Report: Afghan, Iraq wars teaching US gang members military combat

Report: Afghan, Iraq wars teaching US gang members military combat

rawstory.com

By Daniel Tencer
Sunday, July 18th, 2010 -- 2:26 pm

Gang members in the US military are returning home from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan armed with knowledge of military tactics, a fact that could threaten the lives of law enforcement officers in the US and worsen the gang problem, according to a new report from the Chicago Sun-Times.

Jeffrey Stoleson, a Wisconsin corrections officer who has completed multiple tours in Iraq, also told the Sun-Times that civilian contractors are a part of the growing drug-gang problem within the US's overseas wars. Stoleson says he was "involved in

(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
www.suntimes.com
www.stripes.com

Although this story was posted today on Raw Story, Chicago Suntimes and is front page on Stars and Stripes, this knowledge has been circulating for some time. Gangs have been around for a long time, and many have been becoming increasingly violent. We have even seen stories of many gangs from Mexico and Central and South America who have received military training.

Now it seems that the US military is dealing with the gang problem, and unfortunately those gang members who have been in Iraq and Afghanistan are returning home with military training, and a hardened attitude that comes from being in a warzone to resume their gang activities.

The article in the Chicago Suntimes, tells the story of a current Chicago police officer who retired from the US Army who has recently arrested gang members who have the infantry man's bible FM 7-8 in their homes. The threat to law enforcement and private citizens not only in Chicago, but nationwide is of growing concern. The gangs have always been capable of violence, but now many of them are becoming better trained in tactics that can be used against anyone.

rawstory.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

I have FM-78, The Chinook Helicopter Operations Manual and several others on PDF. You do not have to enlist to get them. They are all over the web.

But I agree that gangs in the military are bad news. If I was in the Army, I would be worried about the guys who are supposed to have my back.

reply to post by groingrinder


THe point us not this book or that book, it's that we have given grossly antiamerican subversive criminal elements training and the actual keys to the kingdom. By no realistic estimation is a gangmenber a true american, irresponsible legalities and other black letter law notwithstanding

Originally posted by mordant1
By no realistic estimation is a gangmenber a true american, irresponsible legalities and other black letter law notwithstanding

Considering gang members actually care about everyone else in their gang, as opposed to a government who only cares about itself, I would have to say gangs are more American than what you currently call a country.

US was born from militias and guess what, a gang is a militia. Gangs are made up of all kinds of people, abandoned by their government and disallowed any privileges as a citizen. They're given a choice, band together to survive or become worthless on the street.

reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi


Sorry georgian tovarsh, nie pravada, a criminal gang is a criminal gang that is without morals or goal other than criminality. a militia is a group of people with a national mission. A criminal gang is simply trying to set up a seperate politic preying on the host gang, as you put it by any means available. EVerything isnt equal to everything else, so sorry but no dice. That the gubmint is behaving in a criminal manner itself doesnt detract from those that maintain proper national ideals, as it is the patriots are not treated kindly by the powers that be.
In any respect teaching the defective how to control the normal people is bad juju, Your opinions of any particular aspects of america notwithstanding and essentially off topic.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by mordant1]

Its funny that when a judge orders a gang member to jail, they sometimes offer them a chance to serve in the military.
THATS GOOD.
The military teaches people discipline, honor, courage, committment, and most of all some self respect.
I know plenty of people who were once in "gangs" and after their calling in themilitary, they are now better, and more honorable men than they could have ever thought they were before.

Cops DONT want the people to know how to defend themselves, why would they? They are the enemy in their eyes.

You take a gang member, and turn him into a man. I see nothing but possitives comming out of that.

If they are so worried about these troops comming home and getting back into gangs, then maybe the gov should be more worried about treating their troops better so they dont have to come home and continue on doing what they were doing before.

Originally posted by Common Good
Its funny that when a judge orders a gang member to jail, they sometimes offer them a chance to serve in the military.
THATS GOOD.
The military teaches people discipline, honor, courage, committment, and most of all some self respect.
I know plenty of people who were once in "gangs" and after their calling in themilitary, they are now better, and more honorable men than they could have ever thought they were before.

Cops DONT want the people to know how to defend themselves, why would they? They are the enemy in their eyes.

You take a gang member, and turn him into a man. I see nothing but possitives comming out of that.

If they are so worried about these troops comming home and getting back into gangs, then maybe the gov should be more worried about treating their troops better so they dont have to come home and continue on doing what they were doing before.

\

What percentage of the current crop of gangbangers are likely to become whitebreads because the DI askes them to?
Probably not that many, they do their time, take the money and go back to the world they know and are accepted in with knowledge they really cant be responsible for. That's what I see. This is not the first time, vietnam era gangbangers set up major heroin import businesses that did major damage for some time

reply to post by mordant1


Have you ever been in the military?

I have. I know first hand what it does to punks, it turns them into men.

Military Life and Civilian life are about as comparable as apples and pretzels.



[edit on 18-7-2010 by Common Good]

reply to post by Common Good


Funny. when I was in I seemed to see that it only taught 95% them to fake it for the 'man', but the A/F tended to get the smarter ones to begin with.

reply to post by Wayne60


Yeah...not exactly news or a shock...not as if we didn't know this was coming...

2006: U.S. is recruiting misfits for army / Felons, racists, gang members fill in the ranks

2007 Exclusive: Gangs Spreading In The Military

2007: Gang activity on the rise in the ranks

I'm sure there are positive outcomes of some gang members going into the military and coming out the better for it. Based on the information in the articles, this is not what is being reported. What has been reported are those who were gang members before the military, and returned to the gangs when they were discharged and have since been arrested for committing crimes.

