Russia to expel US displomats

originally posted by: Velatropa24

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Velatropa24
Explain to me, sinse when was Crimea a country, son?

Sometime around the 8th century, BCE. Then the invasions and occupations began. Interestingly the Russians had nothing to do with Crimea until 1783. It was an autonomous republic under the USSR, downgraded during WWII to an oblast and then given to Ukraine in 1954.

originally posted by: Velatropa24
I am still waiting for Kosovo to be handed back. Some how don't see that happening.

Why would it be given back. it would undermine the Brussels agreement of 2013 signed by Kosovo and Serbia.

originally posted by: Velatropa24
And do you really want to start talking about invading countries, being from US? The double standards never cease to amaze me.

Sure - the US didnt invade Ukraine and illegally seize / occupy Crimea.

...and Russia didn't invade Iraq, Lybia, and countless others of recent times. Your point being?

We left and didnt annex anything.

Russia on the other hand...

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Velatropa24

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Velatropa24
Explain to me, sinse when was Crimea a country, son?

Sometime around the 8th century, BCE. Then the invasions and occupations began. Interestingly the Russians had nothing to do with Crimea until 1783. It was an autonomous republic under the USSR, downgraded during WWII to an oblast and then given to Ukraine in 1954.

originally posted by: Velatropa24
I am still waiting for Kosovo to be handed back. Some how don't see that happening.

Why would it be given back. it would undermine the Brussels agreement of 2013 signed by Kosovo and Serbia.

originally posted by: Velatropa24
And do you really want to start talking about invading countries, being from US? The double standards never cease to amaze me.

Sure - the US didnt invade Ukraine and illegally seize / occupy Crimea.

...and Russia didn't invade Iraq, Lybia, and countless others of recent times. Your point being?

We left and didnt annex anything.

Russia on the other hand...

So that makes it alright does it?

Go in, cause desth, suffering and misery, obliterate the infrastructure and leave. Russia on the other hand saved Crimea from what is going on in Donbass right now. The people of Crimea are happier then ever. Economy is growing, peace and security. Everybody wins. Everybody but US who were eying up the black sea naval base.

Russia took back what's theres. And good on them.
Period.

a reply to: Velatropa24

Except Crimea doesnt belong to Russia, it belongs to Ukraine. Throwing a temper tantrum, invading ukraine and illegally occupying Crimea doesnt change that fact.

Sanctions wont go away until russia leaves.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: markosity1973

The most solid evidence I have heard of was the Russians approaching Trump's son and offering dirt on Hilary.

Why are ignoring the US intel community's conclusion?

Russia again is just the boogeyman and an unwitting pawn in a power struggle.

Unwitting? LOL

I'm not.

The agencies said Putin and the Russian government had a "clear preference" for Trump to win the White House. Putin's associates hacked information, paid social media "trolls" and backed efforts by Russian government agencies and state-funded media to sway public opinion, the agencies said.

The report stopped short of assessing whether Russia succeeded in swaying the election result.

www.reuters.com...

What about all those Clinton Foundation donations?

www.washingtonpost.com... a6a3-d50061aa9fae_story.html?utm_term=.636ee7b3af6c

www.theaustralian.com.au...

If you're gonna imply Russia, then you need to look at who backed Hilary too. Remember, there was plenty of mud being flung at Trump too.

I am simply saying that unless a direct cause and effect relationship between what Russia did over any other country that to paraphrase the US intel community 'had a clear preference for Hilary' over voters at the polling booth can be shown, then it's a case of 'well maybe next time the USA should be more careful when it holds an election' and it should stop canvassing other countries for money and favour in terms of candidates. Period.

As Putin said famously - who is America to lecture the world about 'democracy' when in it's history, the election result was rigged by who had the support of the most super delegates over the actual vote count. Naturally referring to Bush winning over Gore there.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Except Crimea doesnt belong to Russia, it belongs to Ukraine. Throwing a temper tantrum, invading ukraine and illegally occupying Crimea doesnt change that fact.

Sanctions wont go away until russia leaves.

You can throw opinions and deny all you want. Crimea is Russia. It was, it is and it will be forever more. Get used to it. It will make your life easier. You'll sleep better.

a reply to: Velatropa24

and like I said russia will remain under sanctions until they withdraw from Ukrainian territory, including Crimea.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Except Crimea doesnt belong to Russia, it belongs to Ukraine. Throwing a temper tantrum, invading ukraine and illegally occupying Crimea doesnt change that fact.

Sanctions wont go away until russia leaves.

