Millennials Are Way Poorer Than Baby Boomers Ever Were

originally posted by: wantsome

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Elvis_Is_Dead

So you embrace the idea of borderless world?

You do understand most of the world looks at you and laughs when you complain about how poor you are?

Because, friend, unless you live anywhere close to this, most of the friend sees you for the selfish whiner you are.

Have you seen Detroit?

Good point. I am sad to say I have seen Detroit but I do not claim to be an expert on it's decline. Do you think Detroit's fate could have been avoided?

originally posted by: toysforadults

originally posted by: ParanoidAmerican
a reply to: toysforadults

So you are doing something that most recommended? You have a viable trade and or learning another viable trade. I think many that advocate against college are really advocating against the useless degrees pushed at liberal arts schools.

I have 3 trades however 2 of them are not financially viable.

I guess if I move to a big city I can probably make carpentry work.

My third trade is an athletic skill that is hard to generate an income from.

I'm hoping technology is better.

As someone who works in information security, and has worked in IT in some form or another for the previous fourteen years, you're going to need more than the degree. That being said, the degree is also optional up to a certain point, you can do quite well for yourself without one if you're willing to put in your time.

I know information security looks like a booming market right now, and there is a reason for that, because much like in the early days of the .com bubble companies were hiring anyone that remotely fit the bill that looked good on paper. These days they're getting a bit more savvy about it, they're finding that there are entirely too many people who look good on paper that can't execute at the job. I've met entirely too many that are assigned to our cyber practice that have never touched a network device in their lives, all can they do is policy and procedure review but can't tell you why a policy makes sense or doesn't. They don't get the underlying framework and can't see the big picture that you need to be able to see in order to be successful in this field.

I'm not trying to burst anyone's bubble on this, I just want to be sure if you're getting a degree that your expectations are set properly. Whatever hiring or placement stats your school is telling you about your program are mostly BS, and you need to be prepared to work your butt off 70-80 hours a week for a while in order to get where you're going to be comfortable with the level of compensation you're receiving.

They are also way lazier than baby boomers ever were. They are also way more entitled.

a reply to: Hypntick

I'm expecting that.

I do spend my time developing real skills such as Python, Cisco networking and with RedHat and Kali Linux.

a reply to: toysforadults

Good deal, as long as you're willing to put the work in it's a rewarding career choice. It's also a career choice that I don't see going away anytime soon, although I will throw a caveat in there with it, there are some areas that are going to be more stable than others. Pick the niche that's right for you and stick with it, just don't silo yourself off completely. I hope it works out for you as well as it has me and if you need any advice don't hesitate to kick me a message on here, I had people I could bounce things off of when I started out and it helped immensely so I always try and return the favor when I can.

a reply to: Hypntick

I appreciate it.

Something I've noticed is that although there is a lot of competition early on there is also a lot of people who are not competitive. I've noticed a lot of techies get comfortable with where they are at.

My personal motto is;

Develop the skill and the opportunity will present itself, if there are no opportunities than you haven't developed the skill

originally posted by: Elvis_Is_Dead

originally posted by: wantsome

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Elvis_Is_Dead

So you embrace the idea of borderless world?

You do understand most of the world looks at you and laughs when you complain about how poor you are?

Because, friend, unless you live anywhere close to this, most of the friend sees you for the selfish whiner you are.

Have you seen Detroit?

Good point. I am sad to say I have seen Detroit but I do not claim to be an expert on it's decline. Do you think Detroit's fate could have been avoided?

Detroit at one point in time was all white and one of the biggest cities in the country. My grandmother said she remembers when the first black family moved in on her street that everyone put their homes up for sale. People fled the inner city and moved the suburbs. In the 70's 80's and 90's Detroit was the most segregated city in America. After the riots in 60's the city was abandoned by whites. High crime taxes and corruption drove businesses out. While the inner city decayed the suburbs flourished. Downtown Detroit has been rebuilt but the surrounding area is a 3rd world country in itself. There are few job opportunities within the city of Detroit. A lot of people can't afford transportation to get to the suburbs. 1/2 of the inner city is illiterate. The school system is a mess. There's a lot of racism in this area. I've seen black people flat out get discriminated against in the work place. There's a lot more to the area but I don't feel like writing a essay.

a reply to: wantsome

The decline of the auto industry has to have something to do with it as well. I would love to hear the unbiased history of that epic failure.

a reply to: conspiracy nut

My grandmother retired in 1983 with a full pension from Crystler. My grandfather retried in 1986 from Crystler. Currently my dad works at GM and my step dad works at Ford. My grandfather came to Detroit after he served in WW2. My grandmother moved here during the war. Before Crystler my grandmother worked in a munitions factory for the government and made parts for the bombs dropped on Japan. My grandmother had a 3rd grade education and was born on a kitchen table in a dirt floor shack in Kentucky. My grandfather had an 8th grade education. Both lived the American dream.

