George Zimmerman's attorneys apologize for mischaracterizing evidence

reply to post by MrWendal


Sure on the right or left however if you really want to know you should watch the video of George's walk through not the video where one of the first things his father said was "I don't know which way he went".

Oh and FYI I am 220 6 ft 3 and I could hide in those bushes if I needed to TM wouldn't have had a problem especially with what he was wearing that day.

You can except the info or not just remember that's what the jury will be made aware of and that's what actually matters not what you or I know.

George Zimmerman's attorneys apologize for mischaracterizing evidence

This certainly throws this case up in the air. This was a huge blunder by the defense and could doom Z by allowing the prosecution to examine Zs background and he certainly doesn't want that!!!

I expect Z to fire his defense team and either hire a new one or to avoid a jury trial, throw himself on the mercy of the court and cop a manslaughter plea. Probably the latter.

By copping a plea...he is hoping to get sent to a medium security facility where he might be able to live out his sentence.

reply to post by GrantedBail


I am tired of hearing about people believing this kid was some sweet and innocent kid. He was a pot head. Caused fights at school. And now we have pics on his cell holding a handgun... Sounds like an outstanding kid. The court is deliberately hiding the fact the kid was on drugs and has a violent behavior. Oh and I am sure the cops Photoshopped Z all bloody. Poor kid. Maybe if he acted like a normal person and talked to Z and explained himself this would of never happened. I bet that never happened. This world is not for the weak. You mess up and you could die.

Originally posted by ratpunk

I am tired of hearing about people believing this kid was some sweet and innocent kid.

I am not claiming he was sweet an innocent, cause the truth is, no one is sweet and innocent.

He was a pot head. Caused fights at school. And now we have pics on his cell holding a handgun... Sounds like an outstanding kid.

None if this is relevant to the night he died. He was not in possession of pot. He was not fighting with anyone nor was he in possession of a gun. George Zimmerman could not have known any of these things about Martin, therefor it had no influence on his state of mind at the time Martin was shot.

The court is deliberately hiding the fact the kid was on drugs and has a violent behavior.

They are not hiding it, the fact is it has no bearing at all on the case as I explained above. Bring this up as part of the defense is no different than bringing up a rape victims sexual history as proof that she deserved to be raped.

Maybe if he acted like a normal person and talked to Z and explained himself this would of never happened. I bet that never happened. This world is not for the weak. You mess up and you could die.

So you are suggesting that teenagers stop and talk to total strangers who are following them with a vehicle at night? I am sure pedophiles and kidnappers all across the Nation are applauding your post right now.

Originally posted by ratpunk
reply to post by GrantedBail

 

I am tired of hearing about people believing this kid was some sweet and innocent kid. He was a pot head. Caused fights at school. And now we have pics on his cell holding a handgun... Sounds like an outstanding kid. The court is deliberately hiding the fact the kid was on drugs and has a violent behavior. Oh and I am sure the cops Photoshopped Z all bloody. Poor kid. Maybe if he acted like a normal person and talked to Z and explained himself this would of never happened. I bet that never happened. This world is not for the weak. You mess up and you could die.

Nothing you said can be used as evidence for crime against Trayvon. "This world is not for the weak" Really? So I can walk around carrying my .45 and anyone who makes physical contact with me I can pull it out and put one in them? Again Trayvon's past is brought up, but not Zimmerman's wife beating past. Get real.

Originally posted by Sankari
Let's see how tough this punk is when he's surrounded by a cell full of bigger guys...

You mean other criminals like Trayvon? In my humble opinion, Trayvon shouldn't have been shot. Instead, he should being doing a ten to twenty year stint for his plethora of criminal acts.

I see so a person who has a pattern of drug use and violent behavior involved in a case means nothing? Last I knew the character of person does impact a case were a person claims self defense. When everyone is saying the kid did nothing wrong and would never attack another person. In fact it shows this kid was a criminal. And is violent on drugs. Making him the prime candidate to attack and violently hurt someone when he has no regard for himself or people around him.

