Obese blamed for the world's ills

reply to post by the titor experience

I must have misread that i'm sorry but my point still stands. Lets say you have a horribly obese person who's about to have a heart attack (or in the middle of one) and a non smoker who exercises who is suffering an angina attack. The person in the most danger gets treatment surely?

[edit on 20-5-2008 by ImaginaryReality1984]

reply to post by the titor experience

Fat people are not taxed more because they buy more food. Firstly, they CHOOSE to eat more food whereas tax is something people have no choice over. Secondly, it is cheaper to eat poorly (junk food is cheaper than healthy food) so those who actually look after themselves pay MORE for their food.

So, what you're saying then, is that people who are already having so much trouble paying for food that it is causing them detrimental health problems, should pay even more taxes?

Sounds like a nice way to speed up the genocide of the poor if you ask me.

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
reply to post by the titor experience

 

I must have misread that i'm sorry but my point still stands. Lets say you have a horribly obese person who's about to have a heart attack (or in the middle of one) and a non smoker who exercises who is suffering an angina attack. The person in the most danger gets treatment surely?

[edit on 20-5-2008 by ImaginaryReality1984]

But you have completely missed the most important part of my situation X. Both people, the fit and healthy person who has spent a life looking after themselves AND the obese person, are in need of urgent medical attention EQUALLY - they present with the same problem and symptoms. Who deserves the bed and medical attention? Not only that, their are HUGE risks associated with medical treatment for obese people - they are more likely to die when under the knife due to the stress placed on the body - that is why many surgeons elect not to go ahead with optional surgery for obese people as they are so much more likely to die on the operating table.

Originally posted by jackinthebox
reply to post by the titor experience

 

Fat people are not taxed more because they buy more food. Firstly, they CHOOSE to eat more food whereas tax is something people have no choice over. Secondly, it is cheaper to eat poorly (junk food is cheaper than healthy food) so those who actually look after themselves pay MORE for their food.

So, what you're saying then, is that people who are already having so much trouble paying for food that it is causing them detrimental health problems, should pay even more taxes?

Sounds like a nice way to speed up the genocide of the poor if you ask me.

In Australia, the healthy food like fruit and veges and meats are far more expensive than a pack of Oreo's. I dont earn much but choose to treat my body like a temple and i suffer for that because i pay more.

There is no need for genocide towards obese people - they are doing perfectly well at ensuring their own premature death with the foods they eat and extra weight they carry around. At the end of the day, it is their choice.....i just object to having to pay for their over-use of the Australian health system.

[edit on 20-5-2008 by the titor experience]

reply to post by the titor experience

But you have completely missed the most important part of my situation X. Both people, the fit and healthy person who has spent a life looking after themselves AND the obese person, are in need of urgent medical attention EQUALLY - they present with the same problem and symptoms. Who deserves the bed and medical attention?

The stark truth and answer to your question is, the person most likely to survive.

reply to post by the titor experience

There is no need for genocide towards obese people - they are doing perfectly well at ensuring their own premature death with the foods they eat and extra weight they carry around. At the end of the day, it is their choice.....i just object to having to pay for their over-use of the Australian health system.

Perhaps it is a bit different down under, but here in the US, it most certainly is NOT their choice. I happen to live on donated food at the moment. And on the ocassion that I get a few bucks, I spend it at a fast food joint Dollar Menu.

My claims are substantiated here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

and here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by jackinthebox
reply to post by the titor experience

 

There is no need for genocide towards obese people - they are doing perfectly well at ensuring their own premature death with the foods they eat and extra weight they carry around. At the end of the day, it is their choice.....i just object to having to pay for their over-use of the Australian health system.

Perhaps it is a bit different down under, but here in the US, it most certainly is NOT their choice. I happen to live on donated food at the moment. And on the ocassion that I get a few bucks, I spend it at a fast food joint Dollar Menu.

