Iran Does Far Worse Than Ignore Gays

Originally posted by bodrul
someone really has to much time on their hands
and need to learn more skills on photoshop.

did you do it?

on topic
great timing

I was under the impression that it wasn't a photoshop and Arabs and Iranians kiss each other on the cheek to greet each other. Its a tradition, is it not?

I have indeed found a new home here at ATS. You have the best in moderation and of course the best topics

This is pure Zionist Neocon propaganda. Takes about .0001 of a second on google to find thousands of gay hate crimes originating right here in good ole' USA and no that is not a reason to "allow" Iran to commit the same yet one must look at what is going on in the world to see why this is somehow a talking point by the controlled news media and their controllers.

Fox news aka "Faux news" is a Rupert Murdoch NEOCON ZIONIST propaganda machine and at this point in my "education" anyone who quotes Fox without skepticism is suspect IMHO.

There is homophobia here, but there is no government mandated death penalty/punishment for being a homosexual...at least that is really enforced anymore. Some states have anti-sodomy laws but as far as I know it is not really enforced.

Still, regardless, it is barely even comparable to what many countries do in the middle east.

Originally posted by lombozo


And how exactly did he lie about gays in Iran? I ask for facts. You seem intelligent, so I expect to see a fine rebuttal.

Calling anyone who disagrees with your views 'borderline retarded' creates a scenrio where you must beyond a shadow of a doubt make your case.
I await your response.

[edit on 25-9-2007 by lombozo]

Are there homosexuals in Iran? He said they don't have homosexuals there. Thats a lie. You can try to twist and turn all you like but it was a flat out lie.

They not only have them but they execute them. I guess you agree with that practice. I don't.

What a bs load of propaganda if I have ever seen one before!!!!

This claim is based on completely false pretenses!!!! It is simply flair to make americans hate Iran!! Can't you people see through the lies of the media?!?! Or do you have to be in Advertising to really understand this kind of psychological bs?!?!?

Listen, "they have laws in place" doesnt mean they are hanging people every day for being gay. Don't you think that would have a much stronger media presence if it was true? I just won't believe it until I see it. I don't believe Iran's leader is truely that against human rights. But please.. prove me wrong

Racist and sexist attitudes exist. Always have, always will. How a civilization deals with this reality is what elevates it from regimes such as Iran. We do not have a gov't that publicly hangs homosexuals, rape victims, etc. In fact, hate crime legislation is extremely strict here. You can assault someone and get fined. If you use a derogatory racial/homophobic term while you are assaulting someone, well, you can serve 10-20 years in the pen. We had slavery...we ended it. Women are not subjegated. We liberated Europe from tyrany. Open gay people have thriving businesses on the busiest streets in this country (which they would not dared do 20 years ago). Our history is not pristene, but we have evolved a lot quicker than these savages in the middle east that terrorize the weak. We should all get on our knees and thank GOD that we live here. Or, you can go over there and get your knees broken if you don't pray to allah.

On a side note: Didn't Arafat die of aids?

I have just researched the subject and okay okay more than Fox is covering it so it may be true about the persecution.. However they keep showing the same 5 pictures ofa buse over and over and over again. Why would that be?

www.youtube.com...


So those two in the pictures were hung for simply being gay.. but the man who started the "gay rights movement" in Iran was simply arrested and eventually let go? Does that add up?

Originally posted by blowfishdl
What a bs load of propaganda if I have ever seen one before!!!!

This claim is based on completely false pretenses!!!! It is simply flair to make americans hate Iran!! Can't you people see through the lies of the media?!?! Or do you have to be in Advertising to really understand this kind of psychological bs?!?!?

Listen, "they have laws in place" doesnt mean they are hanging people every day for being gay. Don't you think that would have a much stronger media presence if it was true? I just won't believe it until I see it. I don't believe Iran's leader is truely that against human rights. But please.. prove me wrong

I am in advertising and that didn't look like a photoshoot for trucks and rope. This should make American's mad. It should make everyone screaming mad. As far as you needing to see it to believe it. You are on ATS. You probably believe in ufo's, bigfoot and the Loch Ness monster. I'd venture to guess you've never seen one of them. Or, perhaps you refuse to believe that this horror exists in Iran because it doesn't fit your personal agenda at this particular point in time.

