What if HUD disappeared? (rand paul article) Ron Paul was same veiws.

reply to post by TinkerHaus


Did you read my post in its entirety? To answer your question, yes either my wife or I certainly works during the Summer. At this moment my wife works part time at the school. I do whatever odd jobs I can find. I have a 3.6, I know it could be better but its far better than the average for my school and during the Summer I have to usually unload trucks for minimum wage. Even then after struggling to find any job, I am lucky to see 32 hours a week. I would have never bothered with school if our country wasn't full of a bunch of morons making it damn near impossible for capable young people to find jobs that pay a living wage. My children were certainly not planned, with the first my wife was on what was supposed to be a very good birth control... With the second she was on a shot form of birth control and apparently the flu canceled out the effects of the birth control... Yes, our mistake, but I don't consider it such. While I am not much of a religious person, I do consider my children a blessing and would have never considered abortion. I consider myself to be agnostic, and support abortion in certain situations, but not as a form of "oh-crap" birth control. So more or less an endless series of bad luck, if you will, has screwed me throughout life. As far as my children are concerned, I wouldn't change a thing, and the opinion of anybody will never sway my feelings about that.

As far as the question of am I willing to work is concerned the answer is yes, I do work, I unfortunately have to take jobs that I should not have to when I am capable of so much more, as do many other Americans. Now I do understand that we are on an internet forum and many people will claim to do or have done things which they have never really done. From your response to my post, it is my opinion that you have not personally experienced the kind of life that you claim to have experienced. In my opinion if you had you would not come at me in the manner that you do, or maybe that's just the kind of attitude you have. However, for anybody ho has not been living under a rock these last few years, it should be painfully obvious that work isn't just something you get because you apply for a job these days. If it were so simple I would be repairing computers and electronics or repairing, building, and customizing motorcycles a minimum of 40 hours a week, trying to get as much over time as I could in order for me to save the money to open my own shop. When it comes to computer hardware and customization I consider myself to be very skilled and would enjoy the work, unfortunately it is impossible to find work in the field, I know this from experience. More than often you will find people who were willing to work for less but know little about the work they are being paid to do.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
reply to post by eLPresidente

 

Not making a good case? In who's world? Do you come from a world where no one is poor and no one is rich. I am showing you to solve the problem. Raise the taxes on the rich; simple. Another solution is to punish companies for outsourcing jobs that americans can do from home. Anyone with half a brian can do a customer service job from home. It only takes a computer,internet connection and downloadable software. I am poor and I have all those things needed to work from home. People can finance,rent or buy a computer at a thrift store. I once saw a computer that was an HP compaq for $150 at a thrift store. It could run the internet and was no more than 4 years old.
There are multiple solutions to every problem of course. Yet both pauls do not offer solutions just threaten to remove things. You can't remove things without a great solid plan. Passing things on to the state is not a good solid plan per say. If it is I need PROOF!

You misunderstand and this is why so many people are against OWS.. Not very many in OWS understand reality well enough to suggest solutions.

That being said I do support a lot of what OWS stands for.

Anyway, Ron Paul offers PLENTY of solutions - in fact he offers better and more realistic solutions than any other candidate. Our country CANNOT SUSTAIN this model! We are all going down together if we don't fix the system from the ground up.

How are you going to feel when no one gets benefits whatsoever because we've all been robbed blind and there is no one left to pay for them? This is very seriously the path we're headed down.

The answer isn't to make the rich pay more, necessarily, but to make corporations and big money pay it's fair share. It's to simplify the tax code, cut out the loopholes, and get us all paying what we should be - not just the middle class!

So yes, many wealthy corporations and individuals should be paying more - but not all/every one. The idea isn't to unfairly extract wealth from the rich, but to have a comprehensive, fair, easily understood tax code that makes us all equally liable to pay our fair share.

reply to post by dreamseeker

I realize you were replying to someone else now. At the same time I am an example of a deserving person.

Wow.. arrogant much? You don't like florescent lights and somehow conned the Government into paying all your living expenses.

Get a job outside.

You're probably the least deserving person I've ever heard of living off of federal an state money.

reply to post by doomedtoday


I'm not sure what you don't believe..

I really was homeless as a kid. My family lived in a tent in the woods for about 6 months. When we had a roof over our head it was a crappy one. I grew up like this until I left home at 16 to work full time. I went to an alternative highschool because the schedule allowed me to work.

I really did get a small scholarship and put myself through college at the local community college. I really do have 2 kids, a 10 year old and an almost 2 year old. I really did just get a second job to make some extra cash to do some home remodeling.. I'm not sure what or why you wouldn't believe me, but whatever, it's beside the point.

I wasn't saying that your kids were a mistake. I have kids too and I would do literally anything for them - so I understand where you're coming from. I wasn't saying you should have done anything different, only that your situation is a result of your choices.

