Number of victims to unknown virus growing! State of emergency to be imposed in Ukraine?

reply to post by dnvrliz


Someone waaay back reported 1st death was from a guy returning from St Peyersburg

jvi.asm.org...

here is where I got the SWINE FEVER info....read the last part carefully.

Situation update #13 from RSOE EDIS. Notice the #'s of infected has gone up 5,000 in 9 minutes form situation update #12 of 185,000 to 190,000. At this rate, we'll wake up tomorrow to find out the entire country has been infected:

Situation Update No. 13
On 02.11.2009 at 03:56 GMT+2

After 60 people died of respiratory problems in one week, Ukraine has made an urgent appeal to world powers to help it fight the swine flu. President Viktor Yushchenko has written to the United States, the European Union, NATO, and Ukraine's neighbors, asking for drugs and equipment to fight the spread of the A(H1N1) virus. The country has asked for 16 tons of Tamiflu, an antiviral drug, from Switzerland, the president's office said. The country's health ministry said there are currently more than 190,000 cases of swine flu, with nearly 8,000 needing hospital treatment. The government has ordered a three-week closure of schools and cinemas to combat the disease. Poland and Slovakia responded immediately to Yushchenko's appeal on Sunday night and dispatched protective masks and supplies of Tamiflu. Swine flu has become a political issue in Ukraine as both Yushchenko and his rival, Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko, are readying for the presidential election scheduled for January.

The lie, at first, tastes sweet, but in the end, tastes bitter.
The truth, at first tastes bitter, but in the end, tastes sweet.
Buddha

reply to post by nikiano

Ok, Beefcake, first you say that you think that it's hospital aquired pneumonia, then you change your story and say that it's community aquired pneumonia. Please don't change your story and then tell me you said something you didn't in the first place.

Not sure why you are splitting hairs Community Acquired Pneumonia is is mostly caught in Hospitals

That being said i believe it is the extreme patient load and conditions in the hospitals that is causing it and we will of course not know anything until we have official word.

But the speculations on this thread right now is: what is causing the pneumonia (and the original respiratory infection it developed from) in the Ukraine....a virus or a bacteria? (And also, of course....where did it come from? A mutation? Bioterrorism? Another virus completely??)That's what we don't know, and we probably won't know until the labs can tell us.

Going on the pretense that we will not know anything until we get lab results i guess you are also saying this whole thread is a waste because we don't know anything yet.

None of us know anything at all tbh everyone is giving their opinion and i think mine is just as much a possibility as any of them including a bio attack.

I get it you don't like me but my opinion on what could be killing them is very possible and also conspiratorial because the gov't would never admit to the hospitals actually causing the deaths.





[edit on 1-11-2009 by Beefcake]

Here's something interesting:

I read on another thread that Elton John spent 2 weeks in the Ukraine before he came down ill with the flu. Now they are reporting on Drudge that he is indeed ill with the flu and also with an e-coli infection.

(Of course, they don't say anything about him being in the Ukraine for 2 weeks.)

In any case....regarding the e-coli infection. I remember hearing cases of food poisoning where e-coli gets into the body and liquifies organs...including the brain...and kills people very, very quickly.

Elton John is supposedly recovering fine from his influenza and e-coli (according to the article), but what if the e-coli is what is causing the hemorrhaging in the body in some of the other patients?

Anyway, just thought I'd throw that in....pure speculation at this point.....just trying to connect the dots.




[edit on 1-11-2009 by nikiano]

Originally posted by mkross1983
reply to post by dnvrliz

 

Someone waaay back reported 1st death was from a guy returning from St Peyersburg

Yeah, I saw that and they say that the SWINE FEVER started there, way too many coincidences.

reply to post by Beefcake


Um, no, you're wrong. Community aquired pneumonia is not caught in the hospital...it's caught in the community. Hospital aquired pneumonia is caught in the hospital. Hence...the different names.

And I am not splitting hairs. you stated something that was wrong (that patients were dying because of hospital aquired pneumonia because they were on vents!) which is completely false. And if you worked in the health care field, you would know that.

But...forget it, I'm done arguing with you. You obviously don't work in the health care field, and you're trying to differentiate between hospital aquired pneumonia and community aquired pneumonia using "wikipedia" as your source.

I'm placing you on "ignore" because I think you're trying to detract from the original discussion, and unfortunately.... it's working on me.




