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Originally posted by thebulldog
reply to post by UsernameCory
watching this healthcare thing unfold makes me glad I live in Canada. Its not perfect but we didn't have to mortgage our house to get my mom cancer treatment.
Cheers
The biggest problem with our current system is GOVERNMENT both on the State and Federal levels. They handicap the insurance industry with rules and mandates that raise the costs of doing business and hamper competition.
Its not perfect but we didn't have to mortgage our house to get my mom cancer treatment.
Originally posted by jdub297
Employer-provided insurance developed with NO government involvement whatsoever. It was a business tactic to attract the best workers.
Originally posted by jdub297
Some Americans already belong to or participate in a "system that doesn't bankrupt individuals." It is called "consumer-driven health care."
Are you opposed to letting consumers of ANY servic Te (and especially health care) have control of the basic transactions and decisions?
It necessitates lowered standards
Because Canfield was self-employed, there are no records of her business, and she said most of the people whose houses she cleaned are now in nursing homes or have died. She said that she doesn't have any savings left, and that with at least a month of chemotherapy still to go, she won't be generating income anytime soon.
However, Canfield's fears that she could lose her home - if, for example, the hospital tried to put a lien on it - are not necessarily unfounded, Sornberger said.
"There are other hospitals that will do that," he said. "There's nothing in the industry that says you can't do it. So she could go 5 miles to some other facility and find that they do have that practice in place."
And Canfield pointed out that even if she does get financial aid, it could take weeks before that money kicks in. Despite the hospital's assurances, her original fears remain.
"The taxes still need to be paid," she said. "I have a home equity line that needs to be paid back every month."
Originally posted by Southern Guardian
Originally posted by jdub297
Some Americans already belong to or participate in a "system that doesn't bankrupt individuals." It is called "consumer-driven health care."
And exactly has consumer driven healthcare done over the years?
In 1960 the US life expectancy rate was 17th in the world. Today its 40th.
Developing countries like China had been climbing up the rank while we have been downgrading.
Today we are 37th in Healthcare in the world below many developing countries. We were 12th in the 1960's
I could bring a tonne of statistics to show you how this nation has been declining in welfare for its own citizens. Ironically, we could see a definite pattern in the 1960's before the privatization of the Nixon administration, and its impact today. And yet there are still people willing to deny it over the sake of ideology.
You see consumerdriver healthcare is effective? Yet, we have held a consumer driven healthcare industry for last 4 decades.
How the hell can consumers control prices when healthcare corporations work in cooperation with one another to rise premiums and pre-existing conditions?
How does the consumer control the market when these corporations themselves work hand in hand to benefit eachother?
By your assumption, if a consumer doesnt like his or her healthcare insurance and cannot afford it, they can just move on to another corporation but hows that when these corporations are working side by side to increase costs?
If a consumer is prevented from coverages due to pre-existing conditions in one insurance firm, how the heck is it going to be any different in another insruance firm?
You assume that consumers have options in a the private insurance industry, and for that to happen, you must deny the reality of the fact that these corporations work hand in hand in price fixing. Becuase this is exactly what has been happening over the years.
Pure consumer driven healthcare with no parachute coverage is a joke and it brings this nations health down to developing world standards. We had this system for 4 decades, and we have seen it steadly get worse.
Originally posted by Byrd
She's got an income of $6,000/year.
While she's a "candidate" for aid (so says the clinic, scrambling to justify itself) no one apparently told her that this was available (some of you can relate to this).
The liens she took out for her treatment were not with the clinic, but rather with other lenders. Unless there's a homestead law there in Ohio (like the one that kept my mother-in-law's house from being sold out under her for debts), she would be at risk for the money.
She's only in her early 50's, and until her story was brought to national attention, nobody bothered to tell her that she was eligible for Medicare. The places where she was treated might have told her. They just didn't.
Her plight is common to the self-employed:
Because Canfield was self-employed, there are no records of her business, and she said most of the people whose houses she cleaned are now in nursing homes or have died.
She said that she doesn't have any savings left, and that with at least a month of chemotherapy still to go, she won't be generating income anytime soon.
Like many of the people we see at the senior center, they sort of "drop through the cracks" of the system. Counselors spend time with them telling them how to find aid and wade through the paperwork to get on Medicare and so forth.
Being a high profile case, she may get her eligibility confirmed within weeks. I think that if you talk to people (like myself) who have tried to get people on Medicare and Social Security disability, you will find that the process takes months... if not years.
Did you notice this part?
However, Canfield's fears that she could lose her home - if, for example, the hospital tried to put a lien on it - are not necessarily unfounded, Sornberger said.
"There are other hospitals that will do that," he said. "There's nothing in the industry that says you can't do it. So she could go 5 miles to some other facility and find that they do have that practice in place."
So she probably has heard of people there in Ohio who became ill and who DID lose their houses when the hospital put a lien on it. Since she did cleaning for the elderly, she undoubtedly saw cases where the family had to sell off everything and move their relative to a nursing home.
And Canfield pointed out that even if she does get financial aid, it could take weeks before that money kicks in. Despite the hospital's assurances, her original fears remain.
"The taxes still need to be paid," she said. "I have a home equity line that needs to be paid back every month."
The "free market" hasn't worked well for health care.
There was a piece on NPR recently where they called around and priced a CT scan from different places (there was, as I remember, a $10,000 difference in cost for the same procedure, all within a 20 minute drive from a location).
And I hope that you and the others here will take some time and volunteer with places (like a local senior center -- as I do) to help folks get medicare and medicaid and deal with problems in our health care system. You would get a feel for what it's like at "ground zero."
I think it would be very enlightening for you.
Originally posted by jdub297
We haven't had consumer-driven health care since the proliferation of health,
Your sources, such as WHO, are wrong.
Funny how the "decline in welfare" has coincided with grater governmental intrusion!
Nixon did nothing for privatization. He sought and endorsed more government interference in private decisions than ANY recent Republican president. You obviously do not know anything about wage controls,
price controls,
Fact is, when consumers have had real control, they HAVE restrained prices,