Pelosi booed for saying NSA leaker Snowden violated the law!! BOOOOO!!!

reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy
I can't believe this! The government breached the consittution first. He just pointed it out to the american public so that we could take action. If he is jailed then everyone who has lied to the public must be jailed too. Don't they understand we are on the same side and we are paying for it, in blood and money. If congress and the president will do 1 tour in the war zone then they too will have invested more that public service, by the way they are payed very well and the perks add up to a lot.

I don't see what everyone is so outraged about Snowden having broken the law and facing justice for it.

Everyone is so eager to jump to his defense with out looking at the cliff under his feet. Snowden pulled a Manning, and he's going to jail for pretty much the same reason.

To whit:

Neither Manning or Snowden _stopped_ at just the expose'. Both went on to leak/give out/ share more sensitive and classified information to people of foreign nationality. Once they stepped beyond the moral subject matter / material and passed on further secret or confidential information that went beyond the scope of a- the war crime in Manning's case, b- the NSA going beyond what should have been permissible in Snowden's case.

Just because you have a moral imperative to step out of the bounds of the laws regarding secrecy or any other valid laws, you do not have a right to escape justice or skip paying the penalty. If a moral imperative on your behalf gives you the right to commit any crime there is, and gives you a get out of jail free card; what it to say the surviving Boston Bomber cannot validly use the same argument to get out of paying for his crimes.

Just because there is a moral hook to those cases, it does not excuse their crimes.

Go ahead, be angry; but don't expect the government to invalidate the rule of law just because it suits your moral indignation.

M.

is her right hand on crack >.>.........................I'm Cuban so i got every right to say that

reply to post by Moshpet

Just because you have a moral imperative to step out of the bounds of the laws regarding secrecy or any other valid laws, you do not have a right to escape justice or skip paying the penalty.

True, but remember the man is entitled to his day in court.

Then....You may hang him. Until then I would prefer a judge handled it.

Who is trying to step out of bounds?....Sheesh, the man has Rights.

If the people/organisation you swear an oath to turns out to be a bunch of lying cheating sociopaths who have broken the law, do your own oaths still hold?

Originally posted by Moshpet
I don't see what everyone is so outraged about Snowden having broken the law and facing justice for it.

Everyone is so eager to jump to his defense with out looking at the cliff under his feet. Snowden pulled a Manning, and he's going to jail for pretty much the same reason.

To whit:

Neither Manning or Snowden _stopped_ at just the expose'. Both went on to leak/give out/ share more sensitive and classified information to people of foreign nationality. Once they stepped beyond the moral subject matter / material and passed on further secret or confidential information that went beyond the scope of a- the war crime in Manning's case, b- the NSA going beyond what should have been permissible in Snowden's case.

Just because you have a moral imperative to step out of the bounds of the laws regarding secrecy or any other valid laws, you do not have a right to escape justice or skip paying the penalty. If a moral imperative on your behalf gives you the right to commit any crime there is, and gives you a get out of jail free card; what it to say the surviving Boston Bomber cannot validly use the same argument to get out of paying for his crimes.

Just because there is a moral hook to those cases, it does not excuse their crimes.

Go ahead, be angry; but don't expect the government to invalidate the rule of law just because it suits your moral indignation.

M.

edit on 23-6-2013 by Moshpet because: M+A+T+H = 42

How long you are working for NSA?

reply to post by Moshpet

Go ahead, be angry; but don't expect the government to invalidate the rule of law just because it suits your moral indignation.

With all due respect, government has been invalidating rule of law for a while now... when and where it suits them, not us... moral indignation withstanding.

reply to post by starfoxxx

Pelosi is small potatoes. Why don't we start by jailing Dick Cheney and his puppet G.W. Bush? They are at the root of all this and they started wars we never needed.

Originally posted by redoubt
The thing here is that had Bush been president at the time, she would have defended Snowden.

