The Mandela Effect: Real or Ridiculous?

a reply to: neutronflux

Mmmm your confused because you jump time lines or current models through advancements in science more accurately position the earth in our changing understanding of the milky way. Has nothing to with the fluid nature of our understanding of the universe?

So can you post a scientific source that shows the old, less accurate position? People seem to think it used to be in the Saggitarius arm. If your counterargument is that science got more accurate then there must be older scientific sources putting it in the Saggitarius arm.

originally posted by: TheMaxHeadroomIncident
a reply to: neutronflux

Mmmm your confused because you jump time lines or current models through advancements in science more accurately position the earth in our changing understanding of the milky way. Has nothing to with the fluid nature of our understanding of the universe?

So can you post a scientific source that shows the old, less accurate position? People seem to think it used to be in the Saggitarius arm. If your counterargument is that science got more accurate then there must be older scientific sources putting it in the Saggitarius arm.

Gave a quote in 2014 scientists still had room for doubt if the milky way was a true spiral galaxy and had not accurately modelled it's structure.


Show me scientist's claims that artist's concept draws of the milky way galaxy from the 80s, 90s, 2000s were literal, accurat, and to be taken as gospel.

a reply to: neutronflux

Show me scientist's claims that artist's concept draws of the milky way galaxy from the 80s, 90s, 2000s were literal, accurat, and to be taken as gospel.

So who started the notion that we are located in the Saggitarius arm?

I dont think it is the Mandela Effect.
I think Them! those who tell the goverment what to do.
are Rewriting the history on the internet.
most people just go with it.
think how much power this gives them!

they have been doing this a long time.
and I think one of they is joking with us to
see just how far he can go before we see it.

Here is one of the first drawing of the milky way galaxy. All others would be false?

www.e-education.psu.edu...

a reply to: neutronflux

"In the past 75 years, astronomers have refined this picture, using a variety of techniques of radio, optical, infrared and even x-ray astronomy, to fill in the details: the location of spiral arms, clouds of gas and dust, concentrations of moleculesand so on. The essential modern picture is that our solar system is located on the inner edge of a spiral arm, about 25,000 light-years from the center of the galaxy, which is in the direction of the constellation of Sagittarius.

Article from 1999.

www.scientificamerican.com...


But we are on the Orion spur now.

a reply to: TheMaxHeadroomIncident

Really don't care. I gave proof the model of the milky has changed as knowledge changes.

How is ME proved by your recall of an erroneous artist's concept of the Galaxy? Prove the artist concept was from a correct model for when it was created.

a reply to: neutronflux

How is ME proved by your recall of an erroneous artist's concept of the Galaxy? Prove the artist concept was from a correct model for when it was created.

I am not trying to prove the ME. I am asking you how the misconception that we are in the Saggittarius arm was born.

Why would all artist renderings just randomly assume that we are in the Saggitarius arm? You'd think this would be based on the science of that time.

originally posted by: TheMaxHeadroomIncident
a reply to: neutronflux

"In the past 75 years, astronomers have refined this picture, using a variety of techniques of radio, optical, infrared and even x-ray astronomy, to fill in the details: the location of spiral arms, clouds of gas and dust, concentrations of moleculesand so on. The essential modern picture is that our solar system is located on the inner edge of a spiral arm, about 25,000 light-years from the center of the galaxy, which is in the direction of the constellation of Sagittarius.

Article from 1999.

www.scientificamerican.com...


But we are on the Orion spur now.

The above bit only mentioned constellation of Sagittarius, not arm.

