Jews and gentiles, the fallacy of "the chosen ones"

a reply to: intrptr

Yes they did write it down .Maybe that is one of the qualities God seen that He could use ,as well as their other cultural anomalies .The still to this day celibate and carry on traditions that link back to their ancient past . Call it a marker of such .When we review ancient documents associated with Biblical writings we see a system that would be very hard for them to have changed without being called out on .We see within the dead sea scrolls a consistency of maintenance which us to have a good degree of confidence in the text . Its even interesting to note the errors and learn a bit about them as well .

God doesn't judge til after death.

That's not correct. Proverbs claim the righteous receive payment in this world, how much more the wicked and the sinners.

So when God sent Jesus to the Jews, He knew they would reject Jesus because of the corruption of His word, and the iniquities in their hearts, and they would suffer for the whole world to see -- and hopefully learn from.

This is a fairly powerful argument against christianity, because what we learn from jews is how to be successful.
www.jinfo.org...

Also, God clearly states in Isaiah he formed this people for himself and that they will recount his praises.
Why would the jews praise God for being a failure? Double untrue, they
1) aren't.
2) and if someone is made as a failure to learn from, if he is very god-fearing he likely will still praise his creator for it, except by doing that he proves he never was a failure to learn from. You, see it paradoxically can't be true.

Also, the jew's chosen-ness isn't entitling them to be derogatory to nonjews and if you see someone doing that it is not because he is allowed to, but because of his own failure.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: Barzini

There are no chosen ones, there never have been, and there wont be until the resurrection of the dead, if you believe in the bible.

Since Jesus did not come to change the (Jewish) law, but to fulfill the law, and Christians follow the God and the law of the Jews,

.

2 issues
There are chosen ones, the NT is very clear, Calvinism is a branch of Christianity that was formed from these teachings
I don't believe Calvinism, it's extremism and some reformed churches are cults. Wesborough comes to mind

Secondly Christians don't follow the laws of the Jews, we can eat pork, we can work Sunday's, you are so wrong in your understanding

Disraelis comments are a reasonable reflection but I do think there is more to be understood.

a reply to: Raggedyman

you are so wrong in your understanding...

LOL! I don't pretend to have any "understanding" of God's will. I was simply sharing another perspective. About the only thing I think I understand is that I don't know much at all!!! I read, I listen, I observe, I learn (hopefully)... but I don't know anything for sure. How can I understand heavenly things if I can't understand earthly things?

Let's retire the word gentile, it's just a p.c. way to say goyim, which is the jewish derogatory term for non Jews.

Here's the fallacy, in "derogatory".

Times I heard "chosen ones" from
Jews: not many
Goyim: many

Chosen for what? Laws including penile reduction surgery? A specific desert sometimes? Nice.

Etymology of "Goyim" says it's not even a little bit derogatory.
Having feelings that Jews are derogatory towards you and gold their noses in the federal reserve to kill Iraqis is propaganda from those who actually do these things and blame "the Jews" for their own actions.

Been done for a while, catches up in specific types of poverty combined with PR campaigns. Chosen for random hate from total strangers is a real nice plus, and being blamed for NYC WTC makes sense too. What Zion really needs is more invaded neighbours warring around and saying we're traitors for being "friends" with the USA who bombs their #ing hospitals, and more police state bull# in America, the second most popular Jewish destination. That's what we want. That's what we talk about in synagogues. That's why we did WTC.

Wake up.
Jews are or at least have been legion in America, work together with all who share common goals, otherwise the 99% means nothing but the crumbled mass of divided fools glad to lose a fight over the puked spoils of cities.

Thank a scribe for the time you've spent studying Biblical text and commentary and remember that your ideas that "Goyim" is derogatory don't come from that sabbatical year you took in Jerusalem's Hebrew University. These ideas come from haters, who also happen to know nothing about Jews yet talk like experts.
"Gentile" is also not derogatory or pc, it's French for Goy. Look up the formation of words between when you encounter them for the first time and when you write them: you will become more socially efficient.

If Jews are derogatory to you, stop propagating our book and do your own thing.
Your opinion of said book is mostly # anyway. Not your fault entirely.

Jews and chosen ones is all a fantasy concocted by "priests" and forgers of history.

Never mind the genetic speculation i.e. intermingling with the "goy" and Khazaria nobody knows who the hell wrote the bible, good read that it is, made up a whole BUNCH OF LIES about God, Egypt, Solomons temple, the giants and the Canaan conquest, Moses and all the slaughter is all made up.

Whatever a Jew is they don't really have any legitimate claim to God or Palestine/Israel. The fact that they duped the world into letting them conquer Palestine is a travesty. 2000 year old stories don't give you the "title deeds from God" to the land like they say. That's a quote but I can't remember if it was Sharon or Netanyahu.

I aint no damn "goy" but I aint no Gentile. I am Elyonite.

