The Mandela Effect: Real or Ridiculous?

This was originally going to be a post, but as is often the case, I get carried away and end up writing a novel. Yes I realize this topic may seem pretty dumb to a lot of people, but this is the skunk works it's fun to think about crazy theories some times. Recently, I realized that I seem to remember things the same way many other people who experience the Mandela Effect claim to remember things, so I've been doing a bit of research on the Mandela Effect over the last few days. Only a week ago I would have laughed at the theory but I'm starting to think there may be something to it, which is hard for me to say, it puts into question my sanity and the basis of my entire reality.

Many of you will know I'm a fairly skeptical and scientific person, I don't believe in religion or ghosts or things like that. But when so many people seem to think a certain thing in history has mysteriously changed, and then I also agree with them on a consistent basis, I have to ask why we all remember it to be the same thing. There's a couple of big ones, like 6 people in the car with JFK instead of 4, I mean I'm not exactly new to conspiracy theories, I shouldn't be misremembering one of the most important moments in the realm of conspiracy theories. I remember reading theories about how it could have been the driver, but now that's not even really possible because of the people between them.

I was some what willing to chock those things up to faulty memory, I haven't researched JFK in some time, but I just came across an example which absolutely blew my socks off more than any other I've seen so far. Ask yourself, where is our solar system located in the galaxy? If you answered some where on the outer edges you would be wrong, according to science it's near the middle, right between the edge and center! Now the reason I find this so astonishing is because I know quite a bit when it comes to cosmology, the majority of my threads are on the topic of cosmology and physics. I know enough that I've been able to work on developing my own theories related to negative energy and negative mass.

I've watched at least several hundred science documentaries over my years of browsing YouTube, and I've seen the location of the solar system described in at least a dozen of them. Do an image search for the location of the solar system in the galaxy and you will see it's depicted as being near the center most of the time. There are some images showing it closer to the edge but they are harder to find, and the one example I found was on a Reddit thread from two months ago where they were discussing the Mandela Effect and how the location of the solar system has changed. It's not just that though, I clearly remember the location being on the edge of the Sagittarius arm, now we're in the Orion Spur?!?

Even in docos made just a few years ago I remember jokes made about how Earth is out in the boondocks. Now one might reason that science changes and evolves, and old data gets replaced with more correct data, but there are two reasons I cannot accept such an explanation. First, we named the arm of the galaxy we are in, it's not something that changes with new information, our distance from the center should simply change with more accurate data. Second, I like to think I keep rather up to date on the latest scientific revelations, at no point did I realize there had been a major shift in our location within the galaxy, it was not announced or discussed by news outlets.

Doesn't it seem a bit strange that this topic seemed to be a non-issue until a few months ago when people starting talking about it on Reddit? With every example of the Mandela Effect I've seen so far, the history behind the thing in question seems some how murky or obscured, and I find it astonishing there isn't any clear explanation for how some of these misconceptions come about. It's like we just accept the misconception but ignore the fact it seems to have no rational origin. And in most cases there is some sort of residual evidence left from how it used to be, most things seem to get changed so that the time line isn't full of paradoxes, old pictures and video will be changed.

But then you'll get something which is like a remnant left over from another time. The lady in this video came across some old collectible record booklets, and she happens to have one for Snow White and also one for Star Wars. In those old booklets, the words spoken by the evil queen are "Mirror, mirror, on the wall" and the Star Wars booklets contains pictures showing C-3PO with a fully gold/bronze body. Unfortunately it doesn't contain the infamous line spoken by Darth Vader to Luke. A Google search will reveal countless people misquoting the film. The scene is also on YouTube, one of the earliest videos was uploaded in 2007. It has over 5 million views and is titled "Luke, I am your father".

The vast majority of the comments under the video are people talking about the Mandela Effect and how they're certain it has changed. In several interviews, even James Earl Jones recalls the the line as "Luke, I am your father". Again, it seems rather strange that people would recently just notice this well known line has changed and why do so many think it has changed, is there a source for this misconception? It seems like this stuff should be pretty easy to debunk if there is a clear cause for these false memories. I get the sense that it's fine for these residual effects to remain, as long as you cannot use them to prove anything has changed, so no one will present a true paradox in reality.