Or

From:
en.m.wikipedia.org...
"The Orion Arm is located between the Carina–Sagittarius Arm (toward the Galactic Center) and the Perseus Arm (toward the outside Universe), the latter one of the two major arms of the Milky Way. Long thought to be a minor structure, a "spur" between the two longer adjacent arms Perseus and Carina-Sagittarius, evidence was presented in mid 2013 that it might be a branch of the Perseus Arm, or possibly an independent arm segment itself.,"

Lots of references to Sagittarius in different contexts.

originally posted by: TheMaxHeadroomIncident
a reply to: neutronflux

"In the past 75 years, astronomers have refined this picture, using a variety of techniques of radio, optical, infrared and even x-ray astronomy, to fill in the details: the location of spiral arms, clouds of gas and dust, concentrations of moleculesand so on. The essential modern picture is that our solar system is located on the inner edge of a spiral arm, about 25,000 light-years from the center of the galaxy, which is in the direction of the constellation of Sagittarius.

Article from 1999.

www.scientificamerican.com...


But we are on the Orion spur now.

I think I misinterpreted this qoute,

The essential modern picture is that our solar system is located on the inner edge of a spiral arm, about 25,000 light-years from the center of the galaxy, which is in the direction of the constellation of Sagittarius.

They mean that the center of the galaxy is in the direction of Sagittarius, not that the spiral arm we are on is in that direction.

My bad.

It's confusing?????

Different articles use similar yet different names.

From galaxymap.org...

"The other arms have been treated a bit like those roads in European cities that change their names every few blocks. The other major arm in Hurt's illustration runs through the southern constellations Scutum, Crux and Centaurus (among others) as viewed from Earth so in the scientific literature it can be called the Scutum-Crux arm, the Scutum-Centaurus arm, the Crux-Centaurus arm, the Crux-Scutum arm, the Scutum arm, the Crux arm, the Centaurus arm, and even the Scutum-Crux-Centaurus arm"

" The Orion spur appears to branch off from the Sagittarius arm at or near the intense radio source W51, which is a large complex of star formation regions and supernova remnants."

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
This was originally going to be a post, but as is often the case, I get carried away and end up writing a novel. Yes I realize this topic may seem pretty dumb to a lot of people, but this is the skunk works it's fun to think about crazy theories some times. Recently, I realized that I seem to remember things the same way many other people who experience the Mandela Effect claim to remember things, so I've been doing a bit of research on the Mandela Effect over the last few days. Only a week ago I would have laughed at the theory but I'm starting to think there may be something to it, which is hard for me to say, it puts into question my sanity and the basis of my entire reality.

Many of you will know I'm a fairly skeptical and scientific person, I don't believe in religion or ghosts or things like that. But when so many people seem to think a certain thing in history has mysteriously changed, and then I also agree with them on a consistent basis, I have to ask why we all remember it to be the same thing. There's a couple of big ones, like 6 people in the car with JFK instead of 4, I mean I'm not exactly new to conspiracy theories, I shouldn't be misremembering one of the most important moments in the realm of conspiracy theories. I remember reading theories about how it could have been the driver, but now that's not even really possible because of the people between them.

I was some what willing to chock those things up to faulty memory, I haven't researched JFK in some time, but I just came across an example which absolutely blew my socks off more than any other I've seen so far. Ask yourself, where is our solar system located in the galaxy? If you answered some where on the outer edges you would be wrong, according to science it's near the middle, right between the edge and center! Now the reason I find this so astonishing is because I know quite a bit when it comes to cosmology, the majority of my threads are on the topic of cosmology and physics. I know enough that I've been able to work on developing my own theories related to negative energy and negative mass.

I've watched at least several hundred science documentaries over my years of browsing YouTube, and I've seen the location of the solar system described in at least a dozen of them. Do an image search for the location of the solar system in the galaxy and you will see it's depicted as being near the center most of the time. There are some images showing it closer to the edge but they are harder to find, and the one example I found was on a Reddit thread from two months ago where they were discussing the Mandela Effect and how the location of the solar system has changed. It's not just that though, I clearly remember the location being on the edge of the Sagittarius arm, now we're in the Orion Spur?!?

Even in docos made just a few years ago I remember jokes made about how Earth is out in the boondocks. Now one might reason that science changes and evolves, and old data gets replaced with more correct data, but there are two reasons I cannot accept such an explanation. First, we named the arm of the galaxy we are in, it's not something that changes with new information, our distance from the center should simply change with more accurate data. Second, I like to think I keep rather up to date on the latest scientific revelations, at no point did I realize there had been a major shift in our location within the galaxy, it was not announced or discussed by news outlets.