[edit on 1-11-2009 by nikiano]

Okay I've been following this thread since the first few pages and here are some of my thoughts. I don't believe it's the it's hospital acquired pneumonia because that doesn't explain the people who haven't been to the hospital. I'm 99% sure that it's not something like Ebola or Marburg because then tens of thousands of people would be dead. The first reports that I saw were talking about some sort of pneumoniac plague, which I believe is still on the table. With all that said to me the most plausible theory is that the H1N1 became more lethal causing people to contract some sort of pneumoniac type disease much like the 1918 Spanias Flu. Just my thoughts!

Originally posted by nikiano
reply to post by Beefcake

 

Um, no, you're wrong. Community aquired pneumonia is not caught in the hospital...it's caught in the community. Hospital aquired pneumonia is caught in the hospital. Hence...the different names.


And no, this thread isn't a waste of time. But you stated something that was wrong (that patients were dying because of hospital aquired pneumonia) which is completely false. And if you worked in the health care field, you would know that.

Forget it, I'm done arguing with you. You obviously don't work in the health care field. I'm placing you on "ignore."


[edit on 1-11-2009 by nikiano]

NO you are wrong
en.wikipedia.org...

Community-acquired pneumonia (CAP) is a disease in which individuals who have not recently been hospitalized develop an infection of the lungs (pneumonia)

There you are corrected Seemingly you don't work in the health field either.

[edit on 1-11-2009 by Beefcake]

reply to post by Bcs8484


Yeah, I think that's probably the most likely scenario, too.

This would also make sense as to why the older people are not getting it, because they already built up immunity. Usually, the oldest are the first to die in a flu pandemic, because they are the weakest. But, they seem to have immunity to this strain.

Originally posted by Bcs8484
Okay I've been following this thread since the first few pages and here are some of my thoughts. I don't believe it's the it's hospital acquired pneumonia because that doesn't explain the people who haven't been to the hospital. I'm 99% sure that it's not something like Ebola or Marburg because then tens of thousands of people would be dead. The first reports that I saw were talking about some sort of pneumoniac plague, which I believe is still on the table. With all that said to me the most plausible theory is that the H1N1 became more lethal causing people to contract some sort of pneumoniac type disease much like the 1918 Spanias Flu. Just my thoughts!

I respect your response. I disagree but i have no proof of my theory i just have internet sources. My wife is a nurse but pediatric and she isn't a disease specialist.

I do for sure think that this is due to extreme patient overload and nothing more. I also maintain that hospital conditions there although decent(don't want to make peeps angry) are not equipped for a massive influx of patients this is a ripe ground for mass cross infection and viruses that are normally not a big deal can become dangerous when facilities aren't up to snuff.

Originally posted by Beefcake

No one who has decided that the flu vaccine is poison is going to get the flu shot because of this thread so i'm not saying you are a paid blogger but for the ones in this thread you are wasting your time.

We aren't scared.

Move on from this thread this will amount to nothing except poor hospital and sanitary conditions making a situation worse.

Beefcake - you turn up at the end of the thread, and obviously have read NOTHING on the thread.

The consensus is that this is NOTHING to do with swine flu. I certainly am not taking any vaccine.

This is being reported in western MSM as SWINE FLU - and sure, their angle is to sell the vaccine. but this thread is nothing to do with that - go and read dammit.

What is occurring in Ukraine is being reported by their prime minister as NOT being the swine flu - but rather some other unidentified disease.

You accuse others of ignorance - but it is yours that is showing. READ the thread.

I would say 99% of people who are contributing are CONVINCED that the swine flu vaccine hype is a total hoax - but by all local (which I consider RELIABLE) reports - this is NOT swine flu - and it certainly isn't going to sell any swine flu vaccines.

Some people are insisting on maintaining that it IS the swine flu - and that is their prerogative - but it also seems they haven't read the thread properly - or simply dismiss any evidence that conflicts with their own analysis.

It IS possible that ALL recorded sickness in Ukraine is simply related to seasonal, or swine flu. Its possible - but that conclusion flies in the face of MANY local reports, and statements by the countries top health professional and prime minister - who state it is NOT swine flu, but that it is UNKNOWN.

I have read the entire thread and every link, when you have done the same - come back and you might have more useful input.

So glad Dr Beefcake is here to save the day... and add absolutely nothing except testosterone and an opinion over and over.
The CDC has predicted that H1N1 would mutate and when it does the world pandemic will take off. Could be why they launched the vaccine at the time they did, taking precautions in numbers of deaths and making the public aware. Emergency management agencies all over the US have been doing drills and increasing inventories.

ternopil webcam
www.opentopia.com...

Ivano-Frankivsk: Vichovyy Square
webcams.ukrtelecom.ua...

doesnt look like much is goin on...

[edit on 1-11-2009 by TheCoffinman]

Just a couple quick questions??

