'Jesus was an Occupier'

'Jesus was an Occupier'

"Jesus was an Occupier, born under a death warrant, a Jew by religion, born in poverty under Roman occupation, ……Gandhi was an Occupier, Martin Luther King was an Occupier, (Nelson) Mandela was an Occupier."

(visit the link for the full news article)

So says the Rev. Jesse Jackson. Speaking in London, the veteran activist compared the global anti-capitalist movement to the U.S. civil rights struggle, the battle against apartheid in South Africa and the fight for Indian independence.

Conversely, many ATS members are convinced OWS protestors represent the nation's worst slackers - not a history of important activism.

Those who take responsibility for speaking out against corruption, and standing up to be counted are accused of not taking personal responsibility. Those who want corporations to be accountable and responsible are accused of abdicating their own responsibilities.

Jesus, Gandhi, Martin Luther King and Mandela - how would they be described here today? As slackers? As people who avoid personal responsibility?

Just curious.



[url=http://worldnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/15/9471810-rev-jesse-jackson-to-london-protesters-jesus-was-an-occupier]worldnews.msnbc.msn.com[/url ]
(visit the link for the full news article)

reply to post by soficrow


Jesse Jackson's support for OWS is enough for me to disregard OWS entirely.

Jesus's family was anything but poor, as even the Gospels tell of kings coming to visit the newborn Jesus and give him gifts. He was a member of a relatively wealthy family with actual blood ties to King David, giving Jesus a legitimate (although distant) claim to the Jewish throne. And he managed to put together a campaign to assert that claim by taking over John the Baptist's following, having him killed, and pushing to Jerusalem to create problems. Unfortunately for him, tensions were high between the Jews and the Roman occupiers (the real occupiers), so it was easier just to have Jesus killed for sorcery than have him create more problems.

The biggest difference between Jesus and the occupiers of today is that Jesus had a clear message, "Recognize me as the King of the Jews." The Occupiers? "Spread out the money?"

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by soficrow

 

Jesse Jackson's support for OWS is enough for me to disregard OWS entirely.

I don't know if I'd go quite THAT far. That's like saying I am dropping support for Ron Paul cause Cain gave his support to him...

Not the usual insightful comment I am used to from you, Rocky. What gives. I don't like Jackson any more than you do, but come on. That's a little over the top. Just imo....but w/e.

reply to post by TrueAmerican


OWS has no spokespersons because being the idiots that they are refuse to have an organized structure in which a council (elected or whatever) speaks for the movement. Thus any tool with the money that can get air time is the spokes person for OWS.

Right now Jesse Jackson is speaking for the whole of OWS.

Relating to say a political campaign with a rigid support and hierarchy is in no way the same thing. OWS is up for grabs, and Jesse Jackson has been at numerous events, including hosting a radio show from Zuccoti Park. Yeah, that's more than enough reason for me to discount the entire movement.

Jesus was an incredibly intelligent individual and a strategist.

That pretty much puts him well above and beyond the Occupy movement.

Jesus didn't occupy anything. He traveled and taught, overturning much of the dogmatic and hypocritical principles that had taken over the Jewish religion and theocratic regime.

He was from a quite wealthy family, at that. Both his father and mother would have been nobility ( His father a descendant of King David, and there is much speculation as to the lineage of his mother). Joseph was selected to work on the Temple - certainly no 'mere' carpenter, and was likely an foreman on his respective projects. Jesus spent quite a bit of time, while there, speaking to the various Rabbi and discussing religion (and politics, as the climate would have it).

To compare him to the Occupy movement is... silly.

He was a teacher, and he delivered his message in a very strategic manner. When the Pharisee would challenge him, he would respond with wisdom and a very well thought out challenge. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" - was a very stout challenge.

I would, actually, compare the Occupy movement to the many "other" messiahs that preceded and succeeded Jesus. The Jews were looking for a warlord to free them from the Roman empire. There was a new Messiah for the Jews every time they turned around, and the result was always the same (the Roman army showed up and bulldozed them). Jesus of Nazareth was largely discredited because of his aversion to militant behavior. This was not so much that Jesus was a pacifist, as much as it was Jesus realized he would be crushed by the Roman army if he started waving a sword around and claiming to be the Messiah.

We can go on and on with this - but, honestly, the Occupy movement is practically the antithesis of Jesus' message. Jesus taught people to care for each other as neighbors. He didn't teach them to demand help from others or to look upon people with contempt for any reason.