Globalization: The auto industry moved down south and to Canada and Mexico. Why pay someone $30 an hour when someone down south is willing to take $16 or $3 in Mexico? We still have a large portion of the Auto industry but we lost a ton of manufacturing to China. In the mid 2000's I watched entire industrial complexes disappear. It moved to China and other countries. Companies I was working for were flat out dealing with the Chinese. I worked in tool and die and we were getting dies in with Chinese writing all over them. Why pay $20000 for a die when the Chinese can make it for $2000. That's exactly what I was told by my boss. There were write ups in the news papers at the time about jobs leaving for China.

Most of the burned out factories from the inner city of Detroit are from the 50's. They built newer factories in the surrounding area. There are still a few auto plants in the inner city but not many. Mostly everything moved to the suburbs.

I will say one thing...
It certainly doesn't look like the baby boomers put a lot effort and thought in to solidifying the future for their children.

Just sayin...

originally posted by: Bluntone22

originally posted by: ParanoidAmerican
As a business owner that employs in this age rage mostly. I can tell you this. There is zero commitment, zero work ethic, and an entitlement complex from 8 out of 10. I went through 15 employees in that age range, not one put in a notice or preformed their job as expected.

I experience this exact thing in my job.
I believe it's the result of the trophy for everybody mentality.
One of the biggest problems is getting them to show up to work every day.

Ah, but for those who do show up and do know about work ethic---it is awesome! I have a couple of young relatives who, despite being raised during the "trophy for participation" phase were taught that if they wanted that latest new gadget, they would have to earn the money to buy it. If they wanted a car they would have to earn the money to purchase it and pay the insurance. If they wanted a college education they had to do well in school and earn scholarships. At age seventeen one of them was earning money by filling out grant and scholarship forms because his friends were too lazy to learn to fill them out. That was in between his dish-washing job, his paper route and his lawn mowing service.
They don't have brand new cars, gadgets, students loans or cable tv. They know how to operate a coffee maker so they don't spend obscene amounts of money per day to look trendy with their "name brand" coffee cups in their hand. They know how to cook so they don't end up spending a third of their paycheck eating fast food. They do have a bit of money put aside in case of emergency and they have risen rapidly in their career fields. The big problem for them is that they have been forced to buy health insurance at a price that could have covered the cost of a mortgage so it is taking them a bit longer to be able to buy a home with a large down payment.

a reply to: wantsome

It wasn't just the $30/hour. When you factored in the benefits that union contracts demanded, you could often double that in worth. So it was more like paying someone $60 to $70 per hour. By the time you factored in labor payout to employees between wages, benefits, pensions on retired workers, etc., the auto industry was often only making about $1,000 or so back on each car to cover everything else it had to pay for in some cases, and that's not talking about making profit but paying overhead to keep making more cars before even getting to profit.

Consumers will only pay so much for cars and trucks, and the auto industry reached that threshold and then started running into stiff competition from Japan where the union wasn't strong-arming them into what they were having to pay their workers.

a reply to: toysforadults

It's the direction the System is being driven. Fake inflation, It's like a deliberate attempt to topple the system over a few decades, so people wouldn't notice. Problem is, people are noticing.

originally posted by: Voyaging
a reply to: Krakatoa

Lol try finding a job without a cell phone and internet connection... Just FYI having a little compassion and understanding for you fellow human being looks a lot better than saying selfish and rude, underhanded things to an entire generation of people.

I cry tears for you, really.
Well, not really, because to me "feelings" aren't something to be used as a tools to win an argument. Actions and deeds are more relevant.

Sorry if that offends your fragile ego and "feelings".

originally posted by: ketsuko
How many millennials also have much higher college debt payments than baby boomers too?

That might be part of your problem.

I think student loans were private sector loans around 3% until Barry Obama made all student loans 6% government loans. Trump should retro-actively return loans to earlier rates. Barry hung out the mils to dry with his policies yet they still voted for him. Colleges treated the mils like mushrooms- raising tuition rates yearly handing out ever larger loans the govt knew could not be repaid.College is mainly a bad investment taking up too much of a family's income. I have empathy for the mils sometimes life is not fair or easy but it looks like things might be improving

and whos fault is this?

a. the people who were born into the system and have no choice?

or

b. the people who made the system the way it is right now?

a reply to: ketsuko

what about the lack of foresight by american automakers who continued to build big expensive gas guzzlers while japan was making cheaper more reliable fuel efficient vehicles? had the american automakers been making a quality product they could have been profitable and their employees could have continued to comfortably provide for their families.

a reply to: toysforadults

You don’t like anything that worked, unions for instance.

Yet you complain...

Maybe the obvious, such as lack of unions, and greed is the explanation for the problem

And the CEO's making so much money compared to the past

a reply to: Willtell

the problem is workers not demanding higher wages unions are just an organized version of that

all we have to do is decide to not purchase the products and services they offer and it fixes itself

originally posted by: conspiracy nut
They are also way lazier than baby boomers ever were. They are also way more entitled.

Another thing we've heard the older generations say about the younger ones since forever.

The current rulers of the roost ever self-satisfied that they've earned the right to judge all that came after and find themselves to be better.

Par for the course.