@wisvol:
I didn't mean to say that jews are derogatory to me if that was directed at me (I know a few jews and so far in my life, of the very little amount people who helped me with issues more than 50% are jews), but that of course there are jews who are derogatory because it's impossible not to happen with millions of people and that when it happens it is a failure that is not attached to judaism --> judaism is not inspiring derogatoriness.
I for one made very good experiences with jews with little exceptions.

a reply to: Cuddlecow

If you mean me then it was not directed at anyone in particular. Just my thoughts on the matter.

a reply to: Cuddlecow

I like Jewish people too in person and on tv, they contribute a great deal to society, for better usually. But the super Talmud Zohar red heifer Zionists are dangerous to mankind.

you are very good a misquoting people. Try giving the full quote the gospel of the grace of God was part of it.

I said it doesn't apply to me a gentile saved under the gospel of Grace of God. I said the book of Revelation applies to the Jew in the great tribulation.

I was speaking of saved people under the gospel of the grace of God will be gone before the book of Revelation starts.

The Gospel of the Kingdom arises again during the great tribulation and all Jews and gentiles at that time can only get saved under that Gospel until the angel presents the everlasting gospel. The gospel of the grace of God will no longer be available during the great tribulation.

Paul said to us Christians today, who are the church of God, where we see Gods inspired and preserved word separated the world into three groups (today during the dispensation of grace).

1Cor 10:32 Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

The unsaved Jew, the unsaved gentile and the saved of both groups (because they are no longer two but one man in Christ

Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 ¶ For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
Col 3:10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
Ga 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

however Christ is only in the believer and vise versa that is why there is the separation of the unsaved into two groups, and the church of God made of both.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Christians are ignorant, they think they are special, hypocrisy who is the Jew in revelation?

a reply to: ChesterJohn


You don't make sense.

Anybody can quote a book but you are obviously bias against.You say " Us chistians are saved by this or that." For all you know death is the same as before you were born, nothing.

You met God? If you met God physicality saw him and he told you that then you can say it.

Otherwise your guessing. Essentially, your a grown man preaching fairy tales like they happened.

Jesus was either human not a god or most likely didn't exist.

Im a Christian, Jesus saved me by dying for MY sins so I am going to heaven and for the rest of my life Im gonna be a jerk.

a reply to: Othello420

Nobody wants to buy that gobbledygook nonsense fiction.

a reply to: Barzini

Confusion reigns!
As a wise man once said, 'If you choose, you are chosen' and this is how God 'chooses' His people; those who choose to believe in and obey Him.
The mistake is in thinking that it is the Jews who are the chosen ones - not so! The whole thrust and context of the Bible is to Israel, and so it is the Israelites who are the chosen ones.
Anyone of any age, gender, previous religious affiliation [including Jews, Christians, Muslims, pagans, atheists, gentiles] etc., can choose. Even the Son said that he was sent only to Israel!
It is specifically the curse and/or the righteousness of the Law that is done away with - not the Law itself; until there is a new heaven and a new earth - which there will be in the future. So until then the Law / Covenant of the Ten Commandments remains.
The Biblical term, 'beast' equates to 'monster'. In describing Hitler as a monster, but no one expects him to appear as anything other than human.

a reply to: intrptr

But some of those mystics clearly knew something since they called them the Chosen ONE:s. It is not like the label Chosen ONE is not found in other religions so it is part of the spiritual Meta Language.

a reply to: Othello420

oh please I meant no offence to your or anyone. So let met establish that what I stated is from our belief not any other. If we do that then saved is in the form of what Christians call salvation i.e. saved which we believe is through faith alone on Christ finished work on the cross. If I am wrong in my belief then no harm comes to anyone. Unless of course we kill people for not believing as we do. Something I am against.

a reply to: LittleByLittle

But some of those mystics clearly knew something since they called them the Chosen ONE:s.

Messianic megalomania. Hitler did it, too.

Kings as gods, god help us.

a reply to: Othello420

The church under the kingdom Gospel as I have studied it was all Jews, It wasn't until after the stoning of Stephen that a change took place and Saul/Paul was called to bring a message of salvation by grace of God through our faith on Christ.

Christ was not my Messiah and many Jews say he was not theirs.

Is the message of Salvation via the gospel of the grace of God a new message? Yes, in some ways it something not seen before in scriptures. No longer is man expected to fulfil any obligations (covenant/contract) for his salvation he need only believe what Paul taught, that Christ's death on the cross was a propitiation for the debt all men owe for their sin.

Eze 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

The Bible I believe is a full narrative on God's wanting to exalt his son and provide a means to save sinful men.

If I am wrong then I do not believe it will hurt my life or anyone else's unless I use religion as a way to rob people. (Which I strongly believe men are doing today and it hurts the message God is sending forth). I am fully against these criminal acts of men who manipulate others to get their money. That is covetousness something God, Jesus and Paul all taught in the Bible was wrong.

I continue to learn from the Preserved word of God the Holy Bible. But one thing I am sure of is that Israel is a Chosen Nation to serve the Messiah as a nation of kings and priests in the area of true worship, that Gentiles were to come to salvation through them

John 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.

And that God will someday Judge men by two means, 1) by the work of Christ in which men have placed their faith for salvation, and 2) by men's own works apart from Christ.

If I am am wrong it will not hurt my life. Seeing that I am no longer a drug addict or dealer, I do not violate the law of men (at least not intentionally), and I try to live as peaceably with all men as much as it lieth within my power to do so.

a reply to: the2ofusr1