So, I say this gentleman speaks with a forked tongue.

I wonder how many modern "occupiers" actually maintain traditional Christian beliefs. I think many of them have forgotten the golden rule "due unto others..." as well as the notion of "turning the other cheek" and the 10th commandment coveting etc etc.

Jackson has no business lumping this entire movement in the same breath as Jesus.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by soficrow

 

Jesse Jackson's support for OWS is enough for me to disregard OWS entirely.

What an ignorant statement.

Fake Christians(This is not directed at Rockpuck) need to read the new testament again and realize Jesus was a "dirty hippy" like those at occupy, just a man sending out good vibes by speaking of peace and love. OWS will win.

Good post OP, I agree.

He rode in on a donkey, like some common goods --a wink to the merchant rabbis of the town.

He slept on the ground, so a tent would be an upgrade for Jesus. Or for any old indian like Crazy Horse for example.

Also he appears not to carry the Roman tax penny as he had to ask someone to show one.

Yes, OP I agree with your title. However, Jesus' message was very simple: "Get the hell out of this city, run by the sons of the devil". That was his real message. Not so much to "occupy" although he did that. But more to flee when the occupation fails massively. Point is, he told people to gtfo if evil seems to not respond. He said "kick the dust off your sandals and be on your way."

Good thread.

reply to post by CREAM


Just for the sake of argument I've never met a hippy that told me if I didn't accept peace and love I'd burn for an eternity in the fiery pits of hell. If Jesus was a hippy, he wasn't a very nice one.

PS: I might be ignorant for absolutely hating that ##SNIP## Jackson and that's fine. But I stand by what I said, unless OWS denounces him I can only assume they support him. He's corrupt, he's in the 1%, he tries his damnedest to racially divide us, he's like the racial ambulance chaser.. he's a bigot and a tool.

Originally posted by jibeho
I wonder how many modern "occupiers" actually maintain traditional Christian beliefs. I think many of them have forgotten the golden rule "due unto others..." as well as the notion of "turning the other cheek" and the 10th commandment coveting etc etc.

Jackson has no business lumping this entire movement in the same breath as Jesus.

edit on 15-12-2011 by jibeho because: (no reason given)

I think the "due unto others" and "turn the other cheek" is EXACTLY what they a protesting for, well for the most part imo, some are more militant, I like both aspects.

Who is bringing the guns and tear gas to the marches? The people who use force and not peace.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
OWS has no spokespersons because being the idiots that they are refuse to have an organized structure in which a council (elected or whatever) speaks for the movement. Thus any tool with the money that can get air time is the spokes person for OWS.

Right now Jesse Jackson is speaking for the whole of OWS.

Jesse Jackson is speaking for Jesse Jackson.

One of the interesting things about OWS for me is that very lack of organization. Just people, knowing so many things are wrong with government today, protesting across the board about all kinds of things. Maybe the movement doesn't need a leader. If it had too much leadership, it would also have too much agenda in one direction with strings attached, personal interest, corruption, and all the rest of the things that OWS is bitching about. I kind of like it just the way it is, even if that is perceived as ineffectual to the more orthodox organizational structure of other movements.

As a whole though, it is sending a message to Washington that the people are unhappy to the point they are taking it to the streets.

reply to post by TrueAmerican

Jesse Jackson is speaking for Jesse Jackson.

Jesse Jackson is speaking in support of OWS

OWS is not condemning Jacksons support.

Thus OWS is allowing Jackson to speak for them.

Thus their ideologies must be inline and OWS is enjoying the support Jackson is giving them.

Simple as that.

Originally posted by Blue Shift
Jesus's family was anything but poor, as even the Gospels tell of kings coming to visit the newborn Jesus and give him gifts. He was a member of a relatively wealthy family with actual blood ties to King David, giving Jesus a legitimate (although distant) claim to the Jewish throne. And he managed to put together a campaign to assert that claim by taking over John the Baptist's following, having him killed, and pushing to Jerusalem to create problems. Unfortunately for him, tensions were high between the Jews and the Roman occupiers (the real occupiers), so it was easier just to have Jesus killed for sorcery than have him create more problems.

The biggest difference between Jesus and the occupiers of today is that Jesus had a clear message, "Recognize me as the King of the Jews." The Occupiers? "Spread out the money?"