Fact #1 Crimea is known officially as the AUTONOMOUS republic of Crimea.

Wikipedia definition of Autonomous republic

An autonomous republic is a type of administrative division similar to a province or state. A significant number of autonomous republics can be found within the successor states of the Soviet Union, but the majority are located within Russia. Many of these republics were established during the Soviet period as Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republics, or ASSRs.

They enjoy a lot more freedom that a regular state because they have their own local government. They write many laws that differ from those of their defacto capital. ie Quite a few autonomous republics are far more gay friendly than Russia.

Fact #2 The local government held a referendum (admittedly AFTER the Russian occupation) and the resut was 95.5% in favour of rejoining Russia.

Fact #3 While the above referndum is contentious at best, there was a German poll done on the locals one year after the annexation by Russia. And the results are below

In February 2015, a poll by German polling firm GfK revealed that attitudes have not changed. When asked “Do you endorse Russia’s annexation of Crimea?”, a total of 82% of the respondents answered “yes, definitely,” and another 11% answered “yes, for the most part.” Only 2% said they didn't know, and another 2% said no. Three percent did not specify their position.

www.forbes.com...

It would seem that the people it ACTUALLY affects, ie the citizens of the Crimean peninsula themselves seem pretty happy with being part of Russia again.

The Ukraine is butthurt because of the way Putin took Crimea back. And because it had NATO ambitions. The USA and the EU are mad because they couldn't do anything to stop it. But if the people actually said yes to it and they are still happy as an independent poll confirms, then maybe it's time to talk about how we accept it.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

and like I said russia will remain under sanctions until they withdraw from Ukrainian territory, including Crimea.

I have some news for you - no one in Russia gives half a s#!t about sanctions. People are happy, they raise children and live their lives. No one is starving because of US sanctions, infact, life is getting better, more jobs are created and domestic businesses are thriving as a direct result of US sanctions. So keep em coming. And if you think that Russia will give half an inch of their territory (including crimea) to ease sanctions, you are delusional.

PS: Donetsk and Lugansk will join Russia to once the time is right. Watch this space.

a reply to: Velatropa24

Lol, yes that is the amazing hat trick Putin managed to pull off. The sanctions decimated their economy at first - the regular middle class folk were almost wiped out, forced into poverty. But Putin showed leadership and said 'well, stuff you all then, let's return to the LOCAL economy' And look what happened - Russia's economy is growing again.

So, pretty much a middle finger to the USA and it's cronies as well as the globalist agenda from Russia right there.

a reply to: Velatropa24

Denial didnt save the soviet union and wont save putins russia.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Denial didnt save the soviet union and wont save putins russia.

And it sure as heck will not save the USA from collapsing in a screaming heap. Your nation is in big trouble. Trump is trying to fix it. And I actually respect him for that. I think he is a man of interesting ideas, but terrible execution.

However, he is being fought so hard, from so many sides that all that is happening is chaos. Like mega chaos.

a reply to: markosity1973

Yes and No.

While our debt is a problem people dont really understand it or how it works. If the US opted not to raise the national debt we would not default on what we owe. Tax revenues can easily cover servicing the debt. Since we dont use a gold standard our currency is backed by the full faith and credit of the US. To investors all they care about is ability to repay the debt, which, again, we can easily do.

US road infrastructure alone is valued at around 37 trillion dollars.

Politicians use it as a political issue however they do so knowing most people dont understand it. They scream about how the world would end if the debt ceiling isnt raise, a depression like the world has never seen, followed by week 2.

The US is nowhere near collapse.

I support trumps attempts to fix things on the money end. Personally I think the US should end all aid we currently provide to Russia and China.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: markosity1973

Personally I think the US should end all aid we currently provide to Russia and China.

What the USA needs to lead the world back away from is decentralised capitalism. i.e. What we consume is made in the country we live in. Corporations are getting rich off the back of slavery and bad working conditions. This has had many many fall out effects;

1) It has decimated local manufacturing and all the associated jobs in the developed world
2) It has empowered places like China to become a problem for us. (Think New Zealand and the economic takeover currently in place over there and the South China sea issue)
3) It has created a flood of cheaply made goods that are usually of lesser quality than locally made items.
4) The above has in turn created a throw away society that does not value quality and longevity in products any more.
5) Profits that were once invested back into local economies are now being invested overseas where foreign governments are using the money they are gaining for purposes that can at times be hostile to the very countries providing them with the business.