The closest phenomena to this I know of occurs between two entangled particles. In setups such as the delayed choice quantum eraser, there is so called "back loading" effect which can occur so that what happens in the past is decided by what happens in the present. What this means is that events in the past are decided in a retrocausal manner so they are consistent with observations made in the present. In other words, what one entangled particle does can depend on what happens to its partner at a future moment in time. Not entirely sure how that relates to the Mandela Effect but it's the best example of interactions happening between different points in time.

If you have a rational explanation for any of the questions I have posed then I would like to hear them, I really would prefer to believe I'm not ping ponging between time lines or living in a computer simulation which is getting adjusted. It's just when I see so many people saying the same thing, and I agree in most cases, and especially when it's something I feel like I've grown up knowing, I have to seriously consider the most insane possibilities. Most of the Mandela Effect videos I have watched have a good like/unlike ratio, which isn't typical for most fringe videos on YouTube, people will strongly dislike misleading and incorrect videos, but that's not what I'm observing in this case.

my vote goes for ridiculous.

originally posted by: akiros
my vote goes for ridiculous.

As does mine.

Now to read the OP...

originally posted by: akiros
my vote goes for ridiculous.

Mine too. There are too many actual issues to be concerned about these days.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Sorry, it falls under ridiculous.

Nice thought out attempt involving entanglement, but no.

The mirror mirror thing? Well that is what was written in the book then, but not what was in the cartoon. It's pretty obvious that the issue regarding this memory could easily be from people remembering being read the story, as anyone reading the book would have said "mirror mirror on the wall".

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

Mostly ridiculous.

Dimensional shifting is an interesting theory which is what the mandela effect seems to allude to, but the examples ive seen and subsequent obsession by some with the subject? I just cant see it as having any real merit.

a reply to: Vector99

I never read the book, didn't read much as kid, I did however watch the movie countless times because it was one of my favorites.

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
a reply to: Vector99

I never read the book, didn't read much as kid, I did however watch the movie countless times because it was one of my favorites.

I didn't say READ the book, I said have it read to you. A common thing in preschool and library book reading session when I was a kid. I can say without a doubt I was read that story at one time or another.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

I think it's legit.

I actually kinda feel sorry for anyone who instantly assumes it's a load of hogwash--where's the imagination? Where's the spirit? The world isn't only cold and logical, sorry--it's much more intricate than that. We live in a world that is just as abundant in creativity, as computations.

Yes, I have been seeing this new location of our solar system in the Milky Way. I have always been schooled that we are on the outskirts of the galaxy.

Most ME 'proofs' are actually just re-merchandising of products over the years, and yes some are admittedly a mis-memory.

I trust my memory. I have an excellent memory. I think there is definitely something afoot here besides blaming faulty memory. I have experienced many inconsistencies that can't be explained by a faulty memory. Who says it has to be caused by time shifting? There could be any number of unknown things going on. We as a species have only been in the technological age how many decades now?

I really just don't understand why people instantly jump at the throat to tell someone it's ridiculous. There are many things about our reality and existence we aren't privy to. To think we know all the rules is a joke. That's the epitome of ridiculous right there, to say, "Ain't nothing new under the sun."

As stated in many threads about this, a faulty memory combined with confirmation bias and stubborn people.

originally posted by: superman2012
As stated in many threads about this, a faulty memory combined with confirmation bias and stubborn people.

Yes, look at any thread and see for yourself which camp is the more stubborn

*rolls eyes til they get stuck that way*

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

It should be called the Bad Memory Effect

a reply to: Vector99

I doubt I ever had that book read to me, I remember virtually nothing from preschool anyway. I do remember that scene in the movie though because I watched it so many times growing up. Yesterday I asked my dad if he could remember the line and he thought it was mirror mirror as well, he also thought there were 4 people in the car with JFK. The really odd thing is, a lot of people have these false memories when you put them on the spot and ask, it seems to me like almost everyone has these memories. I recently watched a video where two girls went around their town asking people and 90% of the answers were Mandela Effect answers. Not just random answers, but the same answers by many different people.

