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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
yeah, $3 million is "a living"
Originally posted by KrazyJethro
NO ONE has more right to my money than me and my family.
Originally posted by Odium
Let us hope your wife, children, yourself never need a transplant or blood while in hospital. After all - why should I donate blood? Why should I do something that'll help other people who might need my help? It's a shame people like you exist who are so selfish.
Originally posted by ape
it would be your choice as an individual to donate your own blood. flip this scenario how would you feel if the government forced you to give that blood and gave you no choice in the matter and not giving that blood would be considered a felony in which you would be imprisoned?
Originally posted by Odium
Originally posted by ape
it would be your choice as an individual to donate your own blood. flip this scenario how would you feel if the government forced you to give that blood and gave you no choice in the matter and not giving that blood would be considered a felony in which you would be imprisoned?
If that is what it takes.
Go to a Hospital and do some volunteer work with children, those who are not even 10 years of age and will not see their next birthday because someone who died wouldn't donate an organ or there's not enough blood for them to have an operation. You look their parents in the eyes and tell them what you think - that you don't need to donate blood, you don't need to help society - because you are as bad as someone who kills someone.
Lack of action, to save an individual is no different than taking the life yourself. You can sit there and go: Oh I didn't kill them directly, but it's the same as giving someone alcohol who'll drive home. We're all responsible for the betterment of society as a whole, not just the bits that we are involved with.
Just hope one day, you don't have children and they do not need an operation or if you do now, one that you yourself can't provide. The amount of dead children because people won't go into a hospital and check their bone-marrow, blood type and so on and so fourth is disgusting in a Western, Civilized Nation.
No different than a savage. No different than a killer.
You have a civic duty, to everyone around you and if you can help you should help. But then you can sit there and let the World get worse and worse.
Originally posted by ape
IMO it's better for a society to choose rather than being forced to help.
Originally posted by Odium
Originally posted by ape
IMO it's better for a society to choose rather than being forced to help.
Choice doesn't work.
No where near enough people donate organs or blood. When people still die because of our selfish acts, there's a problem. The fact is people need to be socialised from the ground up and if in the mean time we need the Government to step in to save a lot of lives than so be it.
I'd rather they did something than we let more and more people die. If it is tax breaks or some form of insentive - like allowing more money to be passed down (skipping inheritence tax) to gain organs, a small tax break for donating blood a few times a year or the Government needs to directly say - it has to happen. I'd support it.
I've been unlucky enough to meet someone whose child died because of a lack of organs. It ruined their life for a very long time.
Originally posted by jsobecky
Here's a Classic Clinton-ism, or what we can look forward to if, God forbid, this woman gets elected to president:
“Many of you are well off enough that [President Bush’s] tax cuts may have helped you. We’re saying that for America to get back on track, we’re probably going to cut that short and not give it to you. ” -Hillary Clinton, San Francisco 6/28/2004
www.signonsandiego.com...
Originally posted by Odium
This is what is.
There are people who through no fault of their own end up in a bad situation, the woman who is raped and needs counselling but can't afford it - should we cast her out? Shun her because someone else attacked her?
The child who's abused and needs to be removed from his family, but no system to re-house them or to place them into care exists. After all - screw them - I only care for myself.
The woman - could be your daughter, sister - who is trapped in an abusive relationship. She can't leave because there are no shelters for women, no where safe to go and she's scared that if she goes to the Police while living with him it'll make things worse. (Since most cases of domestic violence don't end in prison sentances.)
The Army Veteran who looses a limb fighting for his Nation - we should cast him out and expect him to beg for food.
Once you have your own house. The ability to travel - car - and enough money to live a healthy, comfortable life you do not need more money.
You speak of having an equal chance.
Person A: Born into a family who earn $10,000 a week. They can afford for - the best health care, food, education (through University) and even if they fail they have money.
Person B: Born into a family with no money, where both parents work over 40hrs a week to make a living. Live in a rough area, where the education facilities are filled with gang problems. No ability to go through college or University, unless they themselves work but the ability to work and afford such a thing requires the minimum of a full time job.
Oh yeah - that's equality.
Welcome to the Real World.
Stop living in a fantasy land.
Yes, and when you do not tax businesses and people for this stuff, something else springs up to take care of it: they're called private charities.
You leave people's money to them, and yes, society does "work itself out." Women stop having babies without thinking about how to support them because the government won't support her, parents make sure they have the financial means to raise a child first, and private charities spring up. More and more jobs are created as well.
Or, at best, it leads to countries with very poor economies, ala most of Europe.
Italy's economy is 63.4 percent free, according to our 2007 assessment, which makes it the world's 60th freest economy. Its overall score is 0.7 percentage point higher than last year, partially reflecting new methodological detail. Italy is ranked 28th out of 41 countries in the European region, and its overall score is equal to the regional average.
top corporate tax rate is 33 percent.
What you are talking about is a noble idea, BUT IT HISTORICALLY HAS NEVER WORKED.
