How they Built the Great Pyramid of Egypt

Very interesting and well put together.

Here's a thought about the "zig-zag ramp" mentioned in the OP, though. It could still have worked. Instead of turning the stones around, they could have just shifted the ropes and pulled from the opposite end of the stone until the next turn and then reverse again.

As you say, the ancients were pretty clever people.

I wanted to congratulate you Slayer69 on a great thread. I had first seen the CG animation for the internal ramp theory about a year ago but didnt know about the BBC special. It was great.

I saw you posting at the beginning looking for a theory to explain the shafts (obviously its not for souls to escape... they were closed off). Anyway I didnt read the whole thread, I'm not sure if somebody pointed you to the Giza Power Plant theory by Chriss Dunn.

Of course, it doesnt explain how the pyramids were built, but it goes on to explain what exactly the shafts are used for, among other things. He's published a few books on the subject, but its easier to digest one of his lectures on youtube:


Whether or not you will agree with all of it (I dont either), its definitely food for thought.. And I think it fits in well with your theories of construction too. I just feel that the pyramids were a lot more than burial tombs.

reply to post by FalselyFlagged


I'm checking out the video now.
It's my Birthday today so I'll be heading out after and give you my opinion of it later.

PEACE

Dont know if this was posted before,but this guy could build the pyramid himself!
And Mods dont you know it says Insert Google Video where it should say insert Youtube Video?

Hello Slayer, my lengthy post as promised:

A Big Slab of Paradox

There is an equally serious difficulty that precedes the transport and lifting of megaliths that takes place in the quarry. The only tools the ancient Egyptians had were very small copper chisels and rounded hammer-stones. The inflexible and insurmountable problem that the Great Pyramid presents is the fact that 43 blocks of granite weighing from 30 to 70 tons were quarried, lifted out of the bedrock, transported 500 miles and raised 150 vertical feet to the King's Chamber.

Granite has a hardness of 7 and 6, only 3 under diamond which is 10 on the Mohs scale, as it is comprised mostly of potassium feldspar and biotate. The copper tools used by Egyptians have a hardness of ~3.2. This means that the Granite had to be pounded out with dolerate rocks which have a hardness of 5 to 6.5 on the Mohs scale.


Every block would have to be pounded out and shaped using hard dolerite rocks, some weighing sixteen pounds. Chipping away only millimeters at a time. Forty three granite beams twenty four feet long, weighing from 30 to 70 tons, were chipped, shaped, and lifted out of solid bedrock.


More ever, several years ago Egyptologist Mark Lehner spent five hours in the Aswan quarry with a hammer-stone pounding against the granite bedrock (copper is too soft to cut granite). He was trying to prove that the ancient tools could do the job. He managed to excavate a one-foot square hole one-inch deep for his efforts. The granite blocks in the King's Chamber are 17' long and the trench that had to be dug around to them was about 8' deep.

No one has ever shown how these megaliths were undercut and lifted out of the quarry. To solve the problem you have to start with these granite blocks and get them out of the bedrock and up on level ground.

You cannot use levers to pry the blocks up since there is no way to get a wooden beam under the blocks since there is not enough clearance between their edge and the edge of the quarry wall they were dug out of.


These were relatively small blocks compared to the great obelisks that were quarried, transported and then raised up thousands of years ago, many of which still stand. They weigh from 100 to 350 tons. There isn't an archaeologist or engineer that has the slightest idea how this was done.

Our largest modern day, heavy-duty cranes are rated from 100 to 300 tons. We have custom-built specialty cranes that can lift up to 500 tons. Anyone that believes manpower alone could have moved a 300-ton block using ropes and manpower is chasing a dream.

There are cranes today that are completey stationary called 'gantry' cranes. The largest, built in China, can lift 20000 tons and is named Taisun:

en.wikipedia.org...

However, these would not be ideal at all for building a Pyramid especially with near-perfection.


I will write another lengthy post about the very quick and shaky assumption (based on Herodotus' millennium old testimony) about the Pyramid being a "Tomb" tomorrow. It's a contradiction to the Egyptians to build giant tombs that invite thieves and even more so it's a ridiculous assumption to call these Pyramids tombs, when there hasn't been a single, not one, body found in any of the many pyramids in Egypt.


-11118

reply to post by 11118


Well that is a lengthy reply.



Looking forward to reading the rest.

reply to post by SpartanKingLeonidas


Actually there is great evidence to suggest it wasn't slave labor, as we define it, but rather there were "workers" paid and fed very very well.

Just some points on human evidence left behind on the building of this pyramid, that people say doesn't exist.....

