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Pence announces Turkish ceasefire in northern Syria
page: 4share:
originally posted by: Wayfarer
I'm not sure I'd agree that all out war was some inexorable and unavoidable conclusion. I have a hard time imagining any world in which Turkey opens fire on US troops.
I wasn't talking about war with us. Russia was getting involved, and Turkey was invading a sovereign nation (Syria).
Simply leaving a small contingent there as collateral would have been (IMO) more than enough to secure the Kurd's safety.
Yeah - we've been doing that for 10 years now. How much longer? Another 10? 50?
Trump did the only rational, sane thing if we truly want to get out of there.
He got us out of there.
Now the only thing to do is wait and see if he is sincere and starts bringing troops home rather than just redeploying them elsewhere. I don't expect this to happen overnight, but I want to start seeing at least some baby steps soon, or I'll start to doubt his sincerity - or at a minimum, his ability to successfully fight the MIC, who are adamantly opposed to even the idea of us bringing all of our troops home.
Furthermore, its already apparent there isn't really any deal, as Turkey is already shelling the Kurd's as they evacuate.
Proof? Anotrher NBC video of a gun range in Texas this time?
I can understand why it would be your prerogative to believe Ergodan when he says there is no shelling (FAKE NEWS! amirite?), but I'm personally more inclined to believe international reports/photo's/videos/eye-witness reports on the ground (to name a few) than a maniacal dictator.
Depends on the source(s) - and since you didn't link any...
edit on 18-10-2019 by tanstaafl because: (no reason given)
edit on
18-10-2019 by tanstaafl because: (no reason given)
Erdogan is using the exact wrong tactics...
instead of an 'invasion force' of Turk Army/Marines... he should take a page from the USA playbook --> 'Contractors'
the Turks can send into Kurd territory in Syria... several brain-washed mass murderers to create mass murder shootings of Kurd civilians and police stations, etc. (well, for bombings you send in zealots or anarchists not mass murder shooters)
I think I painted a good enough picture that you readers get my drift
instead of an 'invasion force' of Turk Army/Marines... he should take a page from the USA playbook --> 'Contractors'
the Turks can send into Kurd territory in Syria... several brain-washed mass murderers to create mass murder shootings of Kurd civilians and police stations, etc. (well, for bombings you send in zealots or anarchists not mass murder shooters)
I think I painted a good enough picture that you readers get my drift
originally posted by: JustJohnny
a reply to: manuelram16
So is there still a 4D chess match with NK or did America just lose????
I kept hearing about this 4D match then too, but we never got anything..
JohnnyManny subconsciously gives us his fantasy as he stars his alternate posts.
a reply to: underwerks
So we are ceasing fire .. but it is not a ceasefire.
Erdogan said he would NEVER do a ceasefire ... so he is of course claiming the ceasefire is not a ceasefire.
cease-fire noun
ˈsēs-ˈfi(-ə)r
Definition of cease-fire
1: a military order to cease firing
2: a suspension of active hostilities
Sounds like a ceasefire to me.
So we are ceasing fire .. but it is not a ceasefire.
Erdogan said he would NEVER do a ceasefire ... so he is of course claiming the ceasefire is not a ceasefire.
cease-fire noun
ˈsēs-ˈfi(-ə)r
Definition of cease-fire
1: a military order to cease firing
2: a suspension of active hostilities
Sounds like a ceasefire to me.
Both Kurds and Turkey are claiming there's no cease-fire. Head of the Kurds, YPJ, SDF have said they were never contacted or consulted by the US and
ceasefires were only agreed in two towns - the Kurds are refusing Trump's deal/solution as he's 'offering' the same holocaust/ethnic cleansing plan
Turkey has been persuing for over 100 years. It's not a 'deal', it's a 'death sentence' to anyone with a brief knowlege of geo-politics or history.
Images and video of Turkey shelling the City of Ras al-Ayn 13 hours into the claimed US ceasefire are widely available. Before and after use of white phosphorus and napalm by Turkish forces on children is available online but highly graphic footage. International War Monitors, Amnesty International, The UN, have all publicised records of Turkish flights and bombings the same day of the claimed ceasefire, genocide and warcrimes continuing.
Images and video of Turkey shelling the City of Ras al-Ayn 13 hours into the claimed US ceasefire are widely available. Before and after use of white phosphorus and napalm by Turkish forces on children is available online but highly graphic footage. International War Monitors, Amnesty International, The UN, have all publicised records of Turkish flights and bombings the same day of the claimed ceasefire, genocide and warcrimes continuing.
edit on 18-10-2019 by bastion because: (no reason given)
originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: bastion
If Turkey is going back on their word then support Trump in placing more sanctions on them. I will.
