all that and worked my butt off till I burnt out.

A lot of business fields are basically a massive game of Who's Line is it Anyway?, the promotions are made up, and hard work doesn't matter. If the boss likes drinking with you, if you make them look good, if you appear sharp and on the ball you will be promoted. If you look stressed, flat out, and work like a machine it actually counts against you.

Once you notice all that it has an effect on you.

Your work ethic is as much to do with why you work hard as it is to do with some mystical property your soul possesses. It can be for family, promotion, more money, religion, loyalty, achievement, competitive spirit, being a destructive workaholic ... but you have to have some reason to do it.

A lot of directors etc ... waffle on about work ethic when what they really mean to say is, 'I as your leader have given my staff no reason to bother doing anything productive and I just noticed twenty five minutes ago.'

I used to be one of those employees that worked hard and believed in giving your all while on the clock. I'd look at the guy/gal who was just doing the bear minimum and wonder how they could do that.

Let's just say after continuously being overlooked and under-appreciated by ALL of my employers I now hold the opposite view. How can anyone in their right mind give more than is absolutely necessary to their employer? The more you care about your work the more stressed and unhappy you'll be overall.

a reply to: Aazadan

Pay is irrelevant. Either you have a good work ethic or you don't.

Just because the corporation is going to screw you over in the future or isn't paying you enough isn't a reason to do a bad job.

Did you really just say that pay is irrelevant?

And who said anything about doing a bad job? I said I never went beyond what I was supposed to do. Why should I? When I worked at the lumbermill and made 8 bucks an hour I did only the bare minimum. When I started surveying I went from making 28,000 a year to 65,000 a year right off the bat. You know what happened? I worked alot harder for those folks because I was getting paid more. I was the crew Instrument operator within a year and a party chief within 3 years which is pretty fast for someone to move up. Of course they were a small family owned company, but still their workers and knowledgeable folks were rewarded with higher per diem and hourly pay.

Do you know what I saw all of the hard workers get rewarded with when I worked factory jobs? They got to do more hard work while getting paid the same crappy wage.

Money is the only reason 90 percent of people get up at the buttcrack of dawn and drag ass to their crappy job to put up with crap from some power tripping bossman or rude vulgar public for the entire day just to keep the lights on and the kids decked out in Dora the explorer crap until the day finally comes when they cant take it anymore and they either shove a shotgun down their throat or stay on so much medication that they just work and drool on themselves until they drop dead.

If an employer pays minimum wage then they should expect minimum effort from their employees you have to pay for quality it’s a fact of life.

You have to pay extra for skilled loyal workers with a good work ethic just like you have to pay extra for anything of quality in life if you think your business deserves the minimum then go ahead and pay the minimum just be ready for the minimum in return and no extra.

Ah. Has no one on here ever heard the saying "pay peanuts you get monkeys"!!!

a reply to: James1982
I'm self employed and switch between being hardworking when I want to raise cash, or lazy when I want to lay in bed for the odd extra day or two. In my situation no-one is affected by this aside from me, because I always carry out my work as agreed for the payment.

When I used to be employed I was equally lazy or hardworking.
Lazy if I thought I could get away with it, hardworking if I thought it benefited me in some way. I've never really given a toss about the success of any business which has employed me, except for the understanding that if my work is likely to damage the profitability of the company then it would adversly affect me by losing the work. In effect, it is and always has been about me when I'm earning the coin.

I'm known overall as a hard worker and for that reason have pretty much never really been out of work...maybe total of 5 months in 24 years, covering many in-between periods of many different jobs. But I am tactical, and work hard at getting the people who matter to think I'm a hard worker.
It's just business, and I've never been bleating on the hillside like a lost lamb when I've breached an employment agreement (got caught being lazy) and been fired. I made the choice.

I see no problem with people being lazy if they like, just dont bitch when you get called on it.
There are a few blokes who have only done a days work with me but never again because their work rate was not what I wanted. No problem, just someone else will get the work next time. It's all a game really, just a pity so many people's circumstances are such that they feel unable to choose their own rules to play it.

Whoops. Sorry Monkeyboy. It was't personal.

a reply to: crayzeed

The pay I get I would prefer peanuts lol.
Npne taken.

originally posted by: Cancerwarrior
Did you really just say that pay is irrelevant?

I did. I realize others have a different opinion. Mine is that if I'm choosing to work for a company I'm interested in seeing it put out the best product I can help it make. Pay doesn't matter, more money is nice of course but in the grand scheme of things why does it matter?

Short of my own business becoming a success one day I have zero chance at having a savings that matters so... why worry about the pay? Atleast I can make a good product in the meantime.

Do you know what I saw all of the hard workers get rewarded with when I worked factory jobs? They got to do more hard work while getting paid the same crappy wage.

I'm not sure how this is a bad thing. If you didn't want to do the work, then why did you take the job?

Interesting and pertinent topic, OP. Too bad most of the replies missed your point, but here's my take.

There are two aspects to the employee-employer relationship: The pragmatic, economically-driven side, and the human, compassion-driven side. In simpler terms, the selfish view and the martyr view.

The OP is making a case for the first point of view -- the selfish view. Generally, giving away product/services for free will only hurt the bottom line of a business. By the same token, an employee who does more work than required is actually hurting his own bottom line by increasing stress and fatigue, and wasting personal time (which could be used to earn more elsewhere). The exception, for both parties, is when there is promise of future gains in exchange for contemporary a sacrifice. E.g. repeat customers for the employer, or raises for the employee. This mentality can lead to low wages and minimally-productive workers, a cycle that perpetuates just as the OP said. However it also leads to low prices for the consumer and competitive efforts among employees.

On the other end of the spectrum is the martyr view. This view is guided by generosity and compassion. We don't see many employers holding this view, because they don't often last long in the market. Company A pays generous wages to its employees, who happily go above-and-beyond in effort to show their gratitude. Company B comes along offering similar products/services, only they can set prices lower because they pay workers less. Company A then has to either adapt or close its doors.

Though rare in employers, the martyr view is held by many American employees. A large percentage seem to think they are indebted to their employer just for being given a job. Instead of viewing the relationship as a mutually-beneficial contract, these employees look to the employer as a charitable, authoritative distributor of money. Rather than meter their own work output relative to wages received, employees with this mentality pour every ounce of energy into the job regardless of pay. If these people used the same approach when running a hot dog stand, they would say 'I'll accept whatever you will pay, and you can still get all the toppings.'
Sure, they will sell some hot dogs, but there is no question they are short-changing themselves. Just like the customer won't pay much for that hot dog, the employer won't pay more than they have to in order to keep that worker around.

In my opinion, the martyr view on employment was passed down from generations who, after enduring the Great Depression, the Dust Bowl, and World Wars, were genuinely grateful to have any job at all. Don't get me wrong; I admire a strong work ethic and believe it is one of the main reasons the US led the world in production and innovation for so long. Such values should be instilled in children of more fortunate generations, but self-worth and self-assertion also need to be stressed.

As in most social issues, the middle ground is the most sensible. From an employer's standpoint, if you don't incentivize workers properly then you won't likely get all they have to offer. From an employee's standpoint, if you don't work hard, you won't have a chance at advancement.

a reply to: James1982

Advice i frequently give: your next interview with me has already begun.

playing politics is what people do who have too much time on their hands
it works on peter principle type supervisors
unfortunately people who work hard usually don't see the politics coming or participate in it because they are to busy doing the work