I'm sorry, I was reading your post on my phone yesterday and I must have missed some of it. I hope you have a different experience than everyone else relying on student loans to pay living expenses for an extended period, but it really is a long shot.

I too work in a technical field and have worked extensively building systems for home and business use. Come to Utah, we've got jobs a poppin' for PC techs. True story.

Anyway, I'm not lying to you.. Just trying to give my personal example of what a person can do. I'm proud of myself and I hope without being arrogant or cocky about it. I went through a lot of crap as a kid through being a young adult, and I overcame it and became the first person in my immediate family to get a college degree - and I did it with no support from family and very little support from friends. So yes, it can be done. People just don't like to work hard anymore.

I just want to add - I know a lot of people out here.. We aren't exactly overflowing with jobs either, but I notice people that really look, and really try, and really let potential employers know how much they want/need the job, always end up being unemployed for less time than those who put less work into it. Obviously.

I wasn't trying to be a jerk.. My parents were welfare parents even though my dad has the education and capability to make decent money. They were poor because of bad decisions, bad money management, and laziness. I could be a little resentful, so I apologize if it comes out here.

reply to post by dreamseeker


I have a disease too.It is actually a disability I think. It keeps coming back. I get rid of them and they return. It is always there. It depresses me. It Makes me drink. It makes me angry. This causes heart problems and stress. High Blood Pressure.

It is called my bills. Can I get a handout too?

HUD needs to be remodeled just as many government agencies that we, as taxpayers, cannot support anymore. Our country cannot support it anymore. There is too much going out and not enough coming in. You see, when money is flowing, no one looks at the books and everyone relies on credit.

When there is no money, the big fish look for the little fish and we my friends are at the bottom. The money is gone and it is not the rich to blame, or the poor...it is us.

The guy living on assistance with the 55 inch plasma and xbox live needs to go. You know they are out there. They are your neighbors, friends and relatives....They piss me off. The woman working 3 jobs with 2 kids and no help...they need the money that those leeches in this country take.

Flat tax and more rights to the states to govern themselves for commerce. The government is wasting my money....



Also, light sensitivity, yeah, to flouro and staring at monitors, i dealt with it for over 9 years in an office setting with horrible migraines. I would take the bulbs out and they threaten me to stop touching it but I did..to keep working. You are only the person you allow yourself to be...

deleted.

reply to post by Rockpuck


You are a jerk. I am very deserving when I paid into the system by working for 15 years! I have a masters in psychologhy. I never siad I did not like fluroscent lights; I pass out under that type of lighting unless there are special covers. What is wrong with you?
I pay my rent and my bills. I only have about $760 to live on. How in the heck am I supposed to pay rent of $500 per month on that. HUH~! Stop with the judgements and open up your heart. I am a human being and I deserve compassion. Why is this so hard to understand? This thread was intended to be a helpful, healthy and NON JUDGEMENTAL discussion.

reply to post by esdad71


I am not some lazy idoit. My disablity would have killed me years a go if I would have worked outside of my house much longer. I would get flu every year and it would lead to bronchitis. I could not get the flu shot due to senstivities. I had steriod shots to boost my immune system for 10 years!
The DR told me if I get bronchitis a few more times I would develop severe bronchial problems. I was told by a DR to slow down and I was pushed into disablity by a DR. I applied but got approved very quickly because of a DR. I had my drivers license taken away while I was under medical reveiw.
At 3 my parents were told that I had symptoms that mimicked cystic fibrosis. They were told I would not make to 30. Forunately I did not have cystic fibrosis. I was sent home from school 3 times a month. There were times when I had to study from home.
I was told not to hug my friends or hold their hands etc. This was to keep me alive. I was protected all my life. I was not as bad off as the bubble boy but at one point I could not eat white bread, milk or sweets until they figured out what was wrong with me. I was taken to DR after Dr up until 7. At 7 they figured I had a rare antibody disorder where I was missing a certian anti body that I needed so I did not get sick.
I can't work outside my home. If I do then my disablity benefits will be taken away and I will be forced to work full tiem leading back to the cycle of illness and depression.Who likes to be sick 3-6 times a month? I am only healthier now because I listen to my Dr and do not stay outside of my home much during flu season. I aviod or limit those things the DR tells me to do. Why would a person not listen to a DR? They have the knowledge not me. Besides this is not just about me I am only ONE example. Why are people way way too quick to judge without knowing the details. So frustrating.
It is not a hand out to me but something I earned by scarficing my health.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
reply to post by Rockpuck

 

This thread was intended to be a helpful, healthy and NON JUDGEMENTAL discussion.

Really now, because it seems like you spent half the thread saying how evil conservatives, republicans, Ron Paul and his supporters are.

