Jim Crow Vaccine Passport Laws

a reply to: Byrd

I want this thing to be over and gone but the only way it will go is if we get rapid immunity on a global scale. Failing that, rapid immunity on a national scale will do. Having the entire population of the US get sick with this stuff won't stop it (herd immunity) it only provides a breeding ground for variants.

But the vaccine won't give you immunity, nor does it prevent you from spreading it to others. It will only make sure you're getting not as sick. That is the breeding ground for variants:

"Vaccinated" people that think it's now all over, running around asymptomatic while still capable of spreading. It's already evident this mindset is becoming a problem with those that did not educate themselves and took the word of politicians for granted.

I am sure you know all the above. And that's exact why mothers like zosimov, I and others here are looking at the current development very critical.

a reply to: ThatDamnDuckAgain

Wondering if you think Germany will resist going to the French model of mandatory vaccinations? (I hope they do not go to mandatory vaccinations).

Cheers

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2
No, not at this point in time although I don't trust her, Merkel keeps repeating that the state won't introduce mandatory vaccination. I shouldn't be vaccinated even because a) I had it so there's a waiting period and b) my medical history show's that everytime I got a shot, I got dearly sick. We stopped flu shot's about the time I left school because they would be devastating, I was sick every time.

And therefor my doctor noticed it and said there's no sense in vaccinating me and risking the stress, I rather get it naturally.
That's in the medical files but my insurance doesn't have that info so they keep sending me letters that try to usher me to get my shot. It's also unclear how debatable this is and if "public safety" isn't overruling my personal safety soon.

If it's becoming mandatory, then it's because of economic players fueling the need for the vaccine passport, not the vaccine itself.

a reply to: pthena

That is why you don't answer the door at all,problem solved!

a reply to: mamabeth

That's my go-to when I see a solicitor at my door.

This strategy won't help with the distraction/disruption of having a person at my door while I'm working (teaching my classes) but it's a partial solution.

a reply to: zosimov


Here is a thing you can hang on your door.
Well, this is only a picture that I manipulated. I don't think anyone is selling this exact wording.
YET

originally posted by: Byrd
...and the vaccines approved.

Not entirely accurate, now, is it?


www.cvdvaccine-us.com...


www.modernatx.com...

Shameful slight of hand by you.

originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
a reply to: Byrd

I want this thing to be over and gone but the only way it will go is if we get rapid immunity on a global scale. Failing that, rapid immunity on a national scale will do. Having the entire population of the US get sick with this stuff won't stop it (herd immunity) it only provides a breeding ground for variants.

But the vaccine won't give you immunity, nor does it prevent you from spreading it to others. It will only make sure you're getting not as sick. That is the breeding ground for variants:

Except that we're not seeing variants from areas like New Hampshire or Maine, where most of the population is vaccinated. You don't see that from New Zealand (where almost everyone is vaccinated) Delta came from India with a very low rate of vaccination. With global travel and interactions between nations, anyone can bring a variant in from another country and introduce it here -- and if it ends up in an unvaccinated population you get a spike in cases. If it's not stopped in its tracks, it becomes a second infection along with the others.

So the unvaccinated have the possibility of two diseases instead of one (and you can, as was demonstrated from autopsies) actually get both versions at the same time.

Also, the Children's hospital of Philadelphia info sheet explains the situation well -- that immunized people shed viruses under two conditions -- in the first case where an attenuated virus is used (not the case here) and the second is from other types of vaccines (which is the case here.)

In both cases, the amount of virus shed is much smaller than from an unvaccinated asymptomatic person.

In the first scenario (attenuated virus), as the site says, what is expelled is weakened or damaged viruses and because you were immune, the virus wasn't galloping through your body and making zillions of copies e.g.: (If vaccination causes shedding, it typically results in significantly lower quantities of virus being shed, and the shed virus particles are less likely to cause disease because they are the weakened form used to make the vaccine. )

And in the second case, if you get the Covid virus, your body stops it from replicating because it's got instructions to 'look at virus and not reproduce any spiky bits' (quote from the article Simply put, it is impossible for the vaccines to result in the production of infectious virus particles. Our cells do not have the directions to make the whole virus.)

"Vaccinated" people that think it's now all over, running around asymptomatic while still capable of spreading.

I don't think that statement matches what a lot of vaccinated folks think. Yes, some certainly would think that. But many of us know that it's not over and that the more it replicates the more we'll have to go through this horrible thing again -- lockdowns, masking, etc, etc, etc. And here in Texas you really can't figure that the ones trotting around without masks are those who have had the full immunization. The reverse is more likely.

"Caution" is killing people. It's killing people here in Texas, where vaccine skepticism is prevalent in many communities. It's not killing them in Maine, where there's a larger percentage of immunized people.

originally posted by: loam

originally posted by: Byrd
...and the vaccines approved.

Not entirely accurate, now, is it?

www.cvdvaccine-us.com...

www.modernatx.com...

Shameful slight of hand by you.

Honestly, the FDA is not the only approval agency on this globe. In fact, there's a lot of things approved by other countries that the FDA won't approve (you may remember various stories of people going from the US to other countries for life saving treatments that aren't FDA approved but are approved elsewhere.)

Heck, I still have a TENS unit from 25 years ago... got it bootleg from Britain where it was approved for pain but was banned here in the US and not approved until around 2010 or 2014.