The metropolis for workers huts has been excavated and shows occupation at the site that lasted around only 20 years, was not a ongoing not a living city but indicative of a vast workforce....they left when it was finished....and all this dates to Khufus time. They had tried for many generations to build pyramids as tombs, and no they weren't copying an original, they were EVOLVING from mastaba tombs, to step pyramids, to crooked, to the red pyramid to the Giza complex.

Many ARCHeo-Fringe/Ancient Astronaut Fans ignore completely the development and evolution of dozens of pyramids till they got it right. Imhoptep was a great mathematician and the architect of the Step pyramid of Djoser, his achievements are recorded as is how he oversaw the construction......and no he didn't come from outer space.

Deforestation was huge throughout Egyptian civilisation but one of the largest in AE was in the Kufhu period and it fits in with the requirements for building the complex.

The enormous bakehouse remains at Giza carbon date to the old kingdom period are in perfect condition and the size of a bakehouses reflect supply thousands of workers.
Its from this carbon dating that we can see that this period had a large deforestation, the wood was indigenous to Egypt, and old wood was reused.
Additionally as quoted below the builders used absolutely whatever wood they could harvest or scavenge to roast tons of gypsum for mortar, to forge copper chisels, and to bake tens of thousands of loaves to feed the mass of assembled laborers. ...They needed the wood for such a large human manual job....

At Giza, south of the Sphinx, we are excavating remains of facilities for storage and production of fish, meat, bread, and copper that date to the middle and end of Dynasty 4, when the pyramids of Khafre and Menkaure were under construction.......dates from samples taken here are almost direct hits on Menkaure's historical dates, 2532- 2504 B.C. ....the pyramid builders devoured whatever wood they could harvest or scavenge to roast tons of gypsum for mortar, to forge copper chisels, and to bake tens of thousands of loaves to feed the mass of assembled laborers. The giant stone pyramids in the early Old Kingdom may mark a major consumption of Egypt's wood cover, and therein lies the reason for the wide scatter, increased antiquity, and history-unfriendly radiocarbon dating results from the Old Kingdom, especially from the time of Djoser to Menkaure. In other words, it is the old-wood effect that haunts our dates and creates a kind of shadow chronology to the historical dating of the pyramids. It is the shadow cast by a thousand fires burning old wood.

www.archaeology.org...

They had their own technical devices. And the surveyor marks and construction evidence shows that it was done by a large workforce.
Indigenous people are able to come up with methods to fulfill their cultural beliefs.


Cemeteries have been excavated of workers with compounded fractures and damaged spines from heavy labor with stone. Some of these cemeteries and tombs of the overseers or viziers who died at Giza, have 'the honor of building for their king' inscribed on their tombs.

Enormous bake houses to feed a metropolis of workers of up to 10 000 at a time, all with... you guessed it! radio carbon dating by the bucket loads to Khufus time. These are in near perfect condition and use the exact same mortar as the giza pyramids. The huts are workers huts, not normal living dwellings, specifically designed workers huts, there was a difference.

The stones on the pyramid itself have cut marks and surveyor marks through out the entire pyramid, which is strong evidence of the tools used at building time.

The same dated surveyor lines "red paint" are grafiitied by workers dedicating the pyramid to Khufu within the behind the scenes construction areas of the pyramid.

The wooden beams within the structure match the dating for Kufus time, Some were older by 300 years, beauty of RCD and reusing old wood.

The largest deforestation period of Egypt matches exactly Khufus time and signifies the wood resources required for a large scale workforce and to make the mortar.

The surveyor lines on the ground flush flat outside the pyramid are the surveyors lines for "mapping" the pyramid.

Remnants of a ramp used for construction with shards that have Khufus marking on it. Yes the ramp has remains, this is a common misconception, that noone knows if a ramp was used.

Egyptian dedications that Khufu built it are both inscribed and on paper.
We have the Anastasi Papyrus that staes clearly how to build a ramp for pyramids as was done in Khufus time.

I will disclose to thee a command of thy Lord, since thou art his royal scribe, (since) thou art despatched to convey great monuments for Horus, the Lord of the Two Lands. For thou (in sooth) art the clever scribe who is at the head of the soldiers! - There is made a ramp of 730 cubits, with a breadth of 55 cubits, consisting of 120 compartments(?), filled with reeds and beams, with a height of 60 cubits at its summit, its middle of 30 cubits, its batter(?) 15 cubits, its base(??) of 5 cubits. The quantity of bricks needed for it is asked of the commander of the army. All the scribes together lack knowledge among them(?). They put their faith in thee, all of them, saying: "Thou art a clever scribe, my friend! Decide for us quickly! Behold thy name is famous; let one be found in this place (able) to magnify the other thirty! Let it not be said of thee that there is aught that thou dost not know! Answer us (as to) the quantity of bricks needed! Behold its measurement(??) are before thee; each one of its compartments(?) is of 30 cubits (long) and 7 cubits broad."