When Judas got upset over the woman who broke the alabaster box to anoint Jesus' feet with the perfume, Judas said "That box could have been sold and the money given to the poor" to which Jesus replied "the poor you will have with you always, but me you will not always have". There is a limit to the social gospel, and there is a limit of which we are required to throw money at the poor. Judas was the occupier, and he sold out Jesus for money, that same was blood money that was later tossed away. A lot of good it did the poor people Judas seemed to care so much for. Judas then went out and hung himself but the branch broke and he fell onto the rocks below.

Money is not the answer all the time, Jesus preached sharing and going the second mile and giving your cloak also when needed but not to just throw money at the poor.

Judas was the Occupier, and it cost him his integrity, his respect and his life.

At least OWS is doing something. Most people (myself included) would rather sit back and let others do all the hard work. They are criticized every day, yet they are out there trying. They could be sitting at home collecting unemployment, like many others. Yet they go out, with the threat of bodily harm from law enforcement, for the greater good.

I really don't see how anyone can look down on a group that has a true just purpose to change the wealth disparity in this country.

I've seen so much hate on how the movement is doing more harm than good. Is caring that men/women/children are going to bed night after night homeless and hungry is wrong? And thats just in America. Let alone the "3rd World" countries where children are lucky if they even have parents, any education, or not diseased ridden from birth, and might get lucky enough to get a few bites to eat a week.

Many people just don't care. I do. And I pity those who can go through their days knowing people are actually suffering at the hands of a corrupt system that holds humanity by the balls.

I'm sure Dr. King had quite a few people who thought he was wrong and would accomplish nothing. And he was doing more harm than good. Maybe we need to look back and change our future before we destroy ourselves as human beings.

People just don´t get it, do they?

NOTHING WILL HAPPEN WITHOUT GUILLOTINES!

Those in power, they will just wait it out.
They have more money than all of you combined.
Appealing to their common sense is like asking the tide to not roll in.
Protesters will endure the cold while bankers sleep warmly after a delicious dinner.

OWS is nothing but hot air.

Get some blood on your hands, or stop whining.

Originally posted by CREAM

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by soficrow

 

Jesse Jackson's support for OWS is enough for me to disregard OWS entirely.

What an ignorant statement.

Fake Christians(This is not directed at Rockpuck) need to read the new testament again and realize Jesus was a "dirty hippy" like those at occupy, just a man sending out good vibes by speaking of peace and love. OWS will win.

Jesus was not a "dirty hippie" and did more than send out good vibes. He did speak peace and love, because He was the penultimate peace and love. The New Testament I read and have so many times, Jesus expected more out of us than just protesting about how unfair life is because someone else has money and we don't. When God said "man should earn his bread by the sweat of his brow" that is something Jesus would have lived and several of his disciples actually worked as fishermen and one was a....wait for it...a 1% tax collector....

Jesus did have friends, but he did not make it a point to go to hang out. He went where He was invited but nothing in the Bible supports that He just wandered around doing nothing but spreading good vibes. Yes, He preached in an evangelistic style but He also healed people everywhere He went. That is the difference, Jesus healed people and people wanted to be in His presence. He loved people, but for every person he healed there was the expectation for them to repent and live right.

The first thing Jesus preached when He came out of the wilderness was "Repent and believe the Gospel, for the kingdom of God is at hand".

Originally posted by LionOfGOD
People just don´t get it, do they?

NOTHING WILL HAPPEN WITHOUT GUILLOTINES!

Those in power, they will just wait it out.
They have more money than all of you combined.
Appealing to their common sense is like asking the tide to not roll in.
Protesters will endure the cold while bankers sleep warmly after a delicious dinner.

OWS is nothing but hot air.

Get some blood on your hands, or stop whining.

This is completely the opposite of what Jesus would probably want.

After Jesus told people to gtfo of Jerusalem, because it was riddled with evil demonic rock-throwing men, who served a volcano god over all others, there came up a different messiah, a man called "Bar Kochba". This man led the Jerusalem fleeing parties, to Masada, where the Romans slay them.

The rabbis of course, had sided with bar kochba. These same rabbis escaped the bloodshed, to build the silk roads up between Iraq (Babylon) and Jerusalem, eventually compiling the modern babylon talmud which was the ultimate time of legal knowledge, aka the complete codifications of the globo-priesthood.

So see, all the dead people who didn't flee Jerusalem? Their blood got coined into gold. So when you encourage behavior like this, you are acting like the enemies of Jesus. Seriously brah its stupid to encourage people to "get blood on their hands" on the internets. Peace is the way.