You say Ron Paul has no plans, removing the federal government from the powers that they have given themselves against the Constitution IS the plan. We cannot keep spending like this and maintaining the welfare state that has given us trillions in liabilities. Paul is the only one offering a trillion dollar cut in the first year with a truly balanced budget by year three, everybody else just wants to trim around the edges, keeping uninformed people like you happy so that they can rob and screw you some more.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
I can't work outside my home. If I do then my disablity benefits will be taken away and I will be forced to work full tiem leading back to the cycle of illness and depression.:

"I cannot work because I would lose my handout"

The above is about the best argument in favor of supporting Rand Paul's efforts that I have seen to date. Thank you.


It is called responsibility, some of us accept it, some of us refuse it. I fully accept and embrace the responsibility to provide for myself and my family, I similarly reject any responsibility to provide for anyone outside that description anymore. Join the Occupy Wall Street movement... maybe you'll have better luck getting the brainwashed masses to push for higher taxation of corproations and the very wealthy because the middle class gravy train has had enough and we're done supporting the bottom of the barrel. In the eyes of the majority of the middle class, the point of either finding a different source of funds or flat killing programs off has been reached. Many of us will cast votes for those who support policies such as killing HUD because we have recognized that the source of funding will never change, the middle class will always be the primary source of the money. Thus, the time has come to start chopping off hands as they reach for our wallets. Sorry about the HUD user's damn luck.

reply to post by burdman30ott6


More judgements. Please open your eyes and realize that if I went back to working full time I would die earlier. Reread my statement about my disablities. THIS IS NOT ABOUT ME! Sure the systen is broken so it needs to be fixed but too coldly take people off programs is heartless. I NEVER SAID CONSERVATIVES/REPUBLICANS WERE EVIL! IT is not me who is misunderstanding but you. Please keep this thread on course. THIS IS SO UNFAIR TO ME. This was not a thread for telling me I am worthless I should work myself to death or to tell the poor to do the same blah blah blah! NOW STOP!

reply to post by burdman30ott6


How can be so heartless as to cut off the elderly, disabled and the impoverished. REALLY? I am ashamed to share the same forum as you. NOW BACK ON TOPIC!

reply to post by dreamseeker


Uh, you were the one who first brought your personal tale of sorrow and woe into this thread, not me. By doing so, it became obvious that the entire argument in this thread is a blatent conflict of interest. A person who is successfully gaming the system cannot legitimately defend the same system nor can they carry water against those who are identifying that the system doesn't work and needs to be shut down. Personally, I find it evil and heartless for anyone to presume that they have a right to so much as a single cent of my earnings or the earnings of any American outside of the money required to fund community services everyone, regardless of income, utilizes. Those legitimate programs are infrastructure, defense, parks, education, health services... NOT welfare, HUD, food stamps. Unemployemnt and Social Security, within limits, are a different animal entirely because those dollars are taken directly from workers' paychecks. People are entitled to that IF THEY HAVE PAID INTO IT AT A LEVEL COMMENSURATE WITH WHAT THEY TAKE OUT.

Everything else the federal government pisses away billions of tax dollars on, KILL IT ALL. If that makes me the heartless evil Conservative, then OK... I can live the rest of my life accepting that label. In reality, it just means that I have a low tolerance for hypocrites. I find it very hypocritical that, when I express concern about MY money that I earned I am greedy and have no heart, yet when the gimme handouts! crowd expresses concerns about MY money that I earned they are just "concerned about humanity and care about people." My rear end! It's all about money. The only difference is that people who feel entitled to other's financial resources try to sugar coat their greed through portraying it as progressive humanitarianism whereas people who are actually out there working, earning, producing, and keeping their own view it as the fruits of their labors. It isn't about greed. I'm not the one standing around crying for more money... I just want the money I worked for without having to wait for 46 million grubby little hands to have a shot at it before it reaches my wallet.

reply to post by dreamseeker


Look, no where in my post did I call you lazy. There was empathy as well as sympathy plus as a bonus a sarcastic joke. I take it you do not like Dennis Miller.

Your attitude has made me take another road here However. So,you get the flu so you should get disability? What sacrifice did you make. We are all dealt a hand and live with it. My second son was born at 29 weeks due to complications and weighed under 3 pounds when born.3 months in the hospital. He fit in my hand and had a Heart monitor at home for a year. I watched his heart stop beating numerous times in the first months he was born and breathing issues till he was 2.

Now, does this mean if he cannot actively make it in the workplace he can use this as an excuse to draw a check? According to your logic it would and THAT is what is wrong. The government does not owe you a thing. Nothing. You are born with the right to achieve what you can with what you have.