In Germany, they came first for the Communists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist;
And then they came for the trade unionists, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist;
And then they came for the Jews, And I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew;
And then...they came for me...And by that time there was no one left to speak up.

I don't see the point of people calling this propaganda, is recorded and documented. Many countries have good things and bad things, like other poster mentions maybe they are at a stage on their civilization were gays are thought to be freaks, like they were label here in the U.S.

The fact is that this is common practice not only in Iran but many countries in the Middle East and else where, human rights abuse happen all the time, in this case is being amped up because of our conflict with Iran and the words his President said, but this stuff happens more than what you think, it just does not get the attention of the media until its serves them some kind of purpose.

Originally posted by traderonwallst

Iran Does Far Worse Than Ignore Gays

www.foxnews.com

Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad’s seemingly ridiculous claim that "we don’t have homosexuals, like in your country" masks the cruel reality that his government does far worse than ignore gays, human rights groups charge.

"There are criminal laws on the books in Iran that allows for people to be killed for being homosexual," said Paula Ettelbrick, executive director of the International Gay and Lesbian Human Rights Commission.

(visit the link for the full news article)



[edit on 25-9-2007 by UM_Gazz]

ok people in our country get killed for being gay all te time......and for being black......or for being white in a black neiborhood....all kinds of dumb poo.....we do far worse to eachother then other countries because we have a higher population means that more bad poo happens.......can't deny that..

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 26/9/2007 by Mirthful Me]

Mr. President dose Iraq has weapon of mass destruction?
Yes Iraq has weapon of mass destruction.
Mr. President why are you persecuting homosexual?
We don’t have homosexual in Iran.

Why would he answer a question so obvious by lying?
The same has Bush lied for Iraq weapon of mass destruction?
Many people has said that the president of Iran is intelligent and I will have to say yes he is intelligent.
My opinion is that in answering the question this way he as shown that America can take lies only from the mouth of they government.
The issue about gay is very controversial in Iran for reasons that we here in the west have no clue.
Do some research and see how the Iranian are treating the Transsexual community, and also see what Ayatollah Khomeini says about this topics.

Kacou.

I have no doubt that gay people have less rights in Iran, it is a fundamentalist muslim state so I would be suprised if they didn't. What about our allies in Saudi Arabia? How do they treat gay people?

I have not seen any evidence from a third party (please provide it) that they are actually hung in Iran. I am not denying it but I just would like to see verifiable proof.

This strikes me as a piece of propaganda that highlights how 'bad' that they are; a demonising action. There are many countries around the world where gays do not get the rights they deserve, including the USA. This has as much relevance as say, what do they fine people for speeding offences in Iran or how much their taxes are.

Things we do not like about a way that another state 'does business' are nothing to do with us. We can protest it yes but not go to war over it.

Oh and despite the fact that I disagree with the Iranian position, Kudos to their President for being honest and answering as he beleives rather than trying to sugar coat and spin his answer to what he thinks the audience want to hear. If only werstern politicians were as honest...

[edit on 26-9-2007 by EJHoover]

Originally posted by Night Watchman
Good point. Iran will figure it out someday and so, until then, so what if a few gays get strung up right? Your logic is, well, illogical. If we follow your logic, Americans can can never speak out against racism because slavery was once legal in this country.

You can speak out against it. You can educate. Education serves a purpose, because it provides an alternative viewpoint.

Theres no death penalty in the UK. Its considered a barbaric act. You lot in the US still implement it. Does that mean that you are wrong in what you do. Would I be correct in calling you all bloodthirsty barabaric morons for killing people in revenge? The answer is no. Its not my country. You do what you do there and providing it doesn't affect anyone else in their country then really its no one elses business.

Outright, full on, damned condemnation with no flexibility and substance achieves nothing. Strikes me that alot of the posters in this issue would rather shoot the man than talk to him, just because its the easier option. It strikes me that the US government sees it the same way too.

Or to put it another way, I don't agree with your opinion on this subject. If I apply some of the arguments put forward by some of the posters in this thread and similar recent ones that makes you a liar, a nutcase and a threat to world peace and I'd be perfectly justified cleaving a hole in your skull to remove you from the world. Of course, thats not going to happen, but do you see my point yet?