Another really weird one is "Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get". That's what most people remember it being, however it is actually "Life was like a box of chocolates". This could easily be a case of popular culture twisting the phrase into something that sounds a bit better, but consider the message if that's not the case. Are they saying life is no longer unpredictable because someone can control reality in some way, so we do know what we're going to get? It seems like a rather large coincidence but I can see how that could be easily twisted, the skeptic in me will always believe it's just confabulation or something.

originally posted by: NarcolepticBuddha
a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Who says it has to be caused by time shifting? There could be any number of unknown things going on. We as a species have only been in the technological age how many decades now?

I agree, the way the phenomena works is highly targeted to specific events. Even with the power of time travel I don't really see how anyone could change the location of our solar system or human anatomy or anything like that. The same constellations still exist in the sky which must mean we didn't physically change locations, the only explanation I can think of is that the course of science must have taken a different path and we ended up with a different guess for the location of our galaxy. It is a very hard thing to estimate after all, given that we are located within the Milky Way galaxy and cannot get an outside perspective, we can only rely on artist depictions.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

I remember virtually nothing from preschool anyway

Wrong. Do you know your alphabet and how to count?

I do remember that scene in the movie though because I watched it so many times growing up.

Another really weird one is "Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get". That's what most people remember it being, however it is actually "Life was like a box of chocolates".

There are outtakes of him saying like is life a box of chocolates instead of was. The take used for the actual movie was life WAS like a box of chocolates though.

a reply to: Vector99

There are outtakes of him saying like is life a box of chocolates instead of was. The take used for the actual movie was life WAS like a box of chocolates though.

That just shows the film could have easily gone either way based on the whim of a director or something. I see no reason why so many people would remember the outtake version, seemingly more often than the actual line. The same thing applies to Snow White, having the book read to you once or twice as a young child would not override all the times watching the actual movie. The fact of the matter is most people have seen the movie and not read the book, like with most stories. The movie is obviously going to have a much larger impact and imprint on your memory because the characters are brought to life on the screen and good actors make it very memorable.

Ridiculatum!!!

I posed the question recently, What was the "Mandela Effect" called before say...2000.

Well....no one responded. So perhaps it was called, faulty memories, or implanted memories, or just plain bad memory.

The problem, I see, is that a lot of these "Cultural Symbols" as to who said what, and no they didn't its a time shift etc.etc., has been brought on by subsequent "Cultural Status", ie nerdyness as you will, that has missquoted or often used the easiler Sounding way out.....
As I am now an elder, I remember watching the Walt Disney Show in the 60s, and considering Snow White was made in the 1930s...it was ancient when I was a kid. On the TV show, I seem to recall there was often a Mirror that talked, in the show....not the movie. Often Walt would talk, or the Mousekerteers....Probably at one stage SOMEONE??? said , Mirror Mirror on the Wall, in a sketch....and as we were kids, and were scared of the Snow White movie, ....it became...Mirror Mirror on the wall.......Not to mention there were 100s of Disney "Golden Book" series kid books, that may well have read Mirror Mirror, as "Magic" may scare some kids....they thought.
Remember Millionsssss of People watched the Walt Disney Show, in those days.

Now the "Luke" business........Well once again, I lived thru that....NOONE cared WHAT Vader actually said to Luke......all we got out of the movie, was that No...Vader is Luke's Father... (which the rumours alluded too...all pre internet computer rubbish days)
No, during the 1980s we DIDNT run around querying why the "Mandela effect" (which didnt exist obviously) had chaged it from Luke to No.....
We watched the movie, Vader said he was Lukes dad...which we all suspected....and thats that.
Probably what happened, was as the 80s progressed, more comedians and Nerd movies were made (like Chris Farley ones), slowly Cultural references entered the scene......Oh boy, this is just like..."Luke I am your father" etc etc....
In the 80s we didnt care and we laughed......THEN the Noobies, start to become aware, hear the incorrect words from their brothers, Fathers, or TV, and all of a sudden....bamm.....its......... Luke..etc etc

No...if all this "Mandela Effect" really DID have something amazing happen.....
Like...Lurch doesnt say "You Rang" now....He says....."You Knocked on the Door".......OR
Max doesnt say.........."I asked you not to tell me 99"....and now he says... " I wonder if you should tell me 44"..