What is the Worldwide death toll for Influenza???

What is the Worldwide death toll for H1N1???

THX

reply to post by JJay55



Yeah and the ironic thing is Americans are NOT prepared for a major flu pandemic. Obama issues a state of Emergency and it's Monday night football and cake as usual. How many people went to the grocery store to stock up for the next few months? If the government declares a state of emergency it's their responsibility to tell the people what to expect and to prepare for the unexpected. What are we supposed to read into what this state of emergency entails? I personally am stocked up pretty good. But many will be SOL if this crap hits the US and our economy is shut down. Our government has done a terrible job preparing the general public. But maybe that's what they want. Instead of people looking out for themselves the gubmint will come in and save the day through martial law.

reply to post by Amagnon

Beefcake - you turn up at the end of the thread, and obviously have read NOTHING on the thread. The consensus is that this is NOTHING to do with swine flu. I certainly am not taking any vaccine.

I POSTED ON PAGE 17 that it wasn't swine flu how is that "at the end of the thread"

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Massive fail on your part posted way earlier in the thread not at the end and i posted the Health Minister saying it isn't swine flu.

Fair criticism is fair but you are just hating on me
Read the thread next time before commenting on somebody coming in at the end.

PAGE 17 i posted that it isn't swine flu!!!

reply to post by nikiano


I saw that too, I guess Elton and His partner were there in the Ukraine to adopt a child who had HIV....Im not sure how long he stayed or where all he traveled there, that would be interesting to know if he was on the side of the country where this virus/bactirial infection, has begun....

So one report of a man who is coughing up blood and choking on it having "black ears" means we are dealing with a tropical virus of some kind? It wouldn't be more likely that he was suffering from lack of oxygen and turning blue?

What do we know about the swine flu?
In the most severe cases it kills people quickly, often within a single day. These victims die from a cytokine storm in which the immune system attacks the lungs and causes them to drown in blood. I posted the still unreported symptoms of shedding skin and orifice bleeding in the worst cases six months plus ago.

The most severe cases who do not die end up on ventilators because of the lung damage. The flu gives way to a rapid case of pneumonia in most of these cases. A large number of victims who do not succumb to the cytokine storm end up with secondary pneumonia infections (look up the case histories from La Gloria, Mexico - the supposed ground zero for swine flu).

The swine flu mainly kills young adults and children, the majority being around 19 yrs old. We have almost no reports of deaths in the elderly from swine flu.

I have no clue why people want to invent some new, mystery virus when we have one going around that matches every single aspect of the cases. Is it because you don't want people to get vaccinated? Fine, I really don't care - I'm not telling people what to do in that regard.

What we have seen from day one is governments and the WHO trying to downplay the number of swine flu cases. We have this weird duality of seemingly opposing actions - on one hand people accuse them of fear mongering (sometimes rightly so) but on the other we have proven they are under reporting the statistics.

The test they are using in the Ukraine is less than 50 percent accurate and the post mortem blood test cannot detect swine flu - this was posted on ATS months ago. If they come back and claim a small number of deaths as being "swine flu" I would hope people will finally demand an answer as to what the true cause of death was then. So far they have failed to provide that answer. (Mexico City where 400 plus swine flu deaths become a dozen overnight with no explanation for the remaining 400 deaths ever given, for example).

If the idea is to push a deadly vaccine on the public then why do they keep under-reporting the number of deaths? There's only one scenario that makes sense, IMO. They want people scared enough to get a vaccine but not so scared they stop shopping, going to sporting events and work. I see no other reasonable explanation for this duality in behavior.

As for the spraying - there is a response plan called "aeroclave" which calls for spraying a form of hydrogen peroxide out of airplanes. The PHD who invented it went on to found a company called "aeroclave" which provides the same service for vehicles and buildings. The UK ministry of health is the only agency to publish in the open about it but if you search around you can find it. I wouldn't venture outdoors while spraying is going on just to be safe but I wouldn't assume its a bio-weapon either.

Originally posted by Luppakorva
reply to post by Amagnon

 

Thank you,

I decided to go on but mostly with information that I can back up at least somehow, I have been pretty much silent about the information what I have had from the sources I'm unable to back up for now since they would just raise questions, questions and more questions about their credibility and that's something this thread is suffering already too much.

Hey, hell - people are posting what their DREAMS are about! As long we we understand the context of your information - then please by all means keep supplying it. You know someone in the Russian govt - you said he was senior - thats good enough for me - I am interested in what they might be thinking and saying.

Doesnt mean I believe it - but it all adds to the overall picture of events.