What some people don't understand is that to a gang member, the gang is their family, and with few exceptions once you join a gang it is for life. So when these guys are discharged and go back to the hood, it is business as usual only with enhanced capabilities.

As former military myself, I agree the gov could treat the troops better. And it continually ticks me off that vets with injuries and disabilities are not cared for properly, and haven't for a long time. But that's for another conversation.

Nice thread, I especially enjoyed the comments from our Russian comrades.

It is always nice to gain an international presoective and realize none of us are alone or held above certain ...issues

I would have to think that the Gangs would have to be actually teaching the Military a thing or two about urban warfare and how to Actually Win.

Just me meandering mind... but who do you think will actually Run the cities in the US if the SHTF.

I doubt it will be the military, same here as in the war zones gangs are used to war and they know how its done

reply to post by mordant1


Well, thats the Air Force.

Didnt you guys get maids the whole time you were in training?

And the last time I checked, the Air Force really doesnt have "Combat Training".

And the training that they do have, is merely a joke.





Oh yea- One more thing.

I dont really think that the police have to worry about those trained killer air force men comming and teaching all these gang bangers about combat.



_edit_ with all respect to your service, I will keep this as civil as I can.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by Common Good]

Sorry to tell you, guys, but the U.S. intelligence community utilized members of gangs that had been trained in WW I to do some of the dirty deeds that helped expand American interests into widespread areas of new influence all the way back in the Twenties. Think back to the Chicago gangs that used military tactics, armored cars, and sub-machine guns during the "Prohibition Wars" over 80 years ago.

It was the same after WW II, Vietnam, etc. many of the CIA assassins during the Cold War were military-trained snipers from the wars of attrition all over the world from 1945 until the Soviets fell in 1989.

Nothing new here, folks.

Originally posted by Common Good
reply to post by mordant1

 

Well, thats the Air Force.

Didnt you guys get maids the whole time you were in training?

And the last time I checked, the Air Force really doesnt have "Combat Training".

And the training that they do have, is merely a joke.

Oh yea- One more thing.

I dont really think that the police have to worry about those trained killer air force men comming and teaching all these gang bangers about combat.

_edit_ with all respect to your service, I will keep this as civil as I can.

[edit on 18-7-2010 by Common Good]

I think your have wandered far off the reservation, topic wise, trying to make this personal for some reason. My crews carried rather sizable payloads that made lotsa kinda funny clouds when they went off.
What did uncle let YOU do?

[edit on 18-7-2010 by mordant1]

reply to post by mordant1


Hey now, dont get angry, you started with that "we tend to be smarter.." crap.

Yea, you guys do push buttons well. I will give you that.

And I dont think I was very far off topic- Like I said, I dont think anyone has to worry about Air Force vets training criminals about Military Combat.

Trust me, I have personaly seen you guys on the firing range.

Nothing Personal ~!

Like I said, I am going to be civil since you are a Vet, and you of all people should know that every branch of service makes fun of the others, so dont take it too seriously now,k? I know Im not.

Every branch of the military has a purpose, all different from the other.

Air force plays in the skies, The Navy plays in the water, The Army plays on land and air, and The Marines do all of the above.

ALL of equal importance.

reply to post by Common Good


Having been in the U.S. Army and U.S. Air Force, generally the combat training per individual is considerably tougher in the Army. That said, I would dare you to walk into a bar full of USAF PJs and repeat your statement!

Even at that, you get some grunts on the ground in a tough firefight and there's nothing they love more than a flight of F-16s of F-15Es rolling in to deliver their ordnance of HE on target. Anyone from ground combat that I know who received that air support would defend their Air Force comrades in a hearbeat!

Common Good, how many months of active duty did you spend in combat? How many times did you have people taking shots at you because they wanted you to die?

No offense, but taking a simple discussion and going personal works both ways my friend!

reply to post by Truth1000


First off. Read my above post.

Second off, nobody is attacking anyone.

3rd- I live right by Nellis AFB- I know A LOT of Air Force peoplke who are good friends of mine. we joke about these things all the time.

4th- nobody was talking to you, now were they?

5th- I was out of the Marine Corps one month prior to Sept 11., so there wasnt any "war on terror" at the time.

6th- I was a close combat instructer for 2 years.

7th- I was on the largest marine Corps training base- you may know it as the stumps.

8th- Ive trained with Army personal in Maryland- the base you know as Aberdeen.

9th- I kicked the crap out of several of those army brats because they were getting pissed that us marines were taking their Army girls out on dates because we had "the right stuff".

and last but not least- You...are a troll.

reply to post by Common Good


Range? I got a competition marksman medal, first place, with a rack m16 and I dont think any branchis better than the other, so what did you hear exactly?
My ex was a jag so I got to hear about all those that were getting busted and discharged and why.
On the whole the experience was disappointing,piss poor moral and discipline, everyone punching their ticket and setting up for a disability claim, and I resigned my commission is disgust what with the idiocy and corruption I came across.
Bottom line, gangsters of today are not the mob of the 40's. Mafia was essentially criminals but had some vague love for the country, however perverse but not now, gangstas now, are antiamerican anti caucasian antiresponsibility playa subversives, by tradition, straight up.
Now, some small perentage of urban youth did find benefit in discipline purpose and a new national family but proportionally even among the lifers, general intelligncce was piss poor. Enlisted just passing through? Deplorable for the most part even the whites, they be tryin to be all gangsta and shiznit.