What word? No document or ceasefire was ever signed. It only exists in Trumps imagination/campaign rallies. Turkey said they'll only stop if the Kurds surrender northern syria (the country which lelly should be theirs). The Kurds said the US never consulted or spoke to them, they are holding a ceasefire in two zones and the others are impossible to declare a ceasefire at as that's where all the ISIL prisoners are being held.
How are sanctions going to change the behaviour of a brutal dictator who rose to power in a false millitary coup and is comitting war crimes? Trump gave Ergodan the nod to go ahead with the invasion. The Kurds need the Kurdistan the US and Allies has promised them since 1920 and failed to deliver upon, not the 'displace the Kurds'/return Turkey to Ottoman Empire borders offer Trump came up with the other day. despite them saing our arses from ISIS.
This mornings international headlines
French President Emmanuel Macron described Turkey's military operation in Syria as 'madness' and said any resurgence of ISIS was the fault of Ankara
EU Council president Donald Tusk said Turkey's US-brokered truce was not serious and demanded Ankara halt its offensive against Kurdish forces
Czech President Milos Zeman accused fellow NATO member Turkey of teaming up with terrorists during its offensive in Syria
edit on 18-10-2019
by bastion because: (no reason given)
edit on 18-10-2019 by bastion because: (no reason given)
Some photos and videoof the war, Turkey using Jihadi groups to attack Kurds.
President Donald Trump’s decision to pull out of Syria radically realigns the balance of power in the country’s northeast and creates a vacuum which Russia, Turkey and Iran are racing to fill.
With Turkish forces pressing south from the border, the Kurds have invited troops from Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s Russian-backed government in from the south and the west. Assad’s forces are exploiting the U.S. retreat to seize back resource-rich territory they abandoned years ago.
The area includes most of the Syrian lands that formed the “caliphate” of the Islamic State group, whose fighters have gone underground but vowed to stage a comeback.
More than 10,000 Islamic State prisoners, including many hardened foreign jihadis whose Western governments refuse to take them back, are in prisons there, and tens of thousands of their family members are in camps.
Here is a summary of what the U.S. withdrawal means for those rushing in and those left behind.
www.reuters.com...[editby ]edit on 18-10-2019 by bastion because: (no reason given)
What ceasefire ? Apparently attacks are still happening.
Link
Peace
"Air raids and shelling today killed 14 civilians in the village of Bab al-Hayr and other villages on the outskirts," according to the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights
"Despite the agreement to stop the fighting, Turkish air strikes and artillery attacks continue against the positions of fighters and civilian settlements, " said SDF spokesman Mustafa Bali.
Link
Peace
originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
originally posted by: bastion
Turkey said they'll only stop if the Kurds surrender northern syria (the country which lelly should be theirs).
Why is Syria legally the Kurds' territory and not Syria's?
Re-read my post - the answer is in there (Hint: Post WW1 treaty signed in 1920s) that and all recorded human records, legally established as a separate, ethnic Identity were granted it to prevent ethnic cleansing and a holocaust (much like Israel post WW2). International Human Rights, War Crimes Courts, for saving the world's arses from ISIS and Wahabbism.
The history, holocaust and death toll is several thousand years old and far too complex to explain here.
edit on 18-10-2019 by bastion
because: (no reason given)
a reply to: bastion
A promise is not legally binding, there is no Kurdistan, legally speaking.
If what you want is a war where American invades multiple ME countries to steal their land and give it to the Kurds then say so.
It's hilarious how many people are for a ME war because #OrangeManBad.
A promise is not legally binding, there is no Kurdistan, legally speaking.
If what you want is a war where American invades multiple ME countries to steal their land and give it to the Kurds then say so.
It's hilarious how many people are for a ME war because #OrangeManBad.
a reply to: bastion
The US was not the ones who made that agreement nor broke it with the Kurds.
If I remember right the UK had an agreement with Stalin during WW2 that the US was not made aware of known as the naughty document! Thus why the eastern bloc evolved after the fall of Berlin. Our allies overseas tend to make agreements then expect us to make it happen or clean up messes that evolve from such.
Edit add: a statement made is NOT an agreement.
The US was not the ones who made that agreement nor broke it with the Kurds.
During the First World War, while some Kurdish nationalists were working with the British and Russian enemy powers, Kurdish tribal forces were fighting alongside Ottoman troops on the Russian front. Deaths and displacements occurred on a large scale among Kurdish civilians due to wartime conditions and deliberate ethnic cleansing policies.