This is a pure case of someone who walked down the wrong path and choose to do bad things and got caught trying to hurt someone. When that person is armed and uses self defense. Guess what do not cry foul when the character of a person is not of good choice. Did he deserve to die? No. But that still does not excuse him of the choices he made. Example only self defense and not other crimes because they do not fit this action.

Should be a very interesting court case. Zimmermans Father is a retired Judge is he not? I am guessing his legal team will be pretty good. It's not a slam dunk for either side IMO. It will come down to how well the lawyers on each side handle things.

reply to post by ratpunk

Originally posted by ratpunk
I am tired of hearing about people believing this kid was some sweet and innocent kid. He was a pot head. Caused fights at school. And now we have pics on his cell holding a handgun... Sounds like an outstanding kid.

Trayvon Martin is NOT on trial, however. So any of this, whether it's true of false, is irrelevant.

George Zimmerman is on trial. The state of Florida is putting him on trial for murder. The victim's life is irrelevant.

reply to post by ratpunk

Originally posted by ratpunk
I see so a person who has a pattern of drug use and violent behavior involved in a case means nothing?

Trayvon Martin is NOT involved in the case. It's The state of Florida vs George Zimmerman.

In fact it shows this kid was a criminal. And is violent on drugs. Making him the prime candidate to attack and violently hurt someone when he has no regard for himself or people around him.

This is the message Zimmerman's scumball lawyer is trying to pass on to the media. Congratulations. You have been manipulated, just as O'mara hopes the jury pool will be.

reply to post by buster2010

Personally I think he should be charged with manslaughter instead of murder.

Or negligent homicide.

However, no matter how much of a thug Trevon was, it doesn't change the fact that Zimmerman pursued the confrontation, which right then, tossed Stand Your Ground out the window. He took it on himself to play cop, even when advised not to.

Originally posted by ratpunk
I see so a person who has a pattern of drug use and violent behavior involved in a case means nothing? Last I knew the character of person does impact a case were a person claims self defense. When everyone is saying the kid did nothing wrong and would never attack another person. In fact it shows this kid was a criminal. And is violent on drugs. Making him the prime candidate to attack and violently hurt someone when he has no regard for himself or people around him.

George Zimmerman ...Restraining order placed on him by his fiancee citing Domestic Violence...was charged with Assualting an officer..and Takes medication for hyperactivity and ADHD.

Trayvon Martin...the Corroner said the THC levels in his blood were indicative of someone who last smoked pot 1-3 weeks prior to the incident...and when was the last time you knew someone to smoke pot and become violent? It is a tranquilizing drug....as opposed to Zimmerman's hyperactivity.

All of that is independant of the facts, circumstances and reality of what happened that day, and not relevant to what happened, but I remain confused on why you think that Trayvon's fairly typical teenage difficulties are more damning than Zimmerman's established adult history of unpredictable violence and hyperactivity?

Originally posted by Gazrok
reply to post by buster2010

 

Personally I think he should be charged with manslaughter instead of murder.

Or negligent homicide.

However, no matter how much of a thug Trevon was, it doesn't change the fact that Zimmerman pursued the confrontation, which right then, tossed Stand Your Ground out the window. He took it on himself to play cop, even when advised not to.

I still strongly suspect that the irony here, if the full truth is ever revealed, is that it was Trayvon who was forced to stand his ground and fight for his life.

I believe that Zimmerman wanted to be the hero and he "caught" Trayvon in the minutes that appear unaccounted for by both the defense and prosecution. That Zimmerman was frustrated by "these a###ole punks always getting away". That he felt so strongly that he disregarded the dispatcher's order to cease pursuing Trayvon.

He caught Trayvon before he got home. He either told him to follow him to his truck or took him by the arm. When Trayvon arrived at the truck, something triggered him to fight for his life. Either Zimmerman said something, like told him to get in the truck, or flashed the gun...something that changed Trayvon from "flee" which he had been doing wholeheartedly...to "fight".

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
The victim's life is irrelevant. .

But the question remains .... who is the victim?
Just because someone is dead doesn't mean that they are the victim.
Victims kill perps all the time. Either could be a victim ....

reply to post by FlyersFan

Originally posted by FlyersFan
But the question remains .... who is the victim?
...
Just because someone is dead doesn't mean that they are the victim.