If you need help, anyone should get it not matter how much money you make as everyone hits hard times. Do you think people are born homeless? No, they end up there....no one wants to be there. Pay it forward and when you are down someone will eventually extend a hand.

reply to post by dreamseeker


You have successfully proven to me beyond a shadow of a doubt that the system is broken. All through your responses all I have seen is one thing: "Me, me, me, me, me, me, me" "I deserve this" "I deserve that" "You make enough to live off, you should give me this."

And the saddest thing of all .. the thing that really pisses me off isn't even that you steal money from the public, or that tax payers fund your benefits because you feel like you're entitled to disability but that because of people like you, which is the vast majority.. people who legitimately need and deserve the benefits don't get enough, and get cast into the pool of leaches that we see as lazy, arrogant an self absorbed stealing benefits. Even if they are not.

reply to post by Rockpuck


You have GOt to be kidding. I am providing myself as an example HELLO! YEt your position it is my tax money! How does that make you better than me. I can't help that I have a disabitly. GET OFF MY THREAD AND STOP DERAILIN IT!!!
AND YES I DO DESERVE IT AND NO I AM NOT A LEECH> I AM REPORTING YOU!
Are you willing to walk in my shoes?

reply to post by esdad71


It is not my attitude! I started this thread off nicely! People are attacking me and my beliefs. So what I get flu? HUH? Flu can KILL!!!!! IN my case it would be more likely that I die from the flu. Let me explain so you can have the human compassion for me.
I used to get the flu 3-10 times a month. It is not far for someone to be sick that often. I still get 3-5 dizzy spells a day and I only get the flu maybe a few times a year. This a drastic reduction! Why because I spend less time outside my home. Thats only part of it. I get dizzy/fainting spells under non covered flurscent lighting non stop, sun light can do it to if it is directly in my face, computers can do it as well if I see a sudden flashing graphic. The DR theorized that I may have complications due to the steriods I had to take.
This is scary and has caused severe anxieties. I have had many tests to see what else is going on but nothing more concrete that the anti body disorder. I also have to be careful not to cut myself because I can only accept my blood type that has the same disorder which is rare. I have to be careful because I am sensitive to chemicals, perfumes, and heat. I have to have very specfic accomendations in order to work.
Jobs do not want to hire me when I tell them about my fainting spells. It is a huge liablity but I have to be honest so they know what to expect. This is not a walk in the park I can leave with it but I spend a lot of my time already feeling dizzy that is scary to be very very sick on top of it all. The FLU is a HUGE deal for me since I can't get the flu shot.
Imagine the worst flu you ever had for days sometimes weeks. I once lost 20 lbs in a week. How is this safe or normal. I may seem defensive but I am SO SICK OF PEOPLE JUDGING OTHERS AND NOT HAVING COMPASSION! It really depresses me!!! For me I only see human need and I don't think of whether or not that person is perfect. I DON"T HAVE TO BE PERFECTLY DISABLED IN ORDER TO GET HELP. I Went to 2 drs to get on disablity and more than interveiw. They ask you everything and anything; I filled out a lot of paper work.
DO I have to be dying for YOU PEOPLE to believe me! SHESH!! It really hurts me as a respected member of ATS that I am treated like this. It has me in tears because all I can see are a few people who hate more than they love!
TO those who feel the need to be hateful:
NOW I AM SICK OF THE JUDGEMENTAL STUFF HERE GET THIS THREAD BACK ON TRACK OR I WILL REPORT PEOPLE WHO ARE BEING JERKS!

reply to post by burdman30ott6


Your a moderator and yet you flame me! SHAME ON YOU! I am disapointed that you lie and are hateful as well. How do I report those who are being nasty on this thread. You don't deserve to be moderater if you are going to put a nice person down who never means harm and never harms anyone.
I am not "gaming" the system SHESH! I only brought my situation up as a real life human example for COMPASSION for the poor. It seems you think the poor are below you! I am so angry this thread has been derailed if this thread does not get back on track close this thread down and I will create another post on poverty or ron paul if I want too yet clarify upfront more about NO JUDGEMENTS!!!

This post has gotten of track I request a moderator to remove all off topic posts including mine. I am sick of fighting but I feel I must fight agianst this type of ignorance. I never meant to start any trouble I just wanted to educate people about a subject and get intellectual opinions from others. I want this thread to get back to the orginal point.
Take the focus off me and go back to the fact that rand paul and ron paul want to end HUD. Please respect this request. Thank you.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
How do I report those who are being nasty on this thread

Use the complaint form: www.abovetopsecret.com...

As for the topic of the thread, you are wrong. The replies in the thread are on topic. The topic isn't "let's all compose posts which agree with Dreamseeker", it is about the concept that Rand Paul has of eliminating HUD. Therefore, any replies which support or oppose Paul's idea and rationale provided behind that stance is 100% relevant and on-topic.