There was a brief opportunity for Kurdish nationalism after World War I with the dissolution of the Ottoman Empire. Western powers (particularly the United Kingdom) promised the Kurds they would act as guarantors for Kurdish freedom, a promise they subsequently broke. Some of the autonomist Kurdish groups received British support leading up to the Treaty of Sèvres (1920), which prepared for local autonomy for the Kurdish regions and envisaged later independence. Opposition from Kemal Atatürk, leader of the new nation-state of Turkey, and changes in British policy, prevented such a result. Following the Treaty of Lausanne (1923) the Kurdish territory was partitioned between Turkey, the French mandate of Syria, the British mandate of Iraq, and Persia.
If I remember right the UK had an agreement with Stalin during WW2 that the US was not made aware of known as the naughty document! Thus why the eastern bloc evolved after the fall of Berlin. Our allies overseas tend to make agreements then expect us to make it happen or clean up messes that evolve from such.
edit on 10 18 2019 by CynConcepts because: (no reason given)
Edit add: a statement made is NOT an agreement.
In his Fourteen Points Programme for World Peace, US President Woodrow Wilson included the statement that non-Turkish minorities of the Ottoman Empire should be "assured of an absolute unmolested opportunity of autonomous development"
edit on 10 18 2019 by CynConcepts because:
(no reason given)
a reply to: OccamsRazor04
I'm anti-war.
It's called facts and history. Not 'orange man bad' syndrome - I accused all other allies in WW1 and 2 equally and subsequent presidents, prime ministers as equally guilty of betrayal and ignoring the situation earlier in this thread/another thread today.
I'm anti-war.
It's called facts and history. Not 'orange man bad' syndrome - I accused all other allies in WW1 and 2 equally and subsequent presidents, prime ministers as equally guilty of betrayal and ignoring the situation earlier in this thread/another thread today.
a reply to: CynConcepts
I may be slightly wrong there but it was part of the 1919 - 1923 treaties that sevres was included in where the ME would be divided. The British and French led it but US, Italy, Germany, Russia and France carved and them when present due to the Flu Pandemic limiting travel trying to grab what they could from the collapse of three world superpowers.
Map of Kurdistan as it stood/stands on page 100 here: mrsgiannosa.weebly.com...
I may be slightly wrong there but it was part of the 1919 - 1923 treaties that sevres was included in where the ME would be divided. The British and French led it but US, Italy, Germany, Russia and France carved and them when present due to the Flu Pandemic limiting travel trying to grab what they could from the collapse of three world superpowers.
Map of Kurdistan as it stood/stands on page 100 here: mrsgiannosa.weebly.com...
edit on 18-10-2019 by bastion because: (no reason given)
Pence announces Turkish ceasefire in northern Syria
What ceasefire?
www.usatoday.com...
Erdogan mocks trump just like lil kim and trump praises Erdogan. WTF
www.thesun.co.uk...
edit on 18-10-2019 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)
Yah, I believe it was ME who said that there was no way the war mongers and globalists would allow peace to break out in the middle east.
They couldn't even leave it alone for 24 hrs.
eta: Unlike the Trump hating members of this board, I am sad about it. I would prefer no more endless wars. If you are one of those who is gloating about ORANGE MAN BAD and happy that thus far, the cease far hasn't taken hold - you have issues.
They couldn't even leave it alone for 24 hrs.
eta: Unlike the Trump hating members of this board, I am sad about it. I would prefer no more endless wars. If you are one of those who is gloating about ORANGE MAN BAD and happy that thus far, the cease far hasn't taken hold - you have issues.
edit on 18-10-2019 by toolgal462 because: (no
reason given)
originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: bastion
Great, so short of war and the loss of American lives, how are we getting that Kurdistan going?
Why not ask your local Kurdish embassy?
originally posted by: toolgal462
eta: Unlike the Trump hating members of this board, I am sad about it. I would prefer no more endless wars. If you are one of those who is gloating about ORANGE MAN BAD and happy that thus far, the cease far hasn't taken hold - you have issues.
Ok, let's talk about issues...who sent this letter to Erdogan.
www.vanityfair.com...
this wasn't diplomacy, this was a childish threat to a NATO ally....What do you expect?
edit on 18-10-2019 by olaru12 because: (no reason
given)
a reply to: bastion
I can see a map of the Confederate States of America to this day too. the Confederacy attempted to secede and went to war. They did not win and were absorbed in to the United States of America.
The fact of the matter Kurdistan is the same state of affairs, an Unrecognized State. They may decry that this area is their state of Kurdistan but it is not. They have to accept these facts the same as the confederacy in America did. They need to unite with Syria to ensure a stronger front against Turkey.
I can see a map of the Confederate States of America to this day too. the Confederacy attempted to secede and went to war. They did not win and were absorbed in to the United States of America.
The fact of the matter Kurdistan is the same state of affairs, an Unrecognized State. They may decry that this area is their state of Kurdistan but it is not. They have to accept these facts the same as the confederacy in America did. They need to unite with Syria to ensure a stronger front against Turkey.