In the legal case of The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman, which is the case being discussed here, Zimmerman is being charged with murder. The victim of that alleged murder is Trayvon Martin.

This is NOT a a case of Trayvon Martin vs George Zimmerman.

reply to post by FlyersFan


Zimmermans story has changed several times and there is time unaccounted for by his defense.

He chased down Trayvon, tackled him, ended up getting punched in the nose and opted to shoot him.

He said that the man watching was on the phone. Trayvon said that he was going to start walking. Phone hung up and she called him back. He said the man was still watching him. He put his hoodie on because it was still raining.

She told him to run to his dad’s house. He said that he would run. She heard Trayvon running and could hear the wind. Trayvon said that he lost the guy. Then, he told her the guy was coming closer to him. She heard Trayvon say “Why you following me for?” An old man said, “What are you doing around here?” She called Trayvon’s name and he didn’t answer. She said someone bumped him, and she heard the phone drop.

trayvon.axiomamnesia.com...

Also deposed Dec. 11 was "witness 17", the fiancée of witness 6 who was in the townhouse with him that evening, heard the fight between Trayvon and Zimmerman but did not see it, she told investigators in March.

She heard voices from people who sounded as if they were running and getting closer to her, she said. One was calling, "help," but she was not sure who it was.

What she told attorneys Dec. 11 is not clear.

Several neighbors heard or saw portions of the fight, according to prosecution records. Most said they could not make out who was on top. One witness initially told police she was not sure but several weeks later said that after seeing photos of Zimmerman on television was sure he was the one on top.

articles.orlandosentinel.com... von-and-zimmerman

Another witness

Witness says she saw two guys running as she was looking out the kitchen window, but doesn’t know who was in front or behind. They were about 10 feet apart. She saw a fist fight, but doesn’t know who was hitting who. All she heard was “No, no,”

trayvon.axiomamnesia.com...


Three different witnesses seperately say that George Zimmerman chased and caught Trayvon, niether being aware of anyone's else's account...Zimmerman claims he was jumped beside his truck.

He chased down and tackled Trayvon.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
In the legal case of The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman, which is the case being discussed here, Zimmerman is being charged with murder. The victim of that alleged murder is Trayvon Martin.

An alleged murder ... that means alleged victim.
The defense position is that Zimmerman is the victim.
The prosecution position is that Martin is the victim.
I'm looking forward to the jury deciding who is the victim and who is the perp.
The information that should come out at trial should end all speculation.

reply to post by Indigo5

I'm not going to get into another 50 page thread going back and forth on the alleged facts. We'll see the facts during the trial. Not media spin. Not one sided information. Not selectively edited tapes.

My statement remains true ... ALLEGED murder means ALLEGED victim. And just because someone is dead doesn't mean they are the victim. Lots of perps die during a confrontation. I'm waiting on the facts to come out in the trial before I say which person is the perp and which is the victim. This case is too convoluted for me to have a strong opinion in one direction or the other.

(that being said ... I wouldn't be surprised at a Manslaughter conviction for Zimmerman ... but thats based on the information (and probably misinformation) that the media has been spewing ... so who knows?? )

reply to post by FlyersFan


I am giving my opionion given the known evidence. You are welcome to reserve your opinion until post-trial.

I once heard the definition of "Jury" as "a collection of your peers assembled to decide who has the better lawyer".

I do find it ironic that some posters seem to have a very flexible standard of proof, depending on the topic?

Not sure if the trial will disclose the full truth, but lets hope so.

He is on trial for 2nd degree murder, not manslaughter BTW.

reply to post by FlyersFan

Originally posted by FlyersFan
The defense position is that Zimmerman is the victim.

No it isn't. The defense position is that Zimmerman is NOT guilty of murder.

The prosecution position is that Martin is the victim.

No. Martin IS the victim of the alleged murder. There is no question about that.

I'm looking forward to the jury deciding who is the victim and who is the perp.

No. Legally, TM is the victim of the alleged murder. Whether they find Zimmerman guilty or not guilty is the only option. They cannot find him to be the victim in the case against him.

When and if George Zimmerman sues someone for victimizing HIM, then he'll be the victim of the alleged crime.