None of the Nations you listed follow any level of Socialist thinking and if they do please reference the book, I am sure I already have it.
Really? According to E. C. Midwinter in Victorian Social Reform, there was a larger rate of children being dumped, abandoned, etcetera, during the Victorian Period in the United Kingdom than the is now – there were also less Charities and less percentage of wealth being placed into charities.
The fact is – we used to leave people to cope on their own and it resulted in nothing more than low-paid slave labour. People used to work 12+ hrs a day, their children, wives, etcetera, would all work for the same person. Of course the was the odd exception of companies (Cadbury, Owen, etcetera) who would give their workers decent living conditions, education for the children and so on and so fourth but from the period of the Industrial Revolution (Pre-1830’s) to the 1950’s when we began to fully introduce laws (Education, NHS, etcetera) these didn’t exist as more than a handful of people.
The Labour Movement and the Socialist Movement in Europe existed because so many people – who were nothing but old money – didn’t care. They lived in the World you desire and allowed people to die on the streets so they could have 20 bedrooms and never use 18 of them.
Where there are enough spare rooms to get every homeless person off of the streets – if people helped each other – if people cared – the world would be a much nicer place.
Fact 1: The European Union turns over $ 12,820,000,000,000 and the United States of America $ 12,980,000,000,000.
Nations have had a few problems to deal with – now, remember when you studied History? There was this event, it lasted from 1939 to 1945 – it was called World War Two. Now in Europe we had to spend a good 20 years re-building after it, where as the USA didn’t get blitzed every night for over three years. Of course, you don’t factor that into your little explanation of why most of these nations are poor – or the fact many of them just finally got out of war or were stuck fighting them up till a few years ago. No it is because they tried out a form of socialism (which in fact they didn’t.)
P.S: Italy has the 10th largest economy in the World and the 25th largest Population, so they are in fact doing fairly well.
top corporate tax rate is 33 percent.
80%?
Stop making things up.
Fact is, you can’t even be bothered to check your own statistics when you make a claim. You don’t dare to factor in historical evidence as to why some things might be happening and worse yet, you have absolutely no understanding of socialism as can be reference by the fact you think Stalin was a Socialist.
What I talk about? I have a degree in politics (and Law), I focused on Socialism as my Major and I am now working on my MA since I’ve gone back (will be in September). What I myself talk about has never been tried out together, but the aspects of it work (Switzerland, Sweden, etcetera depending on which aspect) and no I was never educated by a “Left Wing” teacher before anyone uses that argument, my lecturer in fact used to make Policy for the Conservative Party in the U.K. and is very much on the Right Wing.
Sources: E.C. Midwinter – Victorian Social Reform – Published by Longman
ISBN: 582 31385 6
Source on Italy:
www.heritage.org...
World Statistics:
CIA Factbook
Originally posted by WheelsRCool
The rich already do give up "a little" of their money to help the greater good. They pay the highest taxes in the nation.
Originally posted by EastCoastKid
Originally posted by WheelsRCool
The rich already do give up "a little" of their money to help the greater good. They pay the highest taxes in the nation.
Do you have any concept of the scale of income disparity in this country?
The middle class is now limping along.
Bush's taxcuts are crazy in light of the war we're waging.
Those poor rich people paying all those taxes aren't giving any in the form of flesh serving in this glorious occupation of Iraq. So, excuse me for not finding much sympathy for them.
Originally posted by EastCoastKid
It's funny how folks who will never get near that american dream (in reality) keep defending it. Defending the few who do not need their defending.
Ya gotta love America for providing great opportunities for people to flourish economically. But the fact remains, poverty is a terrible problem. To suggest we eliminate social programs, etc. is to live in some kind of non-reality. There are people who are in serious need. As a wealthy nation we have a responsibility to help our own.
To whom much is given....
Well gee, yeah, they only tax businesses about 80% of their money, so why would anyone set up shop over there?
Countries such as France and Italy have unemployment rates almost double what America has.
It was the advance of capitalism, as businesses competed, that repaired these.
Child-labor laws only caused children to be forced into other means of employment, such as prostitution.
This is where I say you live in a fantasy land though. Yes, it would be nice, but ONLY ANT COLONIES AND BEE HIVES ACT LIKE THAT. People don't. Even if you try to force them to, they don't. People aren't like insects. We are people. The system that lets people be jerks to each other, but still creates very high standards of living, is what you want. That system is capitalism.
Yes, we also kinda nuked Japan in WWII as well, but they recovered just fine, as heck of a lot better than most any European nation has. South Korea too.
Yes, that doesn't mean their economy still couldn't be a heck of a lot better. By North American standards, it still stinks.
Nor is Sweden really successful because of socialism. Their primary income is from oil.
Sweden emerged as a welfare state, consistently achieving a high position among the top-ranking countries in the UN Human Development Index (HDI). Sweden has a rich supply of water power, but lacks significant oil and coal deposits.
What you talk of never could work because you believe in Communism I think, where everyone should sacrifice for the community.
And Switzerland is not socialist.