(from a satirical letter translated by Alan H. Gardiner in Egyptian Hieratic Texts - Series I: Literary Texts of the New Kingdom, Part I, Leipzig 1911 )

Schematic evidence

A series of round holes about 40 centimeters in diameter were cut into the rock around the pyramid ....These holes are noted by Goyon and Maragioglio and Rinaldi as being connected with the laying out of the pyramid.11 Stadelmann believes that these holes could be bases for trees based on references observed in some in private tomb paintings.12 Lehner took the approach of Goyon, and Maragioglio and Rinaldi, and added that they used these holes to make the layout of the base of the pyramid as a square base. 13 These holes are set at regular intervals and form lines which run parallel to the sides of the pyramid. The best indication for the reason behind these holes is for stakes that carried a line used as a reference, by the builders, as they formed the base of Khufu's pyramid from blocks of limestone, or in the case of Khafre's pyramid, from granite. These fifteen-ton blocks are marked so as to define the center axis of the pyramid's faces and diagonals. There are also trenches that infer the infusion and drainage of water during and after the leveling operations.14

www.guardians.net...

The quarries at Giza match the cubits required for it, with particular mention of the limestone cladding, that quarry is near exact cubit measurements, and we see human tools that scar the quarries, absolutely ancient egyptian tool scarring, and tool remnants.

The Pyramid was covered in Limestone, not marble and gold. The quarry is there and you can walk through it

There is also remains of canal scarring, ie, how they transported the stone rock to the pyramid from the quarry.

The sun boats found under the pyramid (2) placed there for Khufus flight to the underworld, they use a boat as their method of 'flying' transportation, Not a space craft....see how they use their point of reference for perceived transportation? These are dedicated to the king Khufu buried at the pyramid.

Great Thread Slayer, really enjoyable for a archaeology geek like me.

Originally posted by DB340
Wo, ok wait...

You're telling me that, in the past before our civilisation began to decay to the utter state it is in today, mental methods were used to drill and cut holes?

I've spent years interested in ancient aliens, time travel and basically everything this website stands for, but I have never, ever come across the idea that mass telekinesis was used to move, or do anything, to objects large and small.

I think you should open a new thread on this to introduce the concept to the wider community. I'd love to learn more about it with evidence.

Or, like usual, is it just an idea with absolutely nothing to base it upon?

Interesting.........

actually, i believe that telepathy et al was rooted out of the human race.

who wants everyone to know what you are thinking?

reply to post by Draken


that looks like a pagoda.

don't it?

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by jackflap
Do you really think that you would have garnered the precision and beauty of such a monument using slave labor over generations? Do you believe that these ruthless slave drivers who had no time for the weak or aged just pushed them aside and continued with building the monument without missing a beat? Do you believe that slaves would have gave a damn about how tightly two stones fit together and that every one placed by a slave was scrutinized by a slave driver of some sort?

We see this in other Great Ancient Monuments. The Great wall of China. Built by slaves, forced by the whip, very well built, some lengths are very amazing in quality. They had to build it that way or face death. It's an easy choice.

Life, Food, Shelter and attention to detail or Death To me it would be an easy choice. But back to Egypt, there is very little evidence for a slave force. Now If that's true and there were no or very few slaves used then people were very well kept and trained to pay close attention to details.

Would you disagree with the Great walls other name?
The longest Graveyard in the world

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/7f6b2c438029.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/a92e52c37ce0.jpg[/atsimg]

edit on 21-3-2011 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

they were also buried there in the wall, slayer.

there is none of that in the GP!

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by jackflap

 

About 3,900 + or - Years.
Well longer than 1,200 years to build at a pace of one crew placing 1 block an hour. I'm surprised that you cannot seem to in-vision Thousands or Tens of thousands all working simultaneously in multiple shifts and teams/crews around the clock?

They didn't maintain their monuments.

Remember supposedly the Sphinx was buried and in disrepair from an era of 1500 years previously before it was refurbished around 1,200 BC according to legend. They built a city near the Nile lived there for about 20 to 300 years then the Nile would change course leaving them high and dry and they would move accordingly.

wouldn't people loose interest after 862 1/2yrs?

i know what you are saying but if you ever been in a kitchen, more people does not mean faster.

you will have major f'up's believe me.

a well ordered work force will get the job done. with that many people supposedly around and being "slaves" hostages or just by being there, hostile, i don't see it getting done at all.