Unlikely. Snowden's actions are not defensible by anyone in Government. He will be spending time as Brad's buddy after his 15 minutes in the limelight.

Originally posted by Moshpet
I don't see what everyone is so outraged about Snowden having broken the law and facing justice for it.

Everyone is so eager to jump to his defense with out looking at the cliff under his feet. Snowden pulled a Manning, and he's going to jail for pretty much the same reason.

To whit:

Neither Manning or Snowden _stopped_ at just the expose'. Both went on to leak/give out/ share more sensitive and classified information to people of foreign nationality. Once they stepped beyond the moral subject matter / material and passed on further secret or confidential information that went beyond the scope of a- the war crime in Manning's case, b- the NSA going beyond what should have been permissible in Snowden's case.

Just because you have a moral imperative to step out of the bounds of the laws regarding secrecy or any other valid laws, you do not have a right to escape justice or skip paying the penalty. If a moral imperative on your behalf gives you the right to commit any crime there is, and gives you a get out of jail free card; what it to say the surviving Boston Bomber cannot validly use the same argument to get out of paying for his crimes.

Just because there is a moral hook to those cases, it does not excuse their crimes.

Go ahead, be angry; but don't expect the government to invalidate the rule of law just because it suits your moral indignation.

M.

edit on 23-6-2013 by Moshpet because: M+A+T+H = 42

So, when is the NSA facing justice for it?

Are they not breaking the law and claiming that it is to protect us just like snowden did?
Odd how you did not even give that any mention given your stance on the circumstances.

reply to post by pteridine

Unlikely. Snowden's actions are not defensible by anyone in Government. He will be spending time as Brad's buddy after his 15 minutes in the limelight.

Oh, I have no doubt. Our government is basically the single most powerful inquisition on the planet. Laws that were 'supposed' to protect whistle blowers have been repeatedly ignored and those who did the whistling have been persecuted. The outcome is very effective; STFU, say nothing or you will pay a price. Fear is a very potent tool.

As for the politics? To even suggest that the red vs. blue, left vs. right play is not applied by either side... is either selective blindness or blind loyalty in action. In fact, I still find it amazing that there are those who still follow one side or the other with such religious fervor.

Snowden told America that they were being spied upon. That's his sin... let the inquisition begin.

Originally posted by whyamIhere
What happened to a fair trial?

Why are our leaders saying a man is guilty without trial?

Had exactly the same thing a few years back when Julian Assange released the cables.
The Australian Prime Minister declared him to be GUILTY !

...only later, did she ask the Australian Federal Police to figure out what crimes he might have comitted, to which they replied he had not actually broken any Australian laws at all.

People just waiting and hoping to see Snowden go down make me sick!!! Talking about Bush, and dick cheney is really asinine at this point....

Pelosi and the rest in DC are a bunch of hypocrites and she is the most hypocritical bitch of them all. What nerve this tyrannical POS has making a speech about Snowden's actions while her and the rest in DC have violated exponentially more laws than Snowden could do in 5 lifetimes.

The scum in DC has the nerve to call his actions treasonous and refer to him as a traitor when they have betrayed their oaths on a daily basis and by doing so have engaged in treasonous acts and made themselves the biggest bunch of traitors in the history of this nation.

I have said it many times on this site and in this instance I cant think of a better quote to apply in this situation.

"Truth is treason in the empire of lies."

Snowden has let a miniscule amount of truth about the treasonous actions of our politicians be known and they call his actions treasonous. Snowden has given us an insiders glimpse of their empire of lies and now he will pay with his life. Perhaps they should look in the mirror before they start pointing fingers.

Originally posted by starfoxxx
People just waiting and hoping to see Snowden go down make me sick!!! Talking about Bush, and dick cheney is really asinine at this point....