My claims are substantiated here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

and here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The sooner people start to take personal responsibility for their own wellbeing, as well as the state they find their life in, the sooner they will also see they are capable of taking responsibility of getting themselves OUT of the situation they are in.

I do not doubt that food companies are doing what your posted thread suggests. But my friend, it is you who choose to buy their burger. Spend the few bucks you receive on seeds and start growing your own food maybe? Or perhaps save it on whatever is most likely to get you out of poverty.......the longer you make excuses for yourself the longer your predicament will last - and i learnt that the hard way.

You are your own master - unless you believe otherwise in which case you become the victim you believe yourself to be.

Originally posted by the titor experience

Originally posted by jackinthebox
reply to post by the titor experience

 

There is no need for genocide towards obese people - they are doing perfectly well at ensuring their own premature death with the foods they eat and extra weight they carry around. At the end of the day, it is their choice.....i just object to having to pay for their over-use of the Australian health system.

Perhaps it is a bit different down under, but here in the US, it most certainly is NOT their choice. I happen to live on donated food at the moment. And on the ocassion that I get a few bucks, I spend it at a fast food joint Dollar Menu.

My claims are substantiated here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

and here...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The sooner people start to take personal responsibility for their own wellbeing, as well as the state they find their life in, the sooner they will also see they are capable of taking responsibility of getting themselves OUT of the situation they are in.

I do not doubt that food companies are doing what your posted thread suggests. But my friend, it is you who choose to buy their burger. Spend the few bucks you receive on seeds and start growing your own food maybe? Or perhaps save it on whatever is most likely to get you out of poverty.......the longer you make excuses for yourself the longer your predicament will last - and i learnt that the hard way.

You are your own master - unless you believe otherwise in which case you become the victim you believe yourself to be.

Having lived in the inner city in various points of NYC I have to say that I tend to think the personal responsibility canard is a bit full of crappe. They simply do not have access to what you do where ever you are. I am not saying it is expensive, I am saying what vegetable matter is around is disgusting. Certainly not what you find in Connecticut or more well to do areas of NYC.

Apart from that, I think the real enemy to them is a lack of education. Public edcation in US has been under attack since the 70s and is pretty much dead now thanks to GWB's every child left behind initiative. The fact of the matter is THEY want you to be uneducated and sick for maximum profit potential.

reply to post by TheRedneck



You said it Redneck...I am a nurse and a person with thyroid problems...and "working" at weight with certain meds one might be taking and/or thyroid or hormonal and/or genetic issues WON'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE~!~~!

All the wordy blabbering everyone is doing won't make any difference...by the way by the way, I am fortunate not to be obese as any weight gain makes me uncomfortable physically...that is why I say fortunate...my mother was the only one in her family who was pleasantly plump...not obese and she always hated her body though it was beautiful as she was beautiful physically and spiritually. She was a nurse as well. The only time she became thin is while she was dying of Alzheimer's disease. If you don't know, and many don't that disease affects the body as well and eventually kills you physically.

I would have loved my pleasantly plump mother to continue to grace this world rather than to care for her thin dying self and see her waste away.

I don't know about you all actually trying to weigh out the pros and cons of that hate filled statement for England. If you don't see it you don't recognize hate and that you are somehow crazy enough to buy into it and INDEED you will be next...then it won't seem so comfy while others pick you apart like a maniac tearing off a flies wings.

Do unto others people...and look to the source.

This is what gets nothing done in this world. We always have to blame someone for the problems in our world when we should be looking for solutions. Taxes on the obese are not going to fix the problem. The worlds ills are not going away by blaming it on the obese. It's educating the people better on the subject of obesity and teaching our children good eating habits.

Originally posted by Solarskye
This is what gets nothing done in this world. We always have to blame someone for the problems in our world when we should be looking for solutions. Taxes on the obese are not going to fix the problem. The worlds ills are not going away by blaming it on the obese. It's educating the people better on the subject of obesity and teaching our children good eating habits.