Originally posted by PsykoOps

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by PsykoOps

 

They may be referring to the stone of Baalbek. Some also marvel at it's size and weight or the fact that it was moved. However, it is a perfect example of ancient monument builders Failing to accomplish the task. The most likely scenario for it's present day situation is that they probably bit off more than they could chew. Dragged the stone, it got stuck in a rut and it being too big and heavy they couldn't get it moving again and so they had to abandon it in place.

Epic Fail Had there been any Alien intervention we wouldn't be having this conversation. They would have anti-gravity ray gunned it successfully into place

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9ba799408159.jpg[/atsimg]

edit on 21-3-2011 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

Yes that is the one I was referring to. So they failed and left it in the place. What I'd question is what was the failure. I don't think it was failure to move the stone. If that were the case why wouldn't they just cut it into smaller pieces and use it for something else. It has lots of finished parts and that would be the logical thing to do. Maybe the project encountered another difficulty. Perhaps a war broke out or the whole project was cancelled for some reason.
Also now that I think about this I remember vaguely a theory about mayan constructions. Some people claimed to have observed some local bird hack it's nests in solid granite. They were awestruck that a bird could do that and followed them around and found them using some red flower that they said made the rock very soft. This is what I recall and it sounds quite far fetched. If anyone remembers details / links please share. It's quite a curious theory.

exactly, like on easter island.

projects just dropped.

doesn't say much of why.

but thoes puppies "walked" to their places.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Immortalgemini527
IMHO Khufu found the pyramid already built,
lol,you cant even imagine,you really just cant!!

To be brutally honest. I have thought about that possibility.

The Ancient Egyptians found the Very old Great Pyramid in disrepair. It took 20 years to refurbish and repair it Mostly adding the outer casings and building his burial temple outside and when the Pharaoh died was put into his tomb built outside of the Great pyramid. His Son, Khafri fixed and repaired the second one.

edit on 21-3-2011 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

now we're talking!

all that crap of people around giza, the kitchens and sleeping quarters were for pilgrims and repairmen!


not the workers! how you gonna get the workers working in that area?

reply to post by zazzafrazz


no,

sorry, not a chance, that was maintainece.

and good ol consumerism. capitalism, pilgrims and shysters, oracles and magicians.



some things never change.

wow, i have 1/2 a thread of replys no one answered!

probably get socked for this too!

reply to post by fooks


LOL
thats your educated opinion is it?
They required 10 000 workers a day for 25 years for maintenance?
The surveyor lines and builder graffiti throughout the entire pyramid that has large blocks placed on top of it, was magically placed under the stones post building?

The Ramp remains were for errrrr maintenance, and not building?
The quarries were for maintenance?


Aliens that can bend space and time need giant rocks for a building? As opposed to it reflecting the meglomaniac tendencies of the builder.....someone needs to do more reading......

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Fine, Since everybody wants an Alien ok here is an Egyptian Alien

Enjoy...
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/08293841c671.jpg[/atsimg]

edit on 19-3-2011 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

haha hey thats my avatar!

nice work on the thread like always Slayer. how is it you are not a mod by now??

Originally posted by zazzafrazz
reply to post by fooks

 

LOL
thats your educated opinion is it?
They required 10 000 workers a day for 25 years for maintenance?
The surveyor lines and builder graffiti throughout the entire pyramid that has large blocks placed on top of it, was magically placed under the stones post building?

The Ramp remains were for errrrr maintenance, and not building?
The quarries were for maintenance?


Aliens that can bend space and time need giant rocks for a building? As opposed to it reflecting the meglomaniac tendencies of the builder.....someone needs to do more reading......

ya if ya don't know # about it.

prove all ramps, graffiti (they could be added at anytime) and best of all


if you were a giant space people, would you bring environmental friendly plastic?

thought so.

i stand by my opinion, where is all the hippo poop?

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by FalselyFlagged

 

I'm checking out the video now.
It's my Birthday today so I'll be heading out after and give you my opinion of it later.

PEACE

happy bday! i just had mine~ friday. pieces. no matter what we say we are right.!

"Aliens that can bend space and time need giant rocks for a building? As opposed to it reflecting the meglomaniac tendencies of the builder.....someone needs to do more reading......"


how stupid can u be?


where do you buy the flying saucers? are they gov issue or do you make one in your garage?

you gonna go to a planet and just fade out? or use the very fabric of the world you are on?

i would carve mountains on another world, dummy, what is your problem? not enough female toilets?

think.

eta' you know they can bend space and time? of course that is how they got here!

you read!