That is why MAGA does interest me. I think there is a better way to help the world get ahead. And it does not need to be at the expense of the already developed nations.

a reply to: Xcathdra

it seems russia got caught

Yes, that seems to be the case... cloak and dagger games.

where Europe has some economic interests.

Doesn't matter, does it? America first!

With europe the almighty euro is more important.

National interests to the point of national security. We've learned a lot from you guys.

a reply to: PublicOpinion

and to think we rarely agree on anything but today we found a post we do agree on.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Denial didnt save the soviet union and wont save putins russia.

So you are emplying that US sanctions are going to destroy Putin's Russia? Lol thanks for the laugh.

originally posted by: Velatropa24

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Denial didnt save the soviet union and wont save putins russia.

So you are emplying that US sanctions are going to destroy Putin's Russia? Lol thanks for the laugh.

How do you think the Soviet Union collapsed chuckles? All its going to take is Putins ego writing a check he cant cash, resulting in full sanctions from the west again. His latest stunt in Georgia could very well bring them closer to that point.

Putin will bring about the collapse of russia.

originally posted by: markosity1973

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Denial didnt save the soviet union and wont save putins russia.

And it sure as heck will not save the USA from collapsing in a screaming heap. Your nation is in big trouble. Trump is trying to fix it. And I actually respect him for that. I think he is a man of interesting ideas, but terrible execution.

However, he is being fought so hard, from so many sides that all that is happening is chaos. Like mega chaos.

Here I can draw parallels with arguing with deeply religious folk. You bring them 100 undeniable clear as day light facts, and they will go right over their heads, they will just keep arguing their same old points which have already been proven untrue 100 times, with nothing but faith to back them up. They are unsucceptible to logic. Where there is faith, there is no logic or common sense.

The difference with some here (won't name anyone) is they have faith in the United States, in their blinded eyes, everything and anything US does is correct and good. This isn't patriotism it's stupidity and indoctrination. A true patriot wants to solve problems, these sheep are just part of the problem.

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Velatropa24

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Denial didnt save the soviet union and wont save putins russia.

So you are emplying that US sanctions are going to destroy Putin's Russia? Lol thanks for the laugh.

How do you think the Soviet Union collapsed chuckles? All its going to take is Putins ego writing a check he cant cash, resulting in full sanctions from the west again. His latest stunt in Georgia could very well bring them closer to that point.

Putin will bring about the collapse of russia.

I understand it's your wet dream. You just keep wishing buddy so far the exact opposite has happened, Putin has done nothing but good for Russia. If you are too blind to see the trends, there isn't much that can be done for you.

I understand that you would rather see Russia like under yeltsin - Broke, obedient and resources flowing to the west for next to nothing. No more buddy, neve again.

a reply to: Velatropa24

Putin has done nothing but good for Russia

Yes and no. And why is that relevant for this topic?

The data confirm a trend noted by the Levada Center in March. While Putin's approval was still at a sky-high 82 percent, Medvedev's had dropped to 42 percent from 52 percent in February.

There can only be one explanation for the clear shift: Corruption fighter Alexei Navalny's movie about Medvedev's use of stately manors and other luxury attributes held by shady non-profit organizations. The documentary was posted to YouTube on March 2. It has been viewed almost 20 million times since. Medvedev took a long time to respond personally to the accusations in the film. He waited until tens of thousands of people, many of them young, took to the streets throughout Russia to protest against top-level corruption, and until Navalny himself was jailed for organizing the rallies and released after serving out the 15-day sentence. On April 4, the prime minister branded the film "dishonest" and dismissed it as a motley collection of irrelevant material thrown together by those "trying to get people out on the street and achieve their political goals." The April Levada survey shows that this weak response hasn't helped.

This says something important about Levada polls. They are clearly far more useful than a dead man's cardiogram, which they have often resembled in recent years. They efficiently pick up public reactions to new, important information. They can also reflect the precarious standing of major political figures -- as long as these figures aren't Putin. It's not as scary to answer a stranger's question about Medvedev or anyone else in Putin's "power vertical" as it is to answer questions about the national leader himself. You're only disloyal if you want Putin to go.

Medvedev's low support level doesn't mean that his boss has suddenly become unpopular. But it does show Russians' increased dissatisfaction with the way they are governed. Russians know, both instinctively and from Kremlin propaganda, that Putin is the micromanager behind the system. The support for Putin is often insincere, a sign of the general mistrust that characterizes Russian society.

Russian Polls Do Mean Something After All

Where there is faith, there is no logic or common sense.

Chapeau! Guess I'm the only holy trinity here, eh?



PS: can we change the headline to "dissplomats"?