Can anyone deny that what you put in your mouth is YOUR CHOICE. I was once fat, and i blame myself for that. But it sure as hell was no education program which helped me lose 26kg so that i can now run 21km non stop. It is called owning your behaviour - and maybe having to pay extra tax would allow society to stop enabling obese people to have unhealthy eating habits. It may also be a wake up call to them.

Because like it or not - guess what - food companies are still going to sell crappy food and government education is not going to solve your problem. Blame them as much as you want but they are a convenient scapegoat.

How about educating yourself? How about not being reliant on Government education programs so that you are told "facts" by the powers that be. As far as i know, some countries still allow people to read books of their own accord?

The solution starts inside of yourself. You fix your own eating habits, then it will be passed down onto your children.

Surely, on a website like this, reliance on a Government is something people are aware is not that great an idea?

Stop looking for the answers externally and look within - the man in the mirror is where it starts.

[edit on 21-5-2008 by the titor experience]

[edit on 21-5-2008 by the titor experience]

reply to post by the titor experience


I hate anything that has the government stamp on it. I hate government schools and wish for them to go back to public and private education. I don't rely on GOVERNMENT! for anyhting in my life. You're right about looking to yourself and I praise you for losing the weight. But taxes is just another government program that needs to stay out of it! Yes you need to educate yourself and to try harder. Government sure isn't and won't help the situation.

Originally posted by the titor experience

Originally posted by Solarskye
This is what gets nothing done in this world. We always have to blame someone for the problems in our world when we should be looking for solutions. Taxes on the obese are not going to fix the problem. The worlds ills are not going away by blaming it on the obese. It's educating the people better on the subject of obesity and teaching our children good eating habits.

Can anyone deny that what you put in your mouth is YOUR CHOICE. I was once fat, and i blame myself for that. But it sure as hell was no education program which helped me lose 26kg so that i can now run 21km non stop. It is called owning your behaviour - and maybe having to pay extra tax would allow society to stop enabling obese people to have unhealthy eating habits. It may also be a wake up call to them.

Because like it or not - guess what - food companies are still going to sell crappy food and government education is not going to solve your problem. Blame them as much as you want but they are a convenient scapegoat.

How about educating yourself? How about not being reliant on Government education programs so that you are told "facts" by the powers that be. As far as i know, some countries still allow people to read books of their own accord?

The solution starts inside of yourself. You fix your own eating habits, then it will be passed down onto your children.

Surely, on a website like this, reliance on a Government is something people are aware is not that great an idea?

Stop looking for the answers externally and look within - the man in the mirror is where it starts.

[edit on 21-5-2008 by the titor experience]

[edit on 21-5-2008 by the titor experience]

I get it. You don't want to be bothered. Thats fine. Doesn't mean there are not answers and it doesnt absolve all of us from being responsible for all of us, choose to ignore it or not.

reply to post by Extralien


what the hell, guys. You americans buy oil much cheaper than we europeans do ( 2 bucks for a liter !!! ) BUT your cars are oil-thirsty , so before blaming the fat guys, just throw an eye on your mile count when you fill your tank.

Originally posted by Solarskye
reply to post by the titor experience

 

I hate anything that has the government stamp on it. I hate government schools and wish for them to go back to public and private education. I don't rely on GOVERNMENT! for anyhting in my life. You're right about looking to yourself and I praise you for losing the weight. But taxes is just another government program that needs to stay out of it! Yes you need to educate yourself and to try harder. Government sure isn't and won't help the situation.

I hear what you are saying and have heard it a lot on these threads, but to me it seems like one thing to say 'our govt is a failure', and a completely different thing to say that the concept of govt cannot therefore work and the better idea is to abandon it while taking an axe to the root of the tree. Why not just fund public schools?

Originally posted by jackinthebox
Actually, the lack of motivation is most often chemically induced, through the foods that people eat. Even fresh foods purchased at the supermarket, not just fast food. This is a part of the reason that America in particular is suffering from obesity. Americans didn't suddenly decide to become lazy in the last few years. The chemicals are in the water we drink (fluoride) and the foods we eat. The lack of motivation and energy is the chemically induced cause of obesity.