THEN and only THEN, should you start to PANIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!

originally posted by: ChaoticOrder
There's a couple of big ones, like 6 people in the car with JFK instead of 4, I mean I'm not exactly new to conspiracy theories, I shouldn't be misremembering one of the most important moments in the realm of conspiracy theories. I remember reading theories about how it could have been the driver, but now that's not even really possible because of the people between them.

Haha, that's an awesome one. Haven't seen that before, I checked youtube straight away.
There is a simple explanation however.
www.youtube.com...

There's a cg recreation that shows 4 people around the 30sec mark here (and more later I guess). I recognised that, perhaps you were thinking of the same one?

Now, your brain can remember these 4 people in a car like it remembers every other 4 people in a car.
Or it can remember that in this extremely rare case the 4 people don't include the driver.
That's pretty specific to this case regarding the cg version which I remembered from that jfk doco.

Regarding why I think it was 4 people in the JFK car, it's basically the same.

That's a specially made car with a very weird seating plan. It hurts my head to be confused by something which doesn't really matter so I ignore that part and move along when I recreate the picture in my head.

I bet you someone who is really familiar with the model of that car wouldn't be confused and would recreate the memory correctly.

The reality is so much more interesting than the superstition around it.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

I wrote a rather lengthy answer on another thread about the M.E. so i will try to keep this nice and short.

I wouldn't call it ridiculous, although some of the theories about it are so insane that i want to punch my screen.

I believe that goes under the category of mass hysteria. Someone states something, which knows is a false information and then a second person due to misinterpretation or misinformation says that this is right and then you have a bunch of people "remembering" the same thing.

If i make a thread, saying that i'm 100% sure that ,for example the director Arthur Hiller who died a couple of days ago, actually died 10 years ago and that i remember the article etc, there will be a bunch of people saying that they remember this as well. Of course i'm not going to do something like that now, but i was seriously considering it, just to prove that most of the people are just following the trend.

Anyway and to answer one of your questions, the one about the position of Earth in the galaxy. Well there are many illustrations with the "we are here" sign, and most of them are showing a different place. Maybe that's why people are a bit confused about it.

Good post S&F

I clearly remember the location being on the edge of the Sagittarius arm, now we're in the Orion Spur?!?

Here My 2 cents


Anecdote :

This really blew my mind. As an eight year old I got a 'star' book as a present. In it there was a picture of our milkyway. And I clearly remember asking my father 'where is earth while pointing on the picture ?'. My father pointed to the outerrim of the galaxy and told me we're on the sagittarius arm. I responded so...(knowing my fathers starsign) earth is in your starsign ? He smiled...

The reason that I bring this up is that people don't want to discuss the ME effect they just want to blame it on bad memory. The Bad memory doesn't explain why all of the sudden so much people experience the same effects. And why translations and depictions of mandela effect agree with what is now considered 'bad memory'.

... from a post I didn't post.. (to incomprehensible)

At the same time the many worlds interpretation is used by scientists to explain the workings of the Quantum computer. One scientist was very proud to admit that the quantum computer looked like it was the altar of an alien god (look up D-Wave 2). And then he went on telling that QC's are like Nexuses to parallel universes ??? there are only 2 possible solutions. Either the probabilty wave is a superposition of alternate reality's and the guy is speaking the truth or not. Let for a moment assume that Qbits are really made. Doesn't that also mean that this universe is now entangled with a alternate reality ?
I for myself don't think reality has changed but I think 'consciousness' has a hard time selecting the right reality when the points of those realities are too close in hilbertspace.
Think about it in essence is a QC a merger of realities and that is exactly what is happening now with the ME effect ! The main difference is that a classical computer operates within the universe (lowering the entropy (localy)). And a QC partly operates outside the universe (many worlds interpretation) lowering the entropy/differens between universes !
It's childish/unscientific to assume that QC effects are local when entanglement between universes sets in. Scientists know this , but they don't act they just wanna play


Anyway... I love to see how this thread evolves greetings.