Doesn't it seem a bit strange that this topic seemed to be a non-issue until a few months ago when people starting talking about it on Reddit? With every example of the Mandela Effect I've seen so far, the history behind the thing in question seems some how murky or obscured, and I find it astonishing there isn't any clear explanation for how some of these misconceptions come about. It's like we just accept the misconception but ignore the fact it seems to have no rational origin. And in most cases there is some sort of residual evidence left from how it used to be, most things seem to get changed so that the time line isn't full of paradoxes, old pictures and video will be changed.

But then you'll get something which is like a remnant left over from another time. The lady in this video came across some old collectible record booklets, and she happens to have one for Snow White and also one for Star Wars. In those old booklets, the words spoken by the evil queen are "Mirror, mirror, on the wall" and the Star Wars booklets contains pictures showing C-3PO with a fully gold/bronze body. Unfortunately it doesn't contain the infamous line spoken by Darth Vader to Luke. A Google search will reveal countless people misquoting the film. The scene is also on YouTube, one of the earliest videos was uploaded in 2007. It has over 5 million views and is titled "Luke, I am your father".

The vast majority of the comments under the video are people talking about the Mandela Effect and how they're certain it has changed. In several interviews, even James Earl Jones recalls the the line as "Luke, I am your father". Again, it seems rather strange that people would recently just notice this well known line has changed and why do so many think it has changed, is there a source for this misconception? It seems like this stuff should be pretty easy to debunk if there is a clear cause for these false memories. I get the sense that it's fine for these residual effects to remain, as long as you cannot use them to prove anything has changed, so no one will present a true paradox in reality.

The closest phenomena to this I know of occurs between two entangled particles. In setups such as the delayed choice quantum eraser, there is so called "back loading" effect which can occur so that what happens in the past is decided by what happens in the present. What this means is that events in the past are decided in a retrocausal manner so they are consistent with observations made in the present. In other words, what one entangled particle does can depend on what happens to its partner at a future moment in time. Not entirely sure how that relates to the Mandela Effect but it's the best example of interactions happening between different points in time.

If you have a rational explanation for any of the questions I have posed then I would like to hear them, I really would prefer to believe I'm not ping ponging between time lines or living in a computer simulation which is getting adjusted. It's just when I see so many people saying the same thing, and I agree in most cases, and especially when it's something I feel like I've grown up knowing, I have to seriously consider the most insane possibilities. Most of the Mandela Effect videos I have watched have a good like/unlike ratio, which isn't typical for most fringe videos on YouTube, people will strongly dislike misleading and incorrect videos, but that's not what I'm observing in this case.

Great post ,

Yea we were on the 7/10 tenths edge from the center of the Galaxy,they didn't update the theory,we are now 5/10 tenths.

Schrödinger's cat reality change's when it is observed , Entanglement


The Effect is a real

Prior to the 1500s, many sea navigators of different tribes (Europeans) KNEW the Earth was flat....because God created it that way, and the Sun and stars revolved around the Earth....This was undisputed fact, they even drew Maps about it.

As knowledge improved, science improved, and we now know the Earth is in fact, a Sphere, and revolves around the Sun, and is part of a Galaxy, that also revolves, and moves thru the Cosmos.

Of Course, The people of the 1500s and before, say this is the Mandela Effect, that when they were around, they just KNEW the Earth was flat, boats dropped off the edge and Earth was the centre of the Universe..........

Ridiculous isn't it?

a reply to: gort51

Prior to the 1500s, many sea navigators of different tribes (Europeans) KNEW the Earth was flat

False. Navigators were quite aware that the Earth is not flat. Sailing along the coast of Africa told them that. Sailing more than a few miles offshore told them that.


Do you think that Columbus set out to prove that the Earth is round? No, he set out to get to China. There was, however, something in the way. Lucky for him. He barely made it that far.