Did you really expect people to suddenly become motivated after they've been drugged?



[edit on 5/19/0808 by jackinthebox]

We have minds, powerful minds at that. You just have to do it. People in today's world/society often think more about something than doing it.

reply to post by the titor experience

But my friend, it is you who choose to buy their burger.

And what choice is there really? I can't even buy a piece of fruit at the supermarket for a dollar. Not that it would be much more nutritious anyway.

Spend the few bucks you receive on seeds and start growing your own food maybe?

And skip eating until the crop comes up. Not to mention the fact that I have no place to start a garden. I actually have tried planting in some out of the way places on property that is not mine, but the crops always get destroyed or stolen. I have scavenged for berries though when they're in season, and used to raid the apple orchard at night until they turned it into a housing development. I actually stole from people's gardens too at one time. This was the first time I was homeless, a little more than a decade ago.

By the way. I made my way out of poverty before. It is not an easy thing to do at all. In fact, it is damn near impossible. I consider myself lucky. And being homeless once again, I can only hope that a bit of luck will favor me once again.

You are your own master - unless you believe otherwise in which case you become the victim you believe yourself to be.

No man is an island. We all rely on the people around us, and are affected by the people around us wether we like it or not.




[edit on 5/22/0808 by jackinthebox]

reply to post by the titor experience

Can anyone deny that what you put in your mouth is YOUR CHOICE.

Yes. I deny it. Poor people do not have the choice. Even people of average means have little choice, except perhaps to pick their poison. As I have already shown, even foods that are thought to be healthy, are now laced with chemicals, modified, treated, and stripped of nutrients.

Those who ara able to take advantage of better foods, should certainly do so. I am not trying to argue against taking some responsibility for yourself. But this issue goes far beyond personal responsibility.

It is called owning your behaviour - and maybe having to pay extra tax would allow society to stop enabling obese people to have unhealthy eating habits. It may also be a wake up call to them.

Do you honestly believe that fat people don't know that they are fat? And that they are in danger of dieing? If a heart attack isn't enough of a wake up call, then some bull# tax certainly isn't going to solve the problem.

As I stated earlier, taxation will only exacerbate the problem. Here in the US, it is the poorest states who are suffering from the highest obesity rates. Is this just a coincidence? No. Poor people end up fat because they cannot afford to eat properly, not because they don't want to.

Originally posted by jackinthebox

As I stated earlier, taxation will only exacerbate the problem. Here in the US, it is the poorest states who are suffering from the highest obesity rates. Is this just a coincidence? No. Poor people end up fat because they cannot afford to eat properly, not because they don't want to.

I have to say i wonder about this one, hre the jolly old England as many americans like to refer to it. The ingredients for healthy food can be purchased far cheaper than a Big Mac, at least where i am. London may be very different as the people supplying there just inflate their prices on purpose.

I'm not rich here, i have to live on benefit and i can tell you this, preparing and coking food myself is far cheaper than daily fast food runs.

EDIT

Oh and poor people end up fat? Might want to tell that to those starving africans, i think they'd be amazed. Poor people end up stick thin because they can't eat.

[edit on 22-5-2008 by ImaginaryReality1984]

reply to post by jca2005

We have minds, powerful minds at that. You just have to do it. People in today's world/society often think more about something than doing it.

It's not a matter of just doing it. Are you trying to argue that the effects of ingesting chemicals can simply be overcome by willpower? And that the victim of brainwashing really should just know better?

If you ask me if I think that people should get out there and exercise more, my answer would be yes. But if you were to ask me if I thought it would really make that much of a difference if people actually did, my answer would be no.

There are plenty of people out there today who are very active, and yet are still overweight, so it doesn't all come down to exercise. I went to the gym for an entire year, and was quite active at work as well, but I actually gained weight in that year that I was going to the gym six times a week. And I wasn't doing any serious muscle building exercise. Mostly calorie burning cardio.