Is there anything that doesn't cause you to beat the exclam key to death and make personal attacks on Pelosi? Bush and Cheney instigated all of this. Eddie Snowden got his panties in a twist and decided to spill his guts. He started believing that he was some kind of hero. He likes being important and the center of attention. Now he will live [or not] with the consequences. He doesn't know that he is only an expendable pawn in a big international chess game. When he is no longer useful to other countries, he'll be turned over to the Feds and will get to hang out with Brad Manning for the next 20 years or so.

Originally posted by pteridine
Bush and Cheney instigated all of this.

Actually J Edgar Hoover instigated all of this, our nation has been spying on its citizens for 60+ years its just been done under different disguises through the years. First it was done in the name of searching out communists, then it was done in the name of saving our nation from the divisive "hippies" of the 60's and 70's, now it is to save us from terrorists.

There were some other made up targets in between those but the fact is that this is nothing new, they have just become bolder in their endeavors and have realized that our society's addiction to technology makes it easier for them to do. Yes King George and his henchmen accelerated things but what is going on now is the fruition of an agenda that's over half a century in the making.

Drawing political lines in the sand and pointing partisan fingers is about as useful as urinating into a hurricane. Both parties are equally to blame and they are in fact co-conspirators in the agenda to enslave every man, woman, and child in this nation as well as around the world.

The first and most important step to trying to stop their agenda is to put aside party affiliations, stop being a democrat or republican, and be an American first and foremost.

Originally posted by Shadowphile

Originally posted by Moshpet
/snip
Just because there is a moral hook to those cases, it does not excuse their crimes.

Go ahead, be angry; but don't expect the government to invalidate the rule of law just because it suits your moral indignation.

M.

edit on 23-6-2013 by Moshpet because: M+A+T+H = 42

So, when is the NSA facing justice for it?

Are they not breaking the law and claiming that it is to protect us just like snowden did?
Odd how you did not even give that any mention given your stance on the circumstances.

Not odd, it wasn't the overall theme or topic of the thread. Which from what it looks like, a free ride for the traitor Snowden.

But since you want to go there, yes there should be an investigation held and there likely will be, but not just because Snowden leaked. Likely one of the bigger investigations will be on just how the heck a zero like Snowden could get that information.

Do I expect we'll ever see all the inside view points of those investigations, no, as they are a part of national security.
Will heads proverbial roll, more than likely.

M.

Originally posted by xavi1000

Originally posted by Moshpet
/snip

Just because there is a moral hook to those cases, it does not excuse their crimes.

Go ahead, be angry; but don't expect the government to invalidate the rule of law just because it suits your moral indignation.

M.

edit on 23-6-2013 by Moshpet because: M+A+T+H = 42

How long you are working for NSA?

Durrrrr, yuck, yuck, ha, ha, hello troll.

I don't work for the NSA.

I am a disabled Army Veteran, with my own firm opinions. Don't like my opinion on the subject, bite me.
But don't presume you know me well enough to speak for me.

M.

The guy, joins army where he is expected to kill yet finds it immoral to tap phones. LOL Him leaking is one thing but acting like he is some saint is annoying. Hope he enjoys his privacy in China, Russia where ever he ends up. Who didn't know the NSA was listening to phones from suspected people?

Originally posted by whyamIhere
reply to post by Moshpet

 

Just because you have a moral imperative to step out of the bounds of the laws regarding secrecy or any other valid laws, you do not have a right to escape justice or skip paying the penalty.

True, but remember the man is entitled to his day in court.

Then....You may hang him. Until then I would prefer a judge handled it.

Who is trying to step out of bounds?....Sheesh, the man has Rights.

Oh I want a judge to handle it.
But as it stands every twit with a grudge against the government is trying to make him out as a hero.
I don't, neither he nor Manning stopped at the point where I could defend their actions as heroic.
When you knowingly give out sensitive and secret information or materials to a foreign national, that's not taking a moral stance, that is turning traitorous.

Yes he has rights, but he does not have a get out of jail free card coming either.
What he should get is a fair trail, and the full penalties in accordance with this crimes.

M.