OP!

Thank you for your thread.

Most probably you are carrying the biggest ME always with you, your body..

Use your right arm's index and middle finger, close your eyes and try hard to remember all the times you felt your pulse in the wrist of your left arm, now place your fingers were the pulse is ...

There is a big chance that you like me and many others put your fingers here



Well you will not find anything there now

Regarding our position in the milky way, I had to create the following image because it is so nice to see our location like we know it...



does this rings a bell?

originally posted by: heineken
OP!

Thank you for your thread.

Most probably you are carrying the biggest ME always with you, your body..

Use your right arm's index and middle finger, close your eyes and try hard to remember all the times you felt your pulse in the wrist of your left arm, now place your fingers were the pulse is ...

There is a big chance that you like me and many others put your fingers here

Well you will not find anything there now

If you check Google images, you will see there is about five or six different techniques for checking the pulse in your wrist. This makes it look as though the pulse is in different places. Two fingers ACROSS the wrist is how I have always done it...and as does my nurse, who has to give me a check-up every month because I have Crohn's Disease.

originally posted by: stinkelbaum
what annoys me most about this 'mandela effect', is that nobody mentions the socio political impact following his death, apartheid would have no figurehead opponent, governments supported apartheid around the world, reagan and thatcher being the biggest proponents supporting 'mandela is a terrorist', no early eighties free nelson mandela concerts or song, south africa would still not be allowed to participate in sports so, who held the world cup, which famous sports stars received bans for rebel tours to south africa?
these are always ignored, just a vague memory mandela died.
it appears they should get together and put a little more meat to this story.
also, why no uproar a few years back when mandela opened the football world cup in 2010, when invictus came out in 2009 where morgan freeman was up for an oscar for playing mandela, in their supposed timeline he died years prior.

Maybe he did die, and maybe all this happened, and somehow at a distant time we figured out time travel and went back to his death and changed that outcome to change all that from happening trove link
from link
"SOUTH AFRICA

Rumours of Mandela's
death spark riots

JOHANNESBURG, Tuesday (AP). -

Hundreds of Soweto high school students
went on a rampage yesterday because of


rumours that black leader Mr Nelson Mandela had died in prison.

The incident came as police armed with
shotguns barred more than 1,000 students
and teachers from reopening Cape Town area
schools ordered closed by the Government
because of rioting and as South African
troops and planes swept into southern Angola
to strike at South-West African guerillas the
military said were planning attacks on towns
and military bases.

Mr Mandela's wife, Winnie, said the
rumours were false.



The rampaging students streamed from
Orlando high school and stoned vehicles in
response to the rumours, witnesses reported.

Three armored vehicles moved up to the
school, firing teargas and rubber bullets

A police communique said several vehicles were destroyed and soldiers firing
birdshot wounded one youth. _

Police said a gang of young blacks heaving
stones and petrol bombs also ambushed a
tanker truck loaded with an flammable liquid


- tolulene - east of Cape Town on the main
road to the city's airoort."

I don't know if that makes any sense, as I'm confused myself. But I would be interested in how that rumour started.

Mandela Effects are both real and ridiculous.

“Far out in the uncharted backwaters of the unfashionable end of the western spiral arm of the Galaxy lies a small unregarded yellow sun. Orbiting this at a distance of roughly ninety-two million miles is an utterly insignificant little blue green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly primitive that they still think digital watches are a pretty neat idea.” - Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy.

This is coming from Douglas Adams who was a huge science enthusiast and one of the greatest scifi-comedy (one of the few successful at it) writers. He would have checked where science had positioned us in our galaxy. "Backwarters of the unfashionable end of the western spiral arm" doesn't sound like the center of the galaxy on the Orion spur.

I trust Douglas Adams over the official recorded history at this point.

Awaiting impatiently for the next Mandela thread titled:

'Gene Wilder died years ago! PROOF! '


'Gene Wilder died years ago! PROOF! '