It amazes me that so many are bending over backwards to defend and, in some cases, attempt to glorify this man.

Maybe you don't realise whats at stake here and the bigger picture. So let me spell it out for you.

Right now the mainstream US media is following a government led agenda. That agenda is clearly to demonise this man, and the society he lives in at all costs. Judging by a lot of posts I've read on ATS recently that agenda seems to be working.

If that agenda reaches its peak, the step off point is going to costs peoples lives. Ordinary people, like you and I, are going to be killed. Just because they live in Iran doesn't make them any lesser a person that you or I. I'm not trying to bend over backwards and "defend" or "glorify" this man, but what I am trying to do is get the point across that he sees things differently. Seeing things differently is not a crime.

And before you, or some smartarse says "the same could have been said for Hitler" he DID step off the platform, carried out a systematic extermination of jews and invaded foreign countries. Can the same be said of Iran?

The answer is No.

reply to post by Keebie

I have a Saudi Arabian in the family- He is probably the nicest man i have ever met. He and his parents go thru the prayers three times a day, btw, they must wash their feet and hands before every prayer.
Some of us do have knowledge of Middle Eastern practices.

But this has nothing to do with the subject, i just thought you should know not all of us are totally oblivious.

Recently a friend of mine who is a Iranian Baha'i' made the same sort of comment... that there were no homosexuals in Iran and when someone asked why... he drew his finger across his throat.

He was being ironic of course since the Baha'i's in Iran suffer far more prosecution than any other group there but he wasn't either since homosexuals are apparently executed when found.

Originally posted by Aaron_Justin

Originally posted by dgtempe
Oh please!

For years they were in "the closet", then they turned to religion, monasteries, became Catholic Priests, so they would be away from society because THEY ARE NOT ACCEPTED BY YOU.

What do you base this statement on? Catholic priests are hardly "away" form society. I thought priests followed that lifestyle because of thier beliefs not because they could go be gay.

Alot of the time a homosexual will join the preisthood as a way of keeping themselves from doing something "sinful." They are suppose to remain celebate. I even gave the idea a swirl in my head at one point and decided against it. Now I am an open gay christian. I guess it works for some though.

Psychopaths (Sociopaths) are totally unaware that what they are doing is wrong when they kill, rape or do other forms of evil. We still put them in prison and we never make excuses for them. When people in their right minds commit the same acts it is far worse, so why would anyone justify evil acts by someone due to their Religion? It is impossible to defend. Even if an entire Country is doing it it can not be defended without being complicit. In my humble opinion.

If this man had nothing to hide why did he make an evasive response to this and other questions. Perhaps as an insult to our intelligence? Very likely. Very likely he considers Human Rights to be the product of a stupid Society. Lie? No he did not lie. It was an insult to his hosts.

He is a Predator in a Society where Predators still rule. A Society that has yet to learn to keep their Predators in cages. A Society that has not yet learned that the Sheep far outnumber the Wolves and that they can be imprisoned to protect the Flock. He and his type are growing weary of how easy the Prey is to devour in their own Country and they seek more formidable Prey in the outside world. When their teeth become Nuclear they will have to try out their new powers against their perceived Prey and they will not be able to control the urge. A wise Shepard will stay alert into the night with a Shotgun in hand or loose part of his Flock to the Predators.

Judging by history, the US has been a far more aggressive & successful predator than Iran. Our society is led by predators too, and far more dangerous ones.

When Iran starts to approach the foreign body count racked up by the US, let me know, but at the rate we're going, it's going to take a long, long time.

We may not be hanging/imprisoning gays (anymore), but we're still pretty good at bombing cities

[edit on 9/26/07 by xmotex]

reply to post by xmotex


I hate to be cliche, but how does pointing out one wrong justify another? That is similar logic to blaming me for the actions of a member of my race generations ago. It's an intellectual cop out.

The Nuclear Predator is best left in the hands of one that knows not to use it except as a last resort. Killing in self defense is not Predatory. The fact that the Nuclear Predator exists demands that people in their right minds posses it to stop those who would delight in its use.