So, yes, not approved by FDA but under review and expected to be approved.

a reply to: ThatDamnDuckAgain

But the vaccine won't give you immunity, nor does it prevent you from spreading it to others. It will only make sure you're getting not as sick. That is the breeding ground for variants:

Here is the latest that I found on the CDC website:
Science Brief: Background Rationale Down in the Conclusions.

COVID-19 vaccines currently authorized in the United States have been shown to be efficacious and effective against SARS-CoV-2 infections, including asymptomatic infection, symptomatic disease, severe disease, and death. These findings, along with the early evidence for reduced viral load in vaccinated people who develop COVID-19, suggest that any associated transmission risk is likely to be substantially reduced in vaccinated people.

The way that I interpret this is: A vaccinated person may contract the Virus SARS-CoV-2, but the antibodies go to work faster. Very much less time in which the person may spread the virus. Plus the whole time that the battle is raging, the forces of SARS-CoV-2 are too limited to spare much shedding.

Less shedding load + Less time = much reduced spreading.

Total number of replications of the virus increases the chances of mutations. Reducing the time in which replication of virus is occurring reduces the numbers. Thus more people vaccinated leads to less mutations.

originally posted by: Byrd
Honestly, the FDA is not the only approval agency on this globe. In fact, there's a lot of things approved by other countries that the FDA won't approve...

Ah, gotcha.

So which countries with such COVID-19 vaccine approvals are you citing? I think it would be good to understand which regulatory bodies you find more trustworthy.

a reply to: mamabeth

Hi Mamabeth!

The guy that I rent a room from orders a large amount of stuff from online sources. Every day, knocks on the door. Then the Covid. Now the UPS, Fedex, and USPS don't knock any more. They just leave packages on the steps and take a picture.

As for me: I don't much like to put my card number out. If I want something ordered I give him cash and he orders it for me. My reasoning is that the less number of companies with my card number, the less likely that a company with my card number will get hacked by the crooks.

That's been my approach to the Covid. Less exposure = less risk.

a reply to: ThatDamnDuckAgain

Thanks Duck. I wish you viel Gesundheit.

Cheers

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

Danke, wünsch ich dir und dem Rest von ATS natürlich auch

Thanks, wish the same for you and the rest of ATS of course, too.

originally posted by: zosimov
a reply to: Byrd

Hi Byrd,

It's nice to talk to you.

Been a long time.

You might be surprised to hear that I don't see the rush through phase 4 trials to be good news. In fact, I wonder what time frame is being discussed in the following statement:

In a phase 4 trial, any rare or long-term effects of the drug can be observed in a much larger population of patients and over a much longer period of time. If safety surveillance does indeed reveal concerns about the drug, it may be withdrawn from the market and no longer made available on prescription.

Long term meaning.. a year? Or what?

There's also this:

Many drugs have shown harmful effects only during phase 4 trials and have subsequently been banned from use. One example is the pain reliever rofecoxib which showed negative cardiac side effects during phase 4 trials and was therefore withdrawn from the market.

www.news-medical.net...
Check out this link I found regarding rofecoxib:

The 3-year clinical trial called APPROVe (Adenomatous Polyp Prevention of Vioxx), which was halted in late September (2 months before it was scheduled to end), was evaluating the efficacy of rofecoxib in preventing the recurrence of colorectal polyps among patients with a history of colorectal adenomas. It revealed an increased relative risk for serious cardiovascular events, including heart attacks and strokes, beginning after 18 months of treatment among patients taking rofecoxib that was about twice that of patients taking placebo. The results for the first 18 months of the study did not show any increased risk.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
So in this case, long term meant more than 18 months.
Now that the clinical trials have been rushed to closure, the mandates can start to roll. Bad news for me and my son who has PVCs and who won't be getting this jab. (PS, for the concerned, I consulted his cardiologist regarding the risk of COVID considering his condition and he told me that only children with heart transplants should be careful.)
I saw this question posted to you in another thread, but didn't see any response, maybe you could weigh in

If vaccinated people can still get and give COVID-19, can't the virus mutate in the vaccinated as well?
Unity Point Health seems to say yes:

The creation of a vaccine for any new virus could also cause additional mutations.

“Any virus is going to try to keep changing, so it can continue to spread. For COVID-19, that means we’ll likely see more new variants. That’s natural and expected. Don’t be too worried about it, the vaccine should help keep us safe.

www.unitypoint.org...

I'm sorry I can't see the seatbelt analogy as being apt. Seatbelts don't go in your body and you can take them off when you leave the car. Had seatbelts been found to be dangerous after maybe 2 years of use, they could easily have been removed.
Why isn't heart inflammation in young, healthy men a reason to pause?

ETA: I'm not finding info regarding the completion of Phase 4 and FDA approval. As of yesterday, this apparently hadn't happened. Which vaccine has been approved?
www.cnbc.com...

I have nothing against any at risk or anyone who wants to getting the shot. I'm against mandating this vaccine and wanted to highlight which communities mandates might effect the most.

I went back to the unity point source this weekend, and found to my dismay that it had been edited (seems sneaky to me--aren't sites required to post a date when updates are made?)

Another example of covering one's hide after the fact.

a reply to: pthena

I do not know about you, but I have lived scaremongering free, mask free and jab free, since the first hype of rona was over in my state.

Ooops I forgot, I live in a Republican state. All the people I know that had covid have